Law & Order: Original, SVU and OC "Never get Freudian on a man holding a pickle"

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > TV IV > Law & Order: Original, SVU and OC "Never get Freudian on a man holding a pickle"

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MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

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Law & Order is a media franchise created by Dick Wolf consisting of five TV series, with a sixth series only days away as of this writing. Though its star has faded considerably from its heyday, it is still one of the most enduring, popular drama franchises of all time, with two series reaching 20 seasons and all told, over 1,000 hours of programming across the entire franchise. As of right now, only one series is currently on the air, but, as mentioned, another is only days away and at various times over the years, thoughts of a revival for the original series have been kicked around. Is 2021 the year of the glorious resurgence of :doink:

?!

Law and Order (1990 - 2010, 2022 - )

quote:

In the criminal justice system, the people are represented by two separate yet equally important groups: the police who investigate crime, and the district attorneys who prosecute the offenders. These are their stories.

The original. Accept no substitutions. A series about homicides taking place under the purview of the 27th precinct in Manhattan, the detectives that solve them and the district attorneys that prosecute them. The show had a lot of turnover over the course of two decades and as thus, can be split up into a lot of different eras with a lot of different characters but when people think of the original, they tend to think of two people in particular, Executive Assistant District Attorney Jack McCoy (portrayed by Sam Waterston) and the immortal Detective Lennie Briscoe (portrayed by Jerry Orbach). At this point, probably the most serialized and formulaic of all the Laws & Orders, rarely dipping into plots that weren't resolved by the end of that episode, although by the time the last few seasons rolled around, they were willing to dip into some season-long arcs, such as Jack McCoy's promotion to and campaign to remain the District Attorney of New York City and Lieutenant Anita Van Buren's (portrayed by S. Epatha Merkerson) battle with cervical cancer, the latter of which unintentionally became the emotional thru-line and climax of the entire show, as Law & Order was unexpectedly canceled during the filming of "Rubber Room", the final episode of Season 20. Attempts to get the show back on TV have bubbled up and then evaporated at various points over the last decade, ultimately going nowhere, but, come on, they gotta do something while Sam Waterston is still working, right?

drat STRAIGHT THEY DO! On September 28, 2021, NBC ordered a new season of the original Law & Order, bringing the show back for a 21st season!

https://twitter.com/lawandordertv/status/1484331454666444804

Season 21 will be a mix of old characters returning (both Sam Waterston and Anthony Anderson will return as their characters on one-year deals) and new, with Hugh Dancy and Odelya Halevi joining as ADAs and Camryn Manheim as a lieutenant, playing the successor to Anita Van Buren. The series is set to return on Thursday, February 24th, 2022. I for one am just overjoyed Jack McCoy is back.

Law & Order: Special Victims Unit (1999 - present)

quote:

In the criminal justice system, sexually-based offenses are considered especially heinous. In New York City, the dedicated detectives who investigate these vicious felonies are members of an elite squad known as the Special Victims Unit. These are their stories.

As of right now, the last man standing. Largely starting from a similar place to what the original had evolved into by 1999, except with the twist that it dealt specifically with sex crimes, SVU eventually evolved into a very different, very dark, very weird show that, once it had all locked into place, spent a lot of time focusing intimately on the (often crappy) lives of its core cast of detectives. As the series went on, both these characters and the plots of the show would wind up descending into complete insanity, with the centerpiece of it all tending to be Detective Elliot Stabler (portrayed by Christopher Meloni), an unstable cop with an equally insane family who often beat the living poo poo out of suspects, who would eventually leave the series after 12 seasons due to contract disputes between Meloni and NBC. Detective Olivia Benson (portrayed by Mariska Hargitay), the other half of the series' initial main duo, is notable for being there since day one of the series, back in 1999, through every single season, right up until today and the currently airing season 22, so not only has SVU passed the original in episodes, Mariska Hargitay alone has been in more Law & Order than the entire original series.

The series is also noteworthy for having Detective John Much, who A) Rules and B) Through his presence alone connects about a dozen shows together. Apparently it's been scientifically proven that the entire Law and Order series is the fantasy of some kid staring at a snow globe because of John Munch, go figure.

And I'm gonna be honest with you, I don't remember the rest super well, so I'm gonna be mostly paraphrasing wikipedia and the previous thread for those.

Law & Order: Criminal Intent (2001-2010)

quote:

In New York City's war on crime, the worst criminal offenders are pursued by the detectives of the Major Case Squad. These are their stories.

Criminal Intent follows the "Major Case Squad", detectives who dealt with crimes that were either big because of the crime (big murder, big kidnap or big robbery) or big because of the people involved, politicians and other fancy, important people. The other hook of Criminal Intent was that it focused heavily on the actions of the criminals. The cold open, which in most Law & Order is a slice of life bit about some poor shmuck that's about 30 seconds away from finding a dead body, in Criminal Intent was focused on the criminal and the crime they were about to, were in the process of or had just committed. This aspect of the criminal and who they were was played up a lot through one of the main characters, Detective Bobby Goren, who excelled at getting into criminals' heads. Another way Criminal Intent tended to buck the formula, was that instead of the final showdown of an episode taking place in a courtroom, it would instead be the detectives trying to illicit a confession from the criminal.

Law & Order: Trial By Jury (2005-2006)

quote:

In the criminal justice system, all defendants are innocent until proven guilty, either by confession, plea bargain, or trial by jury. This is one of those trials.

And we come to the first of the two Law and Orders that couldn't. Boy, they tried, but they just...couldn't. By the time of Trial By Jury's inception, the court room wasn't as integral a part of either SVU or Criminal Intent as it was the original, those shows focusing more on their detective characters, so this show went in the opposite direction, focusing heavily on the process of preparing for trial, jury selection, etc. And despite it doing decent ratings, particular on a Friday night and as a midseason replacement, the show still got smacked around pretty hard by Numb3rs for its entire run and NBC eventually decided to cancel it in May 2005, the final episode eventually airing on CourTV some seven months later. The show is notable for having the final appearances of Jerry Orbach as Lenny Briscoe before he succumbed to cancer in December 2004.

Law & Order: LA (2010-2011)
I couldn't find a Steve Zirnkilton opening quote for this one. Unbelievable.
It's Law & Order.... ... ...In Los Angeles! And also apparently with a bunch of crazy behind the scenes problems. Just outright quoting Timby from the previous thread:

Timby posted:

This one ... was a doozy. Dick Wolf had been talking with NBC about a Los Angeles-based spin-off for at least two years prior to Vanilla's end, particularly after the runaway success of CSI: Miami. Wolf claims that he had been promised a shortened, final 21st season of the original Law & Order that would have run in late 2010 to feed directly into Los Angeles as a mid-season replacement, but the abrupt cancellation of Law & Order in the spring kiboshed those plans, pushing Los Angeles into a September 2010 premiere slot despite not even having a pilot script written or filmed. Veteran Law & Order producer Rene Balcer ran the show, with several other longtime L&O writers on board, but it was marked by a tumultuous production -- with a premiere of September 29, 2010, the series only began filming in the middle of August, and casting was still ongoing well into early September.

Skeet Ulrich and Corey Stoll originally starred as Detectives Rex Winters and T.J. Jaruszalski, with Alfred Molina and Terrence Howard alternating as the Deputy District Attorney of the Week. The series had significant departures from the traditional Law & Order format; for the first time in the Law & Order universe, composer Mike Post was not retained to write either the theme or the episodes' music, replaced by Icelandic composer Atli Orvarsson, and the show did not originally even have a main theme or intro sequence.

Following disappointing reviews and quickly dropping ratings, Los Angeles was removed from NBC's schedule after the 8th episode on December 1, 2010. Production was halted, and the show underwent a major retooling. Despite five more episodes already having been completed with them, Skeet Ulrich and co-stars Megan Boone and Regina Hall were fired, while Alfred Molina's character of DDA Ricardo Morales was shifted to replace Ulrich's Rex Winters as a detective, with Terrence Howard becoming the full-time DDA. Alana de la Garza was brought on to reprise her Vanilla role of Connie Rubirosa, in the hopes that it would attract longtime L&O viewers originally turned off by Los Angeles' first eight episodes.

The show returned more than four months later, on April 11, 2011, and while the series had experienced a massive creative resurgence, ratings continued to drop (episode nine, "Zuma Canyon," grabbed three million fewer viewers than episode eight had in December), and the show was canceled shortly before episode 15 aired in May. Following the cancellation, NBC burned off the remaining seven episodes (including the five starring Skeet Ulrich).

Fun fact, both Terrence Howard and Alfred Molina were also in SVU! Terrence Howard as Deputy District Attorney John Dekker, the same character he portrayed in LA and Alfred Molina as... *checks notes* a rapist! So, probably not the same character.

Law & Order: Organized Crime (2021 - present)

quote:

In the nation's largest city, the vicious and violent members of the underworld are hunted by the detectives of the Organized Crime Control Bureau. These are their stories

The newest Law & Order series, centered around the return to the franchise of Christopher Meloni as Detective Elliot Stabler as he joins a task force dedicated to fighting organized crime. A marked departure from other Law & Order series in terms of format as it almost entirely eschews the episodic format of the rest of the franchise to go all in on long-term seasonal arcs. And with all that room to breathe, there's plenty of time to spend on Stabler's family and his drama with Benson and constant crossovers with SVU! Hoo....ray....? Here's a quick and dirty guide, courtesy of wikipedia, to the crossovers, because I fell way behind on both of these shows!

Season 22, episode 9 of SVU leads into season 1, episode 1 of Organized Crime.
Season 22, episode 13 of SVU leads into season 1, episode 5 of Organized Crime.
Season 23, episode 9 of SVU leads into season 2, episode 9 of Organized Crime.

Hey, look on the bright side, at least all of these episodes are on Peacock. Remember that SVU crossover that concluded on Trial By Jury? That poo poo's still lost to time.

Where can I watch these shows?!
Law & Order: Thursdays on NBC, 8 Eastern / 9 Central on NBC
Law & Order: Special Victims Unit: Thursdays on NBC, 9 Eastern / 8 Central
Law & Order: Organized Crime: Thursdays on NBC, 10 Eastern / 9 Central NBC

Thankfully, NBC having its own streaming service makes the rest of this pretty simple.
- All of SVU, Criminal Intent and Seasons 13-20 of the original Law & Order are available on Peacock.
- SVU, Organized Crime and Criminal Intent are all on the Free tier. To watch Seasons 13-20 of the original, you have to have at least Peacock Premium, which is 4.99 a month.
- I can't confirm but I assume new episodes of the original will go on Peacock's free tier after airing.
- New episodes of SVU and Organized Crime will be added to Peacock and viewable for free a day after airing.
- Seasons 1-12 of the original, Trial by Jury and LA don't seem to be easily viewable anywhere at the moment.

Hopefully NBC will add them to Peacock sooner or later. I mean. Why else even have a Peacock?

I gotta be honest, I just really love Law & Order and I'm really excited that a new series is right around the corner and the old thread has been vaulted for like four years and I just wanna discuss this franchise with some people. All glory to the doink doink!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP3MuUTmXNk

MJeff fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Feb 26, 2022

# ¿ Mar 31, 2021 05:52

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# ¿ May 22, 2024 18:12

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

It's definitely time to kill Stabler's wife so we can finally make Benson/Stabler canon.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2021 20:06

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Ion TV does big blocks of syndicated shows each day and on Saturdays it does SVU and it's just so easy to have it on in the background and watch episode after episode. They used to do classic, too, but they replaced it with Blue Bloods, which is so much worse of a show that it makes me angry.

# ¿ Apr 1, 2021 05:38

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

I heard SVU did an episode on "pandemic parties" or something (this is where I reveal despite making this thread, I've only seen SVU up to like the end of Season 17), how did that turn out?

# ¿ Apr 1, 2021 06:10

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

One of them is a DA! So the cop kids can argue with her about the extremely illegal poo poo they do.

# ¿ Apr 1, 2021 15:28

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Shimrra Jamaane posted:

Why are the first 9 seasons of law and order not available to stream? They used to be on Netflix like 6 years ago.

No idea. Probably some complicated rights, syndication related thing. Hopefully Peacock gets them eventually.

Anyway, I dunno if you guys have heard, but, some guy named Stoobler is back tonight and it's starting now.

# ¿ Apr 2, 2021 02:01

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Timby posted:

I'm curious to see if Organized Crime has a traditional L&O opening, complete with a Mike Post theme, or if it's going to be a title card with a brief sting, like the #OneChicago shows and Law & Order Los Angeles.

Complete ratings bomb if it doesn't have a Steve Zirnkilton quote about the crime families of New York and the elite task force that hunts them down or whatever.

# ¿ Apr 2, 2021 02:04

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

lol oh my god, Stabler's lovely kids have gotten so old.

# ¿ Apr 2, 2021 02:08

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

That was awesome. I wanted to watch Stabler break the QAnon guy in two.

# ¿ Apr 2, 2021 02:17

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Ahahahahahahah. Offscreen!?

# ¿ Apr 2, 2021 02:50

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

"You've been my poster boy for why the system works, Elliot Stabler."

Incredible.

# ¿ Apr 2, 2021 03:02

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

That got kinda good in the last 10 minutes.

# ¿ Apr 2, 2021 03:58

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Jose Oquendo posted:

Yeah it had a rough start but it�s not bad. So I guess this is going to have a season long story arc?

Seems like Dylan McDermott is gonna be the main antagonist for at least a bit. I like it, seems like an interesting character.

# ¿ Apr 2, 2021 04:00

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

YeahTubaMike posted:

Lol Dylan McDermott actually said "woke"

To which his racist dad responded, "...what's woke? :confused:

# ¿ Apr 2, 2021 05:35

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Hand Knit posted:

I appreciate the The Third Man reference. I don't know if it was any good, and I don't know if the show overall is any good, but I appreciate the reference.

Jack McCoy once reference The Third Man in a cross-examination like 15 years ago!

The subject of that episode?

Fake vaccinations. :v:

# ¿ Apr 2, 2021 17:00

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

J-Spot posted:

I haven't really paid much attention to the L&O universe since maybe the first season of SVU after Stabler left, but I figured I had to at least check out the first episode of his return. I hadn't read anything about this new series so I was expecting this two-parter would just set up the Stabler's reason for returning before moving on to the typical case of the week fare. Then I see Dylan McDermott emerge as the antagonist and it dawns on me that this would not actually be a procedural since he was listed in the credits as a series regular. I guess I'll have to stick with it now to see how a serialized L&O plays out.

I do find it kind of weird that they chose to make the beginning of an ongoing storyline kick off as an episode of SVU before switching to a new show. It makes sense for one night as an event, but for future streaming or syndication of OC you now have to seek out a random episode of another series to get the beginning unless they work that one episode into the package like how some of the Homicide crossovers on the original L&O made it into the cable reruns.

They did this with the Trial By Jury premiere too and it has the inverse effect. Now whenever you're watching SVU re-runs, this episode just ends with Casey getting the absolute crap beaten out of her and having to hand the case off to someone else, it's super unsatisfying.

# ¿ Apr 3, 2021 19:31

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

btw, for week one at least, this block was a massive success.

The last new episode of SVU did a 0.3 18-34, 0.6 18-49 and 0.9 25-54 with 3.6 million viewers
This past week's SVU did 1.0, 1.6 and 2.1 with 7.6 million viewers. And basically everyone stuck around to watch Organized Crime, unsurprisingly.

So all of the :supaburn:

STABLER'S BACK :supaburn:

ads you were forcefed for weeks worked. :v:

# ¿ Apr 5, 2021 03:23

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

I'm gonna go ahead and guess that the biker guy is the culprit for this one.

# ¿ Apr 9, 2021 02:25

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Well that escalated quickly.

# ¿ Apr 9, 2021 02:28

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

fartknocker posted:

That didn�t sound like Steven Zirnkilton...

It feasibly sounds like a 60 year old Steve Zirnkilton. When's the last time he did a new intro, like 15 years ago?

Fake covid vaccines!!

# ¿ Apr 9, 2021 03:05

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

lmao I kinda admire them just going "look I don't have time for the UC poo poo today."

# ¿ Apr 9, 2021 03:43

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

drat Stabler got his rear end whupped.

# ¿ Apr 9, 2021 03:59

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Hand Knit posted:

Do we recognize eye scar guy yet?

Was the guy in the mask supposed to be Dylan McDermott's driver?

# ¿ Apr 9, 2021 04:07

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Cripes, I totally forgot about this. :lol:

I miss anything with SVU?

# ¿ Apr 16, 2021 03:07

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Stabler going "I'm not taking drugs" to his bipolar daughter. :laffo:

# ¿ Apr 16, 2021 03:10

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

...Blacklist is still going? How old is it, like 10 years?

# ¿ Apr 16, 2021 03:14

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

...did we know before this episode that the sarge was gay?

# ¿ Apr 16, 2021 03:20

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

I dunno that I would advertise bitcoin as "this thing that has gone up and then completely loving cratered multiple times".

# ¿ Apr 16, 2021 03:22

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

By god, he's diabolical.

# ¿ Apr 16, 2021 03:43

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

I'm invested enough in OC's story so far, but, yes, I want the original Law and Order back too. I honestly wouldn't even just mind if they brought back the entire cast of season 20 and just picked up from there. Lupo-Bernard-Rubirosa-Cutter was one of my favorite combos in the entire show and Van Buren and McCoy as the respective authority figures worked super well.

The show just got so much drat better when Branch hosed off.

# ¿ Apr 21, 2021 22:48

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Hand Knit posted:

I really like the original Law and Order format, but I don't know if the show could be brought back, just on a cultural level. By that I mean partially that in terms of political culture you can't just bring back a 'good cops' show so easily.

Blue Bloods is successful and that show is so much worse about that than L&O ever was./

# ¿ Apr 21, 2021 23:08

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

That makes sense since the finale and really the entire season was definitely built to say goodbye to her. That it wound up hastily becoming the emotional climax of the entire show and still worked as well as it did says a lot about how much Van Buren ruled.

# ¿ Apr 21, 2021 23:18

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

lol this guy's kinda a dick.

# ¿ Apr 23, 2021 02:24

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

lol dude why is everybody connected to Rollins such a loving caricature.

# ¿ Apr 23, 2021 02:35

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

....wait, Benson's brother ODed?

I knew Tucker was dead. :rip:

So weird how he went from the biggest rear end in a top hat in the show to Benson's bae.

# ¿ Apr 23, 2021 02:45

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

MorrisBae posted:

I�ll call Son walks in, mom drops gun, cops with gun cannon outside snipe her in the head

You're two for two so far!

# ¿ Apr 23, 2021 02:58

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

fartknocker posted:

Rofl the literal �and everybody cheered� ending

God I love them shoving that "btw there's a gofundme, you'll be fine" in there, like, you can't even cut to two days later for that?

YOOOOO WE GOT A STUPID CROSSOVER

# ¿ Apr 23, 2021 03:00

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

drat Kathleen got owned.

Didn't she have like, one single little scar on her eyebrow?

# ¿ Apr 23, 2021 03:02

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Hand Knit posted:

I thought so but couldn't remember.

Also, I figure there's no way Gina survives this episode.

Noooo, she's toast.

# ¿ Apr 23, 2021 03:16

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# ¿ May 22, 2024 18:12

MJeff: Jun 2, 2011; THE LIAR

Hey, Carisi!

Hand Knit posted:

This guy's hosed too.

Super dead.

Haven't they already done this exact plot in L&O multiple times before? I know Jack did a phony arraignment once and another time, somebody had a mob lawyer and they did this fake trial thing.

# ¿ Apr 23, 2021 03:23

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > TV IV > Law & Order: Original, SVU and OC "Never get Freudian on a man holding a pickle"

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