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nine-gear crow posted:
But don't ratings in the 90s/00s look like that for almost everything? The amount of available shows grew exponentially and therefore, each individual show had a smaller audience, except maybe Friends and Seinfeld?
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Apr 22, 2024 11:37
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Peggotty posted:But don't ratings in the 90s/00s look like that for almost everything? The amount of available shows grew exponentially and therefore, each individual show had a smaller audience, except maybe Friends and Seinfeld? This kind of context could be instructive, can you provide some examples?
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Apr 22, 2024 12:42
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nine-gear crow posted:
A tangent but curiosity took over and I needed to know what those two episodes with the punishingly low ratings were Turns out it was Voyager s5e21 "Juggernaut" (written by Bryan Fuller) taking out worst rating episode of the franchise, beating Enterprise s3e19 "Damage"
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Apr 22, 2024 13:26
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Seemlar posted:A tangent but curiosity took over and I needed to know what those two episodes with the punishingly low ratings were Note that "Juggernaut" aired six days after the Columbine shootings, so the low rating is not wholly the product of quality or expectations; in addition to people watching news coverage instead, there were probably preemptions and reschedulings in some markets. I think, as usual, we can award Enterprise the true nadir here.
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Apr 22, 2024 13:42
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nine-gear crow posted:
If you peep the Imgur account of the person who made that, they have some other cool Trek statistics. Analysis of viewer ratings/reactions: https://imgur.com/gallery/ieRHR A closer look at DS9 stats: https://imgur.com/gallery/iYYwF
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Apr 22, 2024 13:56
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A.o.D. posted:This kind of context could be instructive, can you provide some examples? Not really, no, that's why I phrased it as a question. It's just something that I remember reading somewhere and it sounded plausible.
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Apr 22, 2024 15:14
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Pretty sure this very thread has mentioned it before
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Apr 22, 2024 15:16
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disaster pastor posted:Note that "Juggernaut" aired six days after the Columbine shootings, so the low rating is not wholly the product of quality or expectations; in addition to people watching news coverage instead, there were probably preemptions and reschedulings in some markets. I think, as usual, we can award Enterprise the true nadir here. Also ‘Damage’ was the first episode after a long break (IIRC it was something like 6 weeks) - depending on how it was promoted people might not have realized it was back. It would be interesting to see what impact extended breaks had on the viewing figures of the first new episode.
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Apr 22, 2024 16:47
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No Dignity posted:It's wild in those days a show could have a rollercoaster descent down the ratings and still get seven seasons and end on its own terms DS9 was in syndication and VOY was on a network owned by Paramount itself at the time and was basically the only thing people were tuning into that network to watch before they got WWE Smackdown. I imagine those factors helped a bit in keeping both shows alive. Like how Discovery would have been killed after its first season if it was on any other platform but P+ and the only reason it got axed was because Paramount was/is bleeding money like it's the blow out valve on the Hoover Dam and Disco is expensive as poo poo.
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Apr 22, 2024 17:17
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nine-gear crow posted:VOY was on a network owned by Paramount itself at the time Co-owned by Paramount. The other partner in the UPN venture was Chris-Craft Industries (yes, the boat company). And I don't think Paramount actually had any ownership of UPN until 1997, now that I think about it.
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Apr 22, 2024 17:56
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Timby posted:Co-owned by Paramount. The other partner in the UPN venture was Chris-Craft Industries (yes, the boat company). And I don't think Paramount actually had any ownership of UPN until 1997, now that I think about it. this is a good video series (2 parts, plus some corrections) about what the gently caress was going on with UPN: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVwcD66KUSY
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Apr 22, 2024 18:51
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Peggotty posted:But don't ratings in the 90s/00s look like that for almost everything? The amount of available shows grew exponentially and therefore, each individual show had a smaller audience, except maybe Friends and Seinfeld? Eh, not really in the 90s. There were more channels, but not really that much more programming on them - most of them were largely just cheap to play reruns that you put on if there was nothing new you wanted to watch. Looking at genre shows around the same time, Buffy largely only dipped in its last series, Farscape stayed steady throughout it's run, Sliders fell off a cliff half way through the first season but then stayed steady until the end, Xfiles grew to a peak, fell a few years in, but steadied above where it started, and then completely collapsed towards the end. Shows that plummeted tended to be shows that had just outstayed their welcome, which for a lot of people was probably somewhere around TNG S7. People were just done Star Trekkin' for a while by 1995. You don't really see the trend you said until DVRs came in, and you could just queue up everything you thought you want to watch instead of watching something you were only kinda into because it was all that was on that evening. Plus ratings didn't count DVR viewing for years for....some reason, I never quite got?
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Apr 22, 2024 19:10
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GATOS Y VATOS posted:Yeah especially because 6 is a really important one for me. I don't want to buy the 4K set unless it's included. I always loved the idea of the 5+1 VHS set (which we had) "Why the gently caress should we redo the tape sleeves for the new box set? The nerds aren't going to care!" 
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Apr 22, 2024 19:13
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Phy posted:I always loved the idea of the 5+1 VHS set (which we had) honestly i kind of like the symbolism of the undiscovered country being enterprise-free and heading out into open space. fits the name and the themes pretty well.
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Apr 22, 2024 19:18
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The sleeve for VI should have a little pair of gravity boots floating through space
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Apr 22, 2024 19:26
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Phy posted:I always loved the idea of the 5+1 VHS set (which we had) Yeah I have this set too, I wonder where I left it…
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Apr 22, 2024 19:38
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Honestly kinda baffled at the mere idea of this tactical cop bullshit also somehow being someone’s Star Trek cosplay https://twitter.com/starfleethist/status/1782491852417138980?s=46&t=YuqSROOCXrcRx1gn_5vV7Q
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Apr 23, 2024 15:04
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There are always gonna be people who see something like Section 31 and think they're the good guys. And there are people who like hardcore milsim and also like the aesthetics of Star Trek and want to combine the two, no matter how much it's arguably against the spirit of Trek. Other franchises are a better fit for that approach, but like, I didn't grow up watching a Warhammer 40k TV show every week, I watched Star Trek. I mean, ADB has been doing their Star Fleet Battles game for years and years, and their whole approach to Star Trek is just space combat. Now I want to find that old b&w shareware Star Trek game. The one where you just roam a procedurally generated star map fighting Klingons and refueling at space stations. Halloween Jack fucked around with this message at 15:24 on Apr 23, 2024 |
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Apr 23, 2024 15:13
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PICARD: What? That nonsense is centuries behind us.
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Apr 23, 2024 15:18
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Peggotty posted:But don't ratings in the 90s/00s look like that for almost everything? The amount of available shows grew exponentially and therefore, each individual show had a smaller audience, except maybe Friends and Seinfeld? Yeah, I think that graph is missing a 'mean ratings for TV in general curve' as a point of comparison
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Apr 23, 2024 15:29
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Honestly kinda baffled at the mere idea of this tactical cop bullshit also somehow being someone’s Star Trek cosplay "...to the sands of Cestus III." Cestus III was the planet where Kirk fought the Gorn captain thanks to the Metrons. He did it without any tactilol gear, but rather an improvised arquebus (or some similar archaic black powder weapon; not an expert myself in the terminology). He was a Starfleet officer, not a "Marine." And the situation was resolved ultimately through the abandonment of violence and fighting, not through further infliction of pain. In other words, completely missing the point. Halloween Jack posted:I mean, ADB has been doing their Star Fleet Battles game for years and years, and their whole approach to Star Trek is just space combat. But this is an outgrowth of the SFB license and mentality. They had the rights to the blueprints but not literary elements, and were a bunch of engineers and wargamers, so what sort of game were they going to make? Not a co-op mission-based skill game like Star Trek: Expeditions. Admiralty Flag fucked around with this message at 15:36 on Apr 23, 2024 |
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Apr 23, 2024 15:32
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It's been a while since I checked in on those guys, but I remember Steve Cole talking about what he'd do if he were in charge of Star Trek, and he talked about "bringing some military sense to the scripts." I just get the impression that they have very, like, conservative-leaning 70s New Wave Sci Fi old man ideas about how to do science fiction.
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Apr 23, 2024 15:54
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Admiralty Flag posted:
Perhaps the marines started the baseball league that was thriving on Cestus III a hundred years later.
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Apr 23, 2024 16:11
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Hot take here but maybe the peaceful exploration organization shouldn’t have marines at all
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Apr 23, 2024 16:19
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I'd like to see a sci-fi franchise that completely dispenses with naval tradition. Spaceships aren't boats! An aggressive space military doesn't need marines either!
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Apr 23, 2024 16:29
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Hot take here but maybe the peaceful exploration organization shouldn’t have marines at all We desire peaceful exploration *builds a heavily armed armada that goes toe to toe with every imperial power in the quadrant*
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Apr 23, 2024 16:30
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Halloween Jack posted:I'd like to see a sci-fi franchise that completely dispenses with naval tradition. Spaceships aren't boats! An aggressive space military doesn't need marines either! I'd like to see the opposite where an Age of Sail culture is Uplifted to warp capability and maintains every aspect of naval tradition, including rigging, hardtack, cannonade broadsides and rum/lash motivation
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Apr 23, 2024 16:35
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Soul Dentist posted:I'd like to see the opposite where an Age of Sail culture is Uplifted to warp capability and maintains every aspect of naval tradition, including rigging, hardtack, cannonade broadsides and rum/lash motivation This is Spelljammer
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Apr 23, 2024 16:41
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Soul Dentist posted:I'd like to see the opposite where an Age of Sail culture is Uplifted to warp capability and maintains every aspect of naval tradition, including rigging, hardtack, cannonade broadsides and rum/lash motivation  Treasure Planet but serious.Rebel Moon 2 had evil space battleships powered by space stokers shoveling space coal. Good touch imo
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Apr 23, 2024 16:42
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Don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but Saurian brandy, jamaharon, and the agony booth.
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Apr 23, 2024 16:43
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Soul Dentist posted:I'd like to see the opposite where an Age of Sail culture is Uplifted to warp capability and maintains every aspect of naval tradition, including rigging, hardtack, cannonade broadsides and rum/lash motivation The current Trek TTRPG system has a setting book where one of the native species is kind of like this: It's actually pretty neat as a concept, in that the Federation are unclear if interacting with them counts as breaking the Prime Directive because they CAN build warp drives and spacecraft, it's just that their culture is such that they don't. So their society is pretty much Age of Sail in aesthetic and technology, but if they see a phaser they're like, "oh cool, is that using a phlebotnum power cell or unobtanium?"
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Apr 23, 2024 16:58
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Soul Dentist posted:I'd like to see the opposite where an Age of Sail culture is Uplifted to warp capability and maintains every aspect of naval tradition, including rigging, hardtack, cannonade broadsides and rum/lash motivation And the buggering. So, so much buggering.
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Apr 23, 2024 17:45
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Honestly kinda baffled at the mere idea of this tactical cop bullshit also somehow being someone’s Star Trek cosplay lol If you want to do your tacticool Star Trek cosplay you can dress up as a MACO! That's actually in the loving show!
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Apr 23, 2024 17:45
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Honestly kinda baffled at the mere idea of this tactical cop bullshit also somehow being someone’s Star Trek cosplay
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Apr 23, 2024 17:54
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Gaz-L posted:The current Trek TTRPG system has a setting book where one of the native species is kind of like this: It's actually pretty neat as a concept, in that the Federation are unclear if interacting with them counts as breaking the Prime Directive because they CAN build warp drives and spacecraft, it's just that their culture is such that they don't. So their society is pretty much Age of Sail in aesthetic and technology, but if they see a phaser they're like, "oh cool, is that using a phlebotnum power cell or unobtanium?" Kinda sounds like the Ba'Ku from Insurrection, but not so much the age of sail aesthetic.
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Apr 23, 2024 17:54
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Halloween Jack posted:It's been a while since I checked in on those guys, but I remember Steve Cole talking about what he'd do if he were in charge of Star Trek, and he talked about "bringing some military sense to the scripts." I just get the impression that they have very, like, conservative-leaning 70s New Wave Sci Fi old man ideas about how to do science fiction. People getting geared up to act as weekened warriors are a joke, yet Star Trek hasn't been a stranger to adding military or naval aspects to the series or movies. Star Trek II is famous for this due to Roddenberry hating the naval or military traits that were put into the structure of the movie. He believed the film to be about the action and violence, this he didn't care for. He was even upset Kirk killed the slug that came out of Chekov's ear instead of collecting it to study. The guy got so petty about everything he started to leak the fact Spock was going to die. It's why we got the opening we did to trick those who heard the rumor. Didn't stop him from trying to spoil other future movies with his hissy fits. If he hadn't died decades ago seeing MACO being a thing would have gave him an outright heart attack. In conclusion Tactical RP'ers that get geared up and think they are bad rear end are pathetic. Star Trek was always better off away from Roddenberry
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Apr 23, 2024 18:09
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Soul Dentist posted:I'd like to see the opposite where an Age of Sail culture is Uplifted to warp capability and maintains every aspect of naval tradition, including rigging, hardtack, cannonade broadsides and rum/lash motivation Look up the short story The Road Not Taken by Harry Turtledove.
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Apr 23, 2024 18:10
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There are so many things that Roddenberry apparently didn't want to be part of Star Trek, including zippers, that it makes me wonder what a Trek series would look like if every episode had to satisfy his conception of it 100%. Uncharitably, it seems like every episode would be some kind of psychosexual drama that happens due to the manipulations of godlike beings or people developing reality-warping superpowers.
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Apr 23, 2024 18:17
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Powered Descent posted:Look up the short story The Road Not Taken by Harry Turtledove. Just read the wikipedia summary, I love a good asymmetrical species story. Everything in Star Trek is too same sometimes, aliens all developed along the same trajectory, at the same speed, at about the same time. They just evolved slightly different foreheads.
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Apr 23, 2024 18:21
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Halloween Jack posted:Don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but Saurian brandy, jamaharon, and the agony booth. 
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