Thread for discussing how the holodomor DEFINITELY happened

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > Thread for discussing how the holodomor DEFINITELY happened

Grimnarsson: Sep 4, 2018

No it was unknowime.

# ¿ Oct 30, 2022 20:14

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# ¿ May 10, 2024 21:19

Grimnarsson: Sep 4, 2018

indigi posted:

can anyone explain what the holodomor even is anymore? people use the term Willy nilly, it's the new gaslighting

It is confusing sometimes in that is the Holodomor the specifically Ukrainian portion of the Soviet Union wide famine in 1931-33 or does it refer to the whole famine? Often it seems that the way the term is used it refers to the famine in Ukraine in such a way that there wasn't a famine elsewhere in the USSR while also counting the deaths from all across the USSR as having been Ukrainians in Ukraine. I have no problem with Ukrainians commemorating the famine as it affected them but an international recognition should include all the victims.

# ¿ Jan 1, 2023 22:11

Grimnarsson: Sep 4, 2018

Black Book Of Communism and the 100 million murdered by leftism has been vindicated.

# ¿ Feb 26, 2023 19:43

Grimnarsson: Sep 4, 2018

Holodomo arigato, found a tankie denier

Stephen Kotkin, Waiting For Hitler, Part I, Chapter 2; Stalin's Famine:

quote:

Always grudgingly, Stalin approved, and in some cases initiated, reductions in grain exports, beginning already in September 1931;
in 1932 and 1933 he signed reduced grain collection quotas for Ukraine, the North Caucasus, the Volga valley, Crimea, the Urals,
the Central Black Earth region, the Kazakh autonomous republic, and Eastern Siberia on nine occasions.476 The 1933 grain procurement
target fell from 24.3 to 19.6 million tons; the actual amount collected would be around 18.5 million tons.477, 478 Altogether,
the regime returned about 5.7 million tons of grain back to agriculture, including 2 million tons from reserves and 3.5 million
from procurements. Stalin also approved clandestine purchase of grain and livestock abroad using scarce hard currency.
479 Just between February and July 1933, he signed or countenanced nearly three dozen small allocations of food aid to the countryside,
primarily to the North Caucasus and Ukraine, as well as the Kazakh lands (which necessitated sharp reductions
in the bread rations for city dwellers, many of whom were put on the brink of starvation). All of these actions were woefully insufficient
for avoiding the mass starvation in the countryside caused by his policies, in the face of challenging natural conditions.
Still, these actions do not indicate that he was trying to exterminate peasants or ethnic Ukrainians.480 In the Kazakh autonomous republic,
probably between 35 and 40 percent of the titular nation�as compared with 8 to 9 percent of Slavs there�perished from starvation or disease,
not because the regime targeted Kazakhs by ethnicity, but because regime policy there consisted of forced denomadization. Similarly,
there was no �Ukrainian� famine; the famine was Soviet.481

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# ¿ Mar 29, 2024 18:48

Grimnarsson: Sep 4, 2018

I have learned my lesson, from now on I will only quote the wonderful prose of Snyder, Conquest of 80s, Applebaum, and affirm that the Holodomor did indeed happen. Because it did! The grain is gonezo, Stalin did so.

# ¿ Mar 30, 2024 01:00

Grimnarsson: Sep 4, 2018

Ytlaya posted:

I'm sensing some sarcasm here. I don't think you are genuine in your contrition.

Ok spiderman

# ¿ Mar 30, 2024 01:46

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# ¿ May 10, 2024 21:19

Grimnarsson: Sep 4, 2018

Corky Romanovsky posted:

Has anyone amended the Wikipedia page to include more serious sources?

What more serious sources could there possibly be? Stalin?

# ¿ Apr 20, 2024 13:58

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