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explosivo posted:Lol at this grown rear end man almost in tears talking about his big brave firefighting friends needing to get a shot to work throwing away my $300k job to own the libs https://twitter.com/awalkerinLA/status/1429904382930276358?s=20
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Aug 23, 2021 22:25
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I do agree schools should be closed until cases rates are low enough in each district that it's safe to reopen them (a condition that probably hasn't been met anywhere in my state for over a year). It definitely sucks, because remote learning is worse than in person. There's lots to discuss about that, but I don't want to derail. What I just can't understand is that we're in the middle of a delta wave breaking daily positive test records and loving Disney World is open, people are cramming into bars and clubs downtown every weekend, businesses are calling remote workers back to the office, and not even a quarter of people I see at the grocery store are still wearing masks or trying to distance themselves -- and yet the only thing I still hear family and coworkers around here debating is whether schools should have reopened this month. It's taken for granted that there absolutely will not be a shutdown of anything else, other than maybe schools if they get an outbreak. Closing schools while leaving literally every other social gathering space in society open seems like the worst possible arrangement. Which is probably what I deserve anyway for living in Florida. We practice a form of self-flagellation through elections.
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Aug 27, 2021 06:05
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How are u posted:If the CCP wants to dispel the lab leak theory then maybe they should, I dunno, let the world in to prove it wrong. Even assuming they're completely innocent and want to cooperate, I don't think there's anything they could do to definitively prove it didn't leak from a lab. Trying to prove a negative is hard even when conspiracies aren't involved. A lot of people would continue to assume they're hiding something no matter what they share. It also doesn't matter. Even if we had a smoking gun, what then? A bit of sabre rattling and finger pointing, but ultimately nothing changes. We already should assume every advanced country has similar labs and there's always a small risk of an oopsie because humans will find a way to gently caress up even the most well thought out safety protocols. Natural evolution is also pumping out novel viruses all the time. So it's not like the threat landscape suddenly changes. If there's anything to learn, it's not how to prevent the next covid-level virus from ever existing in the wild -- it's how to detect and respond to it when it happens again.
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Aug 27, 2021 22:29
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Duck and Cover posted:I'm not sure being truthful and treating the public as thinking adults would been any better. poo poo masks work? How many do I need? All of them? Okay buying all of them. What do you mean healthcare workers are unable to work? LAZY! Nah, by initially telling the public not to wear masks, they didn't actually stop people from panic buying masks -- they were still sold out and hard to find in early 2020. But they did successfully hurt their own credibility. I still have family who love to point out Fauci said not to wear masks, then changed his story, so he's a liar and you can't trust him. Of course, they're all antimask chuds who are looking for any possible reason to avoid personal responsibility, but still, health officials being deceitful does nothing but supply them with fuel for the disinformation machine. It's better for officials to just be as honest as possible than to try to be puppet masters or use reverse psychology to trick people into doing the right thing. They're not competent enough for that to work, and it only takes a small percentage of people being unconvinced to hoard the entire world's retail supply of toliet paper, n95 masks, or  .
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Aug 28, 2021 03:00
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Tunicate posted:They specifically said that wearing a mask was worse than not wearing one. It was not just telling people not to wear them. My dad still claims this is true and argues with people who ask him to wear one, because the mask acts like a fisherman's net for covid particles and draws them into your mouth. But also, if you tell him that masks are to prevent you from spewing your covid cloud to other people, he will immediately pivot to the holes in masks being too big to capture covid particles. He has a PhD in a science (physics). It's really depressing coming to the slow realization that the parents you once thought were super smart are, and probably always have been, amazingly stupid.
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Aug 28, 2021 03:09
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fondly remembering the time in 2020 when the first covid cases started showing up at work, and the management did their own “contact tracing”. they didn’t actually tell us we had been exposed until 14 days afterward, to let us know that there had been a case in our building but if we weren’t sick already then we were in the clear.
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Aug 31, 2021 03:34
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You’re trying to compare poorer educational outcomes that result from school closures with excess student deaths (and a general acceleration of the delta wave that already has a lot of hospitals at their breaking point) that are resulting from schools remaining open. The two things are measurable but aren’t directly comparable. You can have an opinion on what should be prioritized, health or education, and what the thresholds should be but your vague “look at the data” arguments are worthless because there’s no objective comparison. It’s apples and oranges. The only thing I agree with the anti-shutdown crowd about is that it makes very little sense to only close schools and leave everything else open. But I assume everyone here who thinks schools should close right now also feels that way about theaters, bars, theme parks, gyms, etc. Or at the very least limited to masked and (not or) vaxxed people.
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Aug 31, 2021 21:19
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asdf32 posted:That said it’s far from only educational outcomes. Shutdowns cause other measurable health problems and put kids at risk for various other hazards (depression, bad homes, loss of good meals etc). This is the only part of your post that had any substance at all, and even then it's just throwing stuff out to see what sticks. How many extra kids or family members died from shutdown-related depression, bad homes, or starvation compared to normal in the past 2 years? And how many covid cases traced to a school outbreak ended in a kid or a kid's family member dying in the past 2 years? Are you suggesting this is the objective comparison you want to determine whether schools should be open, because I think it's pretty obvious what the answer will be. Just one point of reference -- in my county, in the 3 weeks since schools opened, about 5% (~3500) of the students and faculty have tested positive. Another ~2700 were quarantined this week awaiting tests. The risk to kids is fairly low, but higher to faculty and family -- some of these cases will be fatal, guaranteed, and the case rate is still accelerating. I think you would be better off conceding that there is no direct, objective public health comparison in your favor, and sticking to the realm of opinion instead.
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Sep 1, 2021 00:14
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spunkshui posted:I have both doors open, 6 box fans exhausting air, 12 windows open, and 2 air filtering machines. sounds like you're all set for the horse paste, incredible ventilation for a day of making GBS threads
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Sep 1, 2021 04:42
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there can be pockets of greatness, periods where the internet is plentiful with stories of people eating worm paste for horses
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Sep 1, 2021 05:33
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Lolie posted:Shingles is so horrible that if you don't know whether or not you've ever had chickenpox it is worth getting a shingles vaccination. I had it once in the mid 2010s during a period where I was under a lot of work stress. I got pretty lucky because it wasn't bad at all. I got prescribed an antiviral, though not until the rash had already broken out. I just had a burning/itchy/painful rash on the left side of my stomach and back that took a few weeks to heal, fortunately without leaving scars. I had heard of a vaccine and asked my doctor about it, but he said it's only recommended for the elderly with a history of multiple cases and the overall effectiveness wasn't that high (reduced your risk by 50% or so, and you were supposed to get the shot every 5 years), so I didn't bother. I did some googling, and mostly found the trials to line up with what he said. The vaccine manufacturer of course recommended it for everyone. The thing I remember most about the doctor visit, though, was asking the guy if it was contagious. He said no, not really, as long as nobody came into contact with the blisters, so I could go to work with no risk. But right after that he also asked something like: "Do you work with anyone who is pregnant or trying?" and basically implied I shouldn't go anywhere near them.  Anyway, it's been a while now, but what I remember from reading about it at the time was that if you've had chicken pox, the virus is probably living in your nervous system for the rest of your life, but normally is kept in check by your immune system. It can flare up and cause a outbreak (and the reason it only affects one side of your body at a time is because it follows nerve pathways that don't cross the center of the body). I read some speculation that the low effectiveness of the vaccine was likely due to the fact that your immune system already knows about the virus, so it might act as a temporary booster, but it's not training it to recognize a new threat. Anyway, not an expert, and there may be newer vaccines or studies in the past 10 years that change things.
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Sep 1, 2021 17:44
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hmm, yeah, reading about shingrix now and it does seem to be better than 50%. Found this with >1 million people in the vaccinated data set (and 15 million in the unvaxed set): https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33580242/ Found 10.32 cases per 1000 person-years in the unvaxed group, 4.5 with 1 dose, and 3.09 with two. The 95% CI result was 1 dose is 55-58.8% effective and 2 is 68.6%-71.5% effective. Might ask about this next time i have an appointment, but if they still recommend it for only 50 and up, not sure I'll be able to get it.
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Sep 1, 2021 18:31
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are any states pushing to get kids vaccinated with parental approval before the fda finishes trials? the number one thing i keep hearing from politicians against school mask mandates is "parents know what's best for their child", and if that includes ignoring the science surrounding masking and distancing, then it should also include ignoring that the vaccine hasn't been declared safe for kids right?
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Sep 1, 2021 23:44
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pov: the end of your tinder date with jorgan
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Sep 2, 2021 02:23
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The issue with the way Florida is reporting deaths is not that the data lag exists, but that they very recently changed the way they reported. It was right as the delta wave was heating up. I've been watching the Florida numbers almost daily throughout the pandemic since I live in this cursed swamp, and it was "normal" in the past to see hundreds of deaths reported each day during the peaks. This time, they've been reporting 20,000+ new confirmed cases almost every day for a month, but somehow single digit deaths each day. So yeah, other places may be doing it too, but the reason it's being talked about in FL is not just because it's misleading, but because the timing of it makes it obvious that the governor is trying to cover up the current crisis and get the "FL breaks corpse pile record for 3rd day in a row as DeSantis defunds another school for requiring masks" headlines out of the news every day. Now we only get those headlines once per week when the cumulative numbers get updated.
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Sep 2, 2021 20:35
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freddiestarfish posted:Do Americans get anything else other than a little card to say they're vaccinated? Seems easy to lose, we get an electronic certificate in a national register that we can access through a phone/computer. Shocking government control of my data I know, but I guess someone needs a database to show who's vaccinated. we get a handwritten card  (edit: in FL)i think the information gets entered into a computer when you get the shot, so they should be able to help you if you lose it at least. i hope.
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Sep 3, 2021 20:44
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it's a plot by big wallet
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Sep 3, 2021 20:50
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Odds of a winter spike are high in the northern hemisphere, but whether it will be as bad or worse than last year, who knows. More than half of adults in the US are vaccinated. I haven't been paying close attention to studies about what percentage of the population has now had covid and thus is likely to have a pretty decent natural immunity, but i have to guess we're somewhere around 1/3rd. The surface area for serious cases involving hospitalizations or fatalities has diminished in a significant way (which really highlights how much worse delta is than the OG strain).
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Sep 4, 2021 03:33
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lamination is free unlamination will be $20
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Sep 4, 2021 04:50
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conservatives buying up all the beggin strips to eat after a major pork brand's PR person tweets a bland statement about black lives mattering sounds extremely plausible
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Sep 4, 2021 21:16
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deep dish peat moss posted:My family has been great about all COVID protections until late June/early July, right around when Delta was starting to spread in the US, when they suddenly decided "okay it's over our vaccines make us immune". First they took the filters out of their masks and then later they stopped wearing masks altogether. My brother started going out to bars and restaurants 2-3 times a week. We all met up for dinner at my parents house and as we sat there maskless he was telling us about his week, about how he went to 2 different restaurants and a couple bars and how he feels fine not wearing a mask now because no one else is either. My parents are both in their 70s and in multiple risk categories each (heart surgery and stroke being the big ones) and I thought they would be upset by this but they didn't care. Long effort post warning, but just for some perspective your family has done way better than mine has. It actually sounds like your family has done better than most and has only stumbled very recently. If they actually wore masks and put effort into social distancing during most of the pandemic, and got a vaccine when it was available, then they did about the best you can hope for (and I'm pretty jealous). I can understand people letting their guard down now that the vaccine is available because there isn't another obvious finish line in sight to wait for. What I mean by that is the way public health measures were communicated for the past 1.5 years was that we need to use distancing, masking, etc. to prevent the infection rate from becoming so high that it swamps our healthcare system. But those measures were always pitched as a temporary sacrifice we need to make until we can get a vaccine out and reach some kind of herd immunity and get back to normal. We're at the point where the vaccines are here, they're effective, they're safe, and (in the US) they're easily available to any adults who want it, but now we've discovered (perhaps unsurprisingly) that a solid 30-40% of US adults would rather die than get a vaccine. Once you accept that truth, what is the new game plan? At the current rate of infections among the unvaccinated (and ignoring the unknown of future variants) we will not reach the population scale herd immunity to effectively end the pandemic for years, if ever. We're in a situation now where we're no longer hostage to covid, but hostage to the unvaccinated. If you are vaccinated, your personal risk of dying or ending up in the ICU from covid is very low. There is still a risk that you could catch it, and there is a risk that you could spread it. But the groups in the most severe danger are the unvaccinated and those at high risk due to being immune compromised or some other factor. As long as the former group exists in significant numbers, the latter will never be safe. With no end to that situation in sight, how long should the rest of us continue living the pandemic lifestyle? There isn't a light at the end of the tunnel anymore for those still sacrificing to protect others. Personally, I'm still waiting until a vaccine is approved for school aged kids and enough time after that to allow anyone who wants one (or sadly, whose parents will let them) to get one. At that point, I'm probably going to try to get back to normal as much as I can (assuming another even more dangerous variant doesn't change the situation). But I really can't blame vaccinated people who have reached that point already, either, because the original game plan has so obviously fallen apart, and public health agencies still seem to be operating in denial instead of giving people a new finish line to look forward to.
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Sep 5, 2021 06:56
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Pennywise the Frown posted:Good. Then they can't reproduce. a lot of them already have  e: really though, i was born into a dumb conservative family and managed to escape, so i don't think a witch cursed my bloodline with chudthink. i'm sure some children of the horse paste will turn out ok. Bad Purchase fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 21:06
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why don't they just scan the microchip to verify vaccination?
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Sep 6, 2021 00:04
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gay picnic defence posted:Cool, now there’s probably a precedent for some chud hospital denying women contraceptives or something. I scanned through this, and the bulk of the article is just short summaries of possible mechanisms by which the drug could interact with the virus. There's a table of studies cited, and 12 of them were written before 2020, so those aren't going to be about covid specifically. But another ~20 are from from 2020 or 2021. These don't look like clinical trials, and the paper itself mentions these are mostly in vitro results. In fact, the whole article has barely anything about clinical results. There's nothing in the entire "Results" section that I can find except for one mention of a trial involving a hamster model. The only reference to clinical trials on humans is actually in the "Introduction", although the meta analysis presented there does make a pretty strong claim: quote:Several doctor-initiated clinical trial protocols that aimed to evaluate outcomes, such as reduction in mortality figures, shortened length of intensive care unit stay and/or hospital stay and elimination of the virus with ivermectin use have been registered at the US ClinicalTrials.gov [7]. Real-time data is also available with a meta-analysis of 55 studies to date. As per data available on 16 May 2021, 100% of 36 early treatment and prophylaxis studies report positive effects (96% of all 55 studies). Of these, 26 studies show statistically significant improvements in isolation. Random effects meta-analysis with pooled effects using the most serious outcome reported 79% and 85% improvement for early treatment and prophylaxis respectively (RR 0.21 [0.11–0.37] and 0.15 [0.09–0.25]). The results were similar after exclusion based sensitivity analysis: 81% and 87% (RR 0.19 [0.14–0.26] and 0.13 [0.07–0.25]), and after restriction to 29 peer-reviewed studies: 82% and 88% (RR 0.18 [0.11–0.31] and 0.12 [0.05–0.30]). Statistically significant improvements were seen for mortality, ventilation, hospitalization, cases, and viral clearance. 100% of the 17 Randomized Controlled Trials (RCTs) for early treatment and prophylaxis report positive effects, with an estimated improvement of 73% and 83% respectively (RR 0.27 [0.18–0.41] and 0.17 [0.05–0.61]), and 93% of all 28 RCTs. These studies are tabulated in Table 1. The probability that an ineffective treatment generated results as positive for the 55 studies to date is estimated to be 1 in 23 trillion (p = 0.000000000000043). The consistency of positive results across a wide variety of cases has been remarkable. It is extremely unlikely that the observed results could have occurred by chance [8]. Unfortunately, there isn't an explanation of what rules or math they used to evaluate the 55 trials or how they determined what a "positive effect" was, nor how they weighted the results together. It could be legit or it could be manipulated/cherry-picked. There's no way to know since they don't provide the numbers they used from each trial and how they combined them. Also, some (and it's not clear how much) of the data they used is unpublished early results from trials still in progress. Other than the paragraph I quoted, the only supporting data in the paper is the table here: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41429-021-00430-5/tables/1 It's just a list of the trials/papers (by author name, not even paper title) and the type of trial. The result of each trial is not even summarized. There is also this big warning at the top of the page: quote:22 June 2021 Editor’s Note: Readers are alerted that the conclusions of this paper are subject to criticisms that are being considered by the editors and the publisher. A further editorial response will follow the resolution of these issues. And the article itself basically acknowledges that its focus is not the clinical trials at the end of the introduction, but rather it's a discussion of literature related to how ivermectin might interact with the covid virus: quote:This article aims to discuss the mechanism of action by summarizing the in vitro and in vivo evidence demonstrating the role of Ivermectin in COVID-19 as per the available literature over the years. I would not eat a tube of apple flavored based on this article alone, but it may be interesting to read some of the clinical trials referenced (when they're complete).
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Sep 7, 2021 05:09
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It's really too early to know if and when boosters of the various vaccines will be needed. Most people have only had them for ~6 months and so far they still seem to be effective (at least the big 3 used in the US). Boosters won't hurt, and I'm sure they will get pushed because there are other strong motivators (money, the appearance of doing something) aside from efficacy. But it's unlikely that you will need a booster of the same vaccine every year for the rest of your life. As new variants come out, new vaccines will be created and tested, so we may end up in a situation where you get delta vaccine/booster next year, and then mu 6 months after, etc. as long as the pandemic continues and the vaccines can be fast-tracked with emergency authorizations.
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Sep 8, 2021 00:02
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a lot of people will threaten to quit, but these are the same cowards scared of vaccines that have been taken by a billion people now. they'll probably be even more scared of losing their job and fall in line after a public tantrum. what i'm hoping to see is infighting where the most deranged members of the anti-vax crowd start turning on the more reasonable ones who comply with mandate to avoid being fired.
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Sep 10, 2021 00:42
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lol, a lot of people are gonna try to get vaxed with a fresh card a 2nd time for the $500. gonna put our public health record tracking to the test.
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Sep 13, 2021 22:42
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Koirhor posted:Joker laugh intensifies #BallGate
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Sep 16, 2021 16:43
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I did the thing where you let your arm go completely limp and both shots were painless. One of them I wouldn't have even known I'd been stabbed if I hadn't watched the needle go in. After the 2nd shot, I also tried rubbing/massaging the area for a few minutes since I read that could help. But both times my shoulder muscle hurt like hell right above the injection site the next day and I could barely use my arm for anything for 5 days afterward. I'm just one anecdote, but in my experience being relaxed and/or massaging afterward doesn't do poo poo.
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Sep 27, 2021 04:30
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Facebook Aunt posted:Mild can still be bad. Remember that study of college athletes? Young, healthy guys in the prime of their life and months after infection 15% of them had signs of heart injury. Sorry this was from a couple pages back, but I'm catching up with the thread. I've seen stuff like this about people showing signs of organ damage months after a covid infection a few times now. It sounds really bad, but one thing I haven't been able to figure out is if this is common to a lot of infections that cause inflammation through the whole body, high fever, and a big immune response. Does anyone happen to know how this compares to other common infections like flu, strep throat, encephalitis/meningitis, etc. that also cause a lot of inflammation? When I get colds/flus I bounce back right in a week or two most of the time, but a couple times I remember feeling winded and fatigued and just couldn't exercise as hard for a few months after a bad flu. I'm not saying iT's JuSt ThE fLu!!! I'm just wondering if "long" symptoms to similar infections were already common, and we're finding it more now just because everyone is hyper-focused on studying anything/everything about covid, whereas flu, etc. are old news.
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Oct 4, 2021 05:57
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there's room for about 330 million flags, just in case also, this looks like something my passive aggressive neighbor would do if their lawn care person ever cut too close to a flower bed
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Oct 4, 2021 16:33
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Raskolnikov2089 posted:In the meantime though, every time you get it you're aging your immune system/organs, making it easier to get even sicker the next time you're infected. They're starting to find heart damage in many asymptomatic cases (small sample but: https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamacardiology/fullarticle/2768916?referringSource=articleShare That is definitely scary. Looks like this was limited to about 100 days after diagnosis in the study. Hopefully the damage is not permanent for most people, but only time will tell. One thing about this study is that they seem to have chosen their control group to be specifically people who had no signs of heart damage to begin with, rather than a random cross section of people: quote:Comparisons were made with age-matched and sex-matched control groups of normotensive adults who were taking no cardiac medications, had normal cardiac volumes and function, and had no evidence of scar (healthy controls; n = 50). Comparisons were also made with risk factor–matched patients (n = 57) for age, sex, hypertension, diabetes, smoking, known coronary artery disease, or comorbidities, sourced from the International T1 Multicenter Outcome Study.12 So of course if your control group is a bunch of people who you already know won't have the problems you're screening for, the comparison isn't going to be that interesting. The risk-factor matched control group is more interesting, and either way I assume 60% of the population is not walking around with signs of heart damage, so it's still likely significant regardless of whether the control group selection was iffy. Edit: Then again, 70% of US adults are overweight, with over 40% being obese, so maybe we all just have lovely dying hearts all the time  https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/obesity-overweight.htm Bad Purchase fucked around with this message at 18:26 on Oct 4, 2021 |
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Oct 4, 2021 18:14
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A man died WITH a gunshot wound (another coronavirus)!!
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Oct 5, 2021 05:04
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They could just add more letters to the alphabet.
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Oct 9, 2021 02:21
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There are some very unhappy people where I work threatening to quit because we got the vax mandate recently too, but so far every one I know about is one of the self-important do-nothing manager types, mostly old, who probably get paid double what their replacement will... if they even bother to replace them. There will definitely be some short term disruption if 5% of the company suddenly resigns, but this is the only time I've actually felt some optimism about the future of the company in 5+ years. A lot of deadweight is threatening to voluntarily break loose right now.
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Oct 11, 2021 23:35
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^ silver lining, you are now allowed to post in the menstruation thread
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Oct 13, 2021 04:00
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just drink some sheep drench when you get your booster to help fight the bad reaction
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Oct 20, 2021 18:07
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can't wait to watch them gently caress up the messaging on the initial rollout, walk back the authorization in 2 weeks just long enough to create more ammunition and doubt for antivaxxers, then go forward with it again
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Oct 20, 2021 22:28
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liz posted:Thanks for all the feedback re third shot! my guess is that it's not really necessary to get the booster if you're otherwise healthy and your main worry is not dying if you live or interact with other people who are unvaxxed or high risk, then it probably is a good idea to get it if you don't want them to die if/when you get a breakthrough case. maybe it will also help you avoid some of the risk of long-covid symptoms, but that's just a guess, i haven't seen any data. this is probably too simplistic and definitely not super scientific, but i suspect part of what we're seeing in the drop off of vaccine effectiveness (like ~90% down to 60% ballpark for pfizer/moderna after 6 months) is the difference between the short term and long term immune response. the way i've heard it explained by people with medical backgrounds is that your body will keep active antibodies around and ready for a few months after an infection. but if you get reinfected after that short term response has faded, your body has to ramp up production again (T cells stimulate B cells which are what carry the antibodies or something like that). that means the virus will have longer to reproduce in your body unchecked before your immune system can fight it off, and the more it spreads in your body the worse you get and the higher chance you have to infect someone else because you'll be shedding live virus that isn't covered in antibodies longer and in larger amounts. getting a booster, even if it does nothing to change long term immunity, will probably put you back in that short term phase and you'll get a few months of heightened immune readiness. most likely, though, long term immunity will probably improve somewhat too. there are usually diminishing returns with each booster, but each one is different and it will take years to really know for sure. one caveat is that there is probably a much bigger benefit to a 2nd J&J shot than a 3rd moderna or pfizer shot. if i were team J&J i'd be scheduling a booster asap, and maybe even doing a vaccine mix tape.
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Oct 20, 2021 22:58
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the covid death rate for a baby (assuming no other major health issues) is negligible -- like there have been fewer than 1000 covid deaths total in the US in the under 14 age group since the start of the pandemic, and even if there's organ damage, the baby organs start to fall out and get replaced by adult organs at age 6.
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Oct 24, 2021 01:54
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