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HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
To chime in - last time I played was around 6 years ago. My memory of the story was non-existent, and rather than try to pick up on (what was when I played last) a maxed out char, I just started a new character.

My Comparisons between Now and When I Played Last:

- leveling feels a LOT faster - particularly at the beginning of the game. Just rushing MSQ & Job Quests, you can get to 30 in maybe 3 hours? (this is without Road to 70, or whatever that buff is - does that still exist?)

- combat feels a lot easier. I can recall dying occasionally during some MSQ Duty I tried being a few levels too low. But now? I'm not sure I have ever even been in any real danger of dying. My attacks hit harder, and things die quickly.

- related to the above: when just walking from place to place, enemies seem a lot more docile than I recall - like their enemy detection/aggression has been decreased. I can definitely remember sections of the MSQ where just walking to the rendezvous meant aggroing 3-4 annoying enemies you had to kill so you could activate the widget. This time, have only seen that happen for that one ARC quest where you look for that poacher in the Qirin camp.

- the addition of NPCs for MSQ dungeons is my new favorite thing. The only one I was unable to get past using NPCs was Ifrit, on a Summoner. You can't tell the NPCs to specifically target anything, so when the Nail or whatever comes out, I couldn't ever DPS it down fast enough by myself. I did fine against Ifrit on every other Job I have tried so far (CNJ, MAR and ARC). I was even testing to see how large of a pull they can handle (since you are handling the pulls yourself), and you can practically wall pull most places and do just fine with NPCs. But no more waiting in the queue to progress MSQ? Sign me up! 5/5 stars.

- your biggest annoyance early game will consist of one thing: getting from A to B. SO. MUCH. WALKING. Auto-run and Sprint are your friends here. Teleports will be expensive early game, compared to the size of your gil. However, as soon as your gil hits mid 4-digits (4k-6k), you can start using teleports as freely as you like - your wallet will be able to keep up from that point on. And when you get to 30 drop everything and unlock your mount.

- You will save yourself a lot of time if - every time you reach a new city, you run around and unlock ALL the Aethernet Shards. Early MSQ can be fetch/deliver this message quest HELL, and spending 5 minutes running around unlocking all the fast travels before you do anything else will save you a lot of time. You also automatically get fast travel to any of the city's exits by unlocking all the Shards, so, prioritize it, since early MSQ be like "go west of the city and kill 3 X".

- rotations in general feel....less complicated than I recall. I played WHM back in the day, and was hesitant to start over as a Healer since the endgame rotation was complex, but I finally did make an ARC and even that felt easier. THM/BLM feels easier than I recall as well. Not sure if things have been simplified or my memory is just fuzzy.

- early MSQ definitely feels like "Babby's First RPG" in places. More than one quest of "take this thing to 3 people within 10 yards of here, then come back", tho I have to say - the New Player Experience feels.....smoother somehow? Maybe it's the differences in combat, I dunno.

Anyway, there's my 2 bits. I am having a lot of fun. I am hoping I don't get sucked in deep like last time, but if I'm being honest - I'm not hoping that hard. ;)

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HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

Xerophyte posted:

To answer a couple of your questions:
- Road to 80 is still a thing and will further accelerate your xp, but only if you make your character on a preferred world. It's honestly not a very big deal, but nice if you want to switch between more jobs as you level.

Ah okay. I looked for preferred world across a coupla data centers but never saw one.

That does raise another question, tho: so when people are talking about leveling two jobs - what are they doing? Do you swap to the lower leveled one until it passes the other, then switch again?

quote:

- Difficulty depends. ARR is certainly easier, mostly due to the xp increase making players higher level than the content on average. ARR and HW have also had the more significant dungeon and trial revamps in order to support AI friends. StB and beyond aren't much different, although the old max level content gets outscaled harder than it used to since most people will be synced down to it. I don't believe mobs have different aggro behavior; you just tend to be higher level and potentially flying.

Yeah I hadn't thought about the level thing. That's likely it, since I have been consistently overleveled for MSQ since lvl 20, I'd guess. So things probably aren't aggroing, since i'm overleveled for the area.

quote:

- Job rotations at lower levels are generally easier. Revamps have seen the removal of various low level skills, cross class skills, the extra healer dots, etc. Rotations at max level is the most complex it's ever been. I'd argue even for healers who do have fewer dps buttons but get a lot of misc defensive cooldowns to optimize instead (healers are easier than ever when outside extreme, savage and ultimate as a result). BLMs are generally an exception: they have never been the subject of a revamp and do their historic rotations in each expansion still. You shouldn't be seeing much of a difference apart from some niche buttons like apocatastasis and cross class skills being gone.

Sorry, I should have mentioned. I have only played BLM up to around 45 or so? So not familiar with the endgame rotation at all. Not sure why it feels easier - maybe I just don't remember it because stooooooooooner.

I had only maxed WHM.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
So am I completely misremembering, or did The Praetorium => Ultimate Weapon sequence at the end of ARR used to be an 8-man?

Am I just remembering a different duty?

At any rate, reached the end of ARR as a Ninja. Once again- NPCs for story dungeons are my new favorite feature. By like a million.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
k so got a coupla questions.

Last time I played I didn't really mess around with DoH/DoL stuff at all.

General advice I am seeing more than one place is: level ALL of them at once. Totally get it. Get materials for crafting job from gathering job, etc.

But from a more practical standpoint: are they saying I should visit every guild and do the opening job quest, then just switch between jobs as needed?

And the real question: should I wait until level cap to do this? I am only just past ARR (like 52-53ish)

I see that the quickest way to level them (over 30) is via The Diadem? When does access to that unlock?

TIA

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
Did I somehow block out the memory of this interminable post-ARR section of CONSTANT "go talk to this guy" quests that give like 2 thousand xp apiece, when I need around half a mil to level up??

I just unlocked wherever Iceheart or whoever is. How close am I to the game getting interesting again?

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

Orcs and Ostriches posted:

The 2.4/2.5 patches, that you're currently on, get pretty decent. Things are happening and there are actual characters.

Once the 2.5 patches are done you'll be in Heavensward proper, which has a lot of new stuff, but actually starts off pretty slow again as it introduces the cast and locations, so unfortunately it's not a straight rise from where you are.

Yeah I played a few years back to the then-current level cap was 80. I just didn't remember such a LONG rear end sequence of "talk to this guy" things, including a straight up repeat of going to all the memorial services in early MSQ. Feels weird like they ran out of ideas for 6-8 hours of playtime.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
So the Crystal Tower stuff used to be a side quest, yes?

I remember doing the first raid back in the day but definitely had never done either of the other two.

Honestly kind of sucks making people wait 3 trips through the DF just to advance MSQ. Not sure I had a wait time under 10 mins and I’m a Tank.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

girl dick energy posted:

Not unless they dramatically overhaul how they teach newer players actual raid mechanics.

Have been thinking about the New Player Experience a lot this time around, since it had been long enough ago (3-4 years) since I had played at all, that I felt like a new player.

I'm not sure I went through the Training Hall stuff last time around, but it at least does teach some basic mechanics. I feel like it should be expanded into more specialized guides for DPS/Tank/Healer, since in particular as a Healer/Tank - it doesn't really teach you anything about your actual job.

Seems like it would be easy enough to have one for say - Tank - that teaches to face a boss away from the party. Throw up something that cleaves a lot, and if you don't turn it around it kills your party and you fail. Could do that with most Raid mechanics. "Use your Mitigation before this Tankbuster lands". "After the Tank gets hit with a Tankbuster, Heal them back up to full, etc." "when you see these arrows, it's going to push you back - get close enough you don't go over the edge". Could do these for stack markers, "don't let the circles overlap" and some of the other common mechanics.

They could even unlock those Training missions when you hit lvl 30 and switch to your actual Job.

At any rate, before I do a dungeon in DF that's new, I always watch a video guide so I understand what the mechanics are, due to a crippling fear of being "the guy who causes us to wipe". Most of the time I probably could have gotten by without seeing a video first, but like - the bit in the 2nd Crystal Tower raid with the Orbs of different colors, and having to drag some of them to the circles, and others are Ice so you just avoid those, etc. - would have had NO idea what was going on at all. Also fighting - Cerberus? - with all that stuff about "if there are an odd number of players, or if it's divisible by three then....." like...."what?"

But yes - they definitely need a better way to introduce raid mechanics.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
I just recalled 2 other things I wanted to ask, one mechanical, and one lore-related.

First - should I be messing with Materia yet? I just got my first IV ones but have never used any, because I figure where I am (WAR 52) armor is going to be changing fast enough to not bother. Am I completely missing out here and running around like a chump? What I mean by armor changing is - nearly every new Dungeon I run results in one piece of new gear better than what I have on, so pieces are getting swapped out fairly quickly.

and Second - what race are the E-Sennas and E-Sumi-Yan? They aren't Au Ra, are they? is there some other "humanoid with horns" race we hear about somewhere?

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

iPodschun posted:

There are weird mechanics during ARR as you've noted but generally they don't mean much anymore and nothing like that will come up again. In that Syrcus Tower boss, if you don't bring a lightning orb to the tower then some people take like 200 damage. Fight design gets much better after ARR and the things you learn carry over more to other fights.

Yeah I did notice that it didn't seem like a big deal when something raidwide did go off when it wasn't supposed to.

I am hoping more things carry over between fights. I am quite enjoying Tanking, tho at one point during Syrcus, I was main Tanking, and I just.....died. Like - I didn't see what happened at all. It even took me a second to notice I went down. So - other than weird things like that happening, I am starting to feel more competent as a Tank.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

Doomykins posted:

What were you tanking? If you're including World of Darkness as part of Syrcus then the giant eyeball uses Doom, the silent sprout killer. Cerberus also has an instant kill trigger if you stand in his feeding puddle without being Mini.

It was not Cerberus, so it must have been the eyeball - which does lead me to another question I had: when there's an attack like that you have to face away from, what exactly does it mean to "face away"? Like do they mean I need to unlock (if targeted), and turn my character away? Or do I need to rotate the camera so the attack is offscreen when it hits? I feel like I have been experimenting with both but not really arrived at a definitive answer on my own.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

Mr. Nice! posted:

It has to do with which way your character is facing. I use legacy controls, so I just press s to turn around and look away.

I will have to see if there's a shortcut for that on console.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
Hey what’s the deal with like individual, named monsters which are level 50?

I tried fighting one at 50, and got wrecked.

Even at lvl 61, I can barely make a dent in them.
Didn’t recall ever seeing them back in the day.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
So as I reached the end of Heavensward (this time), and when whoever it was had the bright idea to just toss Nidhogg's eyes off a cliff (instead of like - somewhere SAFE and guarded), I was like "that's dumb. Like super dumb." Lock in a vault? Toss them into lava? Seal into a lead container and toss it in the ocean, but not just "I'm sure no one will find it if we just toss it off this bridge". C'mon, son! I mean what's the bridge spanning? An infinite abyss? Even if you tossed it off of a cliff in Sea of Clouds - it still has to land SOMEWHERE right?

So now I just finished Baelsar's Wall, and I was right. Extra dumb. Even dumber since Papalymo had to die because of that stupid decision.

In short - writers - please stop having your characters do willfully stupid things, when you have previously spent many HOURS convincing me they are reasonably smart, careful people. There's no satisfaction in the resolution. This was not a "noble sacrifice" it was "character has to pay for the stupid mistake that no one would ever ACTUALLY do earlier."

That is all.

Wait. Was it Alphinaud's idea? Not that surprising, since he complains about the cold in Ishgard literally the first time he arrives there, and several other times throughout HW, yet never buys a loving COAT. So I guess I already knew he wasn't that smart.

But I can't recall if it was him or Aymeric who was like "quick! toss into the Abyss".

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
I guess I just started Stormblood. Weird because I thought I had. I saw credits for Heavensward and assumed that was it. Took another 3-4 hours of playtime before I saw "Stormblood" appear.

Also: I would have liked to see some people who made my poo poo List get a proper comeuppance. The two most glaring:

First - the guy who killed Harchefant. Really? Not even a quick flash at the end of the battle of me planting my axe in his chest with a "that was for my boy Harche, dick!"

Second, I feel like Ilberd didn't suffer an actual consequences either. He had been preaching the entire time about how he was willing to die to retake Ala Mhigo. So in the end, not only does he (in his own mind at least) become a martyr for the cause, his whole plan was to start a war with the Garleans, and he basically gets that too.

Supes unsatisfying.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

JainDoh posted:

so I've played through the latest expansion for the story, mostly solo, and never really raided. If I came back, are there goon orgs active I could join or is everyone in their own thing these days?

There are Goon FCs. Check the first post or two of the thread.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
FFXIV has nearly as many New Player Experience problems as Destiny 2.

Maybe a year ago I got a friend who had never played D2 to download and we partied up to run him thru the first few bits. All he kept saying is "I have no idea what's going on at all, so just tell me what to shoot", because it's SO much information at once. Sucks because it meant he missed out on what is a pretty interesting story because of how the game presents it. FFXIV also gives you a LOT all at once.

Even playing the second time around (just killed Xenos), there are gigantic portions of things I completely forgot because just: too much information at once. I suppose once games are around for that long, and have years of lore built up, it's difficult to figure out how to drop someone who has never heard any of it into the game, because it's difficult to make it NOT feel like you are drinking from the firehose.

The Smith's stuff you can do at the beginning to get that one ring should be expanded out to include some of the more common dungeon mechanics: Tank Busters, Stacks, Circle Markers, etc.

Not really a new player problem, but - I think leveling Alt jobs should be different. If I was in charge, I think the XP boost for Alt Jobs should be greater, as long as they are under the level of your current MSQ, or under the level of your highest Job. Leveling an Alt job shouldn't feel as grindy as it does. Class Quests and Hunting logs should basically get me there just as fast as I got there when I was also doing MSQ. 1-35 or so goes pretty fast, then it slows down for 36-40, but holy poo poo does 41-50 suck so hard. That grind feels ENDLESS.

Another problem I think about how I'd solve is jobs that start at like 50 are so clunky to try and level, because you hit roulette and get sync'd down to 16 for Sastasha, and have no idea what your buttons do at that point because you just got lvl 50's skills all at once, haven't learned THOSE yet, and now most of them are disabled anyway.

It's weird. Maybe have a job available after 50, but the job itself starts lower so you can learn it as you go up, instead of "here are all your lvl 50 skills at once, but now let's take away a bunch because you sync'd down".

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

Vitamean posted:

Singling this out because it's such an interesting topic to me.
omg samesies.

quote:

After they added the Hall of the Novice, people started asking the devs to add some sort of "Hall of the Intermediates" or something that would teach more advanced party mechanics like the ones you mentioned. The devs acknowledged that people wanted it, but never committed on adding anything to the game.

I like what they've done instead, which is just to introduce those mechanics earlier through the recent ARR dungeon reworks. The reworks were primarily done in service to adding duty support NPCs, but it also allowed them to go back and give bosses markers that were developed waaaay later in the game. My two favorite examples are stack markers and tankbuster markers.

  • It used to be the first mandatory stack marker a player would see is in the 3.3 trial. The marker itself was first seen in the 3.1 alliance raid, and there were stack mechanics before, but if you were someone who just pounded out the MSQ you wouldn't see it til then.
  • Tankbuster markers are more recent, coming in hot in the first Nier raid. I didn't even track when they started adding them to the MSQ, but at least by 6.0 you should've run into one in the MSQ.

A key thing about these things coming in earlier is that they're a lot more forgiving as you're first seeing them. A DPS can take an ARR tankbuster raw if for whatever reason the tank dies, getting hit by ground telegraphs does negligible damage, and you don't need all four people in a stack marker if one or two people are frolicking out in the fields. It also just helps the information stick better than someone going into a training instance for 10 minutes and just being given a rundown of basic combat markers.

Man, I'm a little surprised at how hard they nerfed ARR, and even the HW/StB stuff has been easier than I recall. As I was running the first part of Castrum Abania last night, I got a phone call I needed to take, and since I was playing with NPCs, who cares, so I just hit mute and talked on the phone. But I got curious as to how long it would take me to die if I did absolutely nothing (as a WAR). At one pull with 6 enemies, I kept thinking this was it, but nope. On the next pull - 5 enemies this time, I had to gather everyone in one place, so that ALL the AoEs - aimed directly at me or not - would hit me, and the last 2 enemies remaining finally got me. And again - only because I positioned myself to deliberately take more damage. Pretty sure unless you do a HUGE double pull and then do nothing, it's downright difficult to get killed in Solo content. Even more hilarious is if you DO get killed, there's a Very Easy option to try again - tripling your health/damage.

I can recall the first time I played (StB was the latest at the time), dying a lot more often - particularly to overworld stuff like Hunting Logs. Since I too live in fear of being "that guy", before I Tank something for the first time I will watch a video. But nearly every time I do, I watch and go "so the usual: hit things, don't stand in colors on the floor, pick up adds when they spawn. got it." and think I won't bother for the next one, because of how easy everything has been. (I always forget and watch a video anyway, because stoooooooner).

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

404notfound posted:

I understand the basics like dragging the boss to the center of the arena and pointing them away from the party, but is there a guide to how I should cycle my mitigations (which one is good for what application, when to stack them, etc.)? Or how to get a feel for how much I can pull vs. how much my healer can handle?

Actually sounds like you have most of it. I would disagree with always pulling a boss to the center, as I can think of one case where that is BAD to do*. So my simple list of Tank rules would be:

- turn bosses away from party (and pull to whatever the best location is)
- pick up adds (depending. in an 8-man, definitely pick them up if you are the off-tank. If you have good DPS, sometimes the adds go down faster than you can pick them up)
- when the pull is done - STOP MOVING. My two mains are WAR and SCH, so I know this from the Healer side as well. Once you have aggro'd everything, pick a spot and STOP. If there are ranged enemies - right on top of them is a good option. It's hard for other folks to get positionals, or even finish casting if you keep moving all over the place as a tank. The only dodge in the game is automatic, so you don't need to bounce around. Stack enemies up so everyone's AoEs hit, and swing for the fences.
- keep an eye on the enemy list, and if you lose aggro, be sure to retarget and pick up whatever you lost, since it's probably attacking the Healer now.

Only other real nuance to pulling that I have noticed is: I have seen Tanks who like - leave the current fight when the last enemy is almost down, taking off to start the next pull. To me this always make things feel really sloppy- and also a bit relentless- due to a lack of breaking point between fights, I guess? Plus, a big enough pull is a tough fight. Nothing wrong with waiting till everything is down and everyone gets a breath before starting the next. But eh - I don't feel strongly enough to be mad about it - just something I have noticed which differs from my own preferences as Tank or Healer.

As for the last question? Depends greatly on the healer. Just pull. If you die - that was too much. ;). The penalty for wiping is basically nothing. If I am running a super early dungeon that probably has sprout Healers, then I just say in chat something like: "I'm gonna pull big, if it's too much, lmk" and have only had one occasion where a Healer asked me to slow down when I was wall pulling.





* I think it's one of the now mandatory Crystal Tower runs? There's a boss that moves back to the center for an insta-kill raidwide, which you can only avoid by standing in safe spots on the edge of the arena. But since he goes back to the center before casting it, you have to pull him away from the center to give everyone time to get to the safe spots.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
What am I missing in this quest The Will Of The Moon in the cutscene hell between StB and ShB?

You have to fight the angry au’ra girl as yourself then you have to fight the Sunboy au’ra as Y’shtola.

At some point during the latter section Hien goes down and asks you to heal him, but I am unable to target him at that point and don’t have an AoE heal.

I tried just burning down Sunboy AFAP but I don’t do anywhere near enough damage.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

HaB posted:

What am I missing in this quest The Will Of The Moon in the cutscene hell between StB and ShB?

You have to fight the angry au’ra girl as yourself then you have to fight the Sunboy au’ra as Y’shtola.

At some point during the latter section Hien goes down and asks you to heal him, but I am unable to target him at that point and don’t have an AoE heal.

I tried just burning down Sunboy AFAP but I don’t do anywhere near enough damage.

Quoting myself in case someone runs into the same issue:

Check your Targeting Filters

I had NPCs off in my Duty filter, since it's rare you need to target them, and some duties have a million of them I'd rather not have to cycle through.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
So my new Least Favorite Thing this time around is: when I am forced during a Solo Duty to play as one of the other characters.

NONE of those have been the least bit fun, or interesting. Best-case scenario they are boring. They have to dumb-down the NPCs toolkit to 4-5 buttons so you're not thrown into a new Job with 20 buttons to sort out, but that makes it boring to play, and then sometimes you get a "press then button when I say so" action - for "excitement".

Awful.

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
I am a controller player, so I Comm whoever is still left. If there's more than one - best portrait gets it.

But usually by the time I have tabbed over to the Comm button, most of the party has left. :(

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
Why?

Why did they persist in carrying forward the "spot random blob on landscape with telescope then press button" missions?

I think the ONLY one was kind of fun was sniping guards with sleeping darts or whatever it was in Doma.

Did the FF16 event this morning, and even it has one. Does anyone actually enjoy these?

HaB fucked around with this message at 15:28 on Apr 11, 2024

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?

YggiDee posted:

it is incredibly playable with controller, there are so many settings and tweaks to smooth everything out. might still want a keyboard for chat though

Yeah, it's nice. It takes some settings tweaking, and finding a button layout that makes sense for you, but after that it's great.

There are lots of guides on controller setups on YouTube. That should give you enough to tell what it might play like.

I should point out that FFXIV is the ONLY MMO I have ever played, and I have only ever played on a controller, which I'm sure colors my perception.

Would say that a kb is mandatory to chat, tho. The software kb is useless for any longer than "gg"

HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
Got a story question, post ShB, pre-EW:


If Thancred broke his magic gland or whatever and could no longer manipulate aether, how was he able to transfer his Soul/Memories to that crystal to travel back to the Source?

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HaB
Jan 5, 2001

What are the odds?
So I am confused about World/Data Center travel.

I guess my question is: does it help with DF queue times if you travel somewhere crowded?

A friend seems to think it does not, but I can't think of any other good reasons to actually do it if it doesn't help.

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