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Druids are natural Greens and yes my op speculated if greens can be post-left/right like anprims they can be subdivided into left and right
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# ? Feb 20, 2021 08:52 |
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# ? May 9, 2024 03:43 |
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frankly society isn't going anywhere until we can finally distill politics from left-right abstractions to the subject and object
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# ? Feb 20, 2021 08:52 |
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paul_soccer12 posted:there can not.
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# ? Feb 20, 2021 09:02 |
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smarxist posted:politics is a meta process created by society/civilization and the state of the means of production/ownership and its relationship to the masses, it's not a binary left/right, but more of a gradient between preserving and strengthening those relationships or seeking to abolish them and create new relationships, and everywhere in between the current base/superstructure. you can't abolish the superstructure (neoliberalism) without fundamentally altering the base (private enterprise). the means of production are meaningless without relationships to the people who own/control them, they're just capital, or dead labor. the base/superstructure also would seem to possess mechanisms that recreate itself and reinforce itself, even when assailed vigorously by abolitionists (communists). these are largely due to cultural inertia, socialization, ideological brainwashing through false consciousness, where the values of the benefactors of society are programmed into the masses, subtly, even sinisterly.
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# ? Feb 20, 2021 11:03 |
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On the Andaman Islands they shoot bows at helicopters and I believe they do this neither from a left/right politcal spectrum but from below. As said last page uncontacted tribes truly are the pure third positionists untainted by the French counterrevolution. They also want nothing to do with us so I assume they are smart as hell.
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# ? Feb 20, 2021 11:12 |
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Can left and right wing politics be defined meaningfully without money based economy and capital?
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# ? Feb 21, 2021 21:52 |
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My politics is that not only should people have the right to eat ranch dressing, but that they should be legally obligated to be eat ranch dressing
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# ? Feb 21, 2021 22:17 |
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Road pops should be legal
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# ? Feb 21, 2021 23:06 |
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Maximo Roboto posted:errr there was Left Opposition, Right Opposition, and good ol' Stalin there was a post-capitalist economy in the ussr
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# ? Feb 21, 2021 23:40 |
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Maximo Roboto posted:errr there was Left Opposition, Right Opposition, and good ol' Stalin So, there's Good Imaginary Cavemen, who share their ideological tendency with socdems and new agers trying to drop enough DMT to contact the Andromedans and those guys who crawl internet forums looking to fight anyone impugning Stalin's good name; and there's Bad Imaginary Cavemen who are ideologically aligned with Adolf Hitler and George Bush and Elon Musk, and this seems like a meaningful category to you? I guess in that case your neither left nor right would be everyone who professes to care about quote:mutualism and lack of hierarchy quote:oppression and slavery So, anyone from a liberal to a Pinochet-style dictator. Problem solved!
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# ? Feb 25, 2021 16:37 |
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Proud Peronist over here AMA
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# ? Feb 25, 2021 17:40 |
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I believe only in the law of eating rear end. winner take all
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# ? Feb 25, 2021 18:48 |
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a few DRUNK BONERS posted:the conceptualization of politics as a two dimensional line (or euclidean plane) that we should place ourselves is a deliberate neoliberal invention and we would do well to free our minds from this cartesian paradigm. but how do we even think about this? Like this: Fascism is the politics of the Imaginary, Liberalism is the politics of the Symbolic, Communism is the politics of the Real. The left/right line and the authoritarian/libertarian|economic/social grid are indeed all constructed from a fundamentally liberal perspective. The interlocked Lacanian triple ring is a way out of this, as long as one understands that there's no neutral perspective from which to view the terrain - you're already in the structure somewhere. A political diagram that is not liberal could probably only be made from within a revolutionary movement as it moves. emTme3 has issued a correction as of 19:30 on Feb 25, 2021 |
# ? Feb 25, 2021 19:21 |
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one would hope a revolutionary movement has better things to do with its time, but the truth is found within this thread's very tag
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# ? Feb 25, 2021 19:49 |
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having a concrete map of your political situation is actually probably a pretty high priority, movement wise
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# ? Feb 25, 2021 20:12 |
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I think if there were only a single person to have ever existed then their politics, if extant to begin with, would be neither left nor right
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# ? Feb 25, 2021 20:15 |
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real fuckin easy, actual absolute monarchy, the genesis of the left-right split in modern-era politics is basically arguing what to do after it was gone
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# ? Feb 25, 2021 20:24 |
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left/right is the most simplistic shorthand possible for understanding one dimension of political philosophy if you were educated even slightly less stupid and evil you would understand the full power of natural four dimensional reality
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# ? Feb 25, 2021 20:43 |
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splifyphus posted:Like this: splifyphus, I generally think you have really well informed philosophical takes, but trying to map political ideologies to the Lacanian knot seems like a huge stretch and needs more justification. quote:A political diagram that is not liberal could probably only be made from within a revolutionary movement as it moves. This however is probably true.
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# ? Feb 26, 2021 00:21 |
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get this what if politics, but on the moon
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# ? Feb 26, 2021 00:38 |
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i propose politics be on an up/down spectrum, so that all the times i texted 'u up?' were me wanting to discuss the interlocking mechanisms that propel society forward towards a more just distribution of wealth
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# ? Feb 26, 2021 00:54 |
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bagual posted:real fuckin easy, actual absolute monarchy, the genesis of the left-right split in modern-era politics is basically arguing what to do after it was gone what about monarchial divisions like Legitimism vs. Orléanism, Carlism, Miguelistas, Jacobites, etc. Victory Position posted:get this alarumklok posted:i propose politics be on an up/down spectrum, so that all the times i texted 'u up?' were me wanting to discuss the interlocking mechanisms that propel society forward towards a more just distribution of wealth the enemy's gate is down
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# ? Feb 27, 2021 20:11 |
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politics is a torus
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# ? Feb 27, 2021 20:21 |
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:where's Sun Ra fall on the facebook meme political compass pretty sure that if he were still around today he'd be considered a hotep, especially since he was misogynistic and paternalistic regarding Angela Davis: Black Perspectives' analysis of a 1973 interview with Sun Ra posted:Ra, ever the consummate self-promoter, believed he was the first to explore the idea of the Space Age in his music and poems, thus opening the door for the white race to “realize that well yeah, I can do that now because someone is talking about it.” In other words, Ra and his ideas were the catalyst for humans to travel towards and explore space. Ra seamlessly transitions away from this topic to his thoughts about Angela Davis. Ra views Davis’s acquittal and release as another example of this logic. Ra recounts how he informed individuals in Philadelphia that if only someone Black and sincere would speak out in Davis’s defense, then the creator would set her free. Thus, the all-white jury’s verdict of “not guilty” was only possible because Ra first put forth the notion that Davis would be exonerated. With this statement, Ra single-handedly positioned himself as the sole arbiter of Davis’s freedom while also dismissing the work of her legal team and the transnational grassroots activism that led to her acquittal. so yeah, pretty fuckin authoritarian right-wing tbh Great musician tho
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# ? Feb 27, 2021 21:37 |
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Venomous posted:pretty sure that if he were still around today he'd be considered a hotep, especially since he was misogynistic and paternalistic regarding Angela Davis: so you're saying sun ra was the original muskovite
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# ? Feb 27, 2021 22:49 |
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bagual posted:real fuckin easy, actual absolute monarchy, the genesis of the left-right split in modern-era politics is basically arguing what to do after it was gone Nah. Just because the terms originated in revolutionary France doesn't mean the things they describe first came about there. Afaik and atleast since the magna carta England has never had an absolute monarch yet their were definitely political groups you could identify as being left or right prior to the French revolution.
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# ? Feb 28, 2021 00:33 |
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Weka posted:Nah. Just because the terms originated in revolutionary France doesn't mean the things they describe first came about there. Afaik and atleast since the magna carta England has never had an absolute monarch yet their were definitely political groups you could identify as being left or right prior to the French revolution. That's the thing, though, the concepts of left or right are useful insofar as they're at least explainably coherent ideologies (regardless of whether they are in their practicioners' minds), but the situation as existed then did not ask the same great question as exists now and a modern answer in either sense would be considered incoherent and rejected by the greater world then. That is, there are any number of peasant rebellions that would be considered "left" movements now, yes, they were explicitly movements for the working class, but the lack of direct agency of the working class in the major power struggle between the bourgeoisie and the great nobles mean that they're necessarily historical footnotes and Chumbawamba B-sides. Or viewed from the other direction, any number of attempts at noblesse oblige then which were "right-wing" then--if you take the oversimplification that supporting the more majoritarian faction is "left" and the more exclusive faction is "right"--but, like the feudal notion of a nonmonetary labor-obligation for a nonmonetary sustenance-obligation, live on the left side of self-described Communism today. Taking that oversimplification is also the root of confusing liberalism and leftism, both the majoritarian new answer once the previous question was solved, but with leftism as a counterpoint to liberalism's right.
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# ? Feb 28, 2021 01:14 |
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It seems like you're mostly just saying political ideologies evolved over time.
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# ? Feb 28, 2021 04:13 |
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Victory Position posted:get this It’s like politics but on acid and totally hosed up
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# ? Feb 28, 2021 04:18 |
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Private Cumshoe posted:frankly society isn't going anywhere until we can finally distill politics from left-right abstractions to the subject and object you should get to work on that then
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# ? Feb 28, 2021 04:32 |
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I prefer rear end in a top hat and non-rear end in a top hat.
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# ? Feb 28, 2021 06:24 |
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If the politics aren't left, they're not right.
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# ? Feb 28, 2021 06:46 |
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# ? Feb 28, 2021 06:51 |
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Weka posted:It seems like you're mostly just saying political ideologies evolved over time. The opposite; I'm saying the useful portion of describing political ideologies, rather than the majoritarian-elitist or change-consistency axis you mistake for left-right, is describing which class they favor. Further, before that class is relevant in the dialect driving the era's politics (or before it exists at all!), thought about it hypothetically or nascently existing is like considering pre-Copernican tales about being carried aloft to the firmament by angels our first documented space travel. To say otherwise does nothing but create a confusion between serfdom and "from each according to his ability", a confusion of Yeltsin as a leftist and the Supreme Soviet of the RSFSR as right-wingers, a confusion which inevitably sets leftism again minority cultures (whose concerns and traditions are after all minoritarian and traditional,) a confusion which underpins some of the worst parts of bourgeoisie politics.
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# ? Feb 28, 2021 18:53 |
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:what characteristics would determine if someone is wanting to be a caveman in a left or rightwing way Their opinion on what should be done with people who wear glasses
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# ? Mar 1, 2021 01:57 |
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# ? May 9, 2024 03:43 |
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Mandoric posted:The opposite; I'm saying the useful portion of describing political ideologies, rather than the majoritarian-elitist or change-consistency axis you mistake for left-right, is describing which class they favor. Further, before that class is relevant in the dialect driving the era's politics (or before it exists at all!), thought about it hypothetically or nascently existing is like considering pre-Copernican tales about being carried aloft to the firmament by angels our first documented space travel. since when do minority cultures have outsized influence on politics...?
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# ? Mar 1, 2021 08:01 |