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Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

multistability posted:

My lichess must be broken because it's saying the only correct move is to take the Bishop (playing via the Android app). Idk

Yes, taking it is the right move, and then, finding the way to Not Get hosed for doing it is the rest of the puzzle.

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Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

Meadowhill posted:

The london is an affront to humanity but I adore this WCC where they play almost whatever they want instead of testing each other in a single theoretical line that deviates at the 15. move. The double R is a good second.

Nah, everyone loved the WCC in 2018 when Carlsen and Caruana just grinded out draws for 12 games in a row

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
Now they're both in time trouble!

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
i have been trying to work all day with the stream going in the background, and it's literally impossible

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

jesus WEP posted:

this match kicks so much rear end, fide should have told magnus to gently caress off years ago

No one has the balls to play fun stuff against Magnus. So now we get the real fun because Ding and Nepo are just coming at each other like angry beavers.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
Probably good for Ding that tomorrow is a rest day, so he can get some focus back after that meltdown.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
The computer *really* did not like that Nepo move.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

Hand Knit posted:

Tough draw in the end and Ding now has two losses and a draw from good to winning positions in this match. On the other hand, it means that Ding has been getting some very good positions in games he hasn't even been winning, which means he's been able to at least get ahead in the majority of games this match. Puncher's chance.

Yeah. Obviously Nepo is the favourite now, but anyone who thinks it's over is clearly mistaken.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
turns out world championship chess players are like, very very good and will walk into insane positions that make no loving sense to regular humans, and in this WCC match, they just keep doing it

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

VictualSquid posted:

This is the first really grindy draw this match, right?

The first game that made it to an endgame, even.

update: The theoretically drawn endgame was a draw. I am surprised.

Exercu fucked around with this message at 15:54 on Apr 21, 2023

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
that was one of the chessgames of all time. Not really much more to say about it.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

Obfuscation posted:

Game 12 and Ding opens with Colle. The openings in this match have been quite something.

Nepo opens like a normal person, Ding has been opening like a madman and it has been beautiful.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
This game has been a loving roller coaster, jesus christ.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
BLUNDER BLUNDER BLUNDER

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
And tomorrow they have another game, and Ian will be entering with this in the back of his head.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

VictualSquid posted:

Anybody know offhand how they are matched in rapid? Tiebreaks are rapid, right?

About evenly. Ding is higher rated in rapid than Nepo, and has a good recent history in rapid against Nepo, but not by a lot.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
Oh yeah, it's stating the obvious, but with today's result we're guaranteed to get the full 14 games, woo

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
Man, Nepo seems a lot more hesitant today. And not just because his shirt is less pink.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
For real. Like, people talk poo poo about how Ding and Nepo are playing less accurate chess than Carlsen did - but part of it is also just that they (mostly Ding), intentionally, walk into these super sharp positions.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
Everyone: So this is a draw.

Ding: Engages sicko brain and goes on the attack

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
Oh, I know. It also makes Nepo's position much more complicated to play, and if Ding wants a win, that's what he needs, Nepo to make a mistake because he's playing in a complicated position.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
holy poo poo that last minute plot twist of that rapid game

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

vyelkin posted:

what an amazing call to not accept that draw, Nepo was so rattled after that

It was an insanely good call, Nepo had clearly accepted the draw and was mentally ready to go to the blitzes.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

Sway Grunt posted:

Hopefully Ding hires him for the defense.

Nah, even better, he's going to win candidates (he's not, but it'd be fun)

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
Deciding it with rapids is weird, but the alternative of continuing with classical forever until x wins is also unacceptable.

Caruana-Carlsen could have been continuing until this very day.

That said, I'm not entirely sure what the alternative is. Maybe armageddon? But I'm not sure how well that works in classical among super GMs

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

Hand Knit posted:

They should go back to "first to six wins" but make sure that the only players who are allowed to compete are too psychologically weak to draw 40 games in a row.

e: I guess as a slightly more serious tangential answer what we saw from Ding is a pretty serious departure from conventional match strategy, where instead of focusing in on a couple of openings he instead changed what he was playing every game. This meant that, instead of pursuing an advantage by knowing one thing better than the opponent, the match was played as much as possible in a state of novelty. Ding still held an advantage in familiarity but, in total, each player was playing at a much lower level of familiarity and expertise. I think that's a fairly significant part of the reason why we got so many results (and a few more near results). I'm curious to see if that sort of strategy carries over into future matches, and if we get similar results.

I strongly agree with this. A grandmaster from my home country complained about the level of chess in the tournament because it was lower than when Magnus played. I agree with that in a limited sense - if we define good chess as how closely we hew to the best stockfish line. But why should that be the metric? Why not play moves that are hard for humans to refute (because they haven't prepped this line), even if a machine thinks it's easy to refute (because when you can calculate into like, 40 depth or whatever, every move is easily refutable)? Like, stockfish would say you're playing a bad and inaccurate game. But is it, tho?

Or put a different way - is it bad chess if a 600 elo player moves for a scholar's mate because his 600 elo opponent might not be able to calculate it? Even if it's trivially obvious and refutable for his 2000 elo chess teacher?

When Daniel Naroditsky prepped a line for MoistCritikal to mate xqc, was that bad chess just because it was effectively a gambit on whether xqc would notice it?

Exercu fucked around with this message at 15:42 on May 1, 2023

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

cock hero flux posted:

i think you have to sacrifice the bishop because if you preserve it by moving it then g3 absolutely fucks you. once you sacrifice the bishop with bxg4 you should be able to win all 3 pawns and then it's just an endgame where you're up 2 pawns.

wait, unless, bc4? it's actually checkmate in 1 if they don't respond to it and I can't see a response that they have that is actually good

do they even have a response other than giving you their rook for free? lol that might just be mate in 1 or free rook. they can check you with the pawn but that doesn't actually change anything other than making it mate in 2 or free rook. yeah, do bc4.

Actually, maybe they can sneak out if they respond with f4.


Yeah, your edit is right, f4 lets them sneak out. Best move is just slamming your bishop right into them, as you said. Black's left with no good way of stopping you from eating their pawns and then marching up the board.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

jesus WEP posted:

all the games apart from nepo’s were pretty good, prag vs alireza was really good!

Yeah. Like, there's a difference between "they did a Berlin draw, they didn't want to play chess" and then the actual games we had. (though, agreed, maybe except for Abasov - Nepo, that one wasn't too exciting)

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
Magnus: "This year is Hikaru's best chance to win candidates"
Hikaru: 1.5/4

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

jesus WEP posted:

only if vidit gets to sweep hikaru again

legitimately the second funniest thing that has happened at this candidates, yeah (funniest being the saga of Alireza and his Very Loud Shoes).

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
Man, then if you're ahead on time, even slightly, perpetuals become mates. That'd be wild.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

OneSizeFitsAll posted:

Three people tied for first and Caruana just a point behind - going to be an incredibly exciting last couple of rounds.



Hikaru and Ian are both level, so not sure he does need to beat him, especially given the latter plays as black against Caruana in the last round; Hikaru also has a difficult match against Gukesh, but will be playing as white.

Could go various ways at the moment!

My hope is that tomorrow, Hikaru and Nepo draw, Fabiano beats Pragg, Alireza scores a draw against Gukesh so we can enter the last round on a four-way tie with the games Hikaru - Gukesh and Fabiano - Nepo with all participants at 8 points for maximum chaos.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

V for Vegas posted:

So if Ding does a Magnus and decides not to contest, who was 2nd if Ian, Fabi and Hikaru are all on 8.5 pts?

Hikaru.

There are three tiebreaks. First is Sonneborn Berger-score (sum of score of all players you've beaten + half the sum of score of all players you've drawn). Hikaru and Nepo have a score of 56, Fabi only 54.
Then it's number of wins. Hikaru has 5 wins, Nepo only 3.

Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!

mfcrocker posted:

It also helps that Qf3/Qh5 isn't really a very good opening move, so if you don't fall for scholar's mate you're laughing

it's true - the main counterplay to wayward queen is just going "ok, good for you" and developing your knight like you probably should anyway, and then he's just got a queen hanging out putting pressure on gently caress all until he eventually has to move it somewhere else.

Also - not only is it not that good, the kind of player who plays it has no idea of what to do now that his plan is ruined, so you can smell the blunders coming.

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Exercu
Dec 7, 2009

EAT WELL, SLEEP WELL, SHIT WELL! THERE'S YOUR ANSWER!!
Yep. Frequently it's literally just that it's the only thing they know. If they can't win with that, then they'd rather not play.

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