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I'm just bummed that we're not gonna get more Jujutsu Gundam scenes. that robot is fucken sick.
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Sep 9, 2023 07:34
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| # ¿ May 13, 2024 00:32 |
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I like Miwa a lot. Iaido salarywoman owns.
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Sep 10, 2023 00:39
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Lmao that's a solid tweet E oh oh no
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Oct 17, 2023 19:29
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This was the first episode where the animation really bugged me, an anime only fan, too. Rewatching some of the Sukuna fight and earlier episodes like the Mei Mei Smallpox fight, I can see some of the issues that people brought up here. I think that in prior stuff the quality issues were more that elements of the fights were simplified, skipped, or rendered in a more stylized way that was less detailed but looked deliberate. Scratchy linework, or stark black and white fill. They seemed to try to creatively overcome their constraints and deliver something that lived up to the show's quality standards even if it wasn't quite what had been hoped for, or required style shifts to something easier to animate. And for me, at least, they did it well enough. Whereas in this episode a lot of the sequences looked like they were trying to look like the rest of the show but the people doing it couldn't pull it off (which we know is because of time and crunch imposed by management rather than the fault of the animation team, but if I didn't know that I'd have wondered if they gave a b-team of animators a chance to shine and they blew it). And I also get the idea that the transition from S1 to S2 was a bit jarring - S1 was a show about a magic team at magic school with Yuji as the main protagonist, Nobara and Megumi as his buddy team, and Gojo as the wise (ish) teacher dude. It focused on their coming into their own as Year 1 sorcerors at magic school. I got some stuff spoiled, but I would have expected the events here in season 2 to happen a bit later on, to perhaps be more stretched out, for there to be more time for school and for relationships to develop between the students at the two schools. Nobara felt like she was definitely going to be as important a member of the team as Megumi, and the team of the three of them felt like they were going to be the main window through which we saw the greater story. S2 is an ensemble show with way more focus on the adult characters that almost entirely jettisons the school framing, the original team of three, seemed to pretty clearly relegate Nobara to third string, and basically speeds into the overarching plot about jujutsu society and the two main enemies. It's mostly great, and the way that Gege managed to avoid a lot of the least interesting parts of other shonen shows and subverted many shonen tropes whilst still sticking firmly in a fun shonen battle space is refreshing and interesting, but it's a departure from my expectations post S1 and in one marked criticism has done the female characters dirty after starting fairly strongly on that note.
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Nov 24, 2023 18:26
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Lt. Lizard posted:Yeah, the way Nobara was handled this season bugs me something fierce. In S1 you had the feeling the main trio was more or less equal, once you take into account the fact that Yuji is the protagonist and Megumi is the classic edgy rival with a twist. But this season, you have Yuji fight equally with Choso, who was strong enough to participate in the sealing of Gojo and Megumi doing lions share of work in the battle against Special Grade Curse and then doing a pretty good job in surviving against Toji. Nobara meanwhile is completely owned by scrawny twerp and when saved, considers Nanami who, while great, is absolutely far lower on power scale than all of the above, an unstoppable juggernaut. Like girl, what do you mean "so this is what grade 1 sorcerer is"? You are currently a candidate for becoming one as well. And then she sits most of the action out? And then, according to spoilers that were honestly pretty unavoidable if you are visiting anime adjacent spaces, she dies or something like it? Bleh. Yes! I think in S1 I'd have been comfortable ranking her as the least powerful of the trio, but they felt like they were in the same ballpark with very different strengths and weaknesses which would lead to better/worse matchups depending on technique matches. Not so this season. And with her technique attacking the soul directly, I expected it to have some big plot implications. Could she attack Sukuna within Yuji?
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Nov 24, 2023 19:04
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Conspiratiorist posted:If you think about it, this is the realest type of shounen coming-of-age, since the quirky young cast can only watch in horror as the machinations of ancient monsters take their future away from them. On the one hand, this is a great take and it could have made me happier about one of the trio (probably) dying. On the other hand, Gege picked Nobara to be the one to die - he's consistently done women dirty in this story - and I'm probably out now too.
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Dec 1, 2023 04:53
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dipwood posted:Well thanks to this I know she's dead and not coming back for sure. Yeah it kinda sucks tbh
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Dec 1, 2023 19:56
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Y'all saying Nobara wasn't a main character are watching a different show or something
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Dec 2, 2023 06:44
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King of Solomon posted:I'm curious about the context of the negativity you're seeing, assuming it's from places outside this thread. Was it like that for most/all of Shibuya, did it start when Nanami died or Nobara got her skull blown open? There's plenty of negativity in the thread too (ie from me!) - it's not just that Nobara got her skull blown open though that's pretty egregious, but the whole thing feels sorta like a rug pull to me. I wanted more S1, I got a different show that sidelined the cool female protag. I've been more mixed on S2 from the beginning of Hidden Inventory, but my opinion has steadily crystallized into a negative one over the course of the season.
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Dec 22, 2023 18:56
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My criticism, boiled down to the sparest phrasing, isn't that Shibuya isn't ballsy, it's that the way it is ballsy is sexist and an abdication of the possibly subversive initial setup. That Shibuya subverts shounen tropes isn't in doubt. That it subverts them by buying into the sexist sidelining of women by simultaneously robbing them of power and agency and by giving them the worst of masculinity (of Nanami and MeiMei who's the sex pest?) is disappointing as gently caress. I don't want this arc to be less ballsy. I want it to be less misogynistic. And, frankly, I want that of shounen media and anime in general. I don't normally make a meal out of that desire, but I'm also not normally given such high hopes. X-Ray Pecs posted:Yeah, there’s a difference between an awful girlboss and someone who’s truly vile, and the creators want you to know which one Meimei is. Like, this was a choice that the author made. Nanami and MeiMei are foils and guess which side of that coin the woman is? Ugh. I wanna be clear. I get why people like this arc. I think the ways it delivers on some of the promises of shounen media is really solid. I think it does so by doubling down on some of the worst aspects of shounen media and in the end I think that sucks too much to overlook. I don't think this is just "certain circles" complaining - I think it's a wider audience seeing the content and so more people reacting critically to the objectionable parts of it.
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Dec 23, 2023 09:57
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ninjewtsu posted:can someone let me know what this "so much promise" was S1 - huh, Nobara's cool. Her ability looks tailor made to gently caress up one of the main antagonists. And holy poo poo, the ending sequence with Yuji? Def my two fave characters and with such synergistic abilities. And the other women are pretty cool too, with designs that aren't even that sexualized! Maki is awesome and I really wanna see more of Miwa's New Shadow Style battutsu/iaijutsu/whatever-it-is. Both Nobara and Maki, in particular, are written with complex motivations and both are given traits typically excluded from sympathetic female characters in this type of media, where motivations like spite are reserved for the evil shrew archetype and most women are bashful and passive. Maki is shown to be ambitious not for some noble reason, but simply because she's ambitious. She's allowed to just be a person with personal motivations in a way that men consistently are, and women are frequently denied. Rather than being compelled to act by male characters in danger or making demands, the women have motivations that exist because of their backstories and personalities and they aren't put on pedestals as, like, perfect creatures who exist to inspire and be led by the male leads. At this stage, neither character is coded with internalized misogyny to reject their girly sides as weaker or worse, somehow. And they immediately strike up a friendship without any need for the too common girly catfight that's used to prove that Maki is "worth it." That Nobara's probably most significant role model is a woman her age is doubly significant, showing that women can inspire other women and be a source of wisdom and guidance without being on that pedestal - either as some perfect angelic creature, or an otherworldly elder. Nobara and Maki both are written to subvert the meek/bashful writing of so many female characters in Shonen, without being entirely cast as tsundere whose harshness is really, under the surface, actually maternal or romantic love for a male character. They completely buck the Madonna/Whore complex trope. All that said, neither of them has to reject their femininity to be as badass as they are, perhaps Nobara most of all. Rather, Nobara's femininity is confident (she knows she's beautiful! fucken imagine that!!), empowered, and unashamed. They're kinda underpowered compared to the main dudes now but this could absolutely go in two directions with the female characters and fingers crossed it's the good one~~ ! S2 - oh, so it's the bad one where they all die, become uncomplicated villains (child abuse is bad, y'all) instead of unsympathetic antiheroes, or just fail to do anything of note, cool. You really do not love to see it. I know that apparently Maki isn't dead and does, in fact, go on to continue being the kind of female character that I describe her as above, but the show so far hasn't really set that up for me and I had to be spoiled by assholes here about that instead of being able to read it from the text I'm given. That Miwa apparently just made a binding vow not to swing a katana again disappoints me sooooo much too, fuckkkk That's what I mean by promise, in any case. S1 wasn't, like, totally 100% perfectly amazing re female characters compared to other Shonen, but it was a great setup for a Shonen battler where the women are actual people who get to shine and aren't sidelined by men and ultimately useless as much as is frustratingly common in the genre in my limited experience. Like, I'm a relatively new anime watcher. I watched a few bad shows in college and then took a fifteen year break before picking it back up recently. In that time I reconsidered a lot of casually misogynistic views I held unthinkingly from my upbringing. It's been really fun engaging with a new form of art and storytelling and I think I'll be an anime watcher for the rest of my life now. There's so much to love here, really. And shonen stories in particular have been grabbing me - I love a good action centric heroic tale where we don't really question whether the good guys will win in the end, but what's interesting is the costs they pay along the way. JJK S1 was the most excited I've been about this since picking anime up. The thing that consistently disappoints me the most is the treatment of women in these stories. It makes me sad to see JJK go on that pile when I was really sorta hopeful that it wouldn't. Cao Ni Ma posted:Everyone gets loving chumped in JJK. Like if you're nearsighted you might associate a rash of female characters biting it problematic and then a few chapters later a bunch of guys get chumped too. Lol what I think you're entirely missing the point. It's not just that they die, but that they do so without fuckin doing anything. The only people to actually impact the overarching plot are dudes (or male-coded curses that might technically be genderless but I digress - they're dude-coded and get he/him pronouns in almost all discussion I've seen so they're dudes) or in the rare cases a woman does something impactful it's off screen (a lady taught Todo - waow!) or by helping out a dude.
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Dec 24, 2023 04:27
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trucutru posted:
Oh I 100% forgot Hanami, you're absolutely right there. Literally just judged based on the bod which is, like, not exactly great on my part given my argument lmao
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Dec 24, 2023 04:45
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Natural 20 posted:Before I got upset at the obvious sexism of it, my immediate reaction to Nobara dying was to just, sigh. It wasn't shock, or outrage. I just disengaged because the character I was looking forward to seeing the most got written out. Ahhh gently caress so much this. But I do wanna keep fucken zooming in on the sexism for another sec because I do not think the folks enjoying this arc are fairly engaging with it. I'm curious if any of the folks whose opinion of this season are positive can also acknowledge how it's sexist as well? Like, ninjewtsu, you threw down a gauntlet about what (exactly) was promising about the writing in s1 and then didn't engage with any of the replies that actually, well, replied to you. What's up with that? I wanna be clear - I don't think the show is irredeemable or that if you like it there's something bad or wrong about you. It's well within the window of things that people can enjoy despite problems with them. I, personally, like plenty of problematic poo poo and JJK is definitely the sort of thing you can like despite its problems. I do think a lot of fans here are really steadfastly unwilling to admit criticisms or to honestly engage with the fact that the show sucks in some ways that a lot of anime sucks and that that's a fucken problem.
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Dec 28, 2023 08:55
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Absolutely incredible tweet. Thanks for your further posts on this, I've enjoyed reading them. I was unfair putting the bit about acknowledging sexism and calling you out for not responding to the "promise" stuff right next to each other. I actually knew you'd acknowledged the sexism which was why I was disappointed you didn't further engage, but either way you've been a thoughtful foil for me during this discussion and I appreciate it. Ibram Gaunt posted:Sexism is when a woman I like in fiction dies. I can't even YES bread posted:in addition im going to side-eye anyone who chooses the cartoon for 14 year old boys as their moral battleground YES bread posted:it's also when a woman is bad. no other reason for a show aimed at young boys to acknowledge that grown women can be predators, except sexism. i am very smart and sincere YES bread posted:it's mostly gross, i just think the original big analysis post was kind of shallow and it was weird to not even consider any conclusion besides "the woman being the bad one, and the man being the positive (yet tragic) role model is automatic sexism" If this is your takeaway from my posting idk what to tell you. Brave stance against calling out sexism in media aimed at boys, though! King of Solomon posted:Keep in mind that person might be a manga reader. I'm not a manga reader. I've referenced one manga fact in this discussion under a spoiler tag because it could putatively be offered as a counterexample to me which I learned from unspoilered discussion in this thread earlier. I probably should have just skipped it, though, cause I get that it sucks. Anyway, these will likely be my last posts on the topic because it's kinda shutting down other discussions and I don't wanna take away space for fans to be excited together about something that they love. Like I said, I don't think liking this show makes you sexist or something stupid like that, and I have basically made my point that the show is sexist and some of y'all have made my point that many fanboys of the show can't admit that. I hope the season's conclusion is satisfying for y'all. I am gonna watch the rest and I'm excited to see what Yuki's power is. Heck, if the season ends well I might even be back for S3.
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Dec 28, 2023 19:50
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King of Solomon posted:You aren't a manga reader, but the twitter poster is. I actually think it's entirely reasonable for anime onlies to see the pattern the Twitter poster is calling out, the indicators are all there. Ohhhh gotcha, thanks for clarifying. I agree.
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Dec 28, 2023 21:19
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| # ¿ May 13, 2024 00:32 |
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Isn't that almost exactly what he thinks of people?
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Jan 2, 2024 07:00
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