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HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


this is literally just a new tactics ogre why on earth is anyone talking about game of thrones

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Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer
for this game i am excite

mandatory lesbian
Dec 18, 2012

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

this is literally just a new tactics ogre why on earth is anyone talking about game of thrones

well, one is the most famous medeval styled fantasy stories of the last 30 years, and the other is a videogame franchise that hasnt had a new entry in like 20 years

Dackel
Sep 11, 2014


mandatory lesbian posted:

well, one is the most famous medeval styled fantasy stories of the last 30 years, and the other is a videogame franchise that hasnt had a new entry in like 20 years

:negative:

Ace Transmuter
May 19, 2017

I like video games
Um, actually, there's no class system or generic units, so it's actually the most accurate to compare it to Shining Force III :smuggo:

Kingtheninja
Jul 29, 2004

"You're the best looking guy here."
Have only played one battle so far. Units showing greyed out skills, are those skills they unlock at a later level or how do you use them?

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.

Terper posted:

I'm so happy we're finally going to have a good Tactics Ogre game.

I will defend the gently caress out of Let Us Cling Together and Knight of Lodis.

...

They should call this game Bohemian Rhapsody.

100YrsofAttitude
Apr 29, 2013




I know people love job systems and customization, but I really hope it plays it rather straight with just simple classes with maybe a promotion of sorts. I know I have issues with choice paralysis, but aside from that, tactics games need to be balanced and the more customization you have, the harder it is to get that balance right since you now have too many parameters.

It's definitely my least favorite thing from modern FE aside from the often cliché-riddled writing.

Rimusutera
Oct 17, 2014
As someone who loves certain customization elements of the modern era of Fire Emblem a lot I still am interested in seeing this carve out different space; I get the feel that the customization/range of options will be more in the specialists you choose to recruit and them being actually mutally exclusive instead of having reclassing options for each character and I think thats neat.

Bad Video Games
Sep 17, 2017


Ace Transmuter posted:

Um, actually, there's no class system or generic units, so it's actually the most accurate to compare it to Shining Force III :smuggo:

I wouldn't know since the drat thing still isn't translated.

Regy Rusty
Apr 26, 2010

100YrsofAttitude posted:

I know people love job systems and customization, but I really hope it plays it rather straight with just simple classes with maybe a promotion of sorts. I know I have issues with choice paralysis, but aside from that, tactics games need to be balanced and the more customization you have, the harder it is to get that balance right since you now have too many parameters.

It's definitely my least favorite thing from modern FE aside from the often cliché-riddled writing.

I hope so too, I'd really like the choices being in who you want to use based on truly unique and different things each character brings to the party.

waah
Jun 20, 2011

Better stay in line when
You see a Pavel like me shinin

I need this game to have a lot of work done to it before I fall for it.

Not sure if I went in with expectations too high or what but man, this game is boring me.

I've only beaten the first map, but there had to have been a better spot to make a demo from in the game than this right?

I also really want the game to hire an editor or two to cut the dialogue in half so that it becomes interesting instead of rambling.

The voice acting did make me laugh at inopportune times.

There is a very good game here underneath this I think, but there needs to be some serious course correction.

OhFunny
Jun 26, 2013

EXTREMELY PISSED AT THE DNC

100YrsofAttitude posted:

I'd also like a better understanding on attacks that do AOE, though color wasn't my issue. Does a cross-shaped spell hit all 4 sides, or does height break it up? Can your spells damage your own people (No but I wasn't sure if that was the case). The horseman can attack people from two steps away, but if you attack through a person to the one behind them do you hit both (I don't think you do, BUT you will break an Ice wall doing this). Stuff like that could use some clarification. Also if an attack moves you, like "rush" do you return to your starting position or not? Hawk Dive (a leaping attack) does return you effectively giving that character a ranged attack, but "Rush" doesn't, I think.

Only attacks that use TP will use it. Otherwise you gain 1 TP at the start of every turn, there's way to game that though. Your Ice Mage will gain an extra one if he's standing on ice for example. What that means is for example you can use your healer to heal every turn, but she won't gain enough to do the AOE heal unless you skip healing for a couple of turns.

I'm also going to re-hash a bit of what I said in the Switch thread:

After playing the demo my first thought was are that there's waaaaay too much interstitial plot between battles. Now, I figure that there are sidequest fights that'll pop up to keep you busy and the extra long loading times between the world map and the seen was a bit much. All that needs to be streamlined with a simple "Elsewhere" or "Meanwhile". If the scenes feature 0 options and are just extra dialog, like the whatever they were called in FFIX, either play them straight or give the player button prompt to explore them, but having to go through the map each time is long.

Now, I liked the writing and between this and Octopath it's clear the team's got a writer who wants to just explore characters in a fantasy setting, and more power to them. Octopath was really good at the commonality of life in a place like that. Alfyn and Tressa, in particular have rather basic plots and it's refreshing.

The voice-acting is very bad... if I can put it in Japanese I will or I'm just turning it off. It also needs a quick-reset, something I've always liked in FE. In the event you gently caress up you can at least quickly restart your fight if you need too. Having to suspend the battle and reload takes time, unless I missed a load option in the menu.

No music came out as super memorable yet, but they better have a music player this time around. The "Profile' button that shows the character portrait is also kind of strange since it stops all dialog. Why not go the FE route and just have text boxes with a face at the bottom of the screen? A full-body portrait seems like the worst option here.

Skills seem attached to class, which seem very varied. Even if you ostensibly get a fire, ice, and lightning mage, all of them have different powers and implications. I'd presume some level of promotion but nothing extreme I hope. I'd prefer it remaining a bit grounded

Overall, I really liked the game. It's a very good tactics game, it has character, and I like the realistic feudal drama. Favorite character was the Spy/Anna, I got some very good mileage out of her. The battle system is simple but neat. The TP system provides nice hands-on resource management. If you want more mileage out of your mages, you can probably pair them with Julio whose gimmick is pissing TP for everyone else to use.

Also: the whole voting mechanic is neat. You can effectively game it, but just convincing people the way you want a vote to go and ignoring those that are already in your camp, but you get good dialog if you interact with everyone anyway. That sort of choice feels nice, and I'm going to replay it to see what happens if I do give up the Prince.

I loved this actually. I get decision paralysis rather easily when I'm forced to choose too many things, something that's turned me off of modern FE, and something I also dislike since it's easier to find/discover broken classes/combos, which is harder thing to balance. Things that are broken can be fun, but sometimes it trivializes a game so much it's pointless, and you feel like a dope for ignoring it.

Have are my observations.

-Height does not break the 4-cross spells. Weather hit rate/damage is affected is unknown.
-Lance attacks do not hit a friendly unit if one's standing between said unit and enemy.
-Movement attacks are as you say specific. Hawk Dive returns to starting spot, but I think this may be dependent on weather the unit is attacking from high to low and low to high ground. Rush does bring you to the end of the targeted zone.

Regy Rusty posted:

I managed to swing a unanimous vote to protect the prince the first time, but then actually failed to get Frederica to give him up the second go around. The persuasion mechanic does have potential to be very interesting, though it seems like at least as presented here it would always be easy to save and try again if you didn't get the outcome you wanted. Maybe morality choices will make that more complex later on, I dunno.

I hope it all turns out good, it's got me looking forward to it.

It would appear the key to persuasion is twofold. First you must speak to someone and/or find something during the exploration phase and this will unlock additional dialogue that you must select to properly influence that person's vote.

The exploration phase seems very important strategically for some battles. The fight after you surrender the prince is much easier if you activate the sky lifts, especially the right side one, to carry some units up to the top to neutralize the enemy's height advantage and their archers.

OhFunny fucked around with this message at 01:26 on Feb 22, 2021

100YrsofAttitude
Apr 29, 2013




How do you chemist girl? I keep getting the other two?

Regy Rusty
Apr 26, 2010

I don't think anyone REALLY knows yet. All people know is that it seems to have more to do with your hidden morality stat from those choices, and less to do with the route you take in the big decision. I got Julio and Ezana both times, which makes sense because I reloaded from a save right before the persuasion point so my earlier morality choices were preserved.

Scrap Dragon
Oct 6, 2013

SECRET TECHNIQUE:
DARK SHADOW
BLACK FALLEN ANGEL!


I got Medina (the Chemist girl) on my second playthrough by telling Hughette that “Roland must survive at all costs” on the bridge. That was the only choice I’d had the opportunity to make at that point so it’s probably a significant factor.

I don’t remember which choice I made on my first playthrough but it wound up getting me the Shaman lady first.

bewilderment
Nov 22, 2007
man what



It'd definitely be cool if you don't recruit generics and all the people on your own side are unique.


Also reminder that FFTactics literally had this as cutscene dialogue, it's always been political drama just like Tactics Ogre:

quote:

Milleuda: How can you nobles live as you do and yet hold your heads so high? We are not chattel! We are humans, no less than you! What flaw do you hold there to be in us? That we were born between a different set of walls? Do you know what it means to hunger? To sup for months on naught but broth of bean? Why must we be made to starve that you might grow fat? You call us thieves, but it is you who steal from us the right to live!

Argath: You, no less human than we? Ha! Now there's a beastly thought. You've been less than we from the moment your baseborn father fell upon your mother in whatever gutter saw you sired! You've been chattel since you came into the world drenched in common blood!

Milleuda: By whose decree!? Who decides such foul and absurd things?

Argath: 'Tis heaven's will!

Milleuda: Heaven's will? You would pin your bigotry on the gods? No god would fain forgive such sin, much less embrace it! All men are equal in the eyes of the gods!

Argath: Men, yes. But the gods have no eyes for chattel.

Quantum Toast
Feb 13, 2012

Kingtheninja posted:

Have only played one battle so far. Units showing greyed out skills, are those skills they unlock at a later level or how do you use them?
Most of those seemed to unlock over the course of the battle for me, though I don't remember if they coincided with levelups or had their own thing going on.

Tall Tale Teller
May 20, 2003
Grave? Shovel! Let's go.

I like this demo a ton. I wish the camera had a set, rotatable perspective like FFT. Trying to fight the free move into an angle I liked was giving me vertigo.

The end of turn mechanics were clunky for me too. I can't really explain why but I don't like them.

Also the art is some study-hall 10th grade hack action. The character portraits look like it's drawn by somebody who saw some anime once and still calls it "japanimation".

MarsDragon
Apr 27, 2010

"You've all learned something very important here: there are things in this world you just can't change!"

Scrap Dragon posted:

I got Medina (the Chemist girl) on my second playthrough by telling Hughette that “Roland must survive at all costs” on the bridge. That was the only choice I’d had the opportunity to make at that point so it’s probably a significant factor.

I made this choice as well and got Medina, so I'd guess that's the trick.

Scrap Dragon
Oct 6, 2013

SECRET TECHNIQUE:
DARK SHADOW
BLACK FALLEN ANGEL!


Has anyone beaten the “Keep Roland” map without any traps? Do the cutscenes afterwards act like you burnt the town anyway?

OhFunny
Jun 26, 2013

EXTREMELY PISSED AT THE DNC

100YrsofAttitude posted:

How do you chemist girl? I keep getting the other two?

I received Julio on the protect the prince route and Medina on the surrender him route. Shaman on both. I assume that is the difference.


Edit

Regy Rusty posted:

I don't think anyone REALLY knows yet. All people know is that it seems to have more to do with your hidden morality stat from those choices, and less to do with the route you take in the big decision. I got Julio and Ezana both times, which makes sense because I reloaded from a save right before the persuasion point so my earlier morality choices were preserved.

Oh I guess I should have read further down. That is interesting if the recruitable party members is based on your morality score rather than your story path.

OhFunny fucked around with this message at 08:12 on Feb 22, 2021

Salastine
Nov 4, 2008

Scrap Dragon posted:

Has anyone beaten the “Keep Roland” map without any traps? Do the cutscenes afterwards act like you burnt the town anyway?

I have and the story recognized that no traps were used.

The whole time I was playing the map I was like, "of course the story will just pretend the traps were used or just have them be used in a cutscene afterwards" so it was actually a nice surprise when neither of those things happened.

Salastine fucked around with this message at 08:49 on Feb 22, 2021

Evrart Claire
Jan 11, 2008

bewilderment posted:

It'd definitely be cool if you don't recruit generics and all the people on your own side are unique.


Also reminder that FFTactics literally had this as cutscene dialogue, it's always been political drama just like Tactics Ogre:

On my last playthrough of FFT it was very satisfying to get Argath killed in every fight he's a guest in.

100YrsofAttitude
Apr 29, 2013




I only ever played FFTA, which was fine. I didn't quite care for the fantasy world, but it was fine. Is there any easy way to do FFT or even Tactics Ogre?

Josuke Higashikata
Mar 7, 2013


100YrsofAttitude posted:

I only ever played FFTA, which was fine. I didn't quite care for the fantasy world, but it was fine. Is there any easy way to do FFT or even Tactics Ogre?

FFT is on mobile devices nowadays.
Tactics Ogre is locked to PSP.

I'd probably advise FFT: WOTL on PSP emulator with the slowdown patched out, and it's really the only option for Tactics Ogre. PPSSPP is a really good emulator to boot and runs well on Windows and Android (no idea about apple os).
Of course, those games are not necessarily easily commerically available but you can use your imagination for sources.


Both games would be no brainers for a Switch port to me.

Josuke Higashikata fucked around with this message at 10:36 on Feb 22, 2021

Hammer Bro.
Jul 7, 2007

THUNDERDOME LOSER

Blackbelt Bobman posted:

Another gripe I have is the names of the items.

Gonna give Hughette an HP Pellet in Triangle Strategy :allears:

100YrsofAttitude
Apr 29, 2013




Medina is just Tressa from Octopath huh?

The other two recruits are arguably more useful...

waah
Jun 20, 2011

Better stay in line when
You see a Pavel like me shinin

That's not how you talk to a true merchant!

100YrsofAttitude
Apr 29, 2013




Never mind she’s great. A very useful healer in a pinch if you have cash for items.

glassyalabolas
Oct 21, 2006
I want to bowl with the gangsters...

Just got the survey. What are we all going to say?

mandatory lesbian
Dec 18, 2012

glassyalabolas posted:

Just got the survey. What are we all going to say?

honest opinions i hope

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.
They list Tactics Ogre in the "Similar Games you might like" section.

Also Super Robot Wars.

waah
Jun 20, 2011

Better stay in line when
You see a Pavel like me shinin

glassyalabolas posted:

Just got the survey. What are we all going to say?

Please take whatever ever script you have, and try to find a way to put the story in half as many words.

Bad Video Games
Sep 17, 2017


Just got the survey in my email. I gave it a 3/5 stars and my biggest complaints were how long the battles were.

Mezzanon
Sep 16, 2003

Pillbug

Walla posted:

Just got the survey in my email. I gave it a 3/5 stars and my biggest complaints were how long the battles were.

I dunno, they felt a little highly tuned (which they mentioned before the demo came out) but I didn’t feel like they dragged on.

Bad Video Games
Sep 17, 2017


They felt a little tedious to me but I've always felt that way about FFT/Tactics Ogre style games. Doesn't stop me from enjoying them though.

OhFunny
Jun 26, 2013

EXTREMELY PISSED AT THE DNC
They said they tuned the battle difficulty higher than they will be in the final game.

Much like they did with Bravely Default 2's first demo.

Bad Video Games
Sep 17, 2017


I know. It's a design decision that I don't understand. I'd much rather have the demo have the intended difficulty than some inflated one.

Also I said the battles were tedious, not hard. I feel the inflated difficulty made the battles longer than they needed to be.

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Blackbelt Bobman
Jul 17, 2004

I don't need friends! I've been
manipulatin' you since the start!
All so I can something,
something X-Blade!


Please mention the blue/purple squares so I’m not the only one!!

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