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HonorableTB posted:If addiction is a disease, and a disease is harmful, I fail to see how addiction is not also a health harm contrary to what you're saying. Also, this is D&D. Bring your own sources instead of demanding other people go educate themselves. If you have data to utilize backing up what you're saying (and what are you even saying? You forgot to include a point in your post scolding), then post it. Yeah but DV also calls it a civil harm and says and end goal should be ending any nicotine addiction and that's pretty disconnected from the modern view of addiction. https://nida.nih.gov/publications/drugs-brains-behavior-science-addiction/treatment-recovery Addiction isn't something we can cure but we can manage it. There will never be an end to consuming substances as humans and we will always seek them out. Also I'll be honest I don't totally understand what DV means by civil harm in this case. I don't think nicotine addicts are really causing a lot of societal damage here and people are going to be jumpy about that sort of language because it sounds like a tough on crime soundbite, that addiction has civil harm. I don't think that's what DV means but I also don't understand what they did mean.
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Jun 21, 2022 22:56
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Jaxyon posted:Yes she has to smile and pretend to like the people taking away rights so they don't take away rights harder. It's honestly just insanely racist to assume you know someone's true intentions and that they're lying based on the color of their skin. It's not better because you're assuming good things
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Jun 21, 2022 22:59
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Jaxyon posted:I could be wrong, I probably overstated how certain I am that this is going on. I have but the color of their skin has never actually been a good short hand for it. You can come up with a good argument for why she might be doing that in a way that isn't race reductionist. A Supreme Court Justice isn't going to make those calculations the same way someone talking to their boss or a police officer will be on account of being a Supreme Court Justice. Her life isn't the life of your average person of color so using that as a shorthand for her is lazy at best.
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Jun 21, 2022 23:15
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Jaxyon posted:I think it's a combination of race and gender that makes it likely she's had to do this type of thing before and it's something I recognize from women of color literally pointing out, to me, themselves, when they're doing it. I mean, I don't expect her to go off. I just also don't expect her to call Thomas a friend. The whole problem is that they're co-workers. RBG was famously friends with Scalia because he didn't steal her rights, he just went to the opera and bought funny souvenir's on vacation. There are no calculations on gender and race, she's just friends with her coworker on the council who decides what rights you have. I think if you want to make the argument that she is modifying her public behavior because of what lenses she thinks it will be viewed in you would have an argument. But I don't think one of the Supreme Court Justices is heavily motivated by workplace politics. Lifetime appointments really shake that up along with everything else.
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Jun 22, 2022 01:13
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Young Freud posted:Nothing sums up the Republican ethos as Ted Cruz describing "being a gamer" as someone who buys all the micro-transactions and doesn't actually play the game. I bet he owns a star citizen ship
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Jun 22, 2022 04:08
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GreyjoyBastard posted:The particular law here is who cares, it's a toothless pledge. The decision appears bizarre. Conservative judges elsewhere have laughed at these laws so maybe scotus will too. Those useless pledges also have general bipartisan support outside of fringe Democrats so it has the potential to be an ugly one if the Supreme Court makes a lovely ruling. Hopefully they end up also laughing at it.
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Jun 22, 2022 22:38
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Bar Ran Dun posted:I’m not sure what I think about swimming and trans athletics. Most combat sports, though there are few examples in practice due to other factors, allow you to fight after three years of hormone therapy. Swimming likely would require less time. The real answer is that gendered classes were a good short hand for the past but we can be more exact in our measurements and how we build classes in sports these days if we try. Edit: and really let's be honest gendered classes in a lot of sports are so the girls don't beat the boys. Makes sense in some but lmao in a lot. Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 04:02 on Jun 23, 2022 |
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Jun 23, 2022 03:59
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Bar Ran Dun posted:I think that if we don’t have a lovely society this question eventually goes away. If trans kids don’t have to go through the wrong puberty this ceases to be a question. If we lived in a better society we wouldn't have to exclude people but instead we have to exclude them for the sake of college athletics is one option but does feel like priority is reversed. Representation matters.
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Jun 23, 2022 06:14
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Nazzadan posted:What the gently caress is she talking about, I don't know a single cop that makes less than $50k a year, unless state troopers make way less than their city counterparts. I guess it could be true if you're one of three cops in some no traffic light town in Georgia but they're also still probably one of the highest paid people in that town so gently caress em. Edit: quick googling but either she is talking about something besides state troopers or this really only applies to cadets since everyone else's base salary is already over 50k. Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 17:58 on Jun 23, 2022 |
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Jun 23, 2022 17:54
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Srice posted:https://www.forbes.com/sites/andrewdepietro/2020/04/23/police-officer-salary-state/?sh=60f8e5052010 Yeah, I was going off on this info for Georgia State Troopers https://dps.georgia.gov/gsp-career-path The whole thing seems like most other police policy though, so detached from reality that you're worried the person drafting it has had a paranoid mental break.
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Jun 23, 2022 18:23
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Discendo Vox posted:Actual Georgia Law Enorcement pay structure: Where did you find this? It's 2016 numbers, I can't find any info on what those codes actually mean in terms of position, and the URL links to an internal HR website so there's no way to see if it's been updated or if it's the latest numbers or what.
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Jun 23, 2022 18:30
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Discendo Vox posted:https://doas.ga.gov/human-resources-administration/compensation/state-salary-plans Got it ok, this makes more sense than how Abrams explained it in the tweet though honestly I think saying we're raising the salary of troopers and police will go over better than corrections and parole officers who are really the ones who have the low pay here.
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Jun 23, 2022 18:40
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selec posted:Police might only make minimum wage and I’ll still say rhetoric about supporting them is authoritarian bullshit that centers the problem as a victimized or marginalized group. Yeah, I keep going back and forth if you will get more heat for saying you want to raise police salaries or if you want to talk about the poor impoverished prison guard. Neither is a beloved member of society when your prison system is an extension of your slavery past.
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Jun 23, 2022 19:06
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Oracle posted:The other thing that's been on my mind lately is how we raise AMAB vs AFAB. We are not afraid to push AMAB kids to excel, noone warns them not to do too well or else they may alienate friends/the opposite sex, they're encouraged to excel and put sports ahead of everything else without fear of being seen as too manly, etc. So when an AMAB person transitions they don't have all that societal baggage AFAB competitors do. I'd be very curious as to what might happen if AFAB athletes were treated as such coming up. (we already see evidence that societal expectation affects performance in mathematics as an example, countries where its not considered a gendered skill have much higher rates of women in hard sciences/maths vs places where its considered an inherent weakness assigned to sex). That's not always true for AMAB people and especially not AMAB people who entirely transition because being someone who eventually transitions is also an indicator that you didn't meet this societal expectations and your experiences when young are probably different from an AMAB person who probably was. And really the effect of nurture in sports, especially with things like "how much encouragement did they get as a kid?" seems like it would be minimal enough to not really need to adjust things and pretty much impossible to adjust things to take it into account. Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 19:50 on Jun 23, 2022 |
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Jun 23, 2022 19:41
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Oracle posted:That's uncomfortably close to 'society made me be trans because I wasn't manly enough for it' which is not at all the case see e.g. 'feminine' homosexual males or 'butch' lesbians. There are plenty of 'butch' lesbian trans women who met societal expectations for being 'manly' but were STILL uncomfortable in their own skin and transitioned as a result, because they were women, regardless of their gender expression. No, just trying to explain that nature is also different for you based on how you feel you fit into your own gender role. it's not as clear cut as we encourage boys but don't encourage girls. Like if we're going to make uncharitable assumptions about what we're uncomfortably close to you're getting uncomfortably close to arguments about how men transition into women just to steal opportunities from them. Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Jun 23, 2022 |
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Jun 23, 2022 20:00
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ellasmith posted:I’m just glad even democrats are coming around to the idea that defunding the police was an awful decision. Living in a low income city in the northeast, nearly all of my friends and coworkers are black or Hispanic and I can’t think of a single one of them who believes we need less policing, not more. Having the same experience, what I usually hear expressed is the want for better policing. The default assumption here is that they need more money to be better but in practice money doesn't actually lead to better policing. I don't expect voters to understand that but politicians should have the ability to understand how to actually get us to better police but seem to be failing. No one here trusts the police, they just see it as the only option from something worse. Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 20:18 on Jun 23, 2022 |
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Jun 23, 2022 20:16
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Kalit posted:I often hear this, but I rarely see anyone claim what their wording means nor any studies/sources supplied with it. So, for you, how is "helpful" defined? What does "rarely" mean? And are you referring to any crime? Or does some crime get a higher priority than others? Ok, imagine a gunman is in a class room with a bunch of kids. When he starts killing those kids you would expect the police to help. But actually they have no legal requirement and they will not put themselves at risk. Or imagine helpful police who make sure to properly process and investigate all rape kits, an incredibly useful tool that allows us to collect DNA evidence of rape and really push back on a crime that for a long time has honestly been an accepted reality of life. Are our police doing that? Uhhh, well, https://www.endthebacklog.org/what-is-the-backlog/ Also if you need hard numbers police solve less then half of all crimes https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/03/01/most-violent-and-property-crimes-in-the-u-s-go-unsolved/ Want to kill someone? 40% chance you get away. Target someone who society doesn't care about, the lesser dead? Holy poo poo your chances go up. https://www.vox.com/2018/9/24/17896034/murder-crime-clearance-fbi-report
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Jun 24, 2022 03:56
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There's also the famous 40% domestic violence among police stat. Definitely not helpful for their families. Also they don't even teach themselves how to help correctly. The majority of police work has nothing to do with violence and is minor crimes and civil duties. However their training is obsessed with the warrior cop. https://www.vox.com/2020/7/31/21334190/what-police-do-defund-abolish-police-reform-training They're like if the IT guy knew jack poo poo about computers but had a lot of guns and was pretty sure they fixed computers.
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Jun 24, 2022 04:02
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:honestly the best thing you can do for yourself if you live in a red state is loving leave. Like all events that create lots of refugees it will be primarily the rich and middle class who get out. If you can do it you should but once we're at the point people are fleeing we're past it getting better.
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Jun 24, 2022 16:27
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Rigel posted:"if you can" is obviously implied. It is still true. Is it true from a D&D politics perspective? If your goal is giving yourself the best chances it's absolutely true. But part of D&D is zooming out and looking at societal effects and political effects and is the sympathetic upper class fleeing a state a good thing for the future class struggles and fights that will take place in that state? I don't know. I don't think so though I'm not going to tell anyone to not flee. Just that it's way more complicated. And I get the semantics that loam was explicitly saying get out for yourself. I'm just wondering off of that if it's a good thing overall. A good discussion too is what you can do once you are out. The work isn't over once you secure your own safety. Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 19:03 on Jun 24, 2022 |
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Jun 24, 2022 16:34
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This Is the Zodiac posted:How would this even work though? This is the expected outcome either way so we need to try something. Democracy can't be "if enough white supremacists vote to unperson you it's legal and they can do it" and arguments that act as if our hands are completely tied when fascists do that end up just reinforcing that yeah, you can absolutely legally strip rights from people and that's how the system is supposed to work.
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Jun 24, 2022 17:13
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Fart Amplifier posted:Maybe you shouldn't try the thing where you just said the expected outcome is bad My point is that we've been operating for a while as if right wing take over is inevitable yet also use it as a reason to not do things. It can't be both.
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Jun 24, 2022 17:18
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This Is the Zodiac posted:They can't do anything. Short of literal Stalinist purges, this is the way it is. The red team made the rules, they set up the game board, and then they won. If this is true then hopefully the Democrats are preparing for violence because the answer can't be that white supremacists just get to legally vote others into not having rights.
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Jun 24, 2022 17:31
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Eiba posted:It's frustrating to see dumb absolutism lead to counterproductive doomerism. The Democrats have failed. Voting for more Democrats is the only way to fix this. Both statements are true. It's not emotionally satisfying, and it's not easy, but it's obviously true. Has Pelosi campaigned for an anti-choice candidate? That's lovely. Have the Democrats failed to expand the supreme court because some of them think playing nice is more important than their policy goals? gently caress those guys. Is anything going to get better if the Democrats have even less power? No. Things will get significantly worse. The Democrats will not grow spines in adversity. They'll perfect their message, sure. They'll say exactly what we want them to say. But the next time they've got a tenuous grip in power, they'll be just as likely drop the ball again. Yeah but you're describing taking over the party, not voting back in the current parts of it in power.
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Jun 24, 2022 18:31
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Rigel posted:If I saw this post outside this board I would assume it was a Russian bot or a Republican troll gleefully trying to stir up trouble. On this board, it is very likely genuinely posted in good faith. Our system didn't appear by accident but it was built by white land owners who believed in rule only by white land owners even though they were a minority so I think the way things currently work where a white minority controls everything is how the system is designed to work.
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Jun 24, 2022 19:28
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Fister Roboto posted:The reason why the outright fascists were able to "take over" the Republican party is because their interests were never at odds with each other. Republican leadership was 100% OK with fascists being in charge because they were fascists themselves. In fact, it was even advantageous to them because it allowed them play the "reasonable, polite Republican" role and get idiot centrists to support them. The whole idea that fascists "took over" is also just wrong. They've always been in charge. None of this is abnormal for America. What was abnormal was the small period where there was actually a lot of freedom in America, it just happens to be that's when most of us were born and raised so we think it's always been like this. We were lucky to live in the short speed bump where fascists were losing power but now it's rolling back again.
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Jun 24, 2022 19:40
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America Inc. posted:Ok, but it was not Great Men that saved the country, both of those men had movements behind them. They were also explicitly taking less radical actions that ended up causing problems in the future. It's a very simple reading of history but they pay Chris the big bucks to be simple.
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Jun 24, 2022 19:56
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Main Paineframe posted:"Dense" is charitable, I think. They spent yesterday spewing transphobia and screaming about the left's "woke gender ideology". They're literally just another one of the friendly faces at the front of a liberal to fascist pipeline. Vote Democrat but suddenly getting worried that they're going too far with trans rights? Here are the log cabin Republicans here to give you a hug, tell you it's all right, and then introduce you to some fascists
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Jun 24, 2022 20:10
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Rigel posted:If for some reason I was under an ancient voodoo curse permanently trapping me within the state of Wyoming, then I probably would switch parties for that primary to vote for the anti-insurrectionist. Yeah that's one of the big tricks with the liberal to fash pipeline Liz is a part of. You keep compromising until you're voting for the polite fascist who wants to outlaw abortion and gay marriage and start killing people but at least they only want to do it through neglect and not active pogroms so it's still "better". You get to say you're not voting for the insurrectionist and you have fascist like Liz telling you that it's good and you're good for doing it but you've also still voted for a fascist. Once someone is at the point where they're denying human rights they're not a lesser evil, they're just evil along with everyone who agrees with them even if their disagreement is about how wild they should be while denying rights. Also through Liz the party gets your info too and can keep bombarding you with fascist messaging the same way Democrats are better at getting their messaging to you when you are a party member and vote for them. Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 21:07 on Jun 24, 2022 |
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Jun 24, 2022 21:00
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PT6A posted:I really, really want to play poker with Collins and Manchin. I have a feeling it would be incredibly lucrative. You'd get fleeced if you think they actually don't realize they were being lied to.
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Jun 24, 2022 21:25
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Queering Wheel posted:I mean they're smart in the sense that they know how to obtain and wield power, but stupid in the sense that they hate women, minorities and LGBTQ+ people for no good reason and believe that angels are real The air force believes angels are real and they fly planes. Can't be stupid if you fly planes.
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Jun 24, 2022 22:04
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DarkCrawler posted:Unless you personally like them, right? No
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Jun 24, 2022 22:17
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A GIANT PARSNIP posted:poo poo we mixed up our useless performance days. If only someone had warned them about what was happening today.
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Jun 24, 2022 22:18
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Rigel posted:I don't disagree with that. The election is not that far away. If this does not fire people up and get them to decide they care about voting this time, then we have to conclude that abortion is not important. Maybe some people who don't vote might have mildly cared a little bit, but not really all that much. Why should we accept a system that allows human rights to be stripped away no matter how they're stripped? It's just endlessly frustrating to hear how bad voter suppression is out of one side of the mouth and then how voters don't vote hard enough out of the other side. Are people not voting hard enough to protect their human rights or are those rights being unconstitutionally stripped? Is this a failure of the system or is this totally acceptable if fascists get enough fascists to the ballot box? Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 04:08 on Jun 25, 2022 |
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Jun 25, 2022 04:05
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Twincityhacker posted:Because it's the current system we have, and we aren't getting a different one without a civil war. Ok, yeah that's probably going to be the outcome. I've read enough history to see what happens when you turn up the big oppression dial. Trying to hold the center together as it all comes apart has never worked yet through human history but maybe we've figured it out this time.
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Jun 25, 2022 04:13
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Grouchio posted:But who among our effete younger generations would take direct action when a mere canister of tear gas disperses a Phoenix AZ crowd? Has anyone in this country taken direct action? Was it done in 2018? Did we not perform rather well that year? Have there been any other congressmen besides AOC who are trying to fight against this with bite? I've seen nothing but whimpering in the news all day! Dude it's legitimately weird to see you here telling people they need to fight harder while telling people in the LAN thread that they shouldn't worry because they're in a blue state. Don't worry about judging people and just get out there.
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Jun 25, 2022 12:46
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Ogmius815 posted:It wouldn’t have done poo poo. This same right wing Supreme Court would have decided that Congress lacks the power to mandate legal abortion. This entire codification discourse is a red herring raised in the hope that you will overlook the plain truth that the moment to stop this came and went in November 2016. Many of the mouth breathers now blaming Obama and Biden for what 6 Supreme Court justices appointed by Republican presidents have done told us at that time that it didn’t really matter who won that election, and they need to distract people from how unbelievably wrong they were. These takes are extra insane when you remember Hilary won the popular vote and only lost because we're not a proper democracy. There isn't some contingent of leftists to point at and blame here, in any sane country she won. You live in a country who's government is actively trying to kill you and you still can't see that government as your actual enemy, it's sad.
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Jun 25, 2022 14:24
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Rigel posted:When 48 Democrats want to do something, a couple other stupid Senators refuse and would rather sit and do nothing, there is absolutely no way whatsoever to pressure them into giving in, then how would a person who is smart and educated argue that this then means that all 50 are against doing something? It's not that you're not describing reality, you are, it's that they can either call themselves a political party or they can be a vague group of people who can't be blamed as a group and have no responsibility for each other. They don't get to be both because the second one is not congruent with what a political party is.
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Jun 25, 2022 14:36
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Rigel posted:I get that busy uneducated average voters who are not political nerds and who don't know any better may be frustrated about the party, and that is a problem. You have to prove that's true before it's bad faith. Otherwise it's just a disagreement of beliefs. It seems like the party has leverage over party members and have options here. Biden is in constant negotiations with Manchin just as one example. They've gotten him to move on other legislature. He can be manipulated so they should. Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 14:45 on Jun 25, 2022 |
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Jun 25, 2022 14:43
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Rigel posted:They will switch parties, and would actually politically benefit. These are people who campaign at home promising to stand up to Schumer for Arizona/West Virginia and not let the party get everything they want. The Democrats should really not allow vocal and intentional wreckers into the party and allow them to gain positions of power. The real problem with Manchin is that he's a problem that needed to be solved years ago but instead a vocal and open wrecker was encouraged.
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Jun 25, 2022 14:49
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