|
WaltherFeng posted:I used strategy Ive been using since RE1 which is killing everything that takes too much effort to avoid or is clearly in a corridor you'll be returning to often. (And got the so called bad ending I guess). I did the same thing and got Leave which is I assume what people consider to be the "bad" ending, and IMO I sort of agree with it being bad, both from a story and actual design perspective if I'm being honest (obviously ending/full game spoilers) This is mostly because Signalis runs an awful lot off of Vibes considering the dream logic atmosphere of the story and the Vibes I had got from my hours of play is that Elster is a focused, determined individual who is going to find the person she was looking for because Goddamnit I Made A Promise and gently caress anything and anyone in the way. Getting pushed down an elevator won't stop her. Losing an arm won't stop her. Even dying clearly doesn't stop her. All of five minutes before the actual ending she loses an eye and coldly shoots her aggressor before walking off to finish what she started. That was the Elster the game had spent literally the entire time presenting to me and so for her to give up and leave to die alone outside at the very end unfortunately rang false to me. I can see how that ending could work given the story and the characters, because what Elster has promised to do is, to her, something horrible. Even in Promise, she can barely do it. Still, she's already had to go through a lot of horrible poo poo up to that point, and I did not think the game laid enough groundwork to make the end payoff of her running away land properly. This feeling was compounded by then looking up the other endings on YT and concluding that the other endings seemed to fit a lot better with the rest of the game as presented. Then I find the gameplay breakdown of how endings get calculated and get a little peeved at the idea that I got the ending I got by playing too well. Oh, I avoided combat, I avoided getting hurt, I talked to all the NPCs, I poked around all the memories, and by engaging with the game as presented I get a dissatisfying ending. The spell the game had over me broke a little at that point when it became apparent that what I thought was thematically appropriate and what the designers thought clearly differed. All that said, while objectively I don't like the ending I got it was a completely trivial thing to review the other endings, conclude that to me, one specific one rang the most true, and make that my head canon ending. The game is designed from the ground up to invite - nearly require - personal interpretation anyway!
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2023 17:35
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 9, 2024 16:13 |
|
|
I got Promise ending on my first playthrough and after looking up every other ending afterwards, the one I got was the one I liked most.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2023 17:41
|
|
|
I mixed up Leave and Memory endings. I got the Memory ending and I thought it was pretty satisfying because of the obvious implications about the time loop
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2023 18:07
|
|
|
The only minor negative point I have when it comes to Signalis is the fact that it's story boils down to "it was all a dream" and I'm not really a fan of that. It was still an emotionally satisfying story but after I've beaten the game I've spent months trying to analyze the story and try to figure out a different conclusion but in the end that was the only thing that fit. 10/10 otherwise, and it's not really a flaw, more of a personal preference really. I would really like to see another game explore this setting though.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2023 18:13
|
|
|
Looper posted:i know the inventory limit was by far the most common complaint about this game by an incredible margin but i still can't help but feel bummed the devs didn't stick to their guns after all the work they did to mesh that limit with the setting Haha, I was feeling this exact way, strangely enough. I really had a bee in my bonnet when I played Signalis about the inventory limit, especially in regards to the flashlight and eidetic module taking up slots. Nevertheless, the game was cool and interesting enough that I stuck with it, mostly because I understood it was likely trying to get you to think about resurrecting enemies and just picking up items as necessary instead of hoarding. You'd think I would've liked the decision they made to address the inventory limit, and I am somewhat, but I couldn't help but feel a bit let-down that they acquiesced as it implies that it might've been much less important and intentional as a design decision than I thought. I generally like devs to stick to their guns if they make controversial decisions, because I assume there is some intentionality in that choice, and that creates a much more unique experience than everything getting watered down by committee. I swear it isn't the typical 'I suffered, so you have to suffer' mentality! FutureCop fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Oct 27, 2023 |
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2023 18:20
|
|
|
Jack Trades posted:The only minor negative point I have when it comes to Signalis is the fact that it's story boils down to "it was all a dream" and I'm not really a fan of that. Even though that might be the case we learn a lot of interesting stuff that could really cool to explore in a sequel.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2023 18:23
|
|
|
WaltherFeng posted:Even though that might be the case we learn a lot of interesting stuff that could really cool to explore in a sequel. The worldbuilding is loving incredible, yeah. It's the actual chain of events that I find less appealing, because in the end it seems to be not much more than a dying person's jumbled up memories. At least that's the only conclusion I managed to reach. I didn't manage to make any sense of the secret ending or find anyone else's theory that managed to make any sense of the secret ending though.
|
|
#
?
Oct 27, 2023 18:28
|
|
|
Jack Trades posted:The only minor negative point I have when it comes to Signalis is the fact that it's story boils down to "it was all a dream" and I'm not really a fan of that. After also reading/watching a bunch of people talk about the story, I feel like it's sorta different than the game being entirely a dream, that in the universe of the game is completely fictional. To keep it broad, I think that the main events of the game did happen. We know that psychic powers can be insanely powerful (terraforming entire planets). And there clearly was/is something going on with that weird artifact. So there are things that are dreams, or dream-like, but I think the idea is that they're bleeding over into reality. This also being how events can affect things in other timelines (endings).
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2023 14:01
|
|
|
I kind of felt like that was one of the big strengths of the game, the meshing. That everything was dream like and weird and there's this loop going on but also that it all definitely happened in material reality.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2023 16:30
|
|
|
Yeah, in this world there is no "dream or real" because there is no line there to choose a side to be on. Characters can impose their mental model of the world on the lived experience of others. There is no underlying reality the dream is masking that you could theoretically return to, so there's no way to "wake up" and make the events of the game un-happen
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2023 17:06
|
|
|
Ending stuff I normally don't like "its all a dream" because it often eradicates any consequence. But due to how Signalis is set up this is not the case. The dreaming is happening precisely because of what happened. And it doesn't invalidate the main character's goal either. And then there's the puzzle in the shape of the twisted lens the story and lore is presented through. If anything, Signalis would've been weaker if it did not have the dreaming aspect. For me, Signalis and Bloodborne are prime examples of how dreams should be used. And how deliberately the story puzzle is maddingly unsolvable(assuming you're trying to literally make sense of every detail) is very King of Yellow.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2023 19:23
|
|
|
Did they at least change the propaganda poster from 6 to 8 when you pick that setting?
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2023 19:27
|
|
|
Haha no that stays as is.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2023 19:38
|
|
|
Jack Trades posted:The worldbuilding is loving incredible, yeah. Ending speculation: Just because the origin of what happens lies in Ariane's dreams does not necessarily mean the events are. Bioresonance is described as having the potential for powerful reality manipulation. The empress terraformed a planet with it, and Ariane may be unknowingly just as or even more powerful than her. And then there's the whole eye thing which may be an actual literal god messing around. It is not inconceivable that by some means Elster was genuinely transported to the actual station, and the people there are having an extremely bad time as Ariane turns everything into cancer. And even if not, it's strongly implied e.g. through Adler that the people you encounter are very real people with interior lives and self-awareness. So for all intents and purposes it's absolutely real for all involved. Perestroika fucked around with this message at 08:49 on Oct 29, 2023 |
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2023 20:50
|
|
|
I choose to believe that for every body at the bottom of that elevator shaft, it was a newly created Elster but only one Adler that just keeps pushing them if/when they get that far into the loop.
|
|
#
?
Oct 28, 2023 23:36
|
|
|
It could even be an event that Adler only experienced once but was experienced by multiple Elsters.
|
|
#
?
Oct 29, 2023 00:17
|
|
Bear Enthusiast posted:I choose to believe that for every body at the bottom of that elevator shaft, it was a newly created Elster but only one Adler that just keeps pushing them if/when they get that far into the loop. FunkyFjord posted:It could even be an event that Adler only experienced once but was experienced by multiple Elsters. Yeah that's how I've been thinking it; Adler is pretty clear that he is experiencing some kind of hellish loop and says, multiple times, that he's been here before, done this before, and will do it again. He wasn't surprised at all by any of the game's events, just frustrated and desperate that they didn't change - at least that was my read on it.
|
|
|
#
?
Oct 29, 2023 00:22
|
|
|
Mindblast posted:Haha no that stays as is. They should have because 8 is acht in German. It also can mean being alert. Gib acht! Would mean pay attention. It basically writes itself.
|
|
#
?
Oct 29, 2023 07:36
|
|
|
Perestroika posted:Ending speculation: My crackpot theory is the eye is the isometric view we play the majority of the game from, which is Araine watching everything. Elster killing her never works because it only happens due to Ariane imagining it happening in her fever dream, which bioresonance causes to happen for real (via guiding Elster unconsciously), but then even though she's been killed the entire thing is undone because Ariane thinks it doesn't happen. If we assume Yuri Stern not liking the idea of a "good" and a "bad" ending as being part of the intent to consider, then the ritual ending is Ariane becoming somewhat aware of what's happening; She doesn't really want to die. What she really wants is to be able to live peacefully with Elster away from the stupid, fascistic rule she's been forced under her entire life. On one hand, she isn't actually escaping, but she's at least able to ease her miserable state a little by watching Elster repeat everything. Depending on your level of cynicism, this either continues until the end of all existence, Ariane finally dies, an outside factor causes it to break, or she gets enough control over her abilities that the loop ends in some theoretical fifth ending. Nuebot posted:Yeah that's how I've been thinking it; Adler is pretty clear that he is experiencing some kind of hellish loop and says, multiple times, that he's been here before, done this before, and will do it again. He wasn't surprised at all by any of the game's events, just frustrated and desperate that they didn't change - at least that was my read on it. I feel like the idea of a loop is the one thing we can be certain of in the story. "Perhaps, this is hell." WaltherFeng posted:Even though that might be the case we learn a lot of interesting stuff that could really cool to explore in a sequel. I'm so torn on the idea because a lot of stuff is cool, but also in a way where being less vague might hurt it. That said my Million-Dollar idea was a game where you plat as a Protektor, fully kitted out in heavy weapons and armor, but have to constantly cripple yourself to progress. Strip off your armor so you're light enough to ride an elevator, and suddenly the Eules (or whatever) that couldn't even hurt you are much more dangerous. Replace your eyes with ones with night vision, and now you suddenly can't deal with the light as well. Repairing yourself by cannibalizing extra parts, so you lose maximum HP to heal to full. I dunno that isn't specifically related to Signalis, but it's the sort of thing a horror game where you're a robot made me think of.  I'm sad I didn't get the fancy vinyl record, since this is like the first game in forever I've loved so much that I want merch. Shastahanshah fucked around with this message at 07:52 on Oct 29, 2023 |
|
#
?
Oct 29, 2023 07:49
|
|
|
Ive had this idea for horror game for years where it starts off as a 3rd person shooter but it becomes survival horror as your ammo runs out and your gear degrades. Im sure theres a game like that out there tho.
|
|
#
?
Oct 29, 2023 07:55
|
|
|
Worth noting here that the update has added at least one new character and numerous new lore documents.
|
|
#
?
Oct 29, 2023 08:02
|
|
|
Discendo Vox posted:Worth noting here that the update has added at least one new character and numerous new lore documents. Oh no...I'm this close to doing a third playthrough to screencap and the documents and start arranging them on a corkboard.
|
|
#
?
Oct 29, 2023 08:04
|
|
|
Jack Trades posted:Oh no...I'm this close to doing a third playthrough to screencap and the documents and start arranging them on a corkboard. Let me start you off: Top center: None/Eternity/Star/Niemat/5./Unmentioned, should be 17th Night Upper left: Fire/Sacrifice/Sun/Buyan/1./19th Night Upper right: Air/Knowledge/Tower/Vineta/2./16th Night Lower left: Earth/Balance/Lovers/Kitezh/3./6th Night Lower right: Water/Flesh/Moon/Rotfront/4./18th Night Bottom center: Gold/Love/Death/Leng/6./13th Night
|
|
#
?
Oct 29, 2023 08:26
|
|
|
I'm having a weird bug that seems wrong but also kinda fits the weirdness of the game. There's a few rooms here and there where both Elster and the enemies move with odd microstutters and spasms. When this happens enemies can quickly phase through walls or suddenly appear behind Elster. It seems to only happen if there's several enemies at once. Its too weird to be intentional, as the enemies move too fast to track and Elster's movement is just too unpredictable.
|
|
#
?
Oct 29, 2023 16:01
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2023 07:11
|
|
|
WaltherFeng posted:Ive had this idea for horror game for years where it starts off as a 3rd person shooter but it becomes survival horror as your ammo runs out and your gear degrades. STALKER is like the reverse of that progression, but I don't know of a shooter that actually starts you strong and makes you weaker, that sounds fun
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2023 10:44
|
|
|
lmao
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2023 10:47
|
|
|
Good Dumplings posted:STALKER is like the reverse of that progression, but I don't know of a shooter that actually starts you strong and makes you weaker, that sounds fun Eternal Darkness has the 1988 chapter, where Michael finds everything he's ever going to find on a dead soldier in the first room.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2023 04:38
|
|
|
WaltherFeng posted:Ive had this idea for horror game for years where it starts off as a 3rd person shooter but it becomes survival horror as your ammo runs out and your gear degrades. Spec Ops: The Line does this in spirit, but not mechanically. The hoorah-to-horror pipeline.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2023 15:56
|
|
|
I like Signalis a whole lot but I always had a problem with it's story being seemingly just a "it was all a dream" trope. No matter how hard I tried to analyze it myself that was the only thing that seemingly made sense as a conclusion. Today I accidentally found this analysis that's offering a slightly different read on story that seems to make sense at face value and I find that explanation more satisfying. I'm linking it in case anyone else is interested. https://youtu.be/x1Gv8yjEXw8
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 09:44
|
|
|
why would you see it all being a dream as a problem, when this is a world where thoughts can warp reality? the entire world of signalis may as well be a dream given the breakdown of physical causality. but it's not like it means none of it happened or didn't matter.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 10:33
|
|
|
I think most people agree that Ariane's reality warping psychic powers combined with her radiation sickness caused some really mind bending and possibly universe breaking poo poo. Like imagine if you will things into existence with your mind and the only thing you could think of is "oh please I wanna die it hurts"
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 11:13
|
|
|
Because there's a difference between "It was all a dream and thus if something didn't make sense then it was simply because it was a dream" and "despite it being a dream there's a good and specific reason for why things happen they way they do." The former indicates the creator just throwing things together just because, while the latter shows a well thought out story. It's the reason why I also find the "Ariane is just creating everything on the spot from her dream. That's why the sequence of events makes no sense." explanation to be a lame copout.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 11:27
|
|
|
Jack Trades posted:Because there's a difference between "It was all a dream and thus if something didn't make sense then it was simply because it was a dream" and "despite it being a dream there's a good and specific reason for why things happen they way they do." But imo Signalis is mostly the latter case. There are reasons for why things happen, it's not random. There are some details that we might never know as players, but I think there's enough consistency to piece together a coherent narrative, and it doesn't really matter if it's a "dream". The characters and situations portrayed are stand-ins for things that are true and meaningful, no matter if they're "real". Also I would argue that Signalis is probably the best actually 'lovecraftian' game of the last, I dunno, decade? Where most games of this type focus too much on gnarly monsters and jumpscares and loredumps that try to check every box from the same Lovecraft anthology that everybody has read by this point. Meanwhile playing Signalis actually feels like you're facing something unknown and maybe totally unknowable. It evokes the feeling of losing your grip on reality through the story without even having to bother with any half-assed sanity point gameplay mechanic.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 13:49
|
|
|
grate deceiver posted:Also I would argue that Signalis is probably the best actually 'lovecraftian' game of the last, I dunno, decade? Where most games of this type focus too much on gnarly monsters and jumpscares and loredumps that try to check every box from the same Lovecraft anthology that everybody has read by this point. Meanwhile playing Signalis actually feels like you're facing something unknown and maybe totally unknowable. It evokes the feeling of losing your grip on reality through the story without even having to bother with any half-assed sanity point gameplay mechanic. I can definitely see that. I think my personal problem comes from the fact that if I was in a Lovecraftian story, I would be the guy trying to comprehend the unknowable while ignoring everyone's warnings and then going crazy from it.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 14:03
|
|
|
Horror, especially cosmic horror, tends to be much less effective when it is obsessively explained and I am glad that Signalis does not do this
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 14:14
|
|
|
Angry Diplomat posted:Horror, especially cosmic horror, tends to be much less effective when it is obsessively explained and I am glad that Signalis does not do this
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 15:07
|
|
|
I didn't get "it was a dream" at all, really. More You land on a horrible chunk of ice that is host to some sort of Lovecraftian presence, and Ariane's psychic abilities cause it to take the form of episodes from her past It's open to interpretation though, of course.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 15:15
|
|
|
Jack Trades posted:I can definitely see that. And in a way that's what happens in Signalis: you leave the "real" world completely behind and descend to the deepest part of the "dream" for Ariane. Fulfilling the promise is kinda like trying trying to comprehend the unknowable - what was the promise? Who made it? Was it really us or are we just an echo of real people? Who even is Ariane? It doesn't matter, you must find Her.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 15:16
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 9, 2024 16:13 |
|
|
Like has been said, ”is it dream or is it real?” is not a question that really means anything within this setting. The line between the two is so thin it may as well not exist. Things that happen because someone dreamed them are no less real or consequential than things that happened for any other reason.
|
|
#
?
Feb 4, 2024 17:37
|
|