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Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Lol goddamn quicksilver

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Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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STAC Goat posted:

I take it back. Jimmy should call Ant-Man.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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So who was responsible for the turd that is Inhumans?

Edit context here is that the wife and I went through AOS as a pandemic thing. liked it, then thought oh this sounds like it’s a continuation of that story line... wait this is godawful.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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They should go for an animated. A Simpsons episode.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Honestly I think it sets a good precedent too. Not all tv has to be the ongoing season after season format. They can do a fixed length high quality story, and then just do another one in the universe if they want to print more money rather than having an ongoing series.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Splash Attack posted:

feels like something they would do a big movie about, not a tv series that you can only watch on disney plus,

I think Disney is planning on having a high profile serial show running on plus weekly for the foreseeable future. They want people to subscribe and not leave the service ever when they finish one series they want to watch.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Sooooo

Gunna start this post with an explanation and a definition: Revolutionary romanticism. So we all believe in myths. Sometimes those myths get broken by a variety of things. One response to to the breaking of these myths is to attempt to reconstruct them. To look back to broken origin and make up a story that attempts to replace the broken myth. This is always incoherent (because the myth to be replaced was broken, incoherent). Fascism is a revolution romanticism ( that’s what blood and soil are)

That’s fundamentally what Wanda is doing. Reconstructing a past that never really existed and that is fundamentally always false.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Yeah the shared bed thing, one can even see it literature Moby Dick being the quickest example that pops into my head.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Barreft posted:

I liked it for being about Wanda and Vision.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Barreft posted:

Yeah it was cool when I was 8, not yearning to watch a young mr savage learn how to make out when I'm 37 now though, sorry.

Literally watching wonder years right now. No regrets it’s enjoyable.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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So thinking about something.

Wanda and Vision were going to live in Westview. She will never have what he wanted for them and everyone there hates, hates, her with a burning passion for the hex when she leaves. She can’t really ever go back.

I don’t think that’s nothing as a consequence.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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socialsecurity posted:

I mean it was a random poo poo rundown town I don't think it's some shattered dream, Vision was the important part not the town.

Right but it’s where he picked. It’s where his dream for them was.

That’s the broken story she incoherently reconstructed.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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I could go for a cap n carter movie (or series.)

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Harlock posted:

It's fun having the discussion about the morality of the Marvel heroes when Falcon murders like 10 dudes in violent ways of the first 5 minutes into the series.

Some people make a moral distinction between soldiers killing as soldiers in combat actions and killing by other people. The validity of that distinction is certainly up for debate. Pretending that it isn’t a widespread distinction made by very large portions of the public isn’t.

Look at it terms of Cap. Is it okay for soldiers to kill nazis? Once you say yes to that, there are situations where it is moral for states to have soldiers kill certain people and the question becomes which people.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Institutional racism stretches credulity?

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Alchenar posted:

The MCU has always been clear that Stark bankrolled everyone who signed up to be a hero to the extent that money was never an issue for anyone.

They didn’t have to pay for anything. That doesn’t mean they were paid.

Bar Ran Dun fucked around with this message at 23:04 on Mar 20, 2021

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Marsupial Ape posted:

This is indicative of his wealth, but seeing Sam iron his own shirt in a hotel room immediately grounded the character for me. Small details.

This is very much a military officer thing to me.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Yeah they’ve been doing pretty drat well ain’t they. Basically since the start of WandaVision I’ve been checking this thread all the drat time.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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He is a similar thing to what Wanda was constructing in the last series.

Wanda was fabricating a romantic narrative to restore a false past and forcing it on others.

John Walker is a fabricated incoherent romantic narrative with no connection to origin.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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notthegoatseguy posted:

But is he really an rear end in a top hat at this point? We don't see him be an rear end in a top hat until Bucky and Sam brush him off for like the 6th time.

Yes.

The lack of empathy is why. A not rear end in a top hat would recognize what he was was walking into interacting with Sam and Bucky.

Also “targeting civilians”. He is exceptional talented, smart, competent, charismatic, and deeply insecure. The type of person explicitly rejected for the original serum.

That isn’t his fault though and he’s trying to do his best so he is sympathetic and human. He doesn’t completely deserve their scorn.

I think the real contrast to Roger is that Rodgers never gave up on other people. He has given up because his feelings were hurt a few times.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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My money is in the empathy playing out in the flag smashers story line. I bet Sam and Bucky are going to be empathetic to them after some story point.

Walker isn’t.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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This “actually invested in” X has been the big success of both series IMO.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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sticklefifer posted:

I won't be sold until John Walker gets a chance to draxx them sklountz.

I'm kind of not. We're following a post-Thanos world, and it feels like they're wedging in real world issues because a boardroom of rich white guys mandated it. There's no reason to believe that after all the events in the MCU, modern society would be literally the same but also superheroes. The MCU didn't have Trump or Q or BLM, it had Chitauri destroying New York, Ultron almost destroying Earth, Thanos destroying half of all life, and dozens of other existential threats - and that's just the stuff the average civilian knows about. The long-term sociopolitical effects from multiple alien invasions, supervillains destroying cities, appearances of literal gods on Earth, etc. are the kind of thing you have to turn your brain off about in comic books, so when they try to lampshade modern real world issues it doesn't feel authentic or earned to me.

Note that I'm not at all saying these real world minority-focused issues aren't important, just that I don't necessarily need to be hearing about them through the lens of Disney Presents Wokeness™.

Lol

Good literature film and television deals with the lived questions of its audience.

That your response to a show doing that, is to respond in this way is not interesting commentary on the show, it is instead a window into you and what questions you think do not matter.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Captain America is what America thinks of America. To take that symbolic representation seriously the show’s topic fundamentally cannot escape race and its relationship with what we collectively think America is.

Would you rather they halfassed it?

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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In the credits (like 47:23 or 47:24) very quickly an image with “individuals” made to stand out in the text, is followed by another image text with “ won’t save us” made to stand out.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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“My faith is in individuals.” Is in Civil War as Caps letter to Tony.

I’m right about the credits. It is : Individuals won’t save you. I don’t think the resolution of FATWS is going to pull any punches

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Desperado Bones posted:

Oh, and I just remembered that Steve had given blood samples after the incident (Went to quickly check on D+ and indeed, good god and I'm idiot and forgot lol).

There’s some bits about his blood in agent Carter.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Yeah this pulling off the same thing WandaVision did. I really give a poo poo about these characters now. Boat montage was really good.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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I’d watch that.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Sam’s who we want to be.
Walker is who we are.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Phenotype posted:

but without the serum he feels like he's gonna have the same problem as John Walker did: he's a regular human way over his head in a world full of demi-gods and monsters, and he's not skilled enough to handle even human martial arts experts like the Dora Milaje or Batroc.

That’s why they had the: he push’s the truck back up onto the scaffolding scene. With all the serumed up folks watching stunned.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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“Uncle” and “aunt” used for people who aren’t uncles and aunts is a large with complications family thing and not regional.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Terror Sweat posted:

Didn't happen because they are literally exactly where they were at the end of endgame.

What’s a blindness to character development called?

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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I think that both shows are attempting to make all the characters complicated. People are trying to then reconcile complicated with the more traditional clearly defined good/bad archetypes.

The thesis of show, Sam’s viewpoint, is that we should use our empathy to navigate this complexity, rather than resorting to simplistic thinking and violence.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Azhais posted:

this show takes place six months after endgame. The GRC had to be thrown up overnight to deal with the fallout of 4 billion displaced people and there's no way they had anything even vaguely resembling reasonable staffing. The fact that a warehouse in the middle of Latvia had medicine that could have been distributed is a minor logistical miracle.

Karli is a terrorist because given the timelines she was walking down the street, saw a pile of dust turn into a person, and was all "Hanz, get the loving super soldier serum, this means war"

In the past I’ve used the story of the cursed fig tree to try to explain the anger of marginal people. To explain this : “Then he said to the tree, “May no one ever eat fruit from you again.” And his disciples heard him say it.”

The failure of a system to bear fruit when people are hungry is not excused by the fact that it isn’t the season for figs. People who are marginal or have been marginal get this immediately. People who have not been marginal don’t seem to. They waffle about the interpretation and focus on explaining away the failure.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Comrade Fakename posted:

So yeah, they could use some constitutional reform.

The other side of this is that the breaking of traditions and connections to origin with reason is a fundamental action of modernity and capitalism.

I’m not applying good or bad to this, it could be either in a given situation. But it is definitely what western enlightenment based thought does and it is to impose that on another fictional culture.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Sanguinia posted:

Was thinking more along the lines of Renaissance Art than the actual Bible.



Yeah it definitely was referencing this. The image was an Angel descending combined with a pieta. It’s explicit not implicit what the place of each of the characters are in the imagery. Karli is where one finds Jesus in the imagery, which implies really interesting things. If they follow up on it and it’s so explicit that I have a hard time thinking they won’t.

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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Bust Rodd posted:

This was a show about symbolism, it wasn’t a show about meaningful systemic change. That’s why Isaiah’s monument is so important, it doesn’t write any of the wrongs, it just allows him to exist and be a symbol to other black men, like Sam.

Changes in symbolism can break theonomies. And we know there is more story coming. That be a real interesting thing to explore (symbolic change vs material systemic change ).

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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There was quite a bit of sexuality discussion in both GOTG.

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Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006
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ANOTHER SCORCHER posted:

"An entire theatre of people laughed at a deliberate mockery of chivalrous, tragic, romantic love before going home to eat poisoned food and water, masturbate to virtual simulacrums, and take mood-adjusting chemicals."

Revolutionary Romanticism right here btw.

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