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A few updates late, but here's some thoughts on Felicia: Feeding some XP to Felicia and then starting a Branch of Fate with female Corrin means Felicia gains more levels when she rejoins. I want to say your second servant gains 10 levels when they rejoin, so Felicia can come in with Tomebreaker right when it's useful. Your Jakob does start Chapter 7 at level 1 though. Paladin or Great Knight Jakob is good for about 3 chapters, but you should consider Bow Knight Felicia. She will be more relevant in the mid game and can even stay useful well into the late game. Jakob starts out stronger but Felicia will take longer to burn out. Also, I have opinions on Nyx. Great LP! I typically only play on Hard because I find the bullshit of Lunatic to be not fun, but one thing I appreciate is that the enemies on both difficulties generally have the same stats. There's just more of them on Lunatic and more skills.
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Oct 2, 2021 00:57
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FoolyCharged posted:Hey, there's no agonizing over goddess icons. They get immediately pinned to Arthur's chin. No questions asked. Also this. Unless you're one of those godless types who hates justice.
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Oct 2, 2021 00:57
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midnight lasagna posted:Does Bow Knight Felicia really work? I guess she can use both the Shining Bow & the Levin Sword but it's hard to imagine her doing much with her measly strength even at base. Not that I've tried it, I tend to bench her if she's not being used as my premier staff bot. Bow Knights are pretty drat busted in this game. Ch. 8 BK Felicia does what Niles does on that map, except better. With a Corrin pair up she can solo the entire map if you wish and it will be a long time before any enemy catches up to her in speed so she will be doubling forever. She puts in more work in Ch. 10 than Jakob does, she makes short work of Cheve and the Opera House and she's your best hope of having Shuriken Breaker for Ninja Cave without reclassing Camilla or pumping more experience than is feasible into someone else. Also her personal skill is even better for Corrin's survivability. I've never bothered to raise her sword rank since she still dies in 2 hits and I have better uses for Arms Scrolls. Just reclass her in Ch. 8 with a bronze bow and watch her wreck poo poo. quote:Am looking forward to your Nyx opinions. I'll be honest, a lot of units in this game I don't have too much experience with, so for some of my analyses I'll be going on what I've heard other people have said before! Nyx will never be good. Dark Knight Nyx is useful for all of 3 chapters and makes a good wife glued to Odin or Leo but that's about it. But Nyx can make for a great utility unit, especially if you've already reclassed your first servant. Outlaw Nyx will have similar speed to Niles at the same level which means she can one round every unpaired pegasus in Chapter 10. Adventurer Nyx will give you a powerful staff bot who can kill any flier and will make better use of the Shining Bow than even Niles. It's not a power move, but if you want to use Nyx you can spend the resources to do so. Adventurer Nyx absolutely wants Arms Scrolls, and using her means you might lose out on a Ninja or Bow Knight who can potentially put in more work. But if you need a healer and rescue bot for Ch. 10, it's not a wrong move. And honestly, I'd almost rather have Outlaw Nyx for Ch. 10 than Archer Mozu, since Nyx will be more immediately useful there.
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Oct 2, 2021 21:21
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theshim posted:get out
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Oct 3, 2021 02:03
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midnight lasagna posted:Surely you mean "pawned off to become gold I'm too afraid to spend and never use"? My hoarding complex has layers I'll try to save future thoughts for when we get the units. You can do some fun things with Selena as well.
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Oct 3, 2021 19:33
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Elise: Wyvern Elise is a bit of a meme really. I actually feel it's a bit of a waste to reclass her now since she does just fine waiting until she's level 10 and instantly promoting, and by then you'll probably have a free Fire tome. Though at least now she has one of the highest defenses on your team and her strength will be on par once she gains a level. Bolt Axe and Lightning Tome will be fun but she will always want a Fire Tome as well, and her magic and speed will always be high enough that she won't need anything else. She's probably the 3rd best user of Calamity Gate as well if you get it. Her skill will always be horrible no matter how you build her. Effie: She will always be strong. A lesser meme is Maid Effie. At 10/1 she will usually have around 18 strength and the early promotion means she should have Tomebreaker well before end game. She will also be fast enough to double most enemies and still be relatively tanky. You don't do it because it's optimal but because it's funny, and it works as long as you don't need her to heal or use offensive staves. Knight to Great Knight is a perfectly fine path for her, but Archer and Kinshi completely breaks large parts of the endgame. I almost always marry her to Arthur and dump both for their kid. Silas: Silas is either completely mediocre or horribly broken depending on how much you rely on Vow of Friendship and what seals you want to use. Sol Master Ninja has been mentioned, but you could do the same with three other characters and two will use one less seal to get there. He's also probably your best natural Bow Knight. I will always pimp bows in Conquest, especially Bow Knights and doubly so on Lunatic where Inevitable End is a thing. It's not a bad idea to have at least 2 Bow Knights, and Silas will retain everything that makes him good as a Cavalier and only be better. Also for the same amount of seals as Sol Master Ninja you can have Quick Draw + Strong Riposte + Air Superiority + Shurikenbreaker. Add in Vow of Friendship and Elbow Room and he's doing +11 damage on Player Phase, +10 on Enemy Phase with +50 hit/avoid against fliers and ninjas. It's not impossible to have this by the time you fight Hinoka and Ryoma when you need it most. Arthur: He sucks. I love him as a character and you can use him if you want to and make him work, but it takes a lot of work and effort compared to almost anyone else. That said he's probably your second or third best natural Berserker, and if you're not throwing a seal on your servant then it wouldn't hurt to make him a Cavalier so he could catch up in speed and weapon ranks before the penalty is too severe. But if you are using him, he needs to end up a Hero. Also that Goddess Icon and a Bronze Axe immediately cancel out the drawbacks of his personal, and his son was made to be glued to his side. Honestly, I don't think I would use a seal on anyone you have now unless you're building towards something specific. Elise and Silas both benefit by waiting until promotion and it's nearly useless on Arthur and Effie unless you want a second Cavalier now. And Jakob would be better in that role, and Corrin wants to wait until at least level 10. There's an actual good use in the upcoming Paralogue and a decent gimmick in the next chapter, and lately I've soured on Mozu as a unit. Bad Video Games fucked around with this message at 01:02 on Oct 5, 2021 |
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Oct 5, 2021 00:54
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Wow, that's a lot of words. I could tone it down if you wish, but I recently did an All Heart Seal Run and some of them are surprisingly effective.
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Oct 5, 2021 00:59
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midnight lasagna posted:Oh that BK Silas build actually sounds really fun. I've only recently learned the power of marrying units to Mozu for Archer access so I've barely been able to experiment with it but there's so much cool stuff you can do. Part of what makes it great is that Silas is one of the few people who can get those skills. Outside of Corrin, your only other options are Xander and Laslow and both require A+ with the other as well as marriage to Mozu. If you still want Sol Master Ninja, you can achieve that with Kaze, Laslow, Selena, Beruka, Camilla and Charlotte, and maybe others. If I'm remembering how marriage works, I think Laslow and Selena pass their secondary classes to each other so you could have 4 units with that setup if you want. Hell, even Arthur, Keaton and their friends could do it with a female Corrin with Ninja talent.  Birthright classes in Conquest can be extremely good, not just Archer and Ninja. I typically give Corrin something like Spear Fighter or even Apothecary just to pass some fun builds to their spouse, and even something like Shrine Maiden can be good for a fun Great Master build on Jakob. Also if you want you can create a second gen Onmyoji by marrying Niles and Nyx, but it's the definition of sub optimal. Also, Odin is good. He makes a good use of an early Heart Seal if you want him to go physical, though he does want Dark Mage's second skill first. Bad Video Games fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Oct 5, 2021 |
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Oct 5, 2021 19:56
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Odin is competent as a Dark Mage, he retains a decent magic stat as a Samurai and his daughter is the most powerful magic user in the game whose Paralogue gives a Horse Spirit and Calamity Gate which are game changing in Conquest. Also he can pass on Vantage to Ophelia, and that can proc with Nosferatu. Promoted to Dark Knight around level 16 he will have more strength, speed and defense than Leo and a decent magic stat. Staying Sorcerer lets him do some fun strats with Nosferatu. A defense tonic and a pair up will let him solo the archers in Chapter 10 and a Malig Knight pair up lets him solo some powerful foes in Cheve. And he's still Owain, so he's fun. And Ophelia is goofy and adorable.
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Oct 6, 2021 00:46
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Faillen Angel posted:Odin tends to work out for me, but maybe it's because his primary competition is. Fates has a real hate for mages. In Conquest, Elise and Nyx are your strongest but their hit rates are always going to suck even using basic Fire tomes. Odin grows to be good, is great for nostanking even with nerfs, and is still mechanically the weakest of them. Your only good mage is Ophelia, and by the time you see her in a normal playthrough you're already using Odin. Felicia and Niles both make really good mages if you're willing to spend the resources on them. Niles will have some of the bulk of Odin combined with the speed and resistance of Nyx and the actual skill to hit things, but most people aren't going to give him enough weapon ranks to see that. Odin makes a better Samurai than anything, but that also takes some effort and growth as well as a seal so it's even harder than slapping Nosferatu and some tonics on him. Bad Video Games fucked around with this message at 03:57 on Oct 6, 2021 |
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Oct 6, 2021 03:48
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If all you want out of Odin is Vantage Ophelia then it isn't wrong to seal him immediately and glue him to either Elise or Felicia. Another reason I cane to like Bow Knight Felicia is because you can pass Shurikenbreaker to Ophelia early and really trivialize large portions of the mid and late game. Arthur is also on the list of parents you want to pass down skills, since Elbow Room is always active on fliers and Percy can't get it himself without marriage. Also anyone you want Quick Draw on since Mozu can only pass it to her spouse and friends. Niles is the only natural Outlaw in the 1st gen, and his daughter is the only one of the second gen. Chests and doors are rare enough that you don't really need more than 1 or 2. FoolyCharged posted:There's six if you assume they're including the doppelgangers as well. They do count. There was a popularity poll in Japan during the development of Fates. The 3 most popular 2nd gen units, barring Lucina, were brought back as 1st gen units for Conquest; the 3 most popular 1st gen units, barring Chrom and Robin, were brought back as 2nd gen reincarnations for Birthright. If the polls had been worldwide we may have ended up with different results, but the Conquest trio probably would have remained the same. Conquest made me like Odin and especially Laslow a lot more since I rarely bother with kids. I still don't like Selena, but she's better here than Awakening. I just don't like the tsundere archetype.
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Oct 6, 2021 16:20
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FoolyCharged posted::Boots: I honestly forgot him. Though probably because he's a Corrin only support and I tend not to think of them at all.
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Oct 6, 2021 18:58
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I've soured on Mozu as a unit. She just takes too much investment compared to others. If you Heart Seal her immediately then she's much more capable, but she'll still want tonics and forges to be competent for several levels still. She grows into an insane unit if you put in the work, but I prefer units who are immediately useful. Passing on Archer to Niles, Effie and even Nyx can be great, but it's a shame her kids are stuck with Villager. On the subject of Camilla's magic, a magic tonic in Chapter 10 is enough to let her 1 turn every single Oni Savage in the south on Hard, and it should still be true here.
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Oct 6, 2021 23:45
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SloppyDoughnuts posted:Odin is great as a character so it is a real shame that he sucks so bad as a unit. Your pros amounted to "has access to a broken spell" and "gives you Ophelia". Which, being good because using him gets you someone gooder is lol. I appreciate Odin as a unit because in the places he's useful he lets me not have to think. There's so many things that go on in some maps that with Odin and Nosferatu I just have to make sure he can survive the next turn, and it takes much less mental math to do so. The sustain that provides means I can just let him handle a portion of a map and place my mental energy elsewhere. He does often need tonics and a pair up to pull it off, but that's true of everyone. midnight lasagna posted:Huh, after reading this I guess Nyx would actually like all the Archer skills a lot. Hell even a Dark Mage Nyx would love Sure Shot so she could actually hit things. Probably wouldn't be too much pain to suffer through a couple of levels in it if she had a magic bow... Now I feel silly for making a joke about it in my analysis! Also, I'm disappointed you didn't use Odin to bait units on turn 1. Standing in the woods with Elise next to him he could have baited both an Archer and Spear Fighter and survived.
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Oct 8, 2021 00:59
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There's a handful of characters who are simply better in their secondary classes. Mozu, Laslow, Silas, Jakob, arguably Arthur and Elise. Nyx is definitely one of these. Sealed to Outlaw at base will give her 16 speed and a whopping 4 strength, but 4 +18 = 22 and that's her minimum damage output against anything that flies. Possibly twice if she's fast enough. She's also much better as an Adventurer than either Dark Knight or Sorcerer, and if you're not using a servant or Elise then a second healer will be useful. Your next one doesn't show up for 6 more chapters. She's never going to be great, but she can be useable. And it's fun to take trash units and do outrageous things with them.
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Oct 9, 2021 00:46
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Thanks to this lp I'm playing along, but on Hard mode. I've got Bow Knight Felicia, Cavalier Arthur and Archer Nyx and I'm also about to do Chapter 10.
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Oct 9, 2021 02:29
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This is my favorite map in the game, and it's up there for favorite in the series. One thing that's great is there isn't a right way to do it. I usually route everyone except Takumi, though I didn't manage it on my current run. Odin always handles the archers. With a pair up and some tonics he's in no danger from them and counters at range. A sword guy with an attack pair up can handle the onis to the left: usually Servant and Corrin/Silas since the first pair are free kills and the first Throwing Club jerk will always go for maximum damage, which is usually your servant. Niles softens the Onis in the south twice and the remaining sword guy with an attack pair up can bait and kill for easy cleanup. Hold the middle, Odin takes right and someone else takes left while Camilla controls the southeast. 2 archers make this map a breeze. Archer Nyx with a +1 Bronze Bow can one-shot every single pegasus on the map, so level 1 Mozu should be able to do the same? But maybe Nyx gets more strength from Archer than Mozu does, I don't have a spare Heart Seal to check.
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Oct 9, 2021 21:18
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I don't like the kids in Fates. With few exceptions their personalities are horrid, and unless you go out of your way to put some powerful skills on them they often end up the same or worse than the units you already have. Percy is a great example. You can throw Elbow Room on him easily and give him a great mom like Effie and he'll do maybe 1 point more damage than Beruka at base with less defense. So he's a worse Beruka, and that's true for all of them. Velouria and Ophelia are pretty much the only kids who have worked out for me. The rest are only good for the rewards their paralogues bring. Also if you're going to instantly promote Selena, you may as well make her a Kinshi Knight. She'll basically be a copy of Reina from Birthright.
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Oct 10, 2021 14:50
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Not really. The children level up as you progress, and after Chapter 18 they will be level 20 with a special seal that will auto promote them a couple of levels. You can grab a level 5 promoted unit near endgame if you want. But the enemies in the paralogues scale up as well. The children just are kind of lackluster in this game.
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Oct 10, 2021 15:10
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My only issue with Selena is when she joins there's not often room for her. She can put in a little bit of work in the next chapter, but Chapter 12 is gotta go fast is 13 has very limited deployment slots, though she can be useful with an Armorslayer.
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Oct 10, 2021 19:48
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Dammit, you got a great seed on your Lunatic file. My Silas has around 13 strength at a similar level. I've never played past Chapter 10 on Lunatic so it's nice to see the bullshit Conquest throws at you. Birthright on Lunatic is fun and challenging but Conquest seems to be a giant gently caress you.
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Oct 11, 2021 22:11
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I really hate taking Kaze out of Ninja. His bulk isn't helped much by Hero, and E swords sucks with his low strength. I guess if you glued General Effie to him it could work. I'd think getting Hero from Selena would work better since he would hit harder acting as bait. I also really like Mechanist for Kaze. It helps his bulk and range, E bows is fine for anyone who doubles everything in sight and he still provides +1 move on pair up. Also if Kaze gains no levels in the prologue chapters then he only has a D rank and an Iron Shuriken. The penalty from Steel doesn't affect him because he will always double everything forever.
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Oct 12, 2021 23:24
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Arthur was important to give Elise speed and strength. And if you're going to abuse Vow of Friendship then you're going to have Silas and Corrin paired up constantly anyway. Besides, Sophie's Paralogue is best for getting you a free Seal and a stat booster but you need stronger units for that. And Percy's gives you free money, but again you need better units to pull it off. And Kana's gives you some good XP, especially if you let the reinforcements arrive. That's my read on it.
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Oct 13, 2021 00:57
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Nyx is magic and speed and nothing else. With Nyx for a mom, Ophelia will essentially be a slower Nyx with more bulk or a faster Odin with less bulk and skill. I haven't found anyone to do the Nostanking that even a poor Odin does, except for a reclassed Camilla. Next chapter has a great opportunity to show off how Nosferatu can just lock down an entire group of enemies. Lately I've been ignoring the Flame Shuriken. Unless I'm keeping Felicia as a Maid or doing a meme Elise build there's just no one to make good use of it. That also frees up a few more people to cover both sides, but I do often use 2 pairs of units for the Apothecaries. In a different world, Elise married Odin and became a Dark Knight to carry Odin to victory. Hunt11 posted:That does make sense considering what has been shown so far in regards to pairings. Elise and Odin do not get much from being paired up but it does lead to their kid being an amazing magic unit. Malig Knight does grant magic and def and move on pair up, similar to Dark Knight. And Dark Mage boosts defense I think. They don't help each other now, but once they're both promoted they compliment each other well.
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Oct 13, 2021 23:14
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midnight lasagna posted:I had no idea he could come with an Iron Shurriken, that's interesting... I might admittedly be wrong on that, but I do know his weapon rank scales along with his level. My current file that I branch everything from has him join at level 12 with 99 xp and a few attacks away from B rank. If I had managed to squeeze some more xp in the prologues he may have joined with a Silver Shuriken.
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Oct 13, 2021 23:19
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Owain, Severa and Inigo were brought here by the spirit of an ancient dragon to fight another dragon and now are trapped. But you have to buy DLC for that story. Another DLC tells us that Nohr and Hoshido are the mythic past of the world of Awakening. The 3 in Birthright are just supposed to be lookalikes, except Caeldori is explicitly Cordelia before her squad is destroyed. Especially if Selena is her mother in Revelation.
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Oct 14, 2021 17:52
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Hunt11 posted:On one hand it is good that everything about Fates world gets forgotten but on the other hand how does that fit in with anything else about the games Fates supposedly predates? It's literally a single comment by Chrom at the beginning of the map, so probably as much as Ike's descendant showing up in Awakening. However, one big plot point of Fates is the Outrealms. It's how the kids from Awakening got here, it's where the children of our units are raised, it's where the First Dragons came from. We even fight enemies from the Outrealms several times in all 3 routes, and they're a big part of the plot of Revelation. So maybe parallel/alternate world rather than legend of the past. Which implies that the "reincarnations" of Birthright could actually be Tharja, Gauis and Cordelia before they crossed over to the world of Awakening. Cythereal posted:Honestly, I'm also kind of baffled that they'd put the returning hero characters on the bad guy side. I guess maybe IntSys felt they weren't Japanese enough to fit in with Hoshido? Could you see Owain as an Onmyoji? 
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Oct 14, 2021 22:37
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Keldulas posted:That explanation kind of requires you to take Fate's story and writing seriously, which well...... I would love for someone competent to go through the scripts for all 3 routes and the supports and do a rewrite for Conquest and Birthright. There is a good core there, and the overall scenario has so many parallels with the plot of Shadows of Valentia that I think 2 good routes could still exist. Sadly it'll never happen.
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Oct 15, 2021 00:20
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Kana is fine. People were lamenting the poor move and speed of knights and Kana is basically a more mobile knight. Their personal skill means they want to exclusively use dragonstones, and with the right parent they can have a serviceable amount of defense and speed. Speaking of Mercenaries, can anyone other than Silas become one with a Heart Seal? I think he's the only one.
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Oct 15, 2021 23:28
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theshim posted:Huh, I always do that map by flooding the second layer for proper chokepoints. Does make the fliers a little more obnoxious to deal with, I guess. Me too. But I always have 2 archers and make heavy use of dual strikes so the fliers are rarely a problem.
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Oct 15, 2021 23:29
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ApplesandOranges posted:Felicia and Gunter, both of who have... issues. Being Silas' kid, Sophie of course also has it as an option. I don't know how I forgot them, especially since I use Bow Knight Felicia. Also Flora. SloppyDoughnuts posted:13 Magic at level 17. Still remaining hopeful you'll change my mind on Odin. Who else at this stage of the game could have soloed the Apothecaries in Chapter 12?
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Oct 16, 2021 15:04
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SloppyDoughnuts posted:That was all Nosferatu being super good! And the only other unit who could have pulled that off right now is a reclassed Camilla, which would be a waste. Nyx would have been completely obliterated. Odin's lower magic is actually a help here. If it's too high he would potentially not have enough health to survive the second hit, like what almost happened in Chapter 10. It's not just Nosferatu.
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Oct 16, 2021 16:11
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I think what hurt armors the most in the 3DS games was the lack of warp. Being able to position your units wherever you need them means movement matters less and armors were easier to use.
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Oct 17, 2021 01:55
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ApplesandOranges posted:Eh, they're good in isolation but not great genetics wise outside of a busted Ophelia. Camilla's the only interesting one of the lot and that's only because Wyvern. Even then I think a +Magic Corrin or Orochi is better. There's also the whole thing about who Corrin actually is and who he's related to but you have to read a synopsis of Revelation to understand all of that.
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Oct 17, 2021 02:08
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FoolyCharged posted:Their mother divorced the king of evil dragon land and married a tyrant divorced him and married a glorious nippon samurai. Along the way she ditched one of her kids and then had her kidnapped back when the tyrant kidnapped the other kid. Close, actually. I don't remember Mikoto ever marrying Garon, but she did run away from evil dragon king with Corrin and married glorious nippon samurai. Her sister won the concubine wars and married Garon, but she brought Azura from a previous marriage as well. I don't think we ever learn who her father actually is. Corrin's only sibling in the game is loving Lilith if I remember the DLC correctly.
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Oct 17, 2021 03:16
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ApplesandOranges posted:Orochi has her own flaws (aside from needing to play Revelation, which is its own flaw), mainly that she kinda kills speed. Ophelia can take the hit okay, but otherwise Elise!Ophelia does the job pretty much as well and really who else are you gonna give Elise to, Dwyer? I was responding to the part of your post about Sakura and the Birthright kids. Though Elise as Dwyer's mom means he might possibly be useable in a magic class.
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Oct 17, 2021 14:40
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I was really hoping you were going to have Odin solo Takumi's squad. I've seen people do it on Lunatic before and I do it all the time on Hard. I like that map. So much going on at once but you're allowed to take everything at your own pace.
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Oct 17, 2021 21:26
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Odin makes a decent Dark Knight on promotion, especially if he's gained some speed. But Leo is about to show up and he doesn't cost a seal. It's always fun to instantly promote Benny only to have him solo the kitsune map. A bit of a waste, but funny.
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Oct 17, 2021 23:21
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Keaton is a good boy. The trigger for the reinforcements is to be in range of an attack from the forces on the right. You can turtle the staff users without any worries, but once a single enemy can attack is when the Kinshis arrive. This map is another reason I make sure to have 2 archers. Odin is basically Leo. If promoted to Dark Knight right now he would have equal or better stats in everything except magic and resistance. Fates went hard on nerfing magic users except for Corrin and Hayato.
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Oct 19, 2021 01:24
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You pretty much outlined why you don't hear much about Keaton. No 1-2 range is bad, and the 1 map he could shine on is Kitsune hell and it's the same map that could destroy him. Also at this point your team is set, and Corrin gets the best support partner in the game soon and Xander still exists. There just isn't room for poor Keaton generally.
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Oct 19, 2021 21:56
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