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fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004

Sierra Madre posted:

Pride is inherently an event meant to present a community to the mainstream and say 'we are not a threat, we are just like you, we belong in society and do not deserve the indignities we are subject to by being forced outside of society.'

I mean that's one interpretation of Pride but it's neither inherent nor foundational. The foundational Pride parades were a statement of "we are different and we will not be forced to disappear nor hide that difference, we will parade through your public spaces with joy and without fear".

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fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004
If the referendum fails it will absolutely be taken as meaning that the Australian public at large do not care about indigenous rights and give further license to all sorts of horrible poo poo

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004
The jobs for boys are also very likely to include a whole bunch of indigenous jobs for indigenous boys.

Which if you like the idea of transferring commonwealth money directly into indigenous hands, then why not?

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004
Australia has always been racist but progressive on gender politics

the first place to introduce women's suffrage

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004
Bucky make a funny informational cartoon with rude Australian animals then people will really pay attention

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004

Bucky Fullminster posted:

This is an unnaturally tough crowd, it's definitely not as hard outside of here. 70% already there yadda yadda yadda.

And hey I'll even throw in free fixes for flat tyres at the red/yellow dots.

Yeah, no poo poo it's not as hard out there where people are reflexively polite to someone ranting to them about poo poo. They're probably invested in you as a person if they know you.

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004

freebooter posted:

My understanding of the reason they are trying to enshrine the Voice within the constitution is because then, unlike ATSIC, it won't be possible to abolish it via an act of parliament.

It's this. But nobody ever bloody says it enough on the yes side.

The Voice means that even if the organisation turns into a rats nest of corruption (and that's more likely than not), the government has to reform it rather than just scrapping it and having no indigenous participation in policy making for decades.

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004

bowmore posted:

I can't see any real reason to vote no

maybe Australia will be completely dismantled and abolished as a result

how?

nobody knows

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004

Captain Theron posted:

Lol, now Lidia Thorpe is supporting a legislated voice and calling Albanese a coward for not committing to defy the referendum vote.

Lol

A complete idiot. So much for the radical progressive no

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004
The radical no hosed up fundamentally because victory failed to radicalise anyone. If there had been unanimity between all progressive voices then only the most flagrantly bought and sold right wing indigenous Australians would have been saying no. Radicalisation relies on unfairness and injustice. Getting what you wanted doesn't exactly come off as unfair.

Also lol at the idea of there being any successful revolutionary pathway for a minority that's unentrenched in a nation's economic, social and cultural life. Especially a minority that's largely non-revolutionary in approach to political redress.

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004
The steps to treaty without a voice is simple. After all, Victoria has a treaty. Once the rest of Australia is as progressive as inner city Melbourne, it's a shoo in.

fake edit: I'm hearing Victoria only has a treaty process and has not started negotiations.

fez_machine fucked around with this message at 11:46 on Nov 4, 2023

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004
The radical no stood with the minority dissenting voices of indigenous Australia like Kerrynne Liddle, Jacinta Nampijinpa Price, and Warren Mundine and not the comprador Uluru Statement from the Heart.

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004

Blamestorm posted:

Ten to twenty years ago Melbourne seemed flat out the easiest city in Australia to live in - not as expensive as Sydney, great culture and food, relatively good transport. I was staggered when I was in the Brisbane CBD how much it had changed over the past ten years (for the better) and it does feel like Melbourne has been crossing some kind of tipping point in terms of congestion and cost. I was planning to move back there sometime next few years but I have been rethinking.

Am I nuts or had Melbourne just gotten plain worse? To keep it vaguely auspol related, what do we see as the trajectories for our three big cities over the next decade?

Sydney seems irreparably have/have nots now and just seems like a broken nightmare unless you are super rich. Is Melbourne trending this way too? (Or there already - without the harbour and beaches)

Melbourne rapidly deindustrialised into phoney urban renewal, got the most liveable city disease and put huge amounts of power in the planning minister's hands which lead to a lot of wildcat development.

The quality of new development is generally very low and poorly urban planned. The wastes of the Docklands redevelopment was the template for much of what was to come after.

Also complete lack of interest/oversight in development on the fringes which became sprawling and poorly serviced.

fez_machine fucked around with this message at 03:50 on Dec 11, 2023

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004
lmao "it is Melbourne after all"

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fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004

WhiskeyWhiskers posted:

Addressing these conditions in a systemic way is so obviously the correct method to ending both terrorism and inequality.


WhiskeyWhiskers posted:

The Chinese did exactly what they said they were doing, teaching people various trades and a second language to remove barriers to employment and revitalise the economy of Xinjiang.

Work for the dole but from the left

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