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Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Bula Vinaka posted:

They also use massive amounts of water for cooling. Taiwan Semiconductor is building a new chip fab plant in Phoenix AZ, which is pretty far away from big lakes or rivers, so I'm not sure how they're going to handle that.

Coolant doesn't need to be potable, and it doesn't get contaminated in the process. You just keep a reservoir and recycle the water.

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Drone_Fragger
May 9, 2007


If russia couldn't take ukraine i doubt china can take taiwan. Taiwan have been training for like 50 years to defend against invasion. And its nowhere as forgiving terrain wise as "a big flat plain with roads we can drive across"

Comstar
Apr 20, 2007

Are you happy now?
Australia spending 30 years and 1/2 the military budget to build submarines to protect our trade routes with our biggest trading partner...from our biggest trading partner.

And spending a lot of time on working out if the Chinese Navy can take and hold...Guadalcanal.


Why China would try and cut off the supply lines to Australia instead of just buying it (which they did the for the entire Port of Darwin) is unclear. Murdoch would be happy to sell it.

Taima
Dec 31, 2006

tfw you're peeing next to someone in the lineup and they don't know

Bula Vinaka posted:

From what I've read, modern Taiwanese chip fabs make chips using photolithography, which uses ultraviolet light to get down to the atomic scale.



Building a chip fab is one thing, tuning the photolithographic machines it to be able to make multi-core chips where all of the cores test good is an entirely different process that takes years to achieve. So, new chip fabs such as those being built in the USA are years away from being able to produce any meaningful output.

They also use massive amounts of water for cooling. Taiwan Semiconductor is building a new chip fab plant in Phoenix AZ, which is pretty far away from big lakes or rivers, so I'm not sure how they're going to handle that.

A Chinese invasion of Taiwan could occur well before new chip fabs are in full production.

TSMC would be almost impossible to replace for MANY reasons and it would be anything but a short term issue- it would take possibly decades to get back to where we are now.

But, you're barking up the wrong tree here. Photolithography is catered by ASML which is Dutch.

Trust me there are a bunch of reasons why you're right but photolithography is not one. Do those homies look Taiwanese to u, look at that fat gently caress

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASML_Holding

There's other concerns too though. TSMC is struggling with its newest processes as chips scale down so tiny they begin to experience all manner of wacky physics. It's kind of unclear when the 3NM and 2NM processes will be ready for prime time. This may allow competitors to catch up to some degree if this process takes a really long time but it's too early to tell quite yet.

Don't underestimate TSMC though, the poo poo they make is more comparable to magic than anything else humans make imo. It would be a world-changing development if it were to be destroyed, and Taiwan would likely burn TSMC to the ground before it let China have it.

Taima fucked around with this message at 10:15 on May 6, 2023

Toxic Mental
Jun 1, 2019

Has anyone considered installing Tesla Coils around Taiwan that zap chinese ships if they get too close

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1h0gsma9TGQ

Kharnifex
Sep 11, 2001

The Banter is better in AusGBS

Toxic Mental posted:

Has anyone considered installing Tesla Coils around Taiwan that zap chinese ships if they get too close

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1h0gsma9TGQ

Their weakness is power, if the Chinese black out the base, nothing will stop them!

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Taima posted:

TSMC would be almost impossible to replace for MANY reasons and it would be anything but a short term issue- it would take possibly decades to get back to where we are now.

But, you're barking up the wrong tree here. Photolithography is catered by ASML which is Dutch.

Trust me there are a bunch of reasons why you're right but photolithography is not one. Do those homies look Taiwanese to u, look at that fat gently caress

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASML_Holding

There's other concerns too though. TSMC is struggling with its newest processes as chips scale down so tiny they begin to experience all manner of wacky physics. It's kind of unclear when the 3NM and 2NM processes will be ready for prime time. This may allow competitors to catch up to some degree if this process takes a really long time but it's too early to tell quite yet.

Don't underestimate TSMC though, the poo poo they make is more comparable to magic than anything else humans make imo. It would be a world-changing development if it were to be destroyed, and Taiwan would likely burn TSMC to the ground before it let China have it.

I've actually been wondering, wouldn't it be possible to load the most important/expensive parts of the fab onto ships and move them to another location? Obviously it would be difficult and expensive to do this safely, but surely not as difficult and expensive as building brand new equipment from scratch, right?

NoiseAnnoys
May 17, 2010

Devils Affricate posted:

I've honestly never seen you post anything that's even partially based in reality

new to greg's oeuvre i see.

Ez8
Aug 5, 2004
I don't use electronics, OP.

edit: (Amish)

r u ready to WALK
Sep 29, 2001

is it really true that the EMP blast from a nuke will destroy all electronics in a wide radius or is that just fearmongering?

if this ruins my vintage amigas and atari collection I'll be real cross

Mega64
May 23, 2008

I took the octopath less travelered,

And it made one-eighth the difference.
This can only be good for Bitcoin.

Ez8
Aug 5, 2004

r u ready to WALK posted:

is it really true that the EMP blast from a nuke will destroy all electronics in a wide radius or is that just fearmongering?

if this ruins my vintage amigas and atari collection I'll be real cross

Submerse them in molten lead to provide a protective barrier.

Panic! At The Tesco
Aug 19, 2005

FART


war... is bad

*applause*

KakerMix
Apr 8, 2004

8.2 M.P.G.
:byetankie:

r u ready to WALK posted:

is it really true that the EMP blast from a nuke will destroy all electronics in a wide radius or is that just fearmongering?

if this ruins my vintage amigas and atari collection I'll be real cross

EMP destroys electronics by inducing electrical currents and arcing in the circuitry itself without it being connected to power, so no your old poo poo isn't safe and those will be roached.

Also to experience an EMP blast like that you'd have to be so close to nuclear ground zero that you have other, bigger things to worry about.

Dumb Sex-Parrot
Dec 25, 2020

r u ready to WALK posted:

is it really true that the EMP blast from a nuke will destroy all electronics in a wide radius or is that just fearmongering?

if this ruins my vintage amigas and atari collection I'll be real cross

wrap them in tin foil and you should be in the clear

Animal-Mother
Feb 14, 2012

RABBIT RABBIT
RABBIT RABBIT
Let's compromise. Taiwan is the legitimate government of mainland China and mainland China is the legitimate government of Taiwan. Everybody's happy.

Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?
If the world is gonna end I have no reason to not blow my money on smoked chickens right

MrQwerty
Apr 15, 2003

The chip shortage haunted us from about May 2020 until the day we shut down the last production run of boards worth money because we ran out of a SMD capacitor that was going to be delivered as soon as July 12.

Manufacturing ended at that plant in February.

I did have half a lot sit in a dry box for 3 months because we had to wait on an opamp that was cycle counted wrong.

MrQwerty fucked around with this message at 16:45 on May 6, 2023

WAR CRIME GIGOLO
Oct 3, 2012

The Hague
tryna get me
for these glutes

I think xi jinping should be elected to the US supreme court

Sucrose
Dec 9, 2009
It would be very dangerous to declare Taiwanese independence or anything, but IMO the thing that will make a Chinese invasion of Taiwan the most unlikely would be if the Chinese think that an invasion of Taiwan would likely be an economy-melting clusterfuck with an uncertain outcome. In short, the more prepared Taiwan is to resist a Chinese invasion, the less likely it is that the Chinese will ever attempt it.

Mr.Acula
May 10, 2009

Billions and billions of fat clouds

WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:

I think xi jinping should be elected to the US supreme court

I think hes fat and an invalid

MrQwerty
Apr 15, 2003

Sucrose posted:

It would be very dangerous to declare Taiwanese independence or anything, but IMO the thing that will make a Chinese invasion of Taiwan the most unlikely would be if the Chinese think that an invasion of Taiwan would likely be an economy-melting clusterfuck with an uncertain outcome. In short, the more prepared Taiwan is to resist a Chinese invasion, the less likely it is that the Chinese will ever attempt it.

They got a dry-run in Ukraine without (some of) the naval warfare and they evidently don't like the results

Turrurrurrurrrrrrr
Dec 22, 2018

I hope this is "battle" enough for you, friend.

Do we absolutely have to have peace?

Ez8
Aug 5, 2004

Turrurrurrurrrrrrr posted:

Do we absolutely have to have peace?

Oh hey, I own Raytheon stock too.

GolfHole
Feb 26, 2004

*looks at doomsday clock*

90 seconds to midnight huh

keep moving the goalposts lads

HonorableTB
Dec 22, 2006

Turrurrurrurrrrrrr posted:

Do we absolutely have to have peace?

Peace through superior firepower

RickRogers
Jun 21, 2020

Woh, is that a thing I like??
We have a new king now, let's ask him

Strategic Tea
Sep 1, 2012

Sucrose posted:

It would be very dangerous to declare Taiwanese independence or anything, but IMO the thing that will make a Chinese invasion of Taiwan the most unlikely would be if the Chinese think that an invasion of Taiwan would likely be an economy-melting clusterfuck with an uncertain outcome. In short, the more prepared Taiwan is to resist a Chinese invasion, the less likely it is that the Chinese will ever attempt it.

For a generation or two, but remember the lessons of Russia. Fascists are loving stupid and eventually they'll launch into pointless destruction to own the libs. Remember when everyone thought Putin was a savvy spymaster and cunning strategist?

Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?
Bad news.... they didn't have any smoked chickens

Duck and Cover
Apr 6, 2007

Fuckstick posted:

The US won’t go to war with China..they’re our best customers and vice versa.

Actually. https://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/statistics/highlights/topcm.html.

Fuckstick
Nov 30, 2000

r u ready to WALK posted:

is it really true that the EMP blast from a nuke will destroy all electronics in a wide radius or is that just fearmongering?

if this ruins my vintage amigas and atari collection I'll be real cross

I heard if you pee on them they’ll recover. Works on jellyfish stings too I guess

DickParasite
Dec 2, 2004


Slippery Tilde

r u ready to WALK posted:

is it really true that the EMP blast from a nuke will destroy all electronics in a wide radius or is that just fearmongering?

Yes and this is why you horde vintage porno mags.

In the post-EMP wasteland who do you think the people will turn to for their needs?

Bula Vinaka
Oct 21, 2020

beach side

Fuckstick posted:

The US won’t go to war with China..they’re our best customers and vice versa.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXT46osICdY

NoiseAnnoys
May 17, 2010

DickParasite posted:

Yes and this is why you horde vintage porno mags.

In the post-EMP wasteland who do you think the people will turn to for their needs?

their imaginations?

Sophy Wackles
Dec 17, 2000

> access main security grid
access: PERMISSION DENIED.





Send GBS goons directly to the front lines imo.

Methanar
Sep 26, 2013

by the sex ghost
liberating taiwan from american capitalism and the legacy of failed dynasties is good

Private Cumshoe
Feb 15, 2019

AAAAAAAGAGHAAHGGAH
The writing was on the wall for that when Nixon visited China really

Methanar
Sep 26, 2013

by the sex ghost
if taiwan didn't want to be invaded they wouldn't be a rebellious province

Private Cumshoe
Feb 15, 2019

AAAAAAAGAGHAAHGGAH
How do we know Japan doesn't have like secret flying jet powered mechs that will activate in the event of an invasion and reclaim Taiwan as a colony maybe they have been building them underground and in secret kind of like when they made that secret spacetime machine for Jodie Foster

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Drone_Fragger
May 9, 2007


Fuckstick posted:

I heard if you pee on them they’ll recover. Works on jellyfish stings too I guess

Im pretty sure some piss guy spread this rumour then kept going "ah, oh, oh no, ive been stung by s jellyfish ah, it hurts!!"

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