Misc. Racing Thread 2022: H-Sample Test Phase

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > Misc. Racing Thread 2022: H-Sample Test Phase

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

harperdc posted:

Daily SportsCar has more in a conversation with Ford Performance's boss about the choice to build a GT3 car

it's interesting that twice in there the head of the project/department mentions directly a 'body in white' -- aka a production car, at least the body and bare chassis of one. And of a 'standard' Coyote V8 engine, too, which is also interesting.

why 'interesting'? I would imagine starting with a Mustang is a bit of a different place than starting with a supercar like an Audi R8, a Ferrari or Lamborghini, or even something more purpose-built at a higher price point like the new M4. Ditto for the engine. But considering this Mustang GT3 project is being worked on by Multimatic, aka the people who cooked up the Ford GT...I think they'll be fine. and it'll certainly be cool to have an American V8 out there thumping around in places like potentially Super GT, the SRO series in Europe, at the Bathurst 12 Hours, etc.

The engine itself is definitely race capable, just need to replace the parts that don't like to live at high RPM forever. Ford apparently is going to be using the same engine they're planning on using in GT3 in Supercars, so keep an eye on that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEuaNI-LA3w&t=37s

Here's the Gen 3 Supercars Mustang in testing, if you want to hear what it should sound like.

orange juche fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Feb 8, 2022

# ¿ Feb 8, 2022 17:46

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# ¿ May 14, 2024 03:46

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

Dudley posted:

It's happened earlier than expected.

Audi's a bit strange since they were essentially "Pay a team to run the car Porsche are testing". You wonder if this means anything for the Porsche program.

It was a bit weird that Volkswagen had Audi, Porsche, and Lamborghini all as potential LMDh teams, it would be very strange to finance 3 race teams and programs when they can get the job done with less.

I don't think it will impact Porsche's program at all, might impact Lamborghini depending on how things go, Lamborghini has been a bit recalcitrant to tolerate racing endeavors under its brand historically, because of Ferruccio Lamborghini's stance on racing (loving hated racing and saw it as a waste of money).

Lamborghini is a land of contrasts and who the gently caress knows if the Lamborghini LMDh will come to fruition or just disappear, but Porsche will definitely stick around for at least a season if only so they can win and say they beat everyone's rear end at racing again.

orange juche fucked around with this message at 00:56 on Mar 12, 2022

# ¿ Mar 12, 2022 00:48

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

harperdc posted:

The original rumor at the time of the LMDh announce was same chassis for sure, with some thought that Audi (DTM turbo four) and Porsche (the twin-turbo V8) would use different engines to help differentiate. Considering the investment and potential for customers, even that plan seems like a slam dunk, especially given Audi�s customer success.

One problem: Audi USA isn�t on board with much of this. There apparently has been real reluctance for Audi USA to pay their way along with what the HQ wants to do dating back to the R8s, so it�s little surprise their GT3 support has also slowed down.

So, Audi possibly looking at a WEC team and customers in just the WEC is probably why they�re pulling out.

What about Lamborghini? They have some more support in the US for the Trofeo rich-dude series and also a GT3 they�re doing more to support there as well. The rumors before were that Lambo LMDhs would be customer cars only, so I can see them wanting to do that in IMSA and the WEC in a couple years.

There�s also a chance for Bentley, but I�m not sure that was going to be more than a small works team (from a rich customer) targeting Le Mans on the anniversary year.

So, that sucks, especially for a few teams trying to line up Audi factory roles. I guess we�ll see if any other brands from VAG jump in to take that spot.

I figure the Lambo LMDh effort will be customer-only, if it survives instead of falling to the cutting room floor. They have rich guy series like Super Trofeo but there's little/no factory support or appetite to support a works program from what I can tell at Lamborghini, since their finances have always been shaky at best.

Audi USA being shitters has been a thing for a while, it's kind of amazing that the idea of a works based Audi team is still coasting on the last fumes of racing success from 12 years ago with the R8, but then again people also romanticize the 787B when it was a poo poo car except for winning Le Mans via a special weight restriction exemption giving it better fuel mileage than the other prototypes. (The Mazda was allowed to be 375lb lighter than any car in the C2 class, because they sandbagged and Jackie Ickx rules lawyered until FISA agreed that they should be allowed to run at the lighter weight.)

So we have
2023
Porsche - Not vaporware, we promise, we're not Audi, we actually have a car that has tested in the real world!
Audi - Dead as gently caress
Acura - Still kicking
BMW - Thankfully does not have beaver teeth, 2023 IMSA, 2024 WEC/Le Mans.
Cadillac - Field will probably be silly with Cadillac cars.
2024
Lamborghini - Possibly a thing, who knows, historically finances have not supported a factory race effort, but customer program is a a solid maybe, Lamborghini's finances were hurt badly again (-50% projected revenue) during the 2018 recession, and then the covid follow up in 2019 and onward.
Alpine - Should be a thing, who knows, I don't actually know much about their LMDh effort. Agreed to a 4 year program starting in 2024.

Who else is supposed to go in the 2024 block?

orange juche fucked around with this message at 06:20 on Mar 12, 2022

# ¿ Mar 12, 2022 05:57

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

harperdc posted:

Porsche isn't even joking vaporware, they're the first testing an LMDh out there and have Penske working for both testing and with an LMP2 in the WEC. It'll happen.

It's not really clear who else would come or would want to right now. Ford said they're not looking at it right now, and not supplying power, so the rumor for a minute of a McLaren-Ford entry won't take off. I don't think Nissan or Mazda would, though Toyota could possibly bring the LMH car over to play for the 36 Hours of Florida and also Petit Le Mans. I know I put a couple other rumors in the OP of this thread too.

yeah but it sounds amazing and all the new-era Group C cars that year aimed shotguns at their feet and pulled the triggers

Oh yeah I haven't even looked at LMH, I was specifically looking at LMDh.
Toyota - Doing really good with their LMH, and won hugely in 2021 with it
Peugeot - has their cool wingless thing that will be neat to watch, ~~possibly can offer actual competition to Toyota this year.~~ Will miss 2022 1000 Miles of Sebring, ~~but should make round 2 of the WEC, 6H of Spa.~~, and Spa, and Le Mans lol, maybe they will run at Monza?
Glickenhaus - Exists, doesn't do very well vs the Toyotas, better than ByKolles, but only by virtue of sometimes finishing races without DNF/DSQ.
ByKolles - ~~can't burn as much dodgy ducats by doing LMDh so they will stick with LMH and lose repeatedly, everyone loves a punching bag.~~ Dead.
Ferrari - Will exist in 2023 LMH. 2024 they're hopeful to do IMSA post-convergence, but depends on success and interest.

Once convergence happens in 2024, we should have 10 9 10 different works or customer programs at least in the top class of prototypes, so we're not in the slump cycle, unless it massively derails before 2024.

orange juche fucked around with this message at 07:19 on Mar 12, 2022

# ¿ Mar 12, 2022 06:56

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

harperdc posted:

Only �major� OEMs are allowed in LMDh, and �boutique� manufacturers are okay in LMH. However, ByKolles are neither, so they need a partner to keep the grift going. They weren�t allowed in for 2022.

Peugeot not likely to appear until Monza sadly

Yeah the no on 6 Hours of Spa basically hands the 2022 championship to Toyota unless the necessary evil that is BoP reins in the Toyotas and stops them from running away from the SCG cars.

E: WEC rejecting ByKolles is hilarious, but I guess the bribes weren't big enough this year.

orange juche fucked around with this message at 07:10 on Mar 12, 2022

# ¿ Mar 12, 2022 07:05

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

Xisticide posted:

Despite being told to go away, ByKolles have built their new car anyway.:

No wheel arch cutouts, how long before this thing flips upside down in testing? Assuming of course ByKolles actually tests this thing rather than just lighting it on fire in the pit lane to get to the part we all know is coming?

E: I guess the arches are open at the back? Maybe? Still should light it on fire.

# ¿ Mar 30, 2022 09:39

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

Rain with 4 hours left

# ¿ May 29, 2022 11:01

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

spaceblancmange posted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiXArRirhzE

I'm ok with this

# ¿ Jun 25, 2022 09:44

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

I'm ready for Le Mans Daytona h

# ¿ Jul 12, 2022 06:42

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

The S650 based Mustang GT3 is a chunky lad, big enough to give the Big M8 a run for its money imo

# ¿ Sep 15, 2022 10:36

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

algebra testes posted:

For people that live across the world, is it a possibility that a hurricane cancels the race?

They will have some form of racing, I was there when they had torrential rain that washed out a whole section of the track and the cars were hydroplaning over standing water on their aero undertrays. Granted they called the race as soon as they hit the 50% mark and I think it was GT cars 1-2-3 on the podium overall because the protos couldn't do any sort of pace in the weather.

# ¿ Sep 28, 2022 12:08

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

njsykora posted:

Some variation of Putting It In H has been the thread title for 3 years now, are we actually really putting it in H?

Supposedly, it is finally time to shift into "H"

And if you want to instead shift into V8, have 4 hours of no-commentary V8 roar from a vintage Ford GT40 at the 2022 Spa Six Hours back in October.

Robbert Alblas posted:

Onboard racing during the 2022 Spa Six Hours starring the Ford GT40.

Make sure to put your headphones on to fully experience the brutal V8.

It finished P3 while being down on 7 cylinders due to a pushrod failure for the last 90 minutes of the race.

Driven by Oliver Bryant & James Cottingham

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmwDQGGoVPs

Volume up, headphones on

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBz3V-U-LAQ

highlight reel of same race here, same amazing audio, less length.

orange juche fucked around with this message at 05:03 on Nov 15, 2022

# ¿ Nov 15, 2022 04:14

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

Dudley posted:

I should be excited but I'm just not, because fireworks are a good analogy.

It's all fake. There aren't prototypes here, there's a bunch of spec machines with some plastic glued to them that will be BoPed into line and some sub-LMP1 speed "hypercars" that will also be artificially restricted to make sure everyone gets a turn.

The racing will be good, spec racing often is, but the winner will usually be whoever lobbied the FIA best that week and there is absolutely no technology battle. They might as well have gone for straight LMP2 with a spec hybrid.

I'll enjoy the racing but any kind of golden era of prototype racing this isn't, in fact it's confirmation of its probably permeant death.

To be fair there has not been a technology battle since 2017 so you're half a decade late to the funeral.

This will be infinitely better than a Toyota winning by default forever.

# ¿ Nov 15, 2022 11:38

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

wait I thought the h was specifically lower-case in the branding, as in Le Mans, Daytona, h

# ¿ Dec 7, 2022 02:41

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# ¿ May 14, 2024 03:46

orange juche: Mar 14, 2012

Hasn't LMP2 always been the class that gets squeezed hardest whenever other classes are doing well? Its a class that while fast and easy to drive was never really intended to compete for race wins, and now with burgeoning customer programs in LMDh, and LMDh being roughly equivalent to Hypercar, and more importantly cheap/accessible for a top tier formula, any privateer with a taste for race wins is going to move to LMDh, or move down to GT3 to save money if race wins dont matter to them.

I could be talking out my rear end but I'm seeing a future with single digit LMP2 entries again soon.

# ¿ Dec 7, 2022 18:39

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > Misc. Racing Thread 2022: H-Sample Test Phase