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keep punching joe posted:My favourite marketing meme is 'create a disgusting version of a product that everyone hates but will also get the original product positive coverage'. 
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Dec 1, 2021 10:54
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yes but the queen is getting on a bit
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Dec 1, 2021 11:05
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Can't be bothered checking page 1 of the new thread, did anything interesting happen?
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Dec 1, 2021 11:11
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Total Meatlove posted:In the cycles of technology and societal trends vs people finding ways to circumvent them, Twitter doesn't appear to know rhyming slang, so calling someone a berk is fine, but 'oval office' is almost an immediate ban. How do they feel about "mewling quim", or have they cottoned onto it yet?
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Dec 1, 2021 11:12
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He's stepping down isn't he?
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Dec 1, 2021 11:14
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Spotted in London last night
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Dec 1, 2021 11:44
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Preserve them in formaldehyde, perhaps.
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Dec 1, 2021 11:49
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Only 13 words, not well thought out.
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Dec 1, 2021 11:49
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Guavanaut posted:and bring back the old traditions Needs a Moonlight Sword
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Dec 1, 2021 11:49
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Curses, foiled again!
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Dec 1, 2021 11:49
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I’m 41 today and my wife got me a Battle of Cable Street tea towel to hang up above the literal hammer and sickle that can already be seen in the background of all my work calls. My employers got me a third month of not paying my travel expenses! Thanks guys!
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Dec 1, 2021 11:56
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Guavanaut posted:Spare a thought for the real victims of the season, mildly inconvenienced opinion columnists who likely spend all their time not going on about sacred liberties ranting about the human rights act and protestors. i wouldn't be listening to any advice from the baddy off aliens
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Dec 1, 2021 11:57
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Dec 1, 2021 11:59
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Labour in the bin, part 94 https://twitter.com/LKelz93/status/1465995162639904772 Convex posted:yes but the queen is getting on a bit Comrade Keith is investigating this comment, Convex. Expect a letter.
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Dec 1, 2021 12:17
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fuctifino posted:Spotted in London last night *exclusively waves it above racist poo poo* Sanford posted:I’m 41 today 
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Dec 1, 2021 12:22
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Bobstar posted:Ugh, fine. Everyone's Euler system has had 18 months off. 
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Dec 1, 2021 12:22
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Alctel posted:Where did the whole 'the left is actually anti-Semitic' thing come from, it's happening a bit over here in Canada and the US as well (noticeably with bernie but that failed pretty spectacularly for obvious reasons) They tried all sorts on Corbyn (remember when he was a secret agent for the Czechs in the Cold War or w/e?), antisemitism stuck, politics is bidirectional, if it works for the right on one side the right on the other will see that and give it a go and see if it lands. feedmegin fucked around with this message at 12:41 on Dec 1, 2021 |
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Dec 1, 2021 12:23
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Eggman just said that we shouldn't cancel Christmas parties. So glad my work did cancel ours (and I was going to Billy no mates it under the pretense of staying home to watch our servers)
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Dec 1, 2021 12:27
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Re leftwing antisemitism, my brother is a very committed Zionist. He, for example, believes that the threat to Jews is far greater from the left than the right (I feel pretty strongly otherwise). He brought up this as an example (and while searching I also found the second example, which is a bit more nuanced): https://forward.com/news/476921/sunrise-dc-zionist-jewish-groups-voting-rights-rally-israel/ https://momentmag.com/star-of-david-pride-flags-unwelcome-at-dc-dyke-march/ To me those are where anti-Zionism starts bleeding into anti-semitism (in part because the Israeli government has enthusiastically promoted the link between Judaism and Israel, but also in part because I think that some left-wing groups can be over-zealous in policing Zionism - for reasons which may be anti-semitic but may not.) I have been wrestling with why Israel gets such a disproportionate focus. I know some of the explanations (it's an American imperialist proxy, it's colonialist and anti-colonialism is so hot right now etc), and human rights violations by other countries do get protested but not to the same degree. I am just not 100% convinced. There is no active and vigorous BDS campaign against China for what is cultural genocide against the Uighur* and Tibetans (and most other minorities); against Saudi Arabia (we know why); Turkey for its treatment of Kurds, etc. Now I know: i) my responses result from years of conditioning which are hard to shed; and ii) there are causes which become more popular than others for whatever reason, eg apartheid in the 80s, Tibet in the 90s - and right now the focus is on Israel. But I still can't escape the little voice at the back of my mind that part of the amount of focus from the left on Israel, and its sheer vociferousness, is in some cases anti-semitic. * This is well worth reading
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Dec 1, 2021 12:30
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Just doing my calendar for next year and I notice Boxing Day comes before Christmas day. Broken Britain
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Dec 1, 2021 12:43
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JeremoudCorbynejad posted:Just doing my calendar for next year and I notice Boxing Day comes before Christmas day. That's because Xmas Day is on a Sunday so the substitute day is the Tuesday.
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Dec 1, 2021 12:55
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Tim Stanley was always a loving dork but he used to have a lot more integrity. He obviously bowed to the inevitable: if it's shouty, angry, deliberately obtuse articles that pay the mortgage, then shouty, angry, deliberately obtuse articles it must be! I've got no doubt that he doesn't actually believe a word of any of that nonsense he's writing now.
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Dec 1, 2021 12:58
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therattle posted:Re leftwing antisemitism, my brother is a very committed Zionist. He, for example, believes that the threat to Jews is far greater from the left than the right (I feel pretty strongly otherwise). He brought up this as an example (and while searching I also found the second example, which is a bit more nuanced): Haven't read your links yet, however, I just did a swift google of 'campaigns against china' and both US and UK government as well as labour party / Corbyn etc are all involved.* (In 2015 Corbyn brought up the human rights / Uyghur issues directly with Xi Jinping. Also, Corbyn called for sanctions against Turkey re treatment of Kurds. *thus noone is pretending they are the good guys. My gut (NB not in-depth or thoroughly worked through!) thought is that why you don't hear about the other countries is partly because the press don't report them though surprisingly the Mail reported the Corbyn / Xi Jinping meeting. (Heil/news/article-3280795/Corbyn-challenge-China-s-strongman-president-Xi-Jinping-human-rights-abuse-private-one-one-talks-today.html) but also because Israel is heavily funded by the US with an extremely advanced military (or so I am given to understand) yet is considered the victim against big nasty Palestinian rockets. I also acknowledge that there is anti-semitism on the left and occasionally anti-zionism and anti-semitism do merge. (And in my experience of various groups on FB which I have long since abandoned when these items come up) is this also ties in with the tinfoil hatters 'the international conspiracy of jews and bankers' or lizards element of the fringe, some of whom have latched on to the far right and some onto the left). Jaeluni Asjil fucked around with this message at 13:07 on Dec 1, 2021 |
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Dec 1, 2021 13:04
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therattle posted:I have been wrestling with why Israel gets such a disproportionate focus. I know some of the explanations (it's an American imperialist proxy, it's colonialist and anti-colonialism is so hot right now etc), and human rights violations by other countries do get protested but not to the same degree. I am just not 100% convinced. There is no active and vigorous BDS campaign against China for what is cultural genocide against the Uighur* and Tibetans (and most other minorities); against Saudi Arabia (we know why); Turkey for its treatment of Kurds, etc. Now I know: i) my responses result from years of conditioning which are hard to shed; and ii) there are causes which become more popular than others for whatever reason, eg apartheid in the 80s, Tibet in the 90s - and right now the focus is on Israel. But I still can't escape the little voice at the back of my mind that part of the amount of focus from the left on Israel, and its sheer vociferousness, is in some cases anti-semitic. To be honest I think it's mostly because Palestinians were displaced and many of them moved to western countries where they were able to have a more visible presence as a wronged party. Like I first learned about I/P because a close family friend was having trouble because when his kids were born they kept trying to put the father's place of birth as "Israel" on the birth certificate and he kept saying no, he was born in Palestine, and it was only after a very emotional argument that they correctly put his place of birth. Which was also a dumb argument just because the Soviet Union dissolved doesn't mean you weren't born in the e.g. Latvian SSR.
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Dec 1, 2021 13:14
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China is also turning into a huge global market that nobody wants to piss off. They're also investing massively in shareholder stakes in media companies that they can't otherwise influence by witholding access to their markets, which is why given the choice of mentioning Tianemen Square or getting money, most companies will keep quiet. There's a Netflix series called History 101 that goes into the rise of China as an economic power, but it's from a very American perspective*, and rounds out the episode by implying that China's prosperity overtaking the US in the near future is a sinister thing. * The space race episode is especially hilarious, because they keep counting up the amount of times the Russians beat the US into space (0-5), and then the second the US lands on the moon, all 5 of the Russian victories on the infographic explode and the US victories turn into a 1. They then mention that the Russians built Mir, but the Russian count doesn't go back up.
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Dec 1, 2021 13:20
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:That's because Xmas Day is on a Sunday so the substitute day is the Tuesday. I know why but IT'S NOT RIGHT
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Dec 1, 2021 13:22
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You also don't get called a sinophobe by the entire media and political establishment for criticising China whilst your country continues to provide material economic and military support to their ethnic cleansing Like if someone's on the fence on crossing over from anti-zionism to anti-semitism don't you think the entire Labour Party front bench being members of LFI and Keir Starmer saying he wants to hug and kiss Israel very much and if anything they're not defending their colonies hard enough from the beastly natives don't you think that's just going to pushing them over the edge into thinking (((something)))'s going on there
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Dec 1, 2021 13:23
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JeremoudCorbynejad posted:I know why but IT'S NOT RIGHT how is tuesday 28th before xmas?
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Dec 1, 2021 13:26
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therattle posted:Re leftwing antisemitism, my brother is a very committed Zionist. He, for example, believes that the threat to Jews is far greater from the left than the right (I feel pretty strongly otherwise). He brought up this as an example (and while searching I also found the second example, which is a bit more nuanced): In the first link, was anyone turning up with Turkish or Chinese national symbols? In the second, were any explicitly pro-Turkish or pro-Chinese groups present? To take an example closer to home, there aren't parliamentary groups called Labour Friends of Turkey, China, Saudi Arabia or whomever explicitly lobbying for the Labour Party to foster closer connections with those states. Considering a large part of what LFI does is to deliberately conflate anti-Zionism with antisemitism, of course it's going to generate more pushback, and of course it's going to generate more attention because LFI deliberately want it to. The irony is that some of that pushback & some of that attention is going to lead some people in an antisemitic direction & also create a smokescreen for "wilful" antisemites to say "nuh uh I'm just an antizionist". But I don't think (iirc overwhelmingly non-Jewish) LFI give a gently caress about that. (incidentally I'm also not sure it's possible to be a committed Zionist and not think that the greatest threat to Jewish people comes from the left, since the belief that only Zionism can protect the Jewish people is kind of intrinsic to it & the left absolutely is a bigger threat to Zionism, since the right loving love ethnonationalism & also all the Jews leaving)
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Dec 1, 2021 13:28
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NotJustANumber99 posted:how is tuesday 28th before xmas? It's almost a whole year before Christmas.
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Dec 1, 2021 13:29
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therattle posted:Re leftwing antisemitism, my brother is a very committed Zionist. He, for example, believes that the threat to Jews is far greater from the left than the right (I feel pretty strongly otherwise). He brought up this as an example (and while searching I also found the second example, which is a bit more nuanced) Your brother sounds like he's a bit silly. The reason Israel gets specific attention in the West is not because of anti-semitism* but because it is the only country in the world that is 1) a de-facto (and increasingly de jure) race state, 2) actively pursuing apartheid policies towards an ethnic minority population that it considers, at best, to have effectively zero equal rights within its borders, and at worst to be outright subhuman, and 3) is a colonial project with its roots firmly in euro-american imperialism, which our countries directly enable and benefit from. Honestly, the view we get of Israel is, if anything, extremely sanitised, and I'm not just talking about the gratuitous clips you see of war crimes being committed. It's somehow even more disturbing to see things like mass rallies on prestigious university campuses, with huge numbers of the country's most educated and (supposedly) thoughtful people waving Israeli flags and literally calling for the mass expulsion and/or murder of Arabs. Yes, other countries are also doing bad things, but I can't think of any other nation-state that is so self-consciously built on weird race science that, ironically enough, you'd think we'd have put on ice after the second world war. Even the US pays lip service to the rhetoric of racial equality, however hollow it might be. What Turkey is doing in Kurdistan and what China is doing in Xinjiang are both aggressively authoritarian responses to perceived separatist threats. The main opposition ideologies to central government (national liberation PKK stuff in Turkey, Islamic radicalism in Xinjiang) lead to the conflict developing a racialised subtext, for sure, and suppressive policies affect ethnic minorities disproportionately as a result, which obviously can potentially spiral in very unfortunate ways. However, neither conflict originates in the genuine ideological belief that X ethnic group is, by definition, inferior at an existential level. * Though I accept that there are small pockets of anti-semitism, explicit and otherwise, on the left. You do see for example some very sus conflation between 'Israeli' and 'Jewish' interests from some of the more tin-foil hat lefties, though ofc this is deliberately encouraged by the former to implicitly undermine criticism and I genuinely do believe a significant portion of the people who do this are just lazy dumbasses who don't think sufficiently before they speak rather than active racists. ThomasPaine fucked around with this message at 13:46 on Dec 1, 2021 |
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Dec 1, 2021 13:36
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It was mentioned in the last thread with no follow-up, so does anyone know what is wrong with The Donkey Sanctuary as a charity?
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Dec 1, 2021 13:42
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Angrymog posted:It was mentioned in the last thread with no follow-up, so does anyone know what is wrong with The Donkey Sanctuary as a charity? I'd also like to know this as a very nice colleague of mine recently left to work there
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Dec 1, 2021 13:43
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Angrymog posted:It was mentioned in the last thread with no follow-up, so does anyone know what is wrong with The Donkey Sanctuary as a charity? Yes I would like to know too as they were one of the organisations working with us at the pyramids after the revolution along with the Brook, helping the camels, horses and donkeys that were in a dreadful state (no tourism = no food or medical aid for the animals who weren't in the best of condition anyway.) (Though I saw some bad reports on trip advisor about one of the sanctuaries.) Jaeluni Asjil fucked around with this message at 13:54 on Dec 1, 2021 |
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Dec 1, 2021 13:46
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JeremoudCorbynejad posted:I'd also like to know this as a very nice colleague of mine recently left to work there Probably one of the few ways to work with equines and make a living out of it :P They came to do a talk at my work in 2019, and we were all very disappointed that they hadn't brought a couple of donkeys - we have a nice quad that they could have graze on, but apparently donkeys are much less tolerant of travel than horses
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Dec 1, 2021 13:47
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The boss stepped down and their governance is under some sort of investigation but there don't seem to be any further details yet? https://www.thirdsector.co.uk/regulator-assessing-concerns-donkey-sanctuary-departure-chief-executive/governance/article/1722342 Other complaints over the years seem to be that people give too much money to donkeys because they're either unimaginative or donkey's PR is too good.
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Dec 1, 2021 13:50
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Latter isn't really a fault of the charity - donkeys are incredibly cute.
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Dec 1, 2021 13:52
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Tesseraction posted:To be honest I think it's mostly because Palestinians were displaced and many of them moved to western countries where they were able to have a more visible presence as a wronged party. Like I first learned about I/P because a close family friend was having trouble because when his kids were born they kept trying to put the father's place of birth as "Israel" on the birth certificate and he kept saying no, he was born in Palestine, and it was only after a very emotional argument that they correctly put his place of birth. That makes sense, thanks. Bobby Deluxe posted:China is also turning into a huge global market that nobody wants to piss off. They're also investing massively in shareholder stakes in media companies that they can't otherwise influence by witholding access to their markets, which is why given the choice of mentioning Tianemen Square or getting money, most companies will keep quiet. multijoe posted:You also don't get called a sinophobe by the entire media and political establishment for criticising China whilst your country continues to provide material economic and military support to their ethnic cleansing I see that. But if you look at the post I quoted above there is also something going on with China that doesn't get the same focus. Borrovan posted:I absolutely agree that the disproportionate focus on Israel is often antisemitic (but also often isn't - people often have legitimate personal reasons for really caring about one particular cause). But:- With respect to the two links above, I don't think people were turning up with Israeli flags but with Stars of David, which are primarily a religious and not a nationalist symbol. I don't know if Chinese or Turkish groups were included or excluded. Interestingly, there does appear to be a Labour friends of Turkey group, but neither it not LFI are listed on the Labour Friends page... https://labour.org.uk/people/labour-friends-of-group/current-labour-friends-of-groups/ I do agree with your point about LFI conflating anti-semitism and anti-Zionism, although I also think that there can be different good-faith perspectives on whether anti0-Zionism is antisemitic or not. And yeah, the whole commingling of the two issues does get exploited, by both sides, I think. I also agree with your last point. Anyway, thank you all. It's good to have a bit of a sanity check. It is hard to know how much of my reaction is an emotive response based on conditioning and how much a somewhat accurate perception of things.
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Dec 1, 2021 13:52
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Think how many people those donkeys could feed
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Dec 1, 2021 13:53
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iirc it's just that the Donkey people have an ungodly amount of money compared to charities that help humans in similar straits.
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Dec 1, 2021 13:55
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