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I think they've somehow managed to make the meta worse with every subsequent patch this expansion. First they immediately murdered Paladin because of how strong it was in an underdeveloped meta Then they bumped DH to the top of the heap by trying to bring down the other good decks Now it's just Reno warriors endlessly because unless you kill them by turn 7 or 8 they're going to beat you in the late game no matter what
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Apr 30, 2024 15:49
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| # ? May 21, 2024 22:59 |
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It’s just another way discover is making GBS threads up the game, instead of drawing cards and your deck mattering and maybe Highlander’s drawback being relevant, you discover whatever badda bing badda boom
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Apr 30, 2024 19:20
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kater posted:It’s just another way discover is making GBS threads up the game, instead of drawing cards and your deck mattering and maybe Highlander’s drawback being relevant, you discover whatever badda bing badda boom I’m not sure this is how HL Warriors are winning games? Scrub-Niggurath posted:Now it's just Reno warriors endlessly because unless you kill them by turn 7 or 8 they're going to beat you in the late game no matter what It’s weird to me because the last balande patch did a pretty good job at actually reasonably nerfing a bunch of power decks. That’s good! It opened up the meta a lot! But they barely touched HL Warrior, and now that’s the top of the meta. Predictably.
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Apr 30, 2024 19:31
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extremely cool that we finally had an expansion where death knight was fun and good and it got absolutely murdered because ????
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Apr 30, 2024 19:46
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Blockhouse posted:extremely cool that we finally had an expansion where death knight was fun and good and it got absolutely murdered because ???? They were able to counter Reno Warrior and that’s not allowed!!!
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Apr 30, 2024 19:54
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Sandwolf posted:I’m not sure this is how HL Warriors are winning games? They hit all the board clear but none of the lategame value. Only way to beat it now is to go under. This is why guaranteed lethality is healthy for a format
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Apr 30, 2024 20:37
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Sandwolf posted:I’m not sure this is how HL Warriors are winning games? It’s not. The idea that Highlander Warrior is some infinite value discover fiesta like Barrens Priest is completely ridiculous. The only class that currently meets that description is Mage, which is pretty much universally acknowledged to be class 11 out of 11 right now. I know people like to blame poor metas on whatever their particular bugaboo about Hearthstone is, but the anti-discover brigade needs to take a seat for now. All the powerful decks right now win with cards that started in their decks. My read of the most recent patch is that Warrior actually did get nerfed fairly severely, but this was counterbalanced by the overall power level of the format being lowered and its two big counters being taken behind the shed, so those nerfs weren’t as impactful as they might have been in a more focused “let’s deal with Warrior” type of patch. That’s the risk you run when you make huge balance changes affecting almost every class; it’s a lot of moving pieces and it’s difficult to make high-confidence changes. bravesword fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Apr 30, 2024 |
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Apr 30, 2024 23:56
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Reno warrior is being helped a lot by all of the strongest decks rising in the post-nerf format being hard aggro decks
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May 1, 2024 00:29
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I just want a card that says "end all ongoing effects". And tbh, I wish there was a way to see what ongoing affects were active on the battlefield as opposed to having to remember what permanent affects have been played 15 turns ago.
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May 1, 2024 01:28
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Has anyone found a way to make Wheel-lock work since the Big Patch? I miss that deck.
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May 4, 2024 06:56
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Love that Reno/Brann warrior has so little to fear that they now can go for some absolutely greedy poo poo like Zola, Brewmaster and Photographer Fizzle to get a bazillion bombs going and apparently no one can do a drat thing about it. Except maybe Hunter, which is unfun for an entirely different set of reasons.
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May 4, 2024 16:20
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you could always add greedy cards to a singleton deck though, because it's singleton
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May 4, 2024 16:23
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skaboomizzy posted:Has anyone found a way to make Wheel-lock work since the Big Patch? I miss that deck. The combination of the Forge nerf, Wheel delay, and Reno being removed as an option has killed that deck as anything but a meme. I've actually been having quite a bit of fun with the Hero Power/Spell Damage/Dragon Druid deck. It has a lot of wacky plays available, it can push enough damage fast enough to pressure Warrior, and it's flexible enough that it doesn't feel like there are any truly hopeless matchups. The biggest problem is that, as it's playing three different "packages" that don't have a lot of overlap, you run the risk of drawing, i.e., spell damage payoff cards without any enablers, or not enough Dragon cards to trigger all the "holding a Dragon" bonuses, but I've found this to be surprisingly uncommon. (Chia Drake feels so much less anemic as a 3/5; it's unbelievable.)
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May 4, 2024 16:48
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im ambivalent aobut the meta.. on one hand reno warrior is the undisputed king of late game between all of its removal and late game bombs, to the point where all other control decks have been obliterated; but on the other, the meta slowed enough to allow midrange shaman, hunter and druid strategies to now exist! it's alright I guess. Better than it has been for a while.
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May 4, 2024 17:11
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hearthstone is in its "you either kill enemy before turn 6 or you can concede" phase again. (unless you are brann warrior, where it's "survive until turn 7 then you win")
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May 4, 2024 17:17
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I would say the standard meta is better after the nerfs, but there are still a couple overturned Warrior cards.
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May 4, 2024 19:05
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bravesword posted:I've actually been having quite a bit of fun with the Hero Power/Spell Damage/Dragon Druid deck. It has a lot of wacky plays available, it can push enough damage fast enough to pressure Warrior, and it's flexible enough that it doesn't feel like there are any truly hopeless matchups. The biggest problem is that, as it's playing three different "packages" that don't have a lot of overlap, you run the risk of drawing, i.e., spell damage payoff cards without any enablers, or not enough Dragon cards to trigger all the "holding a Dragon" bonuses, but I've found this to be surprisingly uncommon. (Chia Drake feels so much less anemic as a 3/5; it's unbelievable.) Agreed, I love this deck. Aviana gives it at least a fighting chance when games go long, too. Feels like it has a good matchup spread.
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May 4, 2024 19:51
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It's 2015, and Brann was a mistake. It's 2022, and Brann was a mistake. It's 2024, and Brann was a mistake.
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May 4, 2024 23:09
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I will argue that Brann was perfectly harmless his first time through Standard, which is why they thought it was reasonably safe to reprint him in the first place. The most damage he was doing in the Year of the Kraken was, what? Antique Healbot? OG Kazakus? Coldlight Oracle? C’Thun? Jades? He was strong, but he was mostly a value multiplier for strategies that were hoping the game would go long. However, by the time he was put in the Core Set during the Year of the Hydra, that was no longer the case, and he was being used in conjunction with mana cheat like Wildheart Guff and Kael’thelas Sinstrider and huge damage battlecries like Astalor and Denathrius to do OTKs. If the worst Brann could do was double up on your School Teachers or whatever, he wouldn’t have been nearly as much of an issue. bravesword fucked around with this message at 23:50 on May 4, 2024 |
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May 4, 2024 23:48
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Bran is great Odin is the mistake
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May 4, 2024 23:53
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Odyn has seen precisely zero play since he got nerfed, and yet Warrior is still the format-defining deck, so I think you’re wrong
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May 4, 2024 23:56
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I think the bad-feeling card in Warrior is Boomboss. If that was changed in some way, Warrior would be pretty much fine.
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May 5, 2024 00:30
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The problem is the lack of lethality in the format. If you could OTK the warrior then they wouldn't be able to sit around and milk all that value. But they killed wheel so oh well.
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May 5, 2024 00:38
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bravesword posted:I will argue that Brann was perfectly harmless his first time through Standard, which is why they thought it was reasonably safe to reprint him in the first place. The most damage he was doing in the Year of the Kraken was, what? Antique Healbot? OG Kazakus? Coldlight Oracle? C’Thun? Jades? This is a good point, and it feeds into another point that makes Control Warrior so annoying right now: there are only two pieces of permanent hand disruption in Standard right now, and both of them are significantly better when you double their battlecries. I get why they included Dirty Rat in the core set this year, since Brann is the kind of card it was designed to counter, but so many ways to deal with Warrior as a control deck hinge on playing specific minions that it just gets filthy. As for Boomboss, everyone already knows how nuts that is. Ultimately, the problem is that Warrior is the control deck with the best removal suite and the easiest ways to win the game and has the best disruption. If you can knock out one of those legs, other control decks might be able to beat it at some point.
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May 5, 2024 01:04
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Heroic Yoshimitsu posted:I think the bad-feeling card in Warrior is Boomboss. If that was changed in some way, Warrior would be pretty much fine. T. N.T. should randomly destroy a card on board OR in hand OR in deck. Still annoying, still disruptive, but no longer game ending. With it switching to shuffling into the opponent's deck, it just self-accelerates the effect by thinning out the deck, cascading until there is nothing left. Or allow it to destroy other T. N.T.s. to reign it in.
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May 5, 2024 03:32
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1-Brann's effect is too powerful for "rest of the game". The difference between Brann on T6 or T20 is massive in deck quality. This leads to the bad kind of RNG where a match is decided by whether he was drawn early or not. Compare him to any other current highlander card and the only one that is somewhat close in long-term value is Rhaestraza, but even that doesn't feel as hopeless and can also be countered by Reno. 2- Only ways to deal with Brann are "Kill them before they play him", which is a poo poo mechanic in a random ladder, or dirty rat, which is too unreliable. 3-Original Brann was always held back by needing to be on the board, which limited him by mana or by the body itself being in danger. Usually (in the old days) you'd get 1-2 battlecries and then he'd die immediately after, or else the game was pretty much over. With current Brann that's not a thing anymore because once they play him they can do whatever they like. Obviously they have to survive losing T6, but Warrior is probably the best equipped classed to do so.
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May 5, 2024 04:47
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As long as high cost Legendaries exist that are primarily based on their Battlecry, (especially those that are functionally 'From here on, your win chance just spiked like gently caress) and Brann exists, Brann will continue to be a problem. Whether that's Boomboss, Denathrius or Odyn, you'll just shuffle the problem around.
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May 5, 2024 05:23
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Heroic Yoshimitsu posted:I think the bad-feeling card in Warrior is Boomboss. If that was changed in some way, Warrior would be pretty much fine. I agree and this post seems quite well thought out. If be surprised if it didn't see a nerf quite soon. https://www.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/1cibhz8/boomboss_is_by_far_the_main_problem_with_brann/
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May 5, 2024 07:13
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change boomboss to deathrattle edit: while boomboss might be the problem right now, if he's nerfed and brann remains they'll almost certainly need to do more brann-related nerfs in the future (or hold back when it comes to designing new battlecries) peer fucked around with this message at 12:15 on May 5, 2024 |
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May 5, 2024 12:12
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While in theory I like the Highlander change so that you NEED to build your deck with no duplicates to get their effects, I kinda wish it was something like “if your deck started with no duplicates and currently has no duplicates”, that way there would a at least be something the opponent could do to disrupt them. Maybe that’d be too harsh of a condition then?
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May 5, 2024 13:47
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Yeah, that’s the worst of both worlds. You have to build your deck to accommodate the restriction but it can still be easily disabled. Other than Warrior, Highlander decks were dead as a doornail before the last patch because Plagues were so popular.
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May 5, 2024 16:25
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I just think it's silly that warrior's reno class card is essentially an "every turn for the rest of the game you have a massive advantage" effect, while the other classes get a good swing card, a disruption card, a stats bomb, and a permanent free copy of a minion None of the other Reno cards come close to the same power level
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May 5, 2024 16:43
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Hot take: the biggest issue with Control Warrior isn't Reno. It's that Warrior is the only class that can get to high enough life totals so that combo decks can't finish them off. Normally if a hard-control deck got too popular something would be able to come up as a hard-counter, but because it's Warrior the only potential way to beat it is to race damage before they get their inevitable wincons online. Every single lifegain card in the class is never offline, there's a ton of games where the Warrior accidentally ends up at 50+ life from just cycling cards/hero power.
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May 5, 2024 16:48
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As someone who is playing Dummy Warrior, Safety Goggles feels like it shouldn't have been printed.
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May 5, 2024 17:22
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"For the rest of the game" with no way to dispel is poo poo mechanic.
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May 5, 2024 17:55
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bravesword posted:Yeah, that’s the worst of both worlds. You have to build your deck to accommodate the restriction but it can still be easily disabled. Highlander decks were not dead as a door nail last patch, not even close, this Brann Warrior deck was consolidated in that time period. It’s crazy to me they saw Plagues and Highlander Warrior and said “these plagues are too strong”
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May 5, 2024 18:04
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Szarrukin posted:"For the rest of the game" with no way to dispel is poo poo mechanic. I think it would be ok if the effect wasn't so powerful. New or OG Raza come to mind.
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May 5, 2024 18:45
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I said "other than Warrior" right there in the quote you posted. As for the other classes, you saw Reno more from Wheel Warlocks and non-Highlander Warriors and Druids than you saw from dedicated Highlander in Demon Hunter, Druid, Paladin, Priest, or Shaman -- you know, the designated Highlander classes. That's an issue!
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May 5, 2024 18:47
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bravesword posted:I said "other than Warrior" right there in the quote you posted. As for the other classes, you saw Reno more from Wheel Warlocks and non-Highlander Warriors and Druids than you saw from dedicated Highlander in Demon Hunter, Druid, Paladin, Priest, or Shaman -- you know, the designated Highlander classes. That's an issue! Fair enough, but other than HL Shaman I don’t see any of those other HL decks anymore either. I suspect we’re only seeing HL Shaman because Nature Shaman died as well
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May 5, 2024 18:49
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| # ? May 21, 2024 22:59 |
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Just for something not involving Brann, I've been having some fun with this in Wild. ### mechadin # Class: Paladin # Format: Wild # # 2x (1) Drone Deconstructor # 2x (1) Frequency Oscillator # 2x (1) Glow-Tron # 2x (1) Skaterbot # 2x (2) Galvanizer # 2x (2) Instrument Tech # 2x (2) Noble Minibot # 2x (2) Radar Detector # 2x (3) Prosthetic Hand # 1x (3) SN1P-SN4P # 2x (3) Stonehearth Vindicator # 2x (4) Goldwing # 2x (4) Painter's Virtue # 2x (5) Wargear # 1x (5) Zilliax # 1x (7) The Leviathan # 1x (0) Zilliax Deluxe 3000 # 1x (0) Zilliax Deluxe 3000 # 1x (5) Perfect Module # 1x (5) Ticking Module # AAEBAYsWBKCAA5+3A7CyBMekBg2f9QLW/gLX/gL5pATa0wSEpQW4xQXZ0AWG/gW5/gXKngbQqQbMsAYAAQP2swbHpAb3swbHpAbt3gbHpAYAAA== # # To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone You want to mulligan as hard as you can for the brush, radar detector, the tutors, and probably a galvaniser. Idea is basically just flood boards with sticky mechs while you build up insane magnetic bots and then send it all face when you have lethal. It's not gonna be some meta tyrant, but it is fun to slam 50 into someone. Olpainless fucked around with this message at 20:33 on May 5, 2024 |
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May 5, 2024 20:21
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