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Stinky Wizzleteats posted:so ur telling me u don't have a spank bank. U don't have a spank account and u can't pound off to memory movies that to me is hell ma'am i can still remember things and imagine them
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May 2, 2023 01:36
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HashtagGirlboss posted:This is like finding out there are people without an inner monologue yea when I learned there were people like this, i immediately just assumed they were actual retards like major chromosome problems
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May 2, 2023 01:37
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DrSunshine posted:I thought this was a thread for this
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May 2, 2023 02:36
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Stinky Wizzleteats posted:so ur telling me u don't have a spank bank. U don't have a spank account and u can't pound off to memory movies that to me is hell ma'am I have an internet connection, this isn't the dark ages!!
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May 2, 2023 02:47
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i think the first time i realized that people do actually have minds eyes and can see stuff was when the hunger games movies came out and everybody got mad that a character - described as black in the books - was being played by a black actress, because they were like "i didnt picture her looking like that!!!" like they were visualizing it! meanwhile i knew that the character was black because i remembered reading a description of her dark skin. easy peasy.
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May 2, 2023 03:26
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May 2, 2023 03:45
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69 Body Problem posted:yea when I learned there were people like this, i immediately just assumed they were actual retards Joke’s on us, some of them are making policy and there’s no way to identify or remove them 
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May 2, 2023 03:55
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Chewbecca posted:I have an internet connection, this isn't the dark ages!! Yea but what about when poo poo happens like pornhub getting rid of all the really good videos or Tumblr, etc
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May 2, 2023 04:07
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have not seen this for a very long time, drat
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May 2, 2023 06:03
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just watched the episode on cats 
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May 2, 2023 06:38
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watching the intro on loop and regressing into my child state of sitting "indian style" before the elementary school media cart
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May 2, 2023 07:02
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69 Body Problem posted:Yea but what about when poo poo happens like pornhub getting rid of all the really good videos or Tumblr, etc I am not a pervert, I read forum posts as God intended 
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May 2, 2023 07:47
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"Imagining" things is for perverts
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May 2, 2023 08:21
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paul_soccer12 posted:"Imagining" things is for perverts
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May 2, 2023 09:20
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are we 100% sure this aphantasia thing isn’t just fomo. like are there good studies with functional scans of the occipital lobe just doing nothing in seemingly normal people when they’re asked to recall their mother’s face or whatever? most people that say they have a floridly vivid internal 8K movie constantly running as they read YA lit are lying to sound special. I think it’s more normal to gradually build up mental imagery and get impressions of the more aesthetically striking parts. but I don’t understand how you remember what people and things look like or navigate your house with literally zero visual imagination
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May 2, 2023 09:47
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there are fmri studies, yeah. i dont know if any fmri or similar study should be called good as there are i think some major problems with the methodology. if you just read the wiki article for aphantasia or something you can find more than a few papers that answer some of those questions. i dont understand how people who are curious about something don't investigate a little first those are pretty silly questions though, unless you actually remember what things or people look like by visualizing them. generally you just do remember what they look like without any mind's eye visualization. i hope Cuttlefush has issued a correction as of 10:19 on May 2, 2023 |
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May 2, 2023 10:15
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good is relative with brain scanning yeah, we can’t even diagnose most dementia types well without scooping out the brain post mortem. Aphantasia seems like it would be a ‘good’ candidate for EROS in combination with other methods tho cos of where the relevant brain areas physically are. probably have a read later
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May 2, 2023 10:24
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Shogi posted:good is relative with brain scanning yeah, we can’t even diagnose most dementia types well without scooping out the brain post mortem. Aphantasia seems like it would be a ‘good’ candidate for EROS in combination with other methods tho cos of where the relevant brain areas physically are. probably have a read later here's a pretty good looking experimental paper investigating some aspects of memory between normal/aphantasia. includes drawings in the figures https://sci-hub.ru/https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0010945220304317 not exactly a huge difference 
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May 2, 2023 10:34
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Lol at the first control drawing. A flower arrangement is basically just a floating penis right, nailed it cheers for the link. It’s p interesting as a subject if v hard to discuss cos it’s all so subjective. Obv visual working memory and its links to other processes must be functioning to store and encode memories, so there has got to be a rupture somewhere else. not being able to consciously access imagery -at all- is really hard to grasp if you don’t experience it cos it just kinda comes along with the constellation of other subjective poo poo when you think and remember. I can logically sort of get how you can remember a face or what an orange looks like purely based on like info chunks about distance and texture and tone etc, I just can’t imagine i would be capable of it at all
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May 2, 2023 10:58
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Shogi posted:Lol at the first control drawing. A flower arrangement is basically just a floating penis right, nailed it yep. it's weird for sure. it's especially weird to have a just-going-to-sleep dream that wakes you up where you definitely saw something because it seems like that's not really far off from mind's eye visualization. it's also weird that it ends to not impact spatial memory at all (and arguably doesn't actually impact object/other memory much either). i can "access" mental images but I'm just not able to draw them in my head. no, that doesn't make much sense to me either. but from those drawings it's pretty clear that whatever is missing in aphantasia isn't actually the ability to think of an image. if that was the case the aphantasia drawings would not look like the normal ones. however that image info gets stored or generated it seems like it's just separate from being able to recreate it. which I think tracks with people who have a 'low res' mind's eye brains
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May 2, 2023 11:09
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Cuttlefush posted:here's a pretty good looking experimental paper investigating some aspects of memory between normal/aphantasia. includes drawings in the figures people who can't draw are confirmed for NPCs
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May 2, 2023 13:44
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those are all good drawings
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May 2, 2023 13:47
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now im confused, im not fantastic?
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May 2, 2023 14:10
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Shogi posted:not being able to consciously access imagery -at all- is really hard to grasp if you don’t experience it cos it just kinda comes along with the constellation of other subjective poo poo when you think and remember Psychoanalytic theory offers some finesse on the subject that I find really interesting. Aphantasia as a conscious dysfunction when the unconscious is perfectly capable of providing involuntary visualization is something that - at least to me - tracks really well with some ideas there, especially in relation to language, the formation of ego and intermediating with reality. The subjective poo poo is the important part here. Aphantasia, in that sense, is just exactly that: a subjective aspect of conscious mind. It's like people without internal monologues: the idea at face value caused a lot of consternation because people were like "how the gently caress do you reflect about stuff?" - just because it doesn't happen in that format doesn't mean it is non-existent. Their symbolic organization (how they relate to language itself) is, you know, different. Curiously enough, both aphantasia/hyperphantasia correlate with autism iirc
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May 2, 2023 15:33
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dead gay comedy forums posted:Psychoanalytic theory offers some finesse on the subject that I find really interesting. Aphantasia as a conscious dysfunction when the unconscious is perfectly capable of providing involuntary visualization is something that - at least to me - tracks really well with some ideas there, especially in relation to language, the formation of ego and intermediating with reality. https://academic.oup.com/cercorcomms/article/2/2/tgab035/6265046 yep. i know at least that study showed that. im guessing if/once there are similar self-report studies done it'd have a similar relationship with adhd, which has a lot of overlap with asd. shogi, that might also be one you're interested in since it has imaging and spends some time on describing the potential mechanisms that are hosed up. e.g. from the discussion quote:Given that people with lifelong aphantasia do not describe major perceptual difficulties yet are unable to summon images to the mind’s eye voluntarily, reduction in connectivity between relevant cognitive control systems and visual cortices offers a plausible neural mechanism. The underlying thought here is that reverse activation of visual cortices in the service of visual imagery is likely to place stronger demands on reverse connections between frontoparietal executive regions and visual cortices than does visual perception (Dijkstra et al. 2019). This idea is strengthened by the observation that many people with aphantasia experience visual dreams (Dawes et al. 2020; Zeman et al. 2020), suggesting that they are capable of experiencing imagery when the requirement for voluntary imagery generation is removed.
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May 2, 2023 15:48
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https://www.livescience.com/health/neuroscience/newfound-brain-signature-linked-to-multiple-psychiatric-disorders was posted in the UFO thread recently
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May 2, 2023 20:12
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https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-023-02317-4 is the actual articlequote:Furthermore, considering the replication crisis in neuroimaging studies, it was suggested that combining large neuroimaging samples and machine-learning approaches (that is, combining training and validation processes) could increase the reliability and reproducibility of identified neurobiomarkers sus
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May 2, 2023 20:17
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Cuttlefush posted:https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-023-02317-4 is the actual article "given that we can't neuroimage for jack poo poo maybe if we sprinkle a little AI on top of the scans and tell it what we want to find it'll magically fix the replication crisis"
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May 2, 2023 20:23
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"Replication crisis" aka making poo poo up in the first place
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May 2, 2023 21:19
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Just as an aside, neuroimaging is the area of the biggest replication issues, because physics envy makes for bad psychology research
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May 2, 2023 21:27
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Shogi posted:are we 100% sure this aphantasia thing isn’t just homo.
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May 2, 2023 22:15
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Every time I remember I have this I get mad as hell
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May 2, 2023 22:38
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I remember trying to picture my Dad's face after he died and getting upset I couldnt. I now realise it's not specific to hia face, its actually everything lol
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May 2, 2023 22:39
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Chewbecca posted:I remember trying to picture my Dad's face after he died and getting upset I couldnt. don't bum everyone out cmon
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May 2, 2023 22:42
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indigi posted:don't bum everyone out cmon I can't picture tubgirl either, if that helps
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May 2, 2023 22:45
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so who can say if it's bad or not
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May 3, 2023 01:45
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i have a lovely minds eye that can't get me more than a vague impression of a cube or a scene if i try, but will sometimes get kind of vivid if i don't try to consciously control it and just watch brain movies of freeform stuff going by. I assumed everyone else was like this.
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May 3, 2023 03:24
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my imagination is razor sharp and will one day carve itself loose and slaughter you all
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May 3, 2023 03:40
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even if u could imagine things it would all be stupid poo poo anyway, you are blessed who are blank
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May 3, 2023 03:51
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actually i take it back. i'm listening to the Vengaboys' "We Like to Party" in my head and it's crystal clear and coming in sharp and vivid. I do have mental superpowers, but just super hearing instead of super picturing
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May 3, 2023 03:53
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