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You can't cut back on antennas! You will regret
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Mar 15, 2022 13:38
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For Khiva end game, could you stock up on Howlers (just drive every new ship to a hidden city, strip and rebuild them to a howler structure) and then use them as militia commanders? I'm picturing all the cities around Khiva pacified, spreading the howlers out, then when the end game is triggered just hit up every city and buy everything you can. Could be a real cool Zerg rush tactic. Also if you are at end game and don't need to worry about much, they could always give their life for the cause by pulling a glorious full body dive bomb....
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Mar 22, 2022 01:50
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Standard tactic is to have one ship in every city you can, yes. Probably not much benefit in doing a howler refit to all of them though, that seems like a waste of time. Just bum rum the enemy.
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Mar 22, 2022 10:37
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You'd still need to have several strikefleets with enough speed/range to catch the incoming enemy groups before they get to the "sucks be to you, you lose" positions, right? Do you get a grace period or once they hit the launch sites it is instantly game over? I still think an alternative endgame option would have been neat, where you side with Daud and have to rush back south past Ur to deal with a boss fight lurking down in your home country.
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Mar 22, 2022 10:59
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Crazy Achmed posted:You'd still need to have several strikefleets with enough speed/range to catch the incoming enemy groups before they get to the "sucks be to you, you lose" positions, right? To be honest, I've never had one get to a launch sight, so I'm not sure what the launch is like. The game is clear that A100Ns can be used to shoot them down, so keep something like a Triumphant at Khiva if your nervous (I'd prefer to get it up in their face personally). The groups are extremely slow, so unless you've got everything stuck to an unupgraded Sevastopol you'll easily catch them with any ship, and your casualties no longer matter, so sacrificing Archangles and Gladiators just to take out one or two ships is fine. Just remember their going to lob nuclear missiles at anything they see/pick up on radar. But it's still just a strike group, albeit a heavy one. A single aircraft carrier can easily take each one down, plus you'll be launching whatever nuclear missiles you own at the things.
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Mar 22, 2022 12:23
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I’ve had khiva even take a nuke that I let reach it’s launch point and didn’t game over.
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Mar 22, 2022 12:48
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 What's the plan now? buy some more ships? Look for more planes?
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Mar 25, 2022 11:40
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Crazy Achmed posted:
Looks like the reports of that fleet's death were greatly exaggerated. Feels like he needs to hit a rare modules city for planes, and also probably a Tarkhan or trade fleet for a payday. Or even a fleet HQ, since that will be about 16k in nukes. Rebuilding a new attack ship basically needs to be done in a hidden city and would take 60+ hours, by which time the rest of the fleet could be most of the way to Khiva, so I'm not convinced on viability, but the game does allow you to hang out there for the whole time so it's possible just to fast forward an entire ship build
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Mar 25, 2022 18:36
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I keep thinking this thread is dead then I check on it and it has more posts! Basically our situation isn't dire, but it isn't great. Being able to recover The Rooster and a fuel tanker from that debacle is pretty good for us. That TheDemon said is right, we don't really have the time to sit and build a new ship, we really need to get moving. I don't want a repeat of last campaign where the Sevastopol sat in a hidden city for ~100hrs refitting while I fast forwarded. If we can stretch to the next fleet HQ we can make some solid ground.
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Mar 27, 2022 22:32
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Gave this game another try as a result of this LP, its great! I think my first campaign is over though, I learned about the ramming/retry glitch the hard way and lost nearly my entire fleet to a -8 morale ramming penalty from a strike fleet battle that I had to redo twice and didn't end up keeping said battle where ramming took place anyway
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May 5, 2022 00:40
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So is there a known rule in map generation that there'll never be a hidden city so close to khiva? I kinda feel like we're doing amazingly well for just having the two combat ships right now, hopefully we can restock on planes soon.
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May 6, 2022 12:19
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26 minute Speedrun of Highfleet. Couple things to note. - Lots of starting cash - He brings in one ship specifically for spare parts (missiles and planes) - He uses an upgunned version of Howler which carries nukes. - Little tragedy, much more statistics.
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May 6, 2022 16:26
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Crazy Achmed posted:So is there a known rule in map generation that there'll never be a hidden city so close to khiva? Yes, there can be no hidden city within 4000 kilometres of Khiva. And that is indeed some pretty good mastery of the short range combat system, I completely suck at it, so I appreciate it all the more.
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May 6, 2022 16:35
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Donkringel posted:26 minute Speedrun of Highfleet. Hang on, how was Khiva so lightly defended? And only one endgame nuclear strike group? Is this some kind of escalation mechanic where gathering forces get bigger if you take longer / build a larger force yourself? Using a swarm of A-100N-equipped howlers not only to locate and blow up strike fleets, but also to catch incoming nukes, is brutal but effective.
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May 8, 2022 07:02
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Crazy Achmed posted:Hang on, how was Khiva so lightly defended? And only one endgame nuclear strike group? Is this some kind of escalation mechanic where gathering forces get bigger if you take longer / build a larger force yourself? There were two nuke carriers at first, just he nuked the missiles off of one so it was recategorized as a normal strike group. Khiva garrison being small isn't unusual.
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May 8, 2022 07:47
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Donkringel posted:
Yes if you make a ship that's nothing but engines and a jammer you can kite KH-15P missiles from the map. If you do it right you can get them to do a full 180 and fly back into the strategic group that launched them. You can't exactly do that with the regular ones but you can get them to lob them in one direction while your strike sneaks up on them from behind. To redirect a non-P You hit the ECM to get them to shoot at you, toggle it off so the missile acquires a lock and turns, then toggle it back on again so the missile loses lock and keeps flying along it's new bearing. You need a ship that can fly cross range faster than the missiles seeker cone.
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May 8, 2022 15:55
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Also I really appreciate the option to just cut the governor down with your sword during that dialogue. He makes it clear to you at the start that it was intended to be a trap to kill you, so I see no dishonour in taking him out personally.
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May 10, 2022 13:54
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What a loving twist in the latest YT episode. Probably the nastiest situation I've ever seen the game throw at someone.
TheDemon fucked around with this message at 07:39 on Jun 10, 2022 |
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Jun 10, 2022 06:20
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Also, the planet's getting colder. A lot colder, and fast. The Khiva reactor might be the single most important piece of infrastructure on the planet because of the tremendous power output it produces.
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Jun 10, 2022 07:20
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Would the fallout from nuclear strikes spread the cover the entire atmosphere of the planet, or just that one region? Like, the planet is loving ENOURMOUS right? Would there be bits spared? Or maybe they just threw a fuckton of nukes at the place.
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Jun 11, 2022 10:05
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Wrr posted:Would the fallout from nuclear strikes spread the cover the entire atmosphere of the planet, or just that one region? Like, the planet is loving ENOURMOUS right? Would there be bits spared? Nuclear Winter is due to sheer volume of ash thrown up by burning cities, and even then you'd need a good proportion of all cities worldwide burning to see a significant effect. In the fiction it's only been the Capital that's been nuked at the start, so either nuclear war has really gotten out of hand in the Empire, or something about the high methane planet is exacerbating the effect (or the developer underestimates how many bombs are required). Fallout is mostly local, but the ash eventually goes into the high atmosphere and is global (a few areas might get slightly lower effect just due to average high altitude winds). A bigger planet has most atmosphere so the ash is more diluted, but the fiction is depicting what looks like the start of an extremely serious nuclear winter. Not Frostpunk bad, but 5 to 10 years of global Donner party unless you have a handy reactor for heating and hydroponics.
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Jun 11, 2022 12:34
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Bug Squash posted:Nuclear Winter is due to sheer volume of ash thrown up by burning cities, and even then you'd need a good proportion of all cities worldwide burning to see a significant effect. In the fiction it's only been the Capital that's been nuked at the start, so either nuclear war has really gotten out of hand in the Empire, or something about the high methane planet is exacerbating the effect (or the developer underestimates how many bombs are required). Fallout is mostly local, but the ash eventually goes into the high atmosphere and is global (a few areas might get slightly lower effect just due to average high altitude winds). Lorewise there were a lot more nukes thrown than you might think, a LOT
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Jun 11, 2022 20:36
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Also Elaat likely hasn't fully recovered from the previous end of the world and it's climate system and biosphere are still weak and off balance, so this little push certainly doesn't help.
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Jun 11, 2022 20:43
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AtomikKrab posted:Lorewise there were a lot more nukes thrown than you might think, a LOT Paradoxically more nukes at the same targets means less chance of nuclear winter, since the target is just vapourised rather than starting a fire storm which is what generates the sunlight blocking ash. The science of nuclear winter is complex and controversial.
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Jun 11, 2022 20:51
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We might get practical experiments soon, so that'll be a relief. Given the enormous abundance of methane on Elaat, I wonder what sort of nonsense a nuclear blast might cause there, crack a methanifer and just start eternal flamejets as the gas leaves the ground under pressure, like the Darvaza burning crater, or those coal seam fires. Those could be highly exciting, although in those cases, nuclear power won't reduce carbon footprint quite as well.
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Jun 11, 2022 20:56
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Bug Squash posted:Paradoxically more nukes at the same targets means less chance of nuclear winter, since the target is just vapourised rather than starting a fire storm which is what generates the sunlight blocking ash. The science of nuclear winter is complex and controversial. The empire is vast and huge and I think large swathes of it were nuked fairly hard
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Jun 11, 2022 21:02
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I don't think anyone on Elaat would give a drat about carbon emissions, and for good reason. For one thing Methane is 80x worse then CO2 in atmosphere. The place is already a toxic desert. You're never recovering that biosphere on less than a 10,000 year timeframe regardless of how environmental you try to be. Your one and only option is nuclear power and methane power for electricity/heat for desalination and running greenhouses for sustenance.
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Jun 11, 2022 21:11
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Primarily it was a joke about us potentially getting nuked on current Earth. (And it is true that not flaring the methane on oil rigs is a particularly bad practice that somehow pops up whenever the obligation to do so is removed, but I was thinking of impressive sights more than anything with that.) Aside from that, the enormous hydrocarbon availability speaks of an enormous biosphere in geological times, and there is agriculture around the cities as the caravan leaders have said, the cities have to have a source of water around as well, that desert isn't completely hosed, yet, with conditions closer to the Sahel than the Sahara and as it were, the green wall project is doing pretty well down there, it's just a big, labour intensive project that requires government investment around here, I will admit it doesn't look that good on Elaat with the lower population density and the enormous world devouring wars that are threatening to destroy the climate and annihilate all life outside of the bunkers.
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Jun 11, 2022 21:35
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Elaat also used to, or will in the future (Never quite sure if Hammerfight is past or future), have problems with giant flying lobsters that people battle by twirling helicopters with swords attached to them at them. Elaat is a weird place and its biosphere and physics do whatever the hell they feel like.
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Jun 11, 2022 21:49
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It also ties into Perimeter through Hammerfight apparently, not a peaceful place by any means.
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Jun 11, 2022 22:15
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wiegieman posted:Also, the planet's getting colder. A lot colder, and fast. The Khiva reactor might be the single most important piece of infrastructure on the planet because of the tremendous power output it produces. Do they ever explain this or the weird weather that happens? The first run through the game didn't seem to explain much around it
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Jun 12, 2022 12:54
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They presume it's a nuclear winter, or divine punishment.
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Jun 12, 2022 13:27
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TheDemon posted:What a loving twist in the latest YT episode. Probably the nastiest situation I've ever seen the game throw at someone. I know I have abandoned this thread twice (the guilt is extreme), but yeah. This is going to be a really really hard next hour of gameplay. We are in a situation where if one nuke hits Khiva it's an instant game over and there are missile carrier fleets in range that just got the order to pull the trigger. Behind them are multiple Strike Groups with nukes and of course our good friends with their ballistic missile carriers. I asked for hard mode and now they are giving me Iron Man. Edit: Since I haven't updated the thread. The latest Hard Mode update had me take Khiva with an incoming cruise missile on screen. When the game restarted after the briefing from Pytor, the incoming missile turned into a nuke (in mid air) and detonated over Khiva, killed 864k people and putting the health of the reactor at 14%. We can't take another hit. Phrosphor fucked around with this message at 05:35 on Jun 15, 2022 |
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Jun 15, 2022 05:32
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That actually seems quite odd, just because it feels hacky for the game to be programmed to choose the warhead type after it's launched rather than having the AI pick it beforehand. It's really out of keeping with how detailed and grognardy the game is. Anyway well poo poo. At least we have a million ships, what do we do now? Split stuff up and send it out towards the spawn points looking for the ICBM fleets?
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Jun 15, 2022 08:35
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Crazy Achmed posted:That actually seems quite odd, just because it feels hacky for the game to be programmed to choose the warhead type after it's launched rather than having the AI pick it beforehand. It's really out of keeping with how detailed and grognardy the game is. If the game didn't break the rules on warhead types the player could trigger nuclear war and the AI would have to refit all its ships into nukes in reaction. The only janky part is how the warhead is picked dependent on game state on impact, rather than on launch, but in 9999 out of 10000 cases it wouldn't matter.
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Jun 15, 2022 10:34
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TheDemon posted:If the game didn't break the rules on warhead types the player could trigger nuclear war and the AI would have to refit all its ships into nukes in reaction. Well yes! Given how detailed and nuanced other parts of the game are, including forcing the player to spend time and effort reloading and refitting missile loadouts, it's really surprising that the game doesn't also force the computer to reload/refit it ships with nukes. Doing a fast first-strike and trying to take advantage of refit time could be a neat mechanic - although there have been a lot of updates, perhaps it was once a thing and got removed for balance or something.
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Jun 18, 2022 07:01
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The AI changing to nukes suddenly does seem cheap, yes. But, in the LP specifically it is clearly karmic punishment for Phrosphor's attempt to manipulate the Kiva triggers with his foreknowledge.
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Jun 18, 2022 10:25
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It's missiles changing type while still in flight that really gets me. I'd let the ai have an instant retro fit, but surely the game could have kept tabs on whether that was an kn or a kn-n that is flying towards me.
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Jun 18, 2022 11:27
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Bug Squash posted:It's missiles changing type while still in flight that really gets me. I'd let the ai have an instant retro fit, but surely the game could have kept tabs on whether that was an kn or a kn-n that is flying towards me. I think I posted this a while back but yeah AI strategic missiles are always nukes but when detonating they just magically downgrade themselves to HE or proximity/shrapnel warheads based on the "has the player triggered a 'Start of Nuclear War' event?" flag. So what would need to happen is the variable would have to be saved at the time of launch. Also something else I may have pointed out is that when you're firing missiles at a specific moving target that you have spotted via fire control radar, you can click directly on the target's icon (the hitbox for clicking on it is a bit weird but you can watch for when the tooltip includes airspeed) and as long as you maintain FCR contact the missile will be locked-on from the moment it launches and track to intercept in realtime based on the target's velocity, instead of needing to acquire in-flight (and possibly going after the wrong target or whiffing) edit: which is to say if you have a spotter in position you can reliably drop KN15s on a strikegroup/etc without having to guess where they're going to be an hour into the future, and the missile will usually still hit even if the target changes course or reactively tries to dodge/juke or launch bait planes silentsnack fucked around with this message at 20:58 on Jun 18, 2022 |
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Jun 18, 2022 20:47
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I wonder if Elaat is going to have an abundance of oceans in the next few years. Couple reasons why. 1) Massive amounts of rain due. 2) Planet's average temperature dropping due to ash in the air. 3) The absolute shitload of methane gas wells being broken due to nuclear explosions and venting jets into the air producing water vaper as a byproduct. I don't know how far off all the chemical reactions would be covering the planet in a series of shallow oceans, but could do a ocean themed game after the release of Highfleet 2.
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Jun 19, 2022 11:09
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