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JohnKilltrane posted:Unit Spotlight: Corsair Corsairs were not really used en-masse except as a hard counter to mass muta. Otherwise, they were mostly a fringe unit, sometimes used for scouting or a bit of harassing with one or two, but not in anyway game deciding. This all changed in March 2007. The setting is the 10th MSL Finals hosted for the first time by GOM TV. On the one side you have five time consecutive finalist and three time winner - the "Maestro" himself - sAviOr. Savior boasted a 83.9% victory rate against Protoss in the highest leagues. He had easily defeated the three best Protoss of the time (Reach, Nalra and Kingdom). He was the undisputed champion of the time. On the other side you had the newcomer Bisu. He was seen as a solid player. He had lost in the Round of 16 in the OSL (the other premier tournament) half a year ago. But he was showing a spectacular run in his first ever MSL, beating Nalra (the PvP champion, with a win-rate of 87.5%) 3 - 0 in order to reach the finals. At this time, the PvZ match-up was mostly seen as solved. Against equally skilled players, Protoss needed to hit with very hard timing attacks or cheese in order to have a chance. Savior had won the last 13 Best of 3 or 5 matches against Protoss, winning 75% of the games. The outcome was clear: Bisu had a 2.69% chance of winning. This had been plastered all over the air waves. Savior would be crowned.  In light of this, Bisu stated that he was confident and would defeat Savior 3-0 or 3-1. Everyone laughed at his bravado, cheap talk and false confidence. As preparation for the match - his first ever finals - Bisu celebrated his teams 2006 Proleague championship title with a vacation in Busan. He won 3 - 0. With (basically) the same build. A build, a strategy, a revolutionary redefining of the entire match-up not seen before and not seen since. In a single hour, on the biggest E-Sports stage, on national TV, Bisu became the "Revolutionist."  The build was based on a fast expansion build. Through meticulous scouting and keeping his Probe alive as long as possible, he constantly knew what Savior was doing. Seeing that Savior went for a Hachery-first strategy, he safely went Nexus-first himself, followed up by a Forge and Cannon in order to safeguard his expansion and main. He quickly built two Assimilators and a Stargate. And built a Corsair to scout. And then he built a second one in order to harass Overlords. But then he continued building Corsairs. Something nobody had ever done.  While this was going on, Bisu wasn't hunkering down in order to withstand the Zerg onslaught while teching up to High Templar and Storm. Instead he built a second (and third and fourth) Gateway and sent Zealots to their death. He was constantly sending out one or two or three Zealots, harassing the Zerg expansions, forcing Savior to defend them, build some units, send his drones to safety, losing Zerglings, etc. He just couldn't build up enough forces.  And during all of this, Bisu started building Dark Templar.  And it all came together. Suddenly the masses of Corsair killed Overlords, Dark Templar snuck through the cracks of Detection, and Zealots killed the Hydralisks Savior was frantically building in order to protect his Overlords. By the time Savior managed to get everything under control, Bisu had such a huge lead that his army of Zealots, Dragoons, and High Templar were unstoppable. Watch this one minute clip (enable subtitles) - showing the moment in game three where it all comes together. https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxS_EulJs6ul8HH-6UT7kUWR66UM2K5sE5?si=ZYhCzRetXjXDDwWp (Embedding of clips apparently doesn't work) For three games Savior tried to find a solution. The undisputed "Maestro" of Zerg, the smartest Zerg of his time, known for his strategic creativity could not find a solution to even become competitive. It was an absolute massacre. Savior had no chance. He ran headlong into a paradigm shift. And the match-up was never the same again. If you want to get the pure experience, then you can watch the three games with the original Korean live casters' commentary translated in the subtitles (turn them on!) here: Game One - A New Paradigm Game Two - It Wasn't a Fluke Game Three - A New Master Those three games are definitely worth a watch - seeing the commentators trying to figure out what Bisu is doing is very different from other commentators years later talking about this classic game with all the experience gathered since then. You can also watch game three with a history lesson by Tasteless here (Game start at 2:00 is linked): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVx0aOg3Nc0&t=120s DTurtle fucked around with this message at 01:32 on Feb 9, 2024 |
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Feb 9, 2024 00:16
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DTurtle posted:There is some extremely interesting Starcraft history here. Thank you! I love me a bit of lore. I really don't like watching competitive play, but I love stories, and I love meta-talk.
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Feb 9, 2024 00:44
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DTurtle posted:He ran headlong into a paradigm shift. And the match-up was never the same again. great stuff. how long did it take for zerg to come up with a counter to that play, thereby restoring the balance of the universe?
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Feb 9, 2024 03:45
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DTurtle posted:There is some extremely interesting Starcraft history here. This is really cool, goddamn.
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Feb 9, 2024 03:58
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redleader posted:great stuff. how long did it take for zerg to come up with a counter to that play, thereby restoring the balance of the universe? I’m no expert by any means, but Day9 has a video laying out the meta shift. Analysis starts around 5 minutes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oM3Z7FjuixU
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Feb 9, 2024 05:09
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is it the Queen that's the other medium air unit?
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Feb 9, 2024 06:58
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DTurtle posted:There is some extremely interesting Starcraft history here. This is a phenomenal write-up, thank you so much. There's a reason Corsairs were synonymous with Bisu for a long while (and to an extent still are). Aces High posted:is it the Queen that's the other medium air unit? Exactly. Queen and Corsair are the only Mediums of the sky.
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Feb 9, 2024 18:25
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You know, I actually did go looking up the sizes of various air units, deciding I wouldn't post it and be labelled a cheater, but just for my own curiosity. I looked up literally every other flying unit in the game other than Carriers and BCs before finally remembering the Queen exists.
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Feb 9, 2024 18:29
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Protoss X04: The Quest For Uraj  Now then, Kerrigan. Perhaps you had best explain yourself. What is this news you’ve come to give? There is a new Overmind growing on Char. What?! Impossible! Why should we believe anything you have to say? Because, Zeratul, I’m no longer the mindless murderess whom you fought on Char. The Overmind is dead. Whatever warped control it once had over me is gone. I know that this is a lot to take in all at once, but you’ve got to believe me! There’s more at stake here than – She lies! She is infested to the core! I, for one, will not listen to any of this – Silence, Judicator. Continue, Kerrigan.(Aldaris leaves the chat) Apparently, many of the renegade Cerebrates, commanded by Daggoth, have merged into a new Overmind. Fortunately, the creature is still in its infant stages. It can’t control the Swarm yet, but Daggoth and the others still have control over most of the Broods. The two Cerebrates you killed here were a part of Daggoth’s forces.(Does the name Daggoth mean anything to the Protoss?) Look, I don’t need to yell you all what might happen if that thing reaches maturity. I can guarantee you that should it awaken, it’ll take full control of me just like it did before. I don’t want that to happen, and I’m pretty sure you don’t want it to happen either. Even if what you say is true, our priority is to save this world, not assault the new Overmind! We must find the crystals Uraj and Khalis before we are all vanquished. Then I’ll help you with your search. If you can defeat the renegade Zerg gathered here, it’ll weaken the efforts of Daggoth and his ilk. My children, you must put aside your fears and misgivings to accomplish what must be done. For the time being, Kerrigan will assist you in your endeavors. Though she has been your enemy, it is enough that we share the same agenda now. Allow her time enough to prove herself to you, and you may find her to be a valued ally. For now, you must focus on the task at hand. Search for the Uraj on the planet Braxis, and let nothing stop you from recovering it. We will do what you ask, Matriarch. But you cannot expect us to forgive Kerrigan’s crimes against our race! Executor, prepare our forces. We shall debark for the planet Braxis before the next moonrise.Mission Objectives: Bring Kerrigan to the Uraj crystal Kerrigan must survive I like the way this expansion handles the Overmind: on the one hand, of course the Zerg are going to try to remake the Overmind. What else would they do? On the other hand, the last thing we want is a “Somehow, the Overmind returned” retreading of the game we just finished. But as we’ll see throughout the expansion, this “new Overmind” is going to be more of a catalyst and plot device than an antagonist. Minor spoilers, but based on what I remember of this expansion’s story, Kerrigan actually is telling the truth here. Of course, telling the truth and being honest aren’t exactly the same thing… On with the mission. We start with a look at the enemy.  Terran! Protoss vs Terran is too rare a matchup in these campaigns. Three Shuttles zoom in.   Like last mission, these are controlled by the AI. They unload…   …one Dragoon and one Reaver each. Well drat. RIP in peace, Terran base.   Easily handled. And we have another Shuttle coming in as well, dropping off…   Some Probes, and Kerrigan. Oh, and also note the resource situation: they started us with a small chunk of minerals for building Scarabs, and don’t give us our real starting amount until the Probes arrive. We need to sack the rest of this base, first.     Pretty simple. This is a fun opening setpiece that's particularly great for anyone who's been neglecting the glory that is the Protoss Reaver. Explain something to me, Zeratul. Why would your people leave such a sacred crystal in the hands of these Terrans? We didn’t. Long ago, this world was a Protoss colony called Khyrador. When the strife between our tribes escalated, this planet and the Uraj crystal were abandoned. These Terrans have come here only recently.But who are these Terrans? Here's our objective in the bottom right:  Also, you may have noticed: new tileset! Now we get the Obligatory Ice World in the mix. Fun fact: on this tileset, the white player colour is replaced with dark green to help visibility. The more you know. Executor, we have a problem. Our warp matrix was damaged during transit. Because of the extensive damage, we will be unable to warp in Stargates to this location!Well that’s downright rude. Give us a new unit and then yank it away the very next mission. I suspect the actual reason for it is because we could otherwise abuse Disruption Web to just put Kerrigan in a Shuttle and have her beeline to the crystal. I guess in theory it also pushes us to diversify a bit, but Scouts and Corsairs aren’t staple units for us, and Carriers and Arbiters haven’t shown up yet. A closeup of Kerry because it's been a while:  Kerrigan is the exact same as we remember her, only she isn’t quite as exciting here as she was in Episode 2. We’ve already got all the Psi Storms we could want, and as of two missions ago we have cloaked warriors as well. Most importantly, we don’t have anything that’s a good candidate for Consume – it’s one thing to chew up a Zergling for 50 space mana, it’s another thing to chew up a Zealot for the same. Fortunately, even by Protoss standards she’s a combat powerhouse, and while we can get our own cloaked warriors now, we don’t start with any and they’re a ways up the tech tree. Whereas Kerrigan?   Is here now. Also, Red. These Terrans are the Dominion. I guess Braxis was a part of Mengsk’s consolidation push mentioned in the Lorepost. Well? I am at your disposal, Executor. Shall we proceed? Ah… Surely there is a better tactical option… Don’t be so skittish, I don’t bite. Here, I’ll help. Do you want me to scour these Terrans from your path for you? Now all you have to say is “Yes” or “No.” I dislike it as well, Executor, but at the very least, consider that every shot that falls on her is one that is not hitting our own warriors. …Very well. I knew you’d see things my way.Wait, this is weird:  This red Marine turned white when it died. I wonder if they only did the death animation for one colour? It's virtually unnoticeable - like the Mystery Zergling from the start of this campaign, it's only been captured here because I happened to stop on just the right frame. Anyway. This base…         …is screwed. Hah! Just like Antiga. Feeling nostalgic, Matt? Commander Horner remained on Shakuras with the Judicator. We offered to leave him among his people, but he is apparently something of an outlaw and would find no quarter here. What a shame. So callous! You did not even notice his absence? Were you not once comrades? That was a different life, Artanis. You can’t imagine how different…Of course, the Dominion haven't just been sitting idle while we beat up on them:    Took a lot more damage than I'd have liked on that one Zealot. Frigging Firebats, man. But the Dragoons do seem to have things under control, and Kerrigan's out of juice, so…    …let's get her some firepower.  Just in time, too - they've finally gotten a ComSat up. Did you notice that this base doesn't have any Turrets? Knocking it over with Kerrigan is definitely the intended move here. They also send up a Dropship to flank us, where it unloads…  …an extremely brave Ghost.  That could have been a real issue if he'd had Cloak and/or Lockdown, but he didn't, so we're fine. As it is, the Ghost did eat through a big chunk of the Reaver’s shields, which is something we really need to be mindful of: where shields take full damage from all attacks, Large Protoss units aren’t nearly as impervious to Concussive damage as their Zerg and Terran counterparts. This means we have to re-evaluate the damage we might sustain from Firebats, Ghosts, and especially Vultures. Kerrigan goes exploring:  Looks like there's more Mengsk to our south. Probably has his main base around the crystal. Here's an odd quirk:  So we’ve talked a bit about how units respond to being attacked. If they can hit back, they’ll try to do so. If they can’t, they’ll run in panic. Here there’s a weird edge case, though. These Reavers are out of Scarabs, so they can’t attack, but because they could hypothetically attack this Firebat, they aren’t programmed to run away, either. So they just placidly thisisfine’d here while the Firebat scorched them. Which, as per our point above, really demolished the Reavers’ shields. The logic here does make sense, though. Imagine if units retreated from anything they can’t practically fight back against instead of just anything they can’t theoretically fight back against? And when you dropped a Dark Swarm the Marines fighting the units under it just started pinballing trying to automatically run from the battle because they suddenly can’t fight back? It’d be a nightmare. I guess Carriers without Interceptors would behave the same way. But weird setbacks aside…  …we’ve been able to take this expansion early on and without any casualties. That will make funding our forces a lot easier. The funny thing about fighting Terran is that where their tech tree is more strongly bifurcated than others, the AI, who doesn't realize that, ends up sending some pretty wild compositions. Like this:   Three Firebats and a Goliath. Huh. We're also in pretty good shape defensively. Although we are running into trouble trying to maneuver our units through these relatively tight quarters. We want to stay in good shape, so…  …we start shoring up our expansion. And guess what?  Turns out the Cannon can fire at a Bunker that I didn't even know about. The Bunker doesn't fire back, but once it's down…   There were indeed units inside, who come rushing out to meet us. Photon Cannons have a slightly longer range than even upgraded Marines in Bunkers, so we could take it out without being hit back. That wasn’t on purpose, by the way – I’m nowhere near that good at eyeballing ranges in this game. And again, I didn’t even know the Bunker was there. Enough’s happened in the mission so far that it might surprise you to learn that in actual clock time we’re only a few minutes into it, so no Observers. Not yet. Is all this truly necessary? Could we not simply negotiate for the crystal? Terrans seem reasonable enough. Not all Terrans are as noble as Captain Raynor, Executor. We faced some of this so-called “Dominion” on Char. They will not yield the crystal without a fight. They will not even parley with us. That’s one thing we can agree on. After all, you yourself told me that Matty stayed behind so they wouldn’t catch his scent. Does that make them sound like someone you can reason with? Really, I thought you’d be able to connect those dots yourself, Executor. Well, I – This is the first – My experience with these – Ignore her barbs, Executor. We will not have to suffer her presence much longer. Hah! Relax, both of you. I was just joking. Ruh-roh, Rhaggy.  Never mind, doesn't look like they have Siege Tech. However, we don't know if that's because they haven't gotten it yet, or because it's not available to them in this mission, which makes it weirdly more stressful than if they did have it - it's a mystery. (Refer to Terran 07 for my ponderings on the AI having tanks in Siege Mode but no Siege Tech). We finally get an Observer out:   Just in time to spot an attack on our expansion. No problem, Kerrigan's there to handle it.  …or the Cannons will kill them before she arrives. Either way, I guess. A different Observer…  …reveals Dominion presence across the way from us. Seems pretty minor, I'd guess it's guarding another expansion in case we need it. You know, there’s one Protoss unit that we’ve been shamefully neglecting. This mission seems like a good opportunity to bring it out:    The Archon. …wait. I hope they don’t have Science Vessels. And I guess even if they don’t, they’ll be eating full damage from Firebats. Okay, so actually the past two missions would have been much better opportunities to bring it out, but assuming no EMP, they’re still gonna punish here.  Hmm, that's a whole pack of Wraiths. How can we stop that?   Taste that psionic goodness. We also get some buddies to help Kerrigan out:   Ugh, right. They have scan now. I forgot.   Oh well. Still no trouble. Though if you mostly watch competitive, you can easily forget just how much trouble a Firebat in a Bunker can be for Dark Templar. Anyway. Enough playing. Time to move out.   I like that shot. You can feel the Terrans’ fear as the Archons advance.   Fear that was fully justified. …So, here’s the thing. I think I misremembered the difference in difficulty between Enslavers and Brood War. In that Enslavers is a fair bit more difficult than any of the missions we’ve played so far. It is going to ramp up eventually, but not yet. Maybe not even in this campaign. I say this to explain why we’re sending two dozen Dragoons, four Archons, four Reavers, a handful of Zealots, a smattering of High and Dark Templar, and Kerrigan herself to knock over what will prove to be a pretty limited Terran base. I thought this was going to be a much tougher nut to crack.  We have to go up this ramp to progress. Okay, starting to regret the “24 Dragoons” thing.  It's like a conga line. We finally make it up and can hit Mengsk's base proper:     Got a little surprise for you, buddy    Eh, but my Reaver micro is trash so I can't direct them before they autofire at probably some off-screen Supply Depots. But still, imagine if the Reavers had fired at the Bunker and then killed its inhabitants.  I get them there eventually, but it's not the same. The rest of our army is, uh,  doing their best.   Turns out the Archons and Zealots alone were almost enough to handle this.   But the others help to speed things along.  That looks like our destination. Hey, if anyone reading this had a bad day today, just remember:  At least you're not that Siege Tank pilot.  The crystal’s here, boys! Send in a probe to gather it up and our work here is done. You have done well, Kerrigan. There is more to you than it seems. Perhaps I have misjudged you. Given our history, I can’t say I blame ya’. Let’s just get the job done. Throughout all this, Kerrigan’s delivery has a kind of light-hearted affability to it. She’s definitely trying real hard to earn our trust. Again, she’s very much being coded as a sort of playful, morally ambiguous anti-villain who probably isn’t fully on the level but can maybe when the chips are down be trusted to come through and do the right thing?
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Feb 9, 2024 18:48
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I remember the first time I did this mission. During the opening fight I accidentally used up all my minerals filling up my reavers with scarabs and had to restart.
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Feb 9, 2024 19:08
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I'm very surprised you didn't get scanned with your initial Kerrigan shenanigans. But I suppose it's possible I'm just too used to UEDAIP at this point. Speaking of, aside from a smattering of the usual "the AI is smarter and more aggressive" changes, the mod does two main things to this level. The Brown enemy you dislodge to claim your initial base isn't wiped out here at the start - they have another base in the bottom corner, and present a second force to harass you throughout the level. But, and here's the fun change: Kerrigan brought friends. Up on a little high ground mini-base in the top corner, you are given a small Zerg AI ally who harasses the enemy throughout the map... with mutalisks. Quite a genius little gift on the level where you've had your Stargates taken away. They'll also drop scatterings of Zerglings and Hydralisks, of course. What's *funny* though is that they will actually try to Infest any Terran Command Centers they catch at low health, and will start using Infested Terrans if given the chance. Which only gets funnier, considering some shenanigans all the way back in Episode 2 means the mod has three different potential versions of the Kerrigan Hero Unit you could be playing with here... and one of them has Mind Control. Steal an SCV, and you can gift-wrap a present for your Zerg Allies... they're not picky about whose Command Centers they infest.
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Feb 9, 2024 19:10
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redleader posted:great stuff. how long did it take for zerg to come up with a counter to that play, thereby restoring the balance of the universe? Of course there were and are solutions to the specific build that Bisu used against Savior. There is no "perfect" build. Savior though he had one. He didn't even scout what Bisu was doing, that's how sure he was that nothing Bisu could do could stop him. Counter builds to Bisu's specific build were developed and used within a year. However, Bisu's strategy redefined how Zerg played against Protoss. They had to adapt. They could no longer spread their Overlords all over the map, providing unlimited vision (something reintroduced to Zerg game play in SC 2 with creep tumors) and Detection. Instead Overlords had to cluster in defended spots (usually at the front of the natural base in front of the main base). Getting Spore colonies as detectors in the mineral line or at the front in order to stop Dark Templar sneaking through has become essential. Building Scourge in order to hunt Corsairs is always done. Getting early Zerglings in order to stop and kill the harassing Zealots is a necessity. If you look back at the unit spotlights for Zealots and Scourge (and of course Corsair) you will see the exact strategies introduced by Bisu still in play today. JohnKilltrane posted:Protoss X04: The Quest For Uraj DTurtle fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Feb 9, 2024 |
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Feb 9, 2024 19:27
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I do enjoy this version of Kerrigan. Playful, friendly, but also deadly. She's truly free, possibly for the first time in her life, and is clearly enjoying it. And intends to stay that way.DTurtle posted:Fun fact: There are no competitive maps on the Ice World tile set. The reason? They are too bright - especially with Protoss buildings warping in. It's a shame, I do love visual variety. One thing you can appreciate about Starcraft 2's competitive scene is that the maps are beautiful.
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Feb 9, 2024 20:54
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An interesting detail about this mission: It is possible for a probe to pick up and move the crystal. Also, the trigger is linked to the crystal itself, not the beacon it is placed on. Which means you can also complete the mission objective by bringing the crystal to Kerrigan. DTurtle posted:Fun fact: There are no competitive maps on the Ice World tile set. The reason? They are too bright - especially with Protoss buildings warping in.
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Feb 9, 2024 20:59
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I think this mission can be speedrun by just cloaking Kerrigan and moving her straight to the crystal, maybe dodging a siege tank or two. She's really beefy.
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Feb 10, 2024 03:03
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Just wanted to mention that this thread has been a treat to keep up with, lots of great memories with this game. It has also reminded me of this piece of vintage YoutTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2-TgQJamu8
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Feb 15, 2024 14:34
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So... the mechanicspost I'd planned for after mission 4 is taking much, much longer than anticipated. Rather than prolong the thread indefinitely while I work on it, we're just gonna go ahead with the next mission and the non-update posts will catch up when they catch up. Protoss X05: The Battle of Braxis  Executor! Our sensors have just identified a large group of Terran vessels. However, their configuration profile is unlike any Terran group yet encountered. We are receiving a transmission from the fleet’s command ship, identifying itself as the Aleksander. Protoss Commander, I am Admiral Alexei Stukov of the United Earth Directorate. We are here to take control of the Terran Dominion and all of its outlying colonies. You are in direct violation of Terran space and have openly attacked Terran troops. Lower your shields and power down your weapon systems. The UED will be taking custody of your ships and whatever spoils you have garnered from this planet.Vice-Admiral, bud. You’re Vice-Admiral, not Admiral. United Earth Directorate? Raynor spoke of the distant Terran homeworld called Earth. These humans have come a long way to make war on us. Have faith, Zeratul! You almost sound as if you fear these humans. What are they to such as we? Was it not we who defeated the dreaded Overmind? Yes, Artanis. We did vanquish the Overmind. But we did so with the help of humans. Do not be so quick to underestimate them. Of course. Executor, I shall test the mettle of these humans by scouting ahead of your ships and finding a way through this blockade! En Taro Tassadar!Mission Objectives: Destroy all power generators to pierce the UED blockade. Artanis must survive. Hey! Our earth buddies have finally made an appearance! We didn't fight them down there so I guess they arrived and blockaded the planet while we were retrieving the Uraj. Also, Artanis, bud, that's an insane thing for the Executor of Episode 3 to say. I can't think of a way to smooth out that retcon, so, uh, I guess we're just gonna go with Artanis being a few brewskis short of a twofer, if you take my meaning. You know. His goalie’s out at centre ice. His sap is more oak than maple. Anyway, here’s our start:  This is another baseless mission, and spoiler alert: it’s a ton of fun. I mentioned Brood War having more interesting mission design and here’s where that really gets kicked into overdrive. So, for those who don’t feel like counting, we’ve got four Zealots, two Dragoons, two Shuttles (exactly enough to transport all our ground units), three Observers, and four Scouts, including our hero, Artanis. Let’s check him out:  He’s actually a fair bit weaker than Mojo was; the damage output is the same, but the HP and Shields are halved. I guess it makes sense, Mojo’s combined 800 HP and shields would be crazy beefy on a baseless map. But to compensate, Arty’s got his own unique unit quotes (we’ll do a distinct Quotespost for the new units and heroes in BW later on). Anyway, let’s get going.  The blockade is a series of space platforms absolutely filled to the brim with Missile Turrets. It’s got plenty of other defenses on it as well – I think the entire Terran arsenal, minus the new units, makes an appearance here, but the enemy is also baseless so anything we kill won’t be replaced. Here:    There’s a little entrance platform, out of range of the Turrets, where it’s safe for us to unload our ground units. And once we’re there, with a bit of help from our Observer…     …we can use our Dragoons to blast the two Turrets on the edge of that wall there. And with them gone…  We can easily bring our Dragoons up.  There’s Bunkers, as well. And as you can see from those sparks of gunfire hitting our Dragoons, Marine range upgrade combined with the Bunker range bonus means our Dragoons don’t outrange them. On the other hand, we’ve got the high ground, so half their attacks miss.   No problem. Our Dragoons can't reach them all, but…  …that's why the Khala invented Zealots. Hmm. It occurs to me that our Dragoons can probably reach the Power Generator from their vantage point.   They can! Closeup:  These are our objectives. Kill all five of them and we win.  One down. Executor, with the power generator destroyed, the missile turrets on this platform are no longer operational. However, we will need reinforcements to finish the job. Reinforcements are en route now, young Templar.(That Zeratul line plays after every destroyed generator, but I’ll only play it here). Two important things happen. First…  …all the Missile Turrets in this area are powering down, i.e. being transferred over to the control of a neutral player (purple). They won’t attack us, they won’t detect us. Any Bunkers and units in the area are still hostile, but without Turrets they’ll be a whole lot easier to deal with. Particularly in light of the second important thing happening:  Reinforcements!  Hey guys.We get a new selection of troops after each generator destroyed, and they’re always different. This time we get two more Dragoons and four Dark Templar, along with the Shuttles to carry them. The DT are particularly nice with all these Turrets down:    Looks like in response to the attack, the UED sent a Science Vessel to detect us…    …and boy were they not counting on Artanis and his buddies. You know, I love this mission a lot. For a baseless RTS mission it’s surprisingly non-linear. You can tackle the Power Generators in the order you like, and they each have a variety of obstacles that keeps them from feeling like you’re being funneled into making explicit use of the reinforcements they give you. In fact, they can’t do that, because they don’t know what order you’re going to hit the Generators in, nor what sort of casualties you’ve taken. Instead you’re making clever use of terrain and attack angles to try and create an opening you can exploit using whatever you have available. In this case…  the Turrets severely hinder our Observers from exploring further, so…     …we look for creative ways to carve a path for them. Wanna see something painful?    Here it took me ages of trying to drop my Dragoon in just the right spot, occasionally drawing fire from Turrets while I did so, before I finally remembered “Oh hey, right, the Turret blocking a clear shot is neutral, not invulnerable” and kill it.    There we go. Now we can take a peek. More Turrets, more Bunkers…   …oh, and Siege Tanks. Okay. That’s going to be a problem. The tanks are easily handled by Arty and his Scouts, but then there’s the Turrets to worry about. The Turrets are easily handled by Dragoons, but then there’s the tanks to worry about. Not to mention that Bunker. That seems like a good staging ground, but where there's one Tank, there's probably more. I'm not seeing an elegant solution here, so...    Hey, where'd the tank go? There was a Siege Tank there, right? I'm not crazy?  Huh. Some mysteries solve themselves, I guess. If you can't tell, at some point it went into tank mode and wandered off. Now its wandered back. Hmm. I wonder if maybe it was when our Dragoons sniped that second turret. The AI may have said "Something getting blown up near this tank? Better move it up" and then couldn't move it up due to the terrain. Anyway...  We're clear for landing:  Use some Dragoons to thin out the Turrets a bit...  Hey weird, I wonder why that one Dragoon's shields are gone. I'm sure it just took some damage earlier I forgot about.   Wraiths won't help you, bud. Especially since they don't seem to have Cloaking.  Ah. Exciting news! I believe I have cracked the Case of the Missing Dragoon Shields. And more exciting news!  Looks like our DT are in detection range of one of those turrets. The good news is, it looks like that tank only has the one turret nearby, so...    I make sure Artanis arrives first so he’s the one to facetank the damage. But while we pick off the now-helpless tank...  ...I notice that we're actually quite close to an entirely different generator than the one I was aiming for. Might as well. We start with the now-standard Dragoon pick-off to see if we can get any turrets:   Yes, but it looks like we're in range of that Bunker there. And no high ground advantage for us, this time. That's okay. With careful micro, we should be able to juggle around our two Dragoons to make sure they don't take much HP damage.    There we go. Also, I don't think I've exploited it yet, but a baseless mission vs Terran means that when we're in a tight spot, we just need to reduce a building down to red HP and let physics do the rest.  Well. That's not looking too bad. I'll spare you the tedium of transporting everything over.  I think our best bet might be to just brute force this one.   Again, pulling back Dragoons whose shields start to get low.     Wraiths, but that's no problem for our Dragoons.   More turrets are powered down:   Oh, that's neat. I didn't notice before that the disabled turrets give us vision. That's a little helpful.  ...okay, maybe it's a lot helpful. I would have blundered right into that. And the generator going down also means...  More units! Nothing exciting this time, just stuff we already had, but more firepower is always nice. Now, how to crack the right-most generator...    Southern approach seems pretty well-defended, might be better to try from where we were earlier.  The way leading back there has this catwalk that seems treacherous, but so long as it's Goliaths and not tanks up there we should be fine. And with the second batch of turrets down...  The tanks we saw earlier should be easy pickings. I hope.   So far so good,  Nice.  Hmmm, I see another opportunity for...   Dragoon sniping! blazetheinferno, I'm particularly looking forward to hearing how UEDAIP does this mission. I feel like all you really need to do to make it a lot tougher is take away Singularity Charge haha.  Ugh. I'm trying to transport the Dragoons up but two of them decided to wander off and start blasting at a Bunker. Come on, guys. Behave.  Oh, guess it wasn't a Bunker. For the most part every unit in Starcraft sounds very unique and is easily identifiable by its attack sounds, but the Goliath's autocannons do sound pretty close to Marine gauss rifles.   Finally.   More sniping and Dragoon cycling (I'm not using one at a time on purpose, I just can't get them to fire from any spot other than that one).   Well, that was a freebie. No idea where this tank was but I'm real glad it decided to unsiege and come find us.  Now that the Bunker's HP is low enough, we can just leave it alone.  This Bunker we can just bruteforce again.    Oh wow, I didn't realize we were this close. I don't think we have to worry about the Bunker there, just use our Dragoons to -  Uh, okay, thanks guys. Now let's do the power generator.  What no what's happening why are you doing this  'You guys aren't gonna have your pathfinding go berserk on me, are you?  Phew. And that means time for more...    Note: our Reavers start with a full complement of 10 Scarabs each (with the damage upgrade), but we don't get any minerals. No way to replenish them. Also note:  Our High Templar get both spells, but melding into an Archon is disabled. While we try to bring our new guys up to the front, our Dark Templar have been busy:   They're going around clearing out any stragglers so that pathfinding shenanigans don't end in our units accidentally running into enemies. We need eyes on the top area, but the Turrets on the catwalk are out of range of our Dragoons. Looks like its time for more facetanking. Oh Artanis...   While this happens, our new units reach the front:   Anyway, our Observer was able to confirm that it seems mostly safe, so...     Zealot rampage. Alright, the catwalk is ours. Let's see what lies between it and the next generator...    I see how it is. Well, that's okay. We can deal with this. We just need to be patient and take things slow.  Meanwhile, the Zealot Rampage continues unchecked:    We've exhausted the possibilities from the high ground, so...  It's time to start ferrying the Dragoons down. It's a bit riskier, but we should be okay. I am concerned about that Ghost, though. I think it's safe to assume it has Lockdown. Hmm. I know just the thing...   Let's keep the minesweeping going:  Hey look guys, I'm like a professional Protoss player. Let's use an Observer to spot the mines for my Dragoons. I hope there aren't any Siege Tanks around.  What, no. I was doing a bit. I didn't actually mean it.  And they sniped my Observer to boot. Well, let's see if we can pick off some more mines, first. Even if we get too close, a Siege Tank blast shouldn't even break through our Shields.   Two!? We really need to get eyes up there. I think it's worth burning a Scarab for.   Didn't kill it, but that's okay.  It's kinda funny. I feel like Terran buildings burning down has been almost irrelevant for the entire game - up until this mission. Okay, let's see what we're dealing with.  Looks like it's just the two tanks. Seems like a safe bet that there's a Ghost at every corner, though. Let's see. How to navigate this. Hmm. Well...   Tanks don't oneshot HT.  Of course, Storm also doesn't oneshot tanks. But it does leave us in a better position.  Much better, in fact. One more will easily do it.   Ah crap. Came at it from the wrong angle so both tanks fired. Couldn't even get a Storm off first. Hmm. I've cleared most of the mines off to the right...  This seems like a much safer approach for the HT.   The tank outranges the casting range by a fair distance.   One down. And another Storm...  ...leaves the second nearly done. We clear out the bottom left approach...  Only to discover that it looks like the tank's trying to find us? I guess? Well that makes life way easier.     Still turrets to reveal our DT, but when we have this many, does that matter?    No. No it does not. Powering down the turrets also shows us the rest of the minefield:  You know, in retrospect, I could have made taking that much easier just by making use of Hallucination to keep my HT from being blow'd up. Oh well. Hindsight is 200/200. Now, let's take a look at our new units.  ...Well now we're talking.  Hell yes, that Arbiter has both spells. Amazing.  And the Corsairs have Dweb. Better and better. This last generator doesn't stand a chance. And look:  There's even a suitable landing zone, just for us. Let's bring our units over.   :/ Oh well. We need to clear things out first anyway. But first, we should deal with that Ghost.  So many Scouts. Corsairs get the party started...    And our Scouts finish the job. Now we're ready to land.  Whoa whoa whoa. Wait. Wait wait wait. I did not realize we'd be seeing one of those this early. I even specifically said the new Terran units won't make an appearance here. Very cool.  Ah crap, it saw me, and launched some missiles my way.  This is the Terran Valkyrie, a powerful anti-air missile frigate. It's kinda sorta similar to the Corsair, but is a fair bit weirder and wonkier. I'll save the details for the Terran campaign, but suffice it to say, these monsters can tear a group of flyers to shreds. Even so...   It's one Valk against ten Scouts. Now we just facesmash the defenses here...    It'd probably be better to do Dragoon sniping and bust the Bunkers with Reavers, but we just haven't really used the Zealots much this mission. They deserve to have fun, too.    Note the apathetic Valkyrie. Like the Corsair, they too lack a ground attack.  While our Zealots have fun going ham...  ...our Dragoons spy something through the cracks:  A Turret, easily killed. And another:   There we go. That's the opening we needed.  Perfect.   Oh hey, Battlecruisers. I think that means we really did face the whole Terran arsenal here, minus the other new unit. Oh, actually, there were Spider Mines but I don't remember seeing any Vultures. Still, pretty close.  Our Arbiter doesn't make it, but that's okay. It did its duty.    See, this is why I wish there was more PvT. It's absolutely bonkers how quickly Scouts shred Battlecruisers. It's what they were made for, and we almost never get to see it.   Corsairs, on the other hand, are worthless against cruisers, but that's okay. We're just about done here.    Executor, the last of the blockade has been disabled. It should now be safe for our ships to depart. Well done, Praetor. Come, my friends. The Khalis awaits us. ********************************************************************************************  Executor, the Uraj is secured and the UED has given up the chase. We are currently holding perimeter orbit over the planet Char. Zeratul, have you locked onto the location of the Khalis? Yes, I remember sensing its power the last time I was on this world. However, our sensors indicate a massive, fluctuating energy signature at its location. I am, however, unable to identify the signature’s source. That should be obvious, gentlemen: the source is the Overmind itself. When the Cerebrates merged together, they must have locked onto the Khalis’ energies and nested near it. It’s probably that there’ll be a number of Broods protecting that area. It’s risky, but if we can strike hard and fast, we might be able to fight our way through their defenses and escape with the crystal. Comrades, I may have an alternative. Seeing as how the Overmind is still in its infant stages, I wonder if we might be able to disrupt its control over these Broods. If we can do enough superficial damage to the creature, it might pacify the Zerg nearest to it, allowing us some time to retrieve the Khalis. A bold plan, young Artanis. Your courage rivals that of the mighty Tassadar himself. You give me too much credit, noble Zeratul. I am not worthy enough to even speak his name. Touching. Look, boys, either of these plans will work, but let’s not waste any time. I’ll be able to exert limited control over a few of the Zerg here and provide you with some back-up. But the longer we stay, the more we risk losing both the crystals again. Agreed. Executor, deploy your forces. May Adun be with you!Mission Objectives: Retrieve the Khalis crystal with a Probe or Drone OR Do enough damage to the Overmind to send it into remission. It's nice having Kerrigan around to snark a bit when the Protoss go from being too much to too much. So, we have a choice to make. Do we… a) Final Fantasy In Space and go right for the magic rock, or… b) Eye of the Storm Pt 2: Bioelectric Boogaloo and beat up the Overmind? Note that unlike the choice in Enslavers, this has no impact on plot or the coming missions. It’s just two different objectives. I think gathering the crystal is more about running a gauntlet of defences whereas killing the Overmind is more of a straightforward base raid? But it’s been long enough since I’ve played that I’m not a reliable source. …kind of weird, though, when you think about it. If we can get close enough to the Overmind to send it into remission, why not just have Zeratul and his buddies kill it for good? I don’t think this plot hole is ever explained. I guess the idea is that plot-wise we don’t have the forces to keep the Zerg at bay long enough to give them an opening to go for the kill? Oh! Or maybe Tassadar’s big mystical bolt from the SC1 closing cinematic suggests that the Overmind specifically needs more than just a few hits from a Dark Templar warp blade to be killed for good. This is not actually the case, as we will see, but it’ll be a nice theory while it lasts. JohnKilltrane fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Feb 24, 2024 |
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Feb 24, 2024 18:10
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b) Eye of the Storm Pt 2: Bioelectric Boogaloo
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Feb 24, 2024 20:06
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(no vote)JohnKilltrane posted:Our sensors have just identified a large group of Terran vessels. However, their configuration profile is unlike any Terran group yet encountered So, they stole local ships, or no? JohnKilltrane posted:Also, Artanis, bud, that's an insane thing for the Executor of Episode 3 to say. I can't think of a way to smooth out that retcon, so, uh, I guess we're just gonna go with Artanis being a few brewskis short of a twofer, if you take my meaning. You know. His goalie’s out at centre ice. His sap is more oak than maple.
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Feb 24, 2024 20:30
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b) Eye of the Storm Pt 2: Bioelectric Boogaloo
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Feb 24, 2024 20:40
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JohnKilltrane posted:Hey! Our earth buddies have finally made an appearance! We didn't fight them down there so I guess they arrived and blockaded the planet while we were retrieving the Uraj. I think the base you destroyed at the start of the previous mission was supposed to be a UED base - it was brown, unlike the red player that has the rest of the map. Also, it's kind of weird how Kerrigan has nothing to say about the UED. Oh, and b) Eye of the Storm Pt 2: Bioelectric Boogaloo
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Feb 24, 2024 21:06
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Gun Jam posted:So, they stole local ships, or no? That one's easy, it's both. They obviously have UED ships since they were able to travel there, and we know they stole a bunch of local equipment too.
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Feb 24, 2024 21:09
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I viewed it as the UED came with their own ships, and basically commandeered an outpost/small colony on the fringe of Dominion Space. So they have some local assets, but now an absurd amount. I figure the Brown base was also them or something.
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Feb 24, 2024 21:12
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b) Eye of the Storm Pt 2: Bioelectric Boogaloo 
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Feb 24, 2024 21:44
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Our options are Thievery or Violence. Violence gets my vote. As for the plot hole... honestly, the best guess I've been able to come up with is that they know that killing the previous Overmind sent the Zerg on Aiur into a feral, frenzied, uncontrolled rampage. If they do that here, they'll lose their chance at the Khalis. They may be hoping that by merely injuring it (or, give it a concussion as I tend to call it), that it pacifies the Zerg instead of sending them into a frenzy. AND SURE, GO AHEAD AND CALL ME OUT WHY DON'T YA Well, now that I've been called out by name in an actual update, I think I'm obligated now. Battle of Braxis... didn't actually receive a huge structural overhaul like some missions do in UEDAIP. Instead, this mission, while largely the same format, serves as an introduction to the fact that the UED has a whole new unique suite of units, separate from the Koprulu Terran set. Now, because graphic design is hard, these new units are still visually based on the normal terran units, but have pallet swapped appearances to make them visually distinct at least a bit. In general, the fact that the enemy is packing UED units makes a lot of spots a bit more terrifying, though the number of enemies in some areas is reduced. In particular, one of the first enemies you encounter is the replacement for the Firebat: the EMP Trooper. They hit harder than a Firebat, but only single-target. However, when they die, a second or so later, an EMP blast detonates where they died, having all the effects you would expect from it. This has the potential to screw over another UED unit that... I will not discuss, because it's the other New Brood War Terran unit and I don't wanna mention it before the LP gets there, but rest assured, they have an answer to that. Those Goliaths patrolling the catwalk above the minefield around the northeast generator have been replaced with the UED's replacement for the Ghost: the Phantom. These things are TERRIFYING to deal with in a limited-forces mission, because while their attack speed is ABYSMALLY slow (we're talking 3+ seconds between shots, though I don't remember the exact timing), their damage is a whopping 100 concussive damage a shot. These bad boys are fantastic snipers, and their attack sound is either terrifying or The Most Wonderful Sound depending on which end of the gun you're on. They pack cloak as expected, but instead of Lockdown... they actually borrow the Queen's Ensnare ability. Though the UED has no nukes of their own, so the Phantom does not have the ability to call them down. Another complication is that there are a number of pre-placed pairs of UED Skywings, their Wraith replacement, that will periodically move out to hunt you down through the mission. Once you clear them all, that's it, but it's something to be aware of. Unique about these guys, is that unlike everyone else, who use non-combat units for this purpose... the Skywing is the UED's mobile detector unit! Your observers are not safe! Finally, in a little touch of Bank Data use, there are a number of production facilities scattered around the map. They don't see use in this mission, but taking them out here actually weakens the UED in their next hostile appearance, weakening the strength of their attack waves. That next hostile appearance might be a bit sooner than you think, though... (There's also a recently-added bit of further extra bank data added in the form of some structures you can avoid killing to receive a bonus in the first UED mission) EDIT: Okay, there's one last thing this mission does, and it's a neat feature that's scattered throughout the various UEDAIP Campaigns, and was only really made possible and added in the last few months. In some missions, there will be an extra small dropdown menu in the actual Briefing itself, giving you a couple of options for something in the mission itself. Sometimes it's a selection of certain starting forces, sometimes it's choosing between an extra upgrade for different units, sometimes it's instructions for an AI ally for what to focus their efforts on. In this particular mission, you can choose between an extra upgrade for your Ships' weapons, the energy upgrade for your High Templar (which, since UEDAIP gives them an attack, also serves as their attack upgrade), or an entirely new upgrade that boosts the movement speed of all your Robotics Units by a fair amount... but at a very heavy price: All of your Spellcasters permanently lose all of their Energy reserves. The Protoss get several such double-edged upgrades that buff some of your units while nerfing others in Brood War UEDAIP. The Koprulu Terrans and arguably the UED also each have an upgrade that comes with a potential hazardous downside, but the Protoss are the only ones that get quite so many, and the Zerg don't have to worry about it at all. This upgrade will benefit your Probes (though not on this mission, obviously), Reavers, Shuttles, Observers, and one new brand new unit the mod adds to the Protoss arsenal that I'll talk about next time. EDIT 2: Okay, one last thing, now that it's on my mind. Most hero units in UEDAIP have been changed in some way, and their power, while risky to use, is generally very helpful to deal with the increased difficulty. Artanis' attack patterns have changed around. His anti-ground attack damage has shot through the floor down to roughly the same damage as a regular Scout... but he attacks lightning fast. Like, multiple attacks per second fast. His anti-air attack is a bit unique, though. He fires a single anti-matter missile, but it doesn't track the target. He fires at the location where the target was when he fired. But, the shot hits anything that happens to be where it lands (still air-only though). It hits like a truck, and ignores armor, to boot - though since it's a single hit for high damage, and not that fast-firing, it doesn't make as much of a difference; his anti-ground damage still suffers terribly against high-armor targets. Still, Artanis can shred clumped up air targets. BlazetheInferno fucked around with this message at 23:56 on Feb 24, 2024 |
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Feb 24, 2024 22:42
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This was always one of my favorite missions, no-base Protoss is always one of the more interesting designs and Reavers in particular get a fun tactical dimension with their limited ammo. Incidentally, I think the reinforcement waves are the same order each time instead of depending on which generator was destroyed- it's been a long time, but as a child I would always get intimidated by the huge minefield in the top right so would save it for last, and I'm pretty sure I got the same group of units after destroying the top left one instead. I know it's just a consequence of the of the artstyle but it's super funny to me how the dark templar's wireframe in the unit select box shows their capes as a part of their body for unit damage purposes. Fashion is life!
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Feb 25, 2024 02:38
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b) Eye of the Storm part 2: Bioelectric Boogaloo because I've never done that version
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Feb 25, 2024 05:33
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I'll buck the trend and vote A: just go for the crystal. We've seen how many slugfest base pushes now? This feels like the more interesting option. Also, I almost always kill the overmind here when I play.
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Feb 25, 2024 05:41
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A: just go for the crystal I've honestly always gone for the overwhelming force option so I've never seen anyone try the finesse route. In my defense, overwhelming force is really satisfying.
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Feb 25, 2024 06:14
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FoolyCharged posted:I'll buck the trend and vote A: just go for the crystal. We've seen how many slugfest base pushes now? This feels like the more interesting option. Also, I almost always kill the overmind here when I play. Yeah, let's finesse this.
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Feb 25, 2024 15:19
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FoolyCharged posted:I'll buck the trend and vote A: just go for the crystal. We've seen how many slugfest base pushes now? This feels like the more interesting option. Also, I almost always kill the overmind here when I play. 
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Feb 25, 2024 15:29
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A: just go for the crystal
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Feb 25, 2024 16:39
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A: Final Starcraft Fantasy: Gratuitous Latin Crystalis. Primarily because I think it'll be more interesting to LP compared to another smash the base mission.
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Feb 25, 2024 21:34
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A: smash and grab. This last mission was very hard on me since it's possible to lose no units and there's no easy way to get more. Cue hours spent waiting for Artanis's shields to regenerate so you can slam him into another missile turret for guaranteed no unit losses...
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Feb 25, 2024 22:47
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I think it's been patched out but there's a very funny way to complete this by glitching a drone into flying across the map to the crystal
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Feb 25, 2024 22:53
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That siege tank platform is a real bastard and every time I do this mission it goes exactly the way it went for you, fuckups with the high templar included.
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Feb 25, 2024 22:56
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I forget how I usually deal with them. I either brute force the Goliaths with Scouts then just snipe the Tanks... or I say "screw it" and drop the Reavers on the platform.
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Feb 25, 2024 23:56
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B: Kill the Overmind and come up with some excuse why that didn't actually happen. I know the real reason is that the two following campaigns revolve around it still being alive, which makes me wonder why they didn't just put this mission on a different planet.
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Feb 26, 2024 00:58
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I do not remember this last mission at all, and the Protoss campaign is overall my clearest memory of BW. Or I thought it was. Dang. I would've despised it back when it came out, though, I hated baseless missions. Anyway, A: finesse this out because I would be a brute forcer normally.
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Feb 26, 2024 01:12
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A: make off with the crystal
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Feb 26, 2024 01:21
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