|
As bad as the writing in this game is, I actually like the writing on this map. Azura got screwed by your defection, so the Hoshidans try to kill her. She's fleeing/hiding, and has to sneak to a chest to grab a weapon so she can fend for herself. It's reasonable map-based story-telling, which is neat to see. I think Conquest overloads on the gimmicky maps, but there are some real interesting ideas that were executed competently enough in the process. Far better than Birthright, which just goes for over-huge tedious maps that get boring really quickly. I used Azura in dual-attacks a LOT. Mainly because it was funny, but her also being actually reasonably competent at it. Still remember her most common combat bark. "Look me in the eyes!". Sadly, I never finished Conquest, which I find a pity. I blame playing it right after Birthright and the hot steaming garbage that was. So the parts of Conquest which were similar to Birthright had way less tolerance from me, and I just kind of said 'gently caress it'.
|
#
¿
Oct 8, 2021 10:57
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ May 14, 2024 02:45 |
|
|
Honestly Adventurer Nyx sounds better largely because magic bow + staff sounds better than simply tomes given her combat problems.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 9, 2021 01:07
|
|
|
Well, to be fair to myself, I never looked at the world map for Fates because Fates generally sucks on the writing coherency. To be less fair to myself, I don't generally look at video game world maps anyways. When it comes to Fates, the best the writing can really be is good on an individual scale. But your points made, even ignoring the world map thing, kind of make this one fall apart even on that level. A pity, I was actually trying to give the game some credit and look where that got me.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 9, 2021 05:51
|
|
|
You’re making me want to dust off the 3DS (and find it) to play some Conquest. Ignoring the story would be the smart thing, and honestly the maps are well designed. I normally give everyone a Bronze weapon so they can nullify a 1% crit if need be.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 9, 2021 21:46
|
|
|
The children feel functionally nerfed here. While they get more class reach and stuff, it takes a lot of resources to bounce them around classes. My runs didn't give the children special treatment other than vaguely trying to make physical with physical and magical with magical children. They were vastly underperforming compared to my regular units. Granted, hating the poo poo out of the Deeprealms in all its aspects probably made it so that I wasn't engaging particularly highly with it.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 13, 2021 02:38
|
|
|
It’s kind of funny to me that the fan service characters are just so thoroughly unimpressive. They each have their own neat tricks and all, but they just seem weaker than what you’d expect from being returning fanservice characters. Odin’s probably got the most use from Nosferatu, where it always gives him a purpose at least initially.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 14, 2021 21:16
|
|
|
Walla posted:It's literally a single comment by Chrom at the beginning of the map, so probably as much as Ike's descendant showing up in Awakening. That explanation kind of requires you to take Fate's story and writing seriously, which well...... Let's just say that is not within my capacity.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 15, 2021 00:00
|
|
|
Walla posted:I would love for someone competent to go through the scripts for all 3 routes and the supports and do a rewrite for Conquest and Birthright. There is a good core there, and the overall scenario has so many parallels with the plot of Shadows of Valentia that I think 2 good routes could still exist. The problem, even if those with the rights cared enough to do that, is that you'd be shackling a theoretical good writer to the stinking fetid corpse that is the game's existing baseline. - There's no reason for children characters to exist. They're only in the game because people loved them in Awakening. Awakening's children had a reason to exist and a goal, which helped give at least a baseline of writing to work with. Fates children start existing with plot contrivance and have literally no impact on events. - Contributing to the next problem, there's too many loving characters. This is Fire Emblem bloat at its worst. So on the character/support side alone, this one writer or writing team already has a hideously huge task ahead of them. Now for story: - There's no real coherence to events. A lot of maps don't make sense on an individual level, never mind how they fit into a greater narrative. - The major goal of the routes don't really have incremental progress, it's really unsatisfying to play. - If Japanland has all the abundances possible and Nohr has nothing to the point starvation is commonplace, how is Nohr remotely a threat to Japanland? - Corrin is the big gaping canker, being a self-insert avatar. They can't ever do wrong, yet need to face challenges. The result is an incompetent bland character that has no real impact on events as things contrive themselves into place. Either they're accidentally murdering swaths of people in Birthright for pathos or they're somehow never killing anyone themselves in Conquest to stay righteous. What's the point?
|
|
#
¿
Oct 15, 2021 01:34
|
|
|
Quackles posted:Remove them. I totally agree with this (and would say that removing the Awakening characters in general would be a good idea) but I really doubt any writer would get enough freedom from outside meddling to manage this.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 15, 2021 03:26
|
|
|
One of the things I'll definitely compliment Fates for is making Bows not the 'useless weapon'. The fact that you actually want Archers for the first time is kind of a refreshing change.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 15, 2021 03:36
|
|
|
Yeah 3H's answer to just having a skill tax of Close Counter was kind of boring.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 15, 2021 05:03
|
|
|
FoolyCharged posted:I will never understand the thoughts of the doofus who decided that the tank unit should be near incapable of being the first unit to reach the fight. I understand even less how nobody changed this over the course of more than a dozen entries in the series. Part of the problem is that Knights/Generals are usually not even more durable. Dodging is just too valuable and they’re the worst at it, not to mention speed being tied to doubling. They just have a laundry list of oopsies. The movement is also still a bugbear yeah. Fates oddly fixed this somewhat in addition to the Bow thing. Generals getting that skill to stop doubling period did a lot to make them suck less, and Pair Up existing means they can actually piggyback on someone to teach the fight first. I think that’s why I can at least respect a lot of Fates gameplay design because that’s where it felt they were at least trying.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 15, 2021 17:23
|
|
|
That direct Kana/Corrin comparison is a direct reason as to why I'm severely unimpressed with child units really. Extra effort, on a different support line entirely, and not even statistically superior.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 16, 2021 02:15
|
|
|
Your Odin experience is the same as mine. Incredibly useful, trivializes a lot of challenges, garbage levels means eventual replacement
|
|
#
¿
Oct 17, 2021 22:22
|
|
|
Honestly I’d probably start on Casual. Permadeath, while a core part of FE, is honestly not that engaging since it largely forces restarts. I’d say just go Casual, but show some restraint in not deliberately sacrificing units. The idea is more of a safety net to not have to restart due to a 1% crit or just some carelessness at the very end of the map.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 18, 2021 12:57
|
|
|
I at least liked Keaton for battle use better than the Awakening bunch. In general, I appreciate that they tried to make the beast units more interesting in personal dynamic, even if it still kind of misses the mark in a few ways.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 19, 2021 22:42
|
|
|
I actually used Azura in combat in this one. It was the combination of amusement factor, clone Azura not being able to sing, Corrin getting jack poo poo for experience here and the fact that mine's strength growth actually came through. Yours seems strength screwed, 14 is really low for her growth.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 20, 2021 21:30
|
|
|
Its funny that Gunter can have growths like that and not actually be useless due to Fate's mechanics. Being a movement/stat backpack is a dumb role, but Corrin can actually make use of it so... sure! The other people with passives that buff Corrin don't gain access or easy access to Wyvern Rider so let's milk it I guess.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 21, 2021 04:10
|
|
|
As much as I appreciate the idea of making it deterministic, that's basically removing a tool almost entirely from the AI and giving it to the player.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 23, 2021 09:10
|
|
|
Ninja Hell was definitely one of the contributers to my increasing fatigue. The poo poo writing (hadn't learnt to just skip the story yet) on top of the rear end in a top hat design of the map was just kind of eh...... It's really weird to me that Wyvern Elise is actually really good on Conquest. In small part due to Bolt Axe Elise being really good against Ninjas, especially one as bulky as yours, what the hell.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 26, 2021 20:05
|
|
|
As irritating as even the little story snippets are, this is making me really want to pick up a ROM of this, since I can't find my 3DS. I forgot how much I actually wanted a Fire Emblem with, y'know, good map design. I can't play Three Houses anymore because the map design in it is so dull.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 27, 2021 20:49
|
|
|
To be a little fair to the arena battle there, Brass Naginata + WTA and for the Dark Knight, he is hitting her res, which she actually has a decent amount of. The Hero is also working through that dual attack penalty. To be a lot less fair to them, that still means that the Dark Knight has maybe 18 attack. And she only has 10 effective defense before getting sworded, she really should take more damage than that. I understand that they do try to make it so that anyone can fight and win in that arena, but those promoted enemies are just sad. It IS funny though, so that's worth something.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 30, 2021 11:35
|
|
|
This is unfortunately the problem that Conquest map design encounters. When you're trying to do tons of gimmick maps each time, you're going to get some results which are... awful. Kitsune Hell is kind of interesting in managing to stack all these terrible factors together to create something really putrid.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 30, 2021 22:36
|
|
|
ApplesandOranges posted:I guess I'm in the minority where I don't really hate the kitsune map? I just gave Beast Killer/effective weaponry on Benny and Camilla and they were quite good at weaving through the mess. Your point about Azura is the exact reason why this map is terrible. With Pass and Illusion, you can’t use defensive or offensive interference to keep squishies safe. And yet, because they’re all largely the same enemy, the same enemy, a solution applied to one generally works with the whole crowd. So you end up with this really boring map because there’s a narrow band of solutions, and all the solutions tend to slow it down. It’s also too loving big so it drags on badly.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 31, 2021 02:12
|
|
|
That definitely feels like the intended path, but for me all it did was sour me on Fates entirely and I couldn't finish Conquest, which was just a kick in the pants.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 31, 2021 06:23
|
|
|
I see why Leo is at severe risk of being tossed in the dumpster, he is just not shaping up. Ophelia standing there all superior in the ways that matter doesn't help at all. He may be able to Nosferatu better if he reclassed maybe? Being Leo, he's still a reasonable filler member since his personal weapon means he's not taking weapons away from anyone else at least....
|
|
#
¿
Nov 1, 2021 09:26
|
|
|
The fact that Elise wasn't credited for the MVP there is the real crime. I mean, CMON game. Also she is an unholy beast at this point.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 1, 2021 19:04
|
|
|
His strength is too low to actually kill poo poo with and his sword rank isn't supporting it well either. Plus no WTA to help both those ends and 1 range vs a 1-2 range means it's player phase only... which means you may as well just use anyone with better strength who doesn't get one-rounded to do it instead. 15 speed is also past 'slow' and more 'ok who won't double him on this map...' Even Elise would do better with her A rank axes if you used the Dual-Club.... if Camilla wasn't around to basically do a much better job mutilating red-triangle enemies with it. Leo will still do some damage blasting people with his personal spell, but he's definitely a fringe character through and through. Edit: How valid would it be to try to get Leo into General to grab Wary Fighter? I'd always been curious about using Wary Fighter on a Nosferatu tank. It's just that's 3 levels in a physical class with no way to use your primary stat.... And yeah Lilith is just a fine supporting example of why the writing in Fates is atrocious. Keldulas fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Nov 1, 2021 |
|
#
¿
Nov 1, 2021 21:44
|
|
|
Got inspired to start a Conquest run, because honestly, I do adore the dual attack/guard system and the gameplay stuff. I feel they basically took the fun parts of what Awakening introduced, and made it a lot less RNG. Corrin immediately starts with Str/Spd/Def level, and then HP/Str/Def, while Jakob goes for HP/Str/Spd, and another Str/Spd level. Uh..... that's a strong start you two.....
|
|
#
¿
Nov 1, 2021 23:42
|
|
|
To be fair, Azama is actually a physical unit that starts as a priest for some reason, so him getting a physical Heart Seal actually makes sense there.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 4, 2021 06:26
|
|
|
Double post oopsie.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 4, 2021 07:14
|
|
|
I think it’s really the mechanics working against the kids here. First off, unlike Awakening their base stats aren’t getting juiced nearly as much from the parents. So they’re not at a particular advantage. Having inheritance of skills is kind of neat I guess, but the advantage there is less pronounced due to the parents having time to play around with Heart Seals beforehand as well as the A+ or S rank class mixing if inclined. Others have mentioned the lack of post game challenges to use kids on. Which means that the kids barely have any time to be used. And are usually restricted to the weapons of whatever classes they have on promotion unless you want to just force feed them Arms Scrolls. All to get more units that are just stat-par with your current units, but with basically no supports built. It feels like a lot of effort for nebulous gain honestly. Even the early kids suffer from this. Like you can get a really good Sophie early on due to the very natural pairing of Effie or Mozu since the mothers are both low move units that work well with Silas. But any other mother and you start crippling her join time or stats. So there’s very little space for discussion of optimization, so it’s resultingly not very interesting to talk or think about in the slightest. It kind of shows in the children analyses here where it’s like, “this is good for them, I guess…” Also the Deeprealms loving suck. How they suck has already been mentioned a lot. But them sucking this hard may also contribute to a lot of people just disengaging with them in all their aspects.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 5, 2021 20:39
|
|
|
I like how they’re going to have a Hoshidan do something probably scummy but the only way they’re allowed to be evil enough is to be possessed. The oh so perfect Japan. It still sadly makes Takumi the most interesting Royal due to actually having a character arc
|
|
#
¿
Nov 6, 2021 18:21
|
|
|
The Dwyer/Kana replicate combo honestly seems kind of hilarious? No excuse to not be at full HP at all times if you're doing THAT poo poo.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 9, 2021 04:54
|
|
|
Lunge is a lot more annoying in the hands of the enemies than it is useful for the player. Lunge’s purpose is largely to pull something out of position by putting yourself out of position. So it’s far more useful for the enemy since the loss condition is effectively lose any unit. I have used Lunge a few times to make things easier and what not, but this trend still exists.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 18, 2021 17:05
|
|
|
This is sort of reminding me why I couldn't keep going in late Conquest. Too many impossible skill combinations that are specifically not fun to deal with.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 20, 2021 11:17
|
|
|
Honestly, the endgame of Conquest throws so much bullshit at you that the best counter is a doom-stack unit buffed to the gills. And since Xander has his special sword and his extreme power, there's no real reason not to use him for it. Combine that with Xander honestly never really changing from game to game as I don't see how you can give him much variance, and I can see this just being kind of bland for the end. Feels like endgame Conquest doesn't realize that you need to leave a variety of options as valid moves for the game to be interesting.... As far as I can tell, your tactics haven't changed in a good long while because of this restriction, so burn-out is very understandable. At least early on, you had a variety of tactics you were able to employ. I find Fire Emblem at its best when you can use your, y'know, army to fight battles, not just like 1-2 dudes. Conquest endgame seems to suffer from basically turning into Awakening endgame, which is also boring as gently caress because there's no real thought or tactical decisions to make. The only decision is you tweaking the stats to make your doomstack unit do its thing, which isn't really interesting to play or watch. Still, good on you for the LP. I did enjoy myself for the early bits before running into the malaise of watching these endgame maps. They do not look fun, and it kind of killed my interest in doing my own run, but the early bits were still valuable and fun.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 21, 2021 22:21
|
|
|
Three Houses map design really is terminally bland. Conquest goes too far the other direction, to the point of overdoing it. I can at least respect Conquest for having their intent in the right place to make the maps interesting, even if I think they hosed the execution up.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 22, 2021 12:06
|
|
|
Odin is like the prime example of how useful Nosferatu is. I have simply never seen an Odin turn out well, and yet he is still one of the best characters in Conquest for just how much easier he makes the earlier maps. Since those are the maps where you're at your weakest....
|
|
#
¿
Nov 22, 2021 20:51
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ May 14, 2024 02:45 |
|
|
The real problem is that there's a real lack of reasonable counterplay. For some forsaken reason, they removed the Restore staff. So you can't fix any of the debuffs/hexing/freezing that happens on a map, and it's really obnoxious.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 24, 2021 07:02
|
|