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poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


Actually good fantasy:
Ffalfnir and Grey Mouser
Dying Earth
Nine Princes in Amber
Conan
Elric

Very very bad:
Kingkiller Chronicles
Terry Goodkind rip

Everything else is just various levels of mediocre carbon copies of Lord of the Rings.

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poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


They’re good because they really paint a picture of a weird world where all the cities are slums, all the wilderness is filled with monsters, and the heroes are in thrall to weird extra-dimensional beings, and it does it with snappy prose and no wasted space.

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


If you’re writing a series of 600-page doorstops, you’d better be Marcel Proust. One of the biggest problems I have with filler media is the amount of my time they want to waste. No fantasy novel should ever be longer than 200 pages. My list of good ones are all short and cut all the fat. And the bad ones are either endless series or thousands of pages

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


Bell_ posted:

So, this leads to a question of mine own: any positive reads from Tad Williams? I heard of him the same way but hadn't read anything of his.

poisonpill posted:

Actually good fantasy:
Ffalfnir and Grey Mouser
Dying Earth
Nine Princes in Amber
Conan
Elric

Very very bad:
Kingkiller Chronicles
Terry Goodkind rip

Everything else is just various levels of mediocre carbon copies of Lord of the Rings.

*taps the list*

And yes, guilty as charged not reading Earthsea. I’ve read Left Hand of Darkness, which was pretty wild.

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


there wolf posted:

... while Lies of Locke Lamora dropped off as it went along, the first one is still a really solid book and the later ones are still fun even if they're messes.

Lmao I just looked these up online and the first hit was someone complaining that the release date for the fourth book has been pushed back for seven years (with none on the horizon) and the top comment on Reddit is someone who bought the three first editions signed from him and then he just stopped responding.

Modern fantasy writers are lazy ingrates

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


muscles like this! posted:

Ehhh, IIRC Scott Lynch has health issues that have caused the delays. He's not like GRRM and Rothfuss who are running around playing at being a respected author without actually writing anything.

Aw, that sucks. I take it back.

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


A kender, wild mage, paladin, and a chaotic neutral psionic walk into a tavern.

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


It’s my ORIGINAL CHARACTER

DO NOT STEAL

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


RaspberrySea posted:

You can get all you need to know about Goodkind from one hilarious Q and A he did.

http://cgi1.usatoday.com/mchat/20030805003/tscript.htm

This dude is a legend



Orem Utah: What do you think distinguishes your books from all of the other fantasy books out there, and why should readers choose to read your series?
Terry Goodkind: There are several things. First of all, I don't write fantasy.

Haddonfield, NJ: Second Question - I've noticed similarities between your Sword of Truth series and Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time series...(Black Sisterhood vs. Black Ajah; The Order vs. The Seanchan; Richard vs. Rand both discovering their powers, both have Nameless evil Gods...etc.) I've often voiced my suspicion that these two series might be occurring on the same world...how crazy am I?

Terry Goodkind: If you notice a similarity, then you probably aren't old enough to read my books.


Kansas City, KS: What made you choose to leave out other common races(dwarves, elves, etc) from your books?

Terry Goodkind: Please refer to the previous answer, in which I explain that I'm not writing fantasy ... My purpose is not weirdo cultural diversity.


Phoenix, Arizona: What authors do you read yourself?

Terry Goodkind: I think the most important author to read is Ayn Rand. Most of my reading is research for the things I'm writing about, but if I have any time to read, one of the people I like is Dean Koontz. I like his sense of life. He's one of the few writers around today, other than me, who seems interested in writing about heroic individuals who are worthy of being heroes.

There's actually very little to read today because more and more books center around characters who are either unremarkable, pathetic or reprehensible. I don't like authors who choose to tell stories about these kinds of people. I like stories about individuals who can show the nobility of mankind.



Grand Haven, Michigan: How much influence does politics and current affairs have on the story you're writing at the time?

Terry Goodkind: Philosophy is what has an influence on me. Current affairs and politics are driven by the same philosophy, therefore my stories always seem to be relevant to what's happening at the moment.

If you could take my stories back to any time in history and read them at that time, they would also seem relevant to what was happening now. The reason is because, as I said, the stories are about the way people think and about their philosophy. People's good or bad outlook on life remains constant.

A thief in the 18th century is the same as a thief in the 20th century is the same as a thief 1,000 years ago. A murder is a murder, regardless of the age in which it is committed.

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


The art on the cover is better than the writing in the book

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


Wasn’t it written by like a twelve year old and his dad owned the publishing company?

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


No Dignity posted:

That's a very strange scene to write imo

The author, contorting his plot into a scene where the protagonist blamelessly severs a child’s tongue, “no you see, the kid really really deserved it”

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


I’ve never read them but I’m convinced WoT was (and to some extent remains) popular because it was just about the only game in town during a decade where D&D nerds were looking for new generic fantasy novels

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


Spazzle posted:

All the Shannara books are the same story every time. This is not an exaggeration.

Lmao

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shannara posted:

Each land is named after the compass point it faces: the Northland, the Southland, the Eastland, and the Westland, and is the primary home of different peoples.

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


precision posted:

NB: i like the WoT books

Why?

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


This sounds like a joke, and I promise that it isn't: I think 95% of what people think of as fantasy is D&D. Now, D&D is a soup made of 75% LOTR; with the other 25% being a hodgepodge of golden and new wave authors. But that means that the platonic ideal of fantasy is a couple of fairly dodgy elements that people are consciously adhering to, or unconsciously adhering to, or consciously running from. A fantasy world has: overpowered wizards, elves/dwarves/orcs, a small group of adventurers seeking a goal, overthrow of an ancient, embodied evil entity, a mythic past which is lost to the present, which is a weird mix of late medieval and early modern culture/technology level, etc., etc.. Importantly, these are all elements of LotR but they're actually distilled through things like Shannara and D&D and video games, so you've got that filter.

It also means you've got a bunch of could-have-beens for foundational fantasy texts that just never happened, and so we're down a weirdly specific road for what bad fantasy books look like. What if Poul Anderson's the Broken Sword had been the book everyone read, instead of the Fellowship of the Ring? They aren't actually that much different from each other.

Anyway I'll have a chocolate frosty and large fries (I like to dip them)

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


Mom told me to put down that drat video game and pick up a book so I started reading a literal description of playing a video game

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


That would be intellectually dishonest. You have to follow the rules of the made up video game combat options or else the whole thing will just be a big joke

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poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


I didn’t realize that the last battle was a Christian parable, but I also didn’t realize that they died. In retrospect I don’t think I made it that far in the books.

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