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I read Carrier: Alpha Strike (book 8 of ???) by Keith Douglass in 7th or 8th grade. It had airplanes on the cover which is all I needed to hand B. Dalton $6 of my hard earned money. It appears to have been pirated in its entirety onto some random blog as a single 100+ page post, which I'm only sharing because it's funny, I promise it is not worth  -ing."Bird Dog," a young maverick greenhorn F-14 pilot is flying around doing pilot poo poo and complaining about how the Navy has paperwork apparently. The CAG is also a main character and is either a Results Guy Who Doesn't Follow the Rules or a Wise But Tired Father Figure. Or maybe both. Bird Dog has it in for one of the crew chiefs, who is a girl (but a tomboy and one of the guys). She doesn't always follow the rules and Bird Dog wants to show he is a Very Serious Officer, so he disciplines her over some bullshit. His mentor/RIO tells him he's being an rear end in a top hat, but Bird Dog insists on following through. Meanwhile China is up to no good, but it's not actually China because even though they're the bad guys it's the 90s and we're all friends so you can't say it out loud. Instead, rogue actors within the Chinese government do the thing, making a play for the Spratly Islands and attempting to start a global conflict. Bird Dog and CAG fly around and blow poo poo up, and China is able to put their house back in order, but not before the unorthodox tomboy crew chief saves Bird Dog from launching with a control problem that only she could see. Bird Dog is humiliated mid-tirade, learns a valuable leadership lesson, and gives the crew chief a joyride in his Tomcat, which may or may not resolve the sexual tension between them. I didn't read books 1-7 or book 9 so  Honestly about half of that came from memory and the other half I made up based on the standard 90s military book tropes. I bet I'm not far off. The only enduring memory I have of the book is reading it on the bus home from school when a cute girl sat next to me and asked what I was reading. I was so utterly embarrassed to be reading this that I bombed the flirtation even harder than "Bird Dog" bombed the Spratlys. Discussion Quorum fucked around with this message at 18:13 on Mar 27, 2023 |
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Mar 27, 2023 18:11
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Moon Slayer posted:This being Dale Brown, of course, the "invasion" consists entirely of aerial bombing. Our glorious Sky Knights can't be expected to sully themselves with such frivolities as politics, ground combat, objective reality. 
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Mar 27, 2023 20:51
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Discussion Quorum posted:I read Carrier: Alpha Strike (book 8 of ???) by Keith Douglass I've seen the Carrier series go by, and wondered, "Is this terrible, and should I read it?" several times. My condolences on the failed flirting.
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Mar 27, 2023 21:35
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Hmm well if we're discussing wars being won solely with air power, Gerard de Villiers wrote Bombs over Belgrade where the Serbs are doing something America doesn't like (invading Bosnia or Kosovo or something idk it's the late 90s and I can't look it up) so the US starts bombing them to make them stop. Unfortunately this doesn't work despite a ton of damage to Belgrade so our CIA ubermensch is dispatched to Belgrade to get a fix on Milosevic for the latter's "physical elimination" via bomb (a phrase that gets repeated quite a bit). His two main stringers are a gay photographer in Milosevic's PR team and a woman who is more concerned with passing her upcoming driver's license test than getting her head of state killed. (I should mention that out of all nationalities and allegiances in this series, including North Koreans, the Sinaloa Cartel, and Hezbollah, Serbs have probably the least flattering portrayal, as in literally worse than the Interahamwe) They eventually get a line on Milosevic's location via the photographer and they hatch a plan to leave a fancy Breitling (these books are loaded with product placement, especially Defender whiskey) to send a targeting location signal (?) to the USAF from where Milosevic is sleeping. However, Serbian intelligence had gotten wind of the plot and after a whole internal decision making soliloquy over whether or not to just let the CIA kill Milosevic to end the war and the bombing, the Serb spymaster comes up with a plan (I think he's in pajamas for this; this is literally the only Serbian who is positively portrayed over 200+ books) and gets the big man's approval. The photographer is forced to divulge the plot and wear a wire and this is figured out by a woman spying on him as he takes a piss, but it's too late to cancel the plot, and our hero is crestfallen to discover that, spoiler alert, the Serbs moved the emitter into the Chinese embassy, which is dutifully bombed. Anyway he has to spend a few months of exile in an Orthodox monastery but it's ok because he brings a side piece along and it turned out not to matter that much anyway so eventually the CIA picks him up in a helicopter. 100% true story IMO
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Mar 28, 2023 02:49
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FrozenVent posted:My favorite of those is the two guys with the truck full of ANFO slowly driving across the country to blow up the White House. I've always wondered what the original plan for that completely orphaned subplot was, they literally never interacted with anything or anyone else in the book at all
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Mar 28, 2023 14:54
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Amp up the pressure? Suspense? I honestly don’t know. It could be excised entirely without an issue; I remember my teenage self thinking this should have been edited out.
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Mar 28, 2023 15:12
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Clancy was well into his 'Far too rich and important to be properly edited by lowly Editors' phase by that point. I've always called the tendency of successful authors having the length of their books spiral out of control 'Tom Clancy Syndrome'.
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Mar 28, 2023 18:36
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Deptfordx posted:Clancy was well into his 'Far too rich and important to be properly edited by lowly Editors' phase by that point. Famous Writer Book Bloat has been a thing for a while. Eventually, they just can't be pushed back against. I'd think of it as Herman Wouk Syndrome, but honestly I think he started out that way.
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Mar 28, 2023 19:42
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IMO the canonical Clive Cussler insanity streak is the five books between Deep Six and Sahara. Add on Atlantis Rising as the delightful cherry on the top.
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Mar 29, 2023 04:25
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Deptfordx posted:Clancy was well into his 'Far too rich and important to be properly edited by lowly Editors' phase by that point. Stephen King is a far better example, because he's a far better writer that is genuinely hurt by his inability to be edited.
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Mar 29, 2023 04:41
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I think my own most recent example would be The Mirror and the Light. Mantell is a great writer but that last book, post all the acclaim and awards, was bloated as gently caress. You could easily have cut out a third of that novel, and if you argued for half I wouldn't disagree.
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Mar 29, 2023 09:18
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Dale Brown has a Surprisingly Poor Opinion of NORAD We're getting into very late Brown territory here and my memory is very fuzzy. In fact I think this might have been the most recent novel of his that I ever read because I quick glance and the bibliography on Wikipedia shows a bunch of titles that mean nothing to me. Really all I remember about this book is how yet another ultra-nationalist general has couped the Russian government with the intention of taking down the West (I think this is the third time this has happened although some of those may not have been main series Brown novels). A good third of the novel depicts a Russian strategic bomber strike on the mainland US which is somehow wildly successful. Canada does not appear to have any airplanes and NORAD I guess doesn't notice a massive bomber fleet until Offutt is nuked. A bunch of Russian bombers do get shot down I think but the idea that they could get anywhere close to even like Alaska is hilarious. I don't even remember how the book ends but I'm assuming the US retaliates with their own bombing raid that's so much better it knocks Russia out of the game completely. At no point are ground, naval, or rocket forces involved in any of this.
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Mar 31, 2023 14:46
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I'm gonna preface the following book. Growing up my dad had a huge library of 80's scifi/military schlock that I as an edge lord teen ended up reading, imagine a book collection where starship troopers is the most nuanced and thought provoking book of the lot and you'll get it. It's a wonder that I don't have more brain worms. I say this to give you the following book: IT'S THE GRIM DARK FUTURE OF 199X?/200X? and fresh water has grown extremely scarce. So a millionaire libertarian from THE GREAT REPUBLIC OF TEXAS decides to save america by carving up a large piece of antartica and transporting it back to texas, IIRC, texas succeeded from the Union and also dastardly commies rule most of the world now. Everyone from random dastardly politicans and the commies try to stop the iceberg through various schemes one of which iirc involves throwing a nuke at it? There's probably a lot of problematic poo poo mixed in there as most of my dads books probably have.
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Mar 31, 2023 19:44
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What was that book that had a genius nerd who drank pop from 2L bottle and used a 747 with a rolling tank of jet fuel as ballast to launch ICBMs to orbit satellite? Iirc the book ends with him deorbiting a recon satellite into a Chinese warship and sinking it. Might have been Dale Brown. Another boat book, we only got the best. Also a surprising amount of lesbian erotica, lord knows how that got past the fine folks at the seamen’s mission.
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Apr 1, 2023 03:15
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FrozenVent posted:What was that book that had a genius nerd who drank pop from 2L bottle and used a 747 with a rolling tank of jet fuel as ballast to launch ICBMs to orbit satellite? That was Sky Masters, the first appearance of wunderkind Jon Masters in the mainline Brown series. The "need it right this second" NIRTsats. Why the gently caress do I remember this poo poo from thirty years ago.
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Apr 1, 2023 03:28
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Say what you want about the guy he did predict Elon Musk. *touches earpiece* Oh.
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Apr 1, 2023 04:13
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It's time for time travel (again)! The Soviets prevailed over Nazi Germany in WW2, in fact prevailed so hard that they just kept going and rolled over all of Western Europe while they were at it. Now embattled America stands alone, beset from without by pressure from the USSR and from within by socialist sympathizers (bred in the universities, naturally) who are bombing everything in sight and trying to destroy Our God-Fearing Way of Life. The natural countermeasure to all this, you ask? Build a time machine and send an entire mechanized brigade back to 1943 and help the Third Reich win the battle of Kursk, OBVIOUSLY. The author deals with the minutiae of the unit's operation, and the big pile of supplies they are required to take with them to make all this completely sane plan work, and that constitutes all of the worthwhile portions of the story. Even Our Heroes in Green are not immune from the insidious reach of socialist thought, and the tough-as-nails commander has to deal with desertion and defeatism, even after the stirring speech about how it's too bad we're on the same side as Hitler, but it'll all work out right in the end. It does not work out all right in the end, as they somehow return back to the present, and there's a twist ending emerging into a changed world, clearly a hook for a potential series I am blessed to not have read. That's Time AfterTime: At War by John David Thomas, and if I have undersold the overall tone of this book, let me just reiterate that it reeds like a John Birch Society pamphlet with tanks.
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Apr 1, 2023 22:15
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Fuuuuck, and I thought Ringo's "what if the Waffen SS came back to save Germany from aliens" apologia was bad.
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Apr 1, 2023 22:31
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Madurai posted:It does not work out all right in the end, as they somehow return back to the present, and there's a twist ending emerging into a changed world, clearly a hook for a potential series I am blessed to not have read. https://twitter.com/TheDweck/status/1085003233662124032
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Apr 1, 2023 22:34
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Moon Slayer posted:Fuuuuck, and I thought Ringo's "what if the Waffen SS came back to save Germany from aliens" apologia was bad. Had I read this little gem in physical form, I would have thrown it. As it was, there is no "delete this from my Kindle really hard" button.
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Apr 1, 2023 22:43
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Well don't leave us hanging, it's not like we're going to read it. What was the twist?
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Apr 2, 2023 00:12
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Frederick Forsyth was my early life bad military thriller writer of choice. Day of the Jackal, The Odessa File, Dogs of War, The Fourth Protocol etc etc. Don't think I've read any of his stuff for 20 years now at least, can't imagine it aged very gracefully. Also an appropriate April 1st prank for this thread: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvAueVn6Fzo
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Apr 2, 2023 00:12
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Day of the Jackal still holds up decently though the computerization of personal records and general state of worldwide pervasive surveillance makes it pretty implausible today. I picked up Odessa File for a dime last week, will report back when I get through it.
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Apr 2, 2023 00:24
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The Fist of God, where an SAS guy has to go and single handledly find and laze Saddam’s nuke canon, is ok. I’m sure it’s super problematic in this day and age but heh.
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Apr 2, 2023 01:01
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I don't know if it counts but did anyone else read Empire by Orson Scott Card? I remember hearing about it because it was supposed to be some big new thing, there was gonna be movies, video games, books and all sorts of media about the universe. All I knew about Card was that Ender's Game was good so I gave it a read. All I can remember is basically we get a civil war between the democrats and republicans. I forget what happens to the actual military but the republicans go on to create mechs for some reason and the democrats mostly rely on small SF teams. I don't remember the book being very good but I guess there was a sequel. Never got all the media that was promised.
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Apr 2, 2023 01:17
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Wrong Theory posted:I don't know if it counts but did anyone else read Empire by Orson Scott Card? I remember hearing about it because it was supposed to be some big new thing, there was gonna be movies, video games, books and all sorts of media about the universe. All I knew about Card was that Ender's Game was good so I gave it a read. There was a video game but that was it. I suspect after the 2016 election the premise was radioactive.
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Apr 2, 2023 01:45
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Moon Slayer posted:Fuuuuck, and I thought Ringo's "what if the Waffen SS came back to save Germany from aliens" apologia was bad. I'm loathe to do this, but that was not John Ringo. I mean, Ringo signed off on it, but Watch on the Rhine isn't one of the Posleen books written by Ringo. It's by TOM KRATMAN. And goddammit, now I'm going to have to explain who Tom Kratman is.
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Apr 2, 2023 22:59
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Fivemarks posted:I'm loathe to do this, but that was not John Ringo. I mean, Ringo signed off on it, but Watch on the Rhine isn't one of the Posleen books written by Ringo. Tank Marmot, as he is known on some public forums who want to avoid his obsessive name searching.
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Apr 2, 2023 23:08
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yeah learned all I needed to
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Apr 3, 2023 01:16
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I would like to tell you a tale It's a tale of a SECRET BASE in Antarctica It's so secret that basically every military's ELITE SPECIAL FORCES turn up all at once to try and take it Our hero arrives in a hovercraft, which is obviously the perfect vehicle for use in a snowy rocky wasteland. Soon after, A DISTRESS CALL! Then people from different stations begin turning up and our hero recognises the French as Special Forces because..... he realises that they've hidden their SIGNATURE WEAPONS in food tins. What weapons, you ask? Why, the signature weapon of the French Special Forces - Crossbows!!!! The book also goes into detail about how Marine Recon's signature is an Armalite MH-12 Maghook, the SAS it's nitrogen charges, and Navy SEALs it is the Ruger 12 gauge shotgun. There's also something about trained killer whales and a possible alien spaceship or something, but honestly who can remember. It's Ice Station, by Matthew Reilly! Edit: hell yes, they are liquid nitrogen charges so ice bombs Comrade Blyatlov fucked around with this message at 08:15 on Apr 3, 2023 |
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Apr 3, 2023 07:48
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:I would like to tell you a tale Oh you gotta be kidding me, I was literally planning on doing a Matthey Reilly run starting with Ice Station later today! All of the various special forces converge on this station because a photograph comes out that shows what looks like a base of alien spaceships discovered under the ice sheet but what turns out to be an experimental US bomber base that was so top-secret they forgot about it. The prototype strategic bombers were basically big versions of that flying saucer air-car thing so it's somewhat understandable they were mistaken for alien ships I suppose. Our Marine Recon heroes fight the French, the British, and the Russians I think before dropping the whole station off the edge of the ice sheet. Fun fact, the copy I got out of the public library in like 2004 or '05 had had someone write criticism of the story in the margins, with annotations like "highly improbable!" Whoever it was had also crossed out "French" and wrote "Vichy" every time. Moon Slayer fucked around with this message at 14:27 on Apr 3, 2023 |
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Apr 3, 2023 14:21
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I remember it being enjoyable trash, fwiw. Ridiculous as hell, but good for a long flight. I decided to read it again and lmfao noone knows what colour eyes our hero has because he always wears silver reflective glasses That's how you know he's cool Comrade Blyatlov fucked around with this message at 19:11 on Apr 3, 2023 |
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Apr 3, 2023 18:55
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the later books get insane, with stuff like the Four Royal Families that ACTUALLY control the ENTIRE WORLD. And the COMING APOCALYPSE That artifacts left over from a previous civilization can be used to stop- or if they get into the wrong hands, they can give the wielder ultimate power.
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Apr 4, 2023 02:08
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Fivemarks posted:the later books get insane, with stuff like the Four Royal Families that ACTUALLY control the ENTIRE WORLD. And the COMING APOCALYPSE That artifacts left over from a previous civilization can be used to stop- or if they get into the wrong hands, they can give the wielder ultimate power. Same author, different series, but I've read them all, baby. So the sequel to Ice Station has the Marine Recon team having been rewarded for their performance in the Antarctic by being assigned to the White House. You know how when you see pictures of the president getting on Marine One saluting Marines in their blue dress uniforms? That's them. They are accompanying the president on a trip to a secret NORAD-style mountain bunker somewhere in the desert. Except it's actually a secret bioweapons lab? Or maybe the bioweapon was just being stored there? Or something. Anyway during the tour a general who they all thought had been executed for treason a few months ago pops up on a screen and goes into a supervillain monologue. Here's the plot as I remember it: they've somehow hacked the nuclear football into Fire Everything mode that can only be delayed if the president scans his hand every thirty minutes. Also there's a Chinese bioweapon on base that is the coveted "kill only this ethnicity" virus, in this case it's designed to kill anyone not Asian. I think the general is planning to sell it, or change it to non-whites and then sell it? Or use it? I don't remember but a bunch of his mercenary goons are also going to hunt the president for sport. There's also a South African Recces squad that attacks the base and I think maybe the Chinese join the party as well, all trying to get the bioweapon. Meanwhile our heroes are running around with the secret service detail getting into gunfights, protecting the president, and making sure he gets his hand on the football every thirty minutes. Including a time when they're separated by an elevator shaft and have to use the Marines' signature grappling guns to swing the one with the football and the president across the shaft and meet in the middle. All this time the evil general is monologing over the PA and claims to be using the Emergency Broadcast System to transmit the hunt live to the nation. I don't remember exactly how it all ends but the general is killed, the various parties hunting the bioweapon are driven off, and the day is saved. There's actually a fairly funny bit where every few chapters the view would cut away to the nation glued to their TV screens but at the end of the day it turns out that the evil general hosed up the broadcast and everyone was really watching 24-hour news channel coverage of a celebrity couple snowed in at a ski lodge. e: poo poo, wait, I think it's that the president had a bomb implanted in his heart during a surgery before he was in office but was going to run so the bad guys were playing the long game. The nukes will all launch if he dies but the bomb can be reset every 30 minutes with the football. That's also why the mercs are trying to kill him, to trigger the launches. Moon Slayer fucked around with this message at 14:40 on Apr 4, 2023 |
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Apr 4, 2023 14:36
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Oh god I've wanted to post a Let's Read of this for a while but I've been busy so this thread at least gives me a chance to bring this up: THE GUARDIANS by RICHARD AUSTIN And if that isn't just the best pen name ever. Author's real name was Victor Milan, and he wrote Star Trek books, Battletech books, Wild Card books, something like 100 published novels in all. The Guardians apparently lasted for 16 books, starting in 1985 and running to 1991, but the last two were by a ghostwriter. A ghostwriter for a pen name. So from memory: the titular Guardians are a four-man elite team which consists of one member from each military service. You've got Billy McKay, a Marine from Special Operations Group Southwest Asia Command, who wound up in the hospital when his helicopter got blown up by an RPG. There's Tom Rogers, a Green Beret. Casey Wilson is an Air Force pilot who got ace-in-a-day by shooting down 5 MiGs over Libya, and Scott Sloan is a Navy officer whose ship was hit by a salvo of missiles from an Libyan OSA II and who took command when the captain was killed and managed to get the ship back to port. Novel points out that having one dude from each service was necessary for the political support required to create the group in the first place, because the enabling legislation puts it outside of the military chain of command: the actual President cannot order these guys around. And their whole mission is ostensibly to safeguard the chain of command in the event of a nuclear war. And of course they're all cross-trained extensively so everyone can in a pinch do what the other guys do easily. And of course there's a nuclear war! There's a border incident in Berlin, with a bunch of defectors ramming across the border in an up-armored truck, and when the East German border guards chase them across and the West Germans shoot the East German border guards dead, the Soviets use that as an excuse to launch a full-scale invasion, which proceeds to come apart at the seams as the better tech and better training and better morale of NATO forces starts leading to a Soviet defeat which even the use of chemical weapons doesn't avert. Panicking, the Soviets go full nukefest. And doncha know it, contact with the President's NEACP is lost, so the Vice-President's promotion is sworn-in by a hasty ceremony in the Oval Office and now the Guardians and a small Secret Service detachment have to transport the new President, the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, and a few other VIPs to a top-secret installation called Heartland so they can start putting the nation back together (There's a really cool scene where they're underground watching the nuclear war progress, which explains why they don't go to Mount Weather: a 25-megaton warhead from an SS-18 gets a lucky hit). Their transport consists of three M706s, two of them with 7.62mm and .50 cal machine guns in the turret, and one with a 7.62 and a Mk19 grenade launcher. Some of the scenes include: * - leaving a broken and burning D.C. While they're doing this a late-launched Soviet warhead airbursts over the city, destroying one of their three APCs. * - They're supposed to deliver the President to an airfield where CIA assets will load him into a plane and fly him to Heartland. Surprise, the CIA tries to kidnap him instead and the plane is an AC-130 that's supposed to kill everyone on the ground to cover up the kidnapping. So there's a great set piece between an AC-130 on the runway and the two remaining armored cars. * - Some team bonding over poker. * - After they escape, the CIA switches to just trying to kill them all. At various times they're faced with ATGM teams or helicopter gunships trying to blow them up. * - So close to Heartland, a broken axle. No big problem, there are emergency supply caches pre-staged all across the country so they're not far away from one. But! A renegade National Guard unit led by an officer who wants to set up his own private post-apocalyptic fief has already broken into it and is looting it, so they need to work with the local townspeople who are being brutalized by the Guard to get their necessary spare parts and kill the officer before he captures the President. And of course when they finally do get the President to Heartland that's not the end of things. It turns out that there's an expansion pack of DLC: dispersed all around the country is something called the Blueprint for Humanity. It consists of various documents and scientists and technologies that will be able to accelerate the recovery from the war, and it was deliberately scattered around to prevent it all from being annihilated with one bomb, and the *real* mission of the Guardians is to fetch-quest all that poo poo and Save America. Okay, this is pulp, obviously, but it's surprisingly well-written pulp. It's a bit repetitive (drive along in the APC for a while, get attacked, drive along in the APC for a while, get attacked, etc), and the only character who's interesting in any way is McKay (also probably the character whose POV we get the most), but it's not *bad* The quality of the prose is a bit purple in places but it's generally surprisingly high, and there are a few really entertaining scenes. The bit on the airfield with the AC-130 is loving great, and when I read this in middle school in like '86 the scene where they're in the underground bunker getting reports and seismograph readings on all the falling bombs really stuck with me, that was some chilling poo poo to consider at the time. And there isn't really any magic tech, everything was pretty realistic, there's nothing like those heartbeat detectors that Tom Clancy fell for, or any Dale Brown goofiness. I only ever found the first few to read and even by that point the quality was falling off, especially in regards to the bullshit quotient. At some point someone's got a CAWS firing depleted uranium shotshells that can penetrate IFVs, and my understanding is that eventually there's just no-poo poo magic spells and wizards and poo poo.
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Apr 9, 2023 01:29
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Vic Milan did one spec ops novel I vaguely remember, only in details, like the protagonist being a US born Spetsnaz soldier that was part of a special OPFOR/infiltration unit called Texas Squad, who tested security on Russian facilities
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Apr 9, 2023 17:00
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Why is the CIA trying to kill the president after the nukes have dropped? Generic evilness?
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Apr 9, 2023 17:46
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Moon Slayer posted:Why is the CIA trying to kill the president after the nukes have dropped? Generic evilness? The Church Committee cast a long shadow.
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Apr 9, 2023 17:56
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Moon Slayer posted:Why is the CIA trying to kill the president after the nukes have dropped? Generic evilness? There's this whole 5th Column subplot with this Russian conspiracy and well-placed traitors in each country to take over while the West is still reeling from the war. It's not heavily revealed in the first book and honestly I don't remember too much about the details, there's a guy named Maximov and another named Trajan and I don't recall which one works for the other.
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Apr 10, 2023 02:48
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GD_American posted:Vic Milan did one spec ops novel I vaguely remember, only in details, like the protagonist being a US born Spetsnaz soldier that was part of a special OPFOR/infiltration unit called Texas Squad, who tested security on Russian facilities I read this as "Texas Squid", which would be a good name for a Metal Gear character.
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Apr 10, 2023 03:03
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