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First off, this is definitely a US/ Hollywood centric post. So, we’re two years out from the start of covid. Even with some small resurgences in hit movies, the blockbuster, or at lest the guarantee of lots of blockbusters every year, seems to be done. Many major movies serve mainly to advertise people about the upcoming movies in that franchise. The new nature of streaming content seems to be pushing money more toward tv shows that can engage people for longer. The nature of streaming pushes toward content that can be watched while half distracted on the phone. Many of the major directors, movie stars, etc that could dictate the art they make are dead, dying, retired, or close to retiring. Streaming means that basically 100 years of film are easily accessible to anyone, and even have handy algorithms to curate it to people. Why do we even need that much new stuff? On the other hand, this could be an opportunity for more indie filmmaking. The tech to make movies is cheaper than ever, albeit still limited in what it can do with special effects. This will of course favor certain genres over others, but does mean that more artists have the ability to make art. There are some smaller studios that have taken advantage of this to produce movies that, while niche, are popular. Or at least it’s cheap enough to fund a lot of these movies nowadays, albeit without big stars or ad campaigns the way mid budget movies used to have. Streaming also allows a much lower barrier of entry to reach a ton of people, although the state of the web in 2022 means that very little actually goes viral without paid pushes and advertising. I know the old argument used to be about the number of sequels versus original content. I dunno how important that really is, given they were making jokes about too many sequels a half century ago. That doesn’t seem like it’s the thin that could kill movies, or at least not do so very quickly. What do folks think?
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Jun 20, 2022 05:00
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Not very dead at all. https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2022/06/19/movies-tom-cruise-top-gun-maverick-tops-900m-at-worldwide-box-office/?sh=51ab096970ca
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Jun 20, 2022 07:27
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PeterCat posted:Not very dead at all. Multiple things I mentioned would label this as an anomaly. Fewer blockbusters per year. Movie star who is going to retire soon. Another sequel/remake.
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Jun 20, 2022 07:43
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Is any medium ever dead? They still do radio plays, live theater, poetry maybe somewhere I dunno. But anyway, not very. Right now the industry has a major problem where the blockbuster is still very much alive and well, and because of the COVID backlog there's still a lot of stuff trickling out- everyone's still smoothing out their schedules- which compounds the issue of there not being much room for smaller movies because the big ones are now arriving every couple of weeks it seems. And of course this is a problem because there's no real incentive on the part of the studios to try anything else. But there are some good signs. There are always some nice exceptions to the rule, like The Lost City being a mid-budget romcom adventure flick that made a decent return, or Everything Everywhere All At Once being a sleeper hit. (And even in the depths of 2019 there were films like Knives Out and Hustlers that again, managed to attract an audience without any familiar source material.) And one thing I've noticed since theaters started reopening is that movies are kinda having longer runs? Like this is partly due to the weird pace but I'm seeing a lot more films hang in there for a while. Again, Everything Everywhere's run is largely fueled by buzz and word of mouth (and to be sure a very good marketing push) and in general I feel less like a movie will be gone from theaters if I wait longer than 2 weeks to see it. So I dunno, things still feel weird to me, the new normal doesn't feel quite like the old.
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Jun 20, 2022 08:53
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the hollywood blockbuster has been dead for the last two decade, theatres are dead, but imo movies at large of the last 5 years are better then they've been since the 80's. so many more varied perspectives, so many more arty movies getting mainstream attention, it's all great stuff.
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Jun 20, 2022 16:23
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Movies aren't dead. Streaming has moved theatrical blockbuster experiences toward a more live music model - as in, you'll probably go to the movies around six times a year for the biggest poo poo and for anything else you'll be home and watching them on streaming. This means that some movie theaters are going to have to close, sadly.
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Jun 20, 2022 17:46
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I think indie theaters are due for a boom, around whenever digital projection looks good without an expensive setup or a dcp or whatever.
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Jun 20, 2022 19:48
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Ensemble casts are just market consolidation. In the future there will only be two movies.
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Jun 21, 2022 01:05
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Warm und Fuzzy posted:Ensemble casts are just market consolidation. In the future there will only be two movies. They will however share the same cinematic universe, and each will be completely incoherent without watching the other one first.
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Jun 21, 2022 13:52
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What feels dead has merely altered state. A bit. Movies will continue on, through this paradigm shift and the next and the one after that. It is interesting to think about though. I'm waiting until ai generated movies which will feel like the real death of cinema but what no what's this? Necromancy is a forbidden art but is somehow in 2066 now an integral part of the movie making process. Is cinema dead, now, surely? No? It happened! Humans will sit staring at a screen in states of great concentration, trying to communicate with an entity, and as long as they do movies will not be dead.
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Jun 21, 2022 14:34
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Famethrowa posted:the hollywood blockbuster has been dead for the last two decade, theatres are dead, How many Hollywood movies in the past two decades grossed over a billion dollars vs how many from the entirety of the 20th century? I’ll save you the trouble, out of the 36 $1b+ films only 2 came out prior to the last 2 decades, Titanic, and Jurassic Park. Big dumb blockbusters are alive and healthier than ever my friend.
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Jun 21, 2022 19:26
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That does not necessarily mean they are more profitable/sustainable than they were before.
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Jun 21, 2022 19:38
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Movies will never be dead. But it'll never be the same as it once was. The fact is that...at least in my opinion...television series have overtaken film as the preeminent media form. Premiums, streaming, and many cable networks are now pouring money into big budget television on a scale that never existed twenty five years ago. The ability to release from the constraints of run length just offers more flexibility. Talent is flooding away from movies and into TV.
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Jun 22, 2022 01:04
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Streaming is running into problems of its own though. Netflix has been increasingly relying on THE ALGORITHM to create content, so making a movie or show for Netflix now means you're gonna get as many notes as if you were doing it for Paramount or CBS (and they've been on a cancellation spree of late, so if you are making a show don't bother leaving anything hanging at the end of the season.)
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Jun 22, 2022 01:45
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Maxwell Lord posted:Streaming is running into problems of its own though. Netflix has been increasingly relying on THE ALGORITHM to create content, so making a movie or show for Netflix now means you're gonna get as many notes as if you were doing it for Paramount or CBS (and they've been on a cancellation spree of late, so if you are making a show don't bother leaving anything hanging at the end of the season.) Netflix is speeding downhill. They've been throwing money at people to make garbage for too long and it's starting to catch up. Haven't subscriptions plummeted? Got to think that they'll get some better program directors (or whatever you call the people who decide what to greenlight) soon. They've got the $$$ to do it. Maybe steal someone from HBOMax. They put out oodles of content and rarely misfire too hard. It's not rocket science.
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Jun 22, 2022 02:40
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Why do Netflix movies kinda suck? They’re either not good or very mid, and a lot of these are made by directors who have made great films. What happens during the filmmaking process?
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Jun 22, 2022 03:18
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Well I know Red Notice was very much "the marketing says people like heist movies and these two actors" and basically following the algorithm all the way down.
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Jun 22, 2022 04:02
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Na'at posted:How many Hollywood movies in the past two decades grossed over a billion dollars vs how many from the entirety of the 20th century? there used to be 20 wholly unique blockbusters from 6 different studios every year of literally every genre now there are maybe 10, from 3 studios, are generally about superheroes and half of them are intrinsically tied to the previous piece of Content. who gives a poo poo about how much money they make we're talking about the culture and sustainability here. Famethrowa fucked around with this message at 04:15 on Jun 22, 2022 |
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Jun 22, 2022 04:06
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CelticPredator posted:Why do Netflix movies kinda suck? They’re either not good or very mid, and a lot of these are made by directors who have made great films. I think they make them intentionally bland and approachable. There's nothing wrong with doing this, I liked RLM noting that some people want premium content and some people just want to have a buffet. The weird part is that they spend obscene amounts of money on the equivalent of made-for-TV movies and then give them huge pushes. Hulu and Amazon also put out plenty of bland garbage movies but they're just kind of there on the service and they don't drop 8 or 9 figures for them. And also they don't seem to buy better genre poo poo or actual good movies as much as they used to. Red Notice at least got a lot of eyeballs on it, supposedly. But I mainly remember some write up for that Ben Affleck Triple Frontier movie, that was just asking how in the world they spent $115 million on the equivalent of a Red Box exclusive action movie.
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Jun 22, 2022 04:18
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Maxwell Lord posted:Well I know Red Notice was very much "the marketing says people like heist movies and these two actors" and basically following the algorithm all the way down. That's exactly what I think of when I think of Netflix. Create paint by the numbers popcorn flick and throw big cash at name actors. As I said earlier....I think that method isn't working out so great right now. So much content being created right now on a number of different services.....that mediocre efforts like that aren't reeling people in as much. It's sad that with the kind of money that they are working with....that they cannot find better scripts for these things. HBOMax is really the one premium/streaming service that is really heads and shoulders above everyone else. Apple+ is making a good push right now to separate from the pack as well. Again....Netflix has to reel it in and start making better decisions. Just look at 'Space Force'. So much talent and $$$ behind that show for it to be as mediocre and lazy as it was. Did anyone see the new Mike Myers show on Nexflix? I didn't. Just another 'toss money at it' effort with a poor result is what I've heard.
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Jun 22, 2022 04:37
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There are some things about movies that are worse than they were in the past and some things about movies that are better than they were in the past. Depending on what stuff you value, things are either overall worse, overall better, or it's ultimately kind of a wash. I don't like how bad things are getting for theaters and I don't how studios are putting all their chips on bland, cookie cutter blockbusters and therefore crowding out space for smaller movies like mid budget romcoms. I like how we're getting movies from many more diverse voices than we've ever gotten before and how streaming is allowing some movies with niche appeal to be viable. Ultimately I think the best attitude is to be thankful for the good things in life and try not to be too bitter about what once was and what otherwise might have been. If you want to make yourself sad about things there will always be raw material in the world to fuel your sadness. But the same is true of happiness. So it's up to you whether you want to dwell on the poo poo and make your life suck, or revel in the good and be happy every day.
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Jun 22, 2022 04:47
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Famethrowa posted:there used to be 20 wholly unique blockbusters from 6 different studios every year of literally every genre Where are you getting “20 wholly unique blockbusters every year”? How are you defining blockbuster? Because traditionally the A-budget films have usually been based on existing/familiar source material. The squeeze has been in the middle, the B pictures (not the true indie and micro budget films mind you.)
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Jun 22, 2022 05:13
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Maxwell Lord posted:Where are you getting “20 wholly unique blockbusters every year”? How are you defining blockbuster? Because traditionally the A-budget films have usually been based on existing/familiar source material. I think there’s been a pretty obvious homogenization of the top grossing films in the last decade or so.
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Jun 22, 2022 14:23
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RestingB1tchFace posted:Movies will never be dead. But it'll never be the same as it once was. The fact is that...at least in my opinion...television series have overtaken film as the preeminent media form. Premiums, streaming, and many cable networks are now pouring money into big budget television on a scale that never existed twenty five years ago. The ability to release from the constraints of run length just offers more flexibility. Talent is flooding away from movies and into TV. Prestige TV is worst than movies and with HBO turning towards more and more franchise shows over original content, it's not looking too good for the future.
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Jun 22, 2022 21:20
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It seems like there's this idea that only great movies used to get made and that watered down filler is a new thing but really there are a handful of classics from every decade and we'll look back at stuff like Fury Road and Fallout and Maverick as being stand outs from this era and they're all IP blockbusters.
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Jun 22, 2022 21:26
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live with fruit posted:It seems like there's this idea that only great movies used to get made and that watered down filler is a new thing but really there are a handful of classics from every decade and we'll look back at stuff like Fury Road and Fallout and Maverick as being stand outs from this era and they're all IP blockbusters. Yeah go back and look at the top 10 highest earning movies of each year, you will recognize some of them but a lot you won't
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Jun 22, 2022 22:24
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I just wish we had more young aspiring filmmakers. Making a movie is as simple as it’s ever been but it doesn’t seem like zoomers give a gently caress about movies.
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Jun 22, 2022 22:31
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sponges posted:I just wish we had more young aspiring filmmakers. Making a movie is as simple as it’s ever been but it doesn’t seem like zoomers give a gently caress about movies. How much is this a thing, though? In general there are not going to be a lot of well-known filmmakers in their early 20s, outside of Indy stuff.
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Jun 23, 2022 01:56
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sponges posted:I just wish we had more young aspiring filmmakers. Making a movie is as simple as it’s ever been but it doesn’t seem like zoomers give a gently caress about movies. There’s a ton of stuff on YouTube of younger people making stuff. It’s just hard and expensive to do the rigamarole to get it out there. But not totally impossible.
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Jun 23, 2022 02:27
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fr0id posted:How much is this a thing, though? In general there are not going to be a lot of well-known filmmakers in their early 20s, outside of Indy stuff. I don't think it is a thing. Generally, late 30s to early 40s would be fairly young to helm a studio production. It takes time to get to that level. Generally, you spend 15 to 20 years cutting your teeth in commercials, music videos, short films, and smaller independent productions. The vast majority of filmmakers need that experience if they aren't going to be propped up by producers and technicians making the real decisions. You occasionally get a prodigy like Steven Spielberg who just busts out of the gate in their early 20s as fully formed masters, but there's a reason directors like that are considered exceptional. Over the last decade, we've had several sharp directors debuting in their mid-30s. Ari Aster, Robert Eggers, Dan Trachtenberg, Ryan Coogler, Yorgos Lanthimos, and Gareth Evans all had internationally recognized films by their mid-30s. Bugblatter fucked around with this message at 07:07 on Jun 23, 2022 |
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Jun 23, 2022 06:58
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The average age of a director making their first feature is like 32 iirc
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Jun 23, 2022 07:03
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There's a decent amount of young directors out there, it's just that that it's real hard to get the funding for a feature film when you're young unless you make a big splash with some short film work or something (or have some rich/well-connected parents). And even then for every, say, person like Damien Chazelle who gets to break out in a big way, you get a ton that get to make maybe one or two films then vanish into obscurity.
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Jun 23, 2022 12:28
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Mantis42 posted:Prestige TV is worst than movies and with HBO turning towards more and more franchise shows over original content, it's not looking too good for the future. Not sure where this is coming from. Just since the start of 2021 HBO has done mini series like 'Mare of Easttown', 'The White Lotus' and 'Station Eleven'. Original dramas like 'Succession', 'Raised By Wolves', and 'Barry'. And a handful of other really great shows like 'Made For Love', 'Minx', 'Ten Year Old Tom', and 'The Other Two'. That's just what I've watched and liked. They have tons of great stuff that is original.
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Jun 23, 2022 15:13
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I haven't heard of most of those. Maybe I was wrong about HBO then but I've heard a lot about new GoT spinoffs, new Sopranos stuff etc. Steaming is a lot worst with a bad LotR show, like 4 bad Star Wars shows, 5 bad MCU shows, etc.
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Jun 23, 2022 17:08
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Mantis42 posted:I haven't heard of most of those. Maybe I was wrong about HBO then but I've heard a lot about new GoT spinoffs, new Sopranos stuff etc. Steaming is a lot worst with a bad LotR show, like 4 bad Star Wars shows, 5 bad MCU shows, etc. Sure.....I mean....Game of Thrones ended three years ago now. And while the new GoT show is likely going to be a big deal....it's not like HBO is dropping everything to focus on bringing back their old shows. They've been pumping out all sorts of stuff....whether it be original or based on other works.
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Jun 26, 2022 05:19
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RestingB1tchFace posted:Not sure where this is coming from. Just since the start of 2021 HBO has done mini series like 'Mare of Easttown', 'The White Lotus' and 'Station Eleven'. Original dramas like 'Succession', 'Raised By Wolves', and 'Barry'. And a handful of other really great shows like 'Made For Love', 'Minx', 'Ten Year Old Tom', and 'The Other Two'. The ongoing status of HBO / HBO Max are a big question mark at the moment. e.g. of the ten shows you've listed, only five are coming back. They've also significantly scaled back on development... HBO Max used to be the catchment for a bunch of different channels, several of which have stopped producing original content, and Max itself is producing less original material itself. HBO (as opposed to Max, they're separate entities) is still producing television, but they've talked about wanting to pivot away from works without franchising potential. So more Green Lantern, Batman, etc. and less Station Eleven, Raised By Wolves, etc. etc. Most of this has only happened over the last three months or so, so we're not seeing the full impact of the change yet.
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Jun 26, 2022 08:10
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Open Source Idiom posted:The ongoing status of HBO / HBO Max are a big question mark at the moment. e.g. of the ten shows you've listed, only five are coming back. They've also significantly scaled back on development... HBO Max used to be the catchment for a bunch of different channels, several of which have stopped producing original content, and Max itself is producing less original material itself. I think you're referring to the fairly vague statements coming from the Discovery purchase. There's been conflicting information on what all that will entail and no one will really know until there's been more time for the new management's decisions to play out. That they want to leverage their existing IP more in streaming is a given. The major streaming platforms need flagship IPs to attract and retain subscribers. Historically HBO has used GoT/The Wire/Curb Your Enthusiasm to attract subscribers and float the rest of their projects. They have more competition at their level now, and GoT is a shakey property to bank their future on. So bringing in some of the Warner properties makes sense. Outside of rumors, I haven't heard anything that substantiates the idea that this move will result in the end of smaller projects. They'd alienate a lot of their demographic if they go that route. Half of their shows not making it past a second season isn't all that uncommon. Only the biggest of HBOs hits ever get long runs. It is, as you say, a question mark. While that means we can't have faith that HBO will remain a bastion of prestige TV, it's also a bit early to predict a doom of nothing but DC shows.
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Jun 27, 2022 04:45
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https://twitter.com/FilmUpdates/status/1541111785327333376?s=20&t=uuWddx5RFuWmmpqKQ32FlA
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Jun 27, 2022 06:18
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CelticPredator posted:Why do Netflix movies kinda suck? They’re either not good or very mid, and a lot of these are made by directors who have made great films. Their focus on algorithmic entergagement instead of an actual movie. it's like conservative humor, if the main driver is an afterthought the product wont be good.
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Jun 27, 2022 16:03
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Open Source Idiom posted:The ongoing status of HBO / HBO Max are a big question mark at the moment. e.g. of the ten shows you've listed, only five are coming back. They've also significantly scaled back on development... HBO Max used to be the catchment for a bunch of different channels, several of which have stopped producing original content, and Max itself is producing less original material itself. Well several of those shows were miniseries/never meant to go past a single season. And again....I'm only picking a selection of the shows that they run. Speaking of DC....and I could really care less about superhero stuff....'Doom Patrol' is fantastic. So is the animated 'Harley Quinn' show. As for original material.....I haven't heard anything suggesting a significant pullback. Hell....as far as I know....they haven't even shut down Cinemax originals yet. Both 'Warrior' and 'The Knick' are set for third seasons coming to HBOMax. Very excited for those.
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Jun 28, 2022 05:03
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