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My feedback and suggestion is that maybe Toshimo didn't need his dick sucked about how good and right he is while giving him a tiny slap on the wrist for dancing on a man's grave
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Sep 10, 2023 17:43
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Magnetic North posted:Wait, how did Framboise hand out a 1 day probe? Aren't they an IK? IKs can queue whatever, they just have a lower threshold for what automatically goes through without approval
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Sep 10, 2023 18:15
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Those are a lot of words to describe bad moderation and no words about how you plan to address it
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Sep 10, 2023 21:50
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I've read your post again and it seems like maybe you think I was arguing for a lighter punishment. Can you clarify?
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Sep 10, 2023 22:08
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Leperflesh posted:it sounds like you think Framboise agreed with dancing on the grave of a dead guy, and he didn't and I don't either. It also sounded like you thought that post should have gotten a longer probation: framboise suggested a 24 and I thought that was reasonable. These are judgement calls. If you (TG mods and IKs) want to give someone a probation for, as you said, a grotesque post then the probe reason can just be "grotesque post, dancing on the grave of a guy who just died". If you don't want people to think you actually agree with the person being probated then you probably shouldn't type two mealy-mouthed paragraphs that say, "I don't disagree". Twice. That might give people the impression that you don't disagree, which is what all the people who posted here about it have told you. Whatever you thought that message conveyed, it did the opposite. Maybe if the probation was something meaningful then people would have thought perhaps they were misinterpreting the message. But it was a day. As you said, "pretty minor". So the overall picture is not a good one
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Sep 11, 2023 00:46
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Kai Tave posted:What is even the point of this thread? Every time feedback is given on moderation it seems the response is just "sorry we're not going to do anything different because that would involve actual effort." Actually the response is Framboise posted:Take the boneheaded histrionics and stuff it So ironically I agree with what you said but not the tone
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Sep 11, 2023 00:59
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Framboise posted:You said I was "sucking his dick" about it when all I did was agree with the notion that people should be paid for the work they do but it wasn't a good time to bring that up, and that the "Good riddance" comment was hosed up and lovely. So yeah, sounds pretty overdramatic to me and you can, in fact, stuff it. You know what, fair enough. It was an unnecessarily aggro way to raise my complaint with the way the post was handled. I've felt like my feedback in TG has been dismissed or minimised in the past but you weren't involved in that and I shouldn't have brought that energy to this issue. I'm sorry
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Sep 11, 2023 01:51
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Framboise posted:Please understand that I was asked to IK the thread and I agreed to do so on the condition that I'm not expected to be terminally online in the thread and will help out now and then, and wanted to do so in a minimally invasive way. This is the first time I've seen anyone complain about your decisions, outside of the thread that was deemed to be enough of a mess to need you as a dedicated IK. I don't even know if they've complained about you in that thread other than the guy I saw whining about tone policing in response to this probe. By SA standards, that's pretty loving good! Seriously. And this situation wasn't that big a deal. I'd have liked a longer probe and a less conciliatory probe reason, that's it. Again, by SA standards this is small stuff. Clearly the rest of the TG mod team has your back still, tempers have cooled, no is asking for your head. The worst has passed. Captain Invictus posted:my suggestion was that toshimo should just be threadbanned from the mtg thread, but I was rebuked. this pussyfooting around a poster like toshimo has, demonstrably, not done anything to stop them being who they are. multiple people, most prominently pablo nergigante, have said they stopped reading the mtg thread because of crazy aggro posters like toshimo, and I would trade toshimo for pablo in a loving heartbeat Yeah I agree with this. I've previously defended Toshimo as aggressive but generally correct in the EDH thread, so my hands are not clean here, but as I've read more and more threads all across the forum I keep seeing people I like say that they're into MTG or board games but that TG is too aggro and/or miserable and I don't want that. People have said this place reminds them of the bad days of video games (the forum) before it was cleaned up by video games (the admin), so if TG mods want some advice on making this a happier place to post about poo poo that should be fun I know who I'd talk to
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Sep 11, 2023 03:00
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Framboise posted:I didn't even know until now that I was the subject of yet another thread until now, so that's fun. The probe got mentioned in the SAD small questions thread and they've already moved on to cspam drama
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Sep 11, 2023 03:05
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Tekopo posted:Thank you for your service He was thread banned from Path of Exile video game thread for recommending unplayable builds
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Sep 12, 2023 23:53
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sebmojo posted:he made his own PMF thread for posting terrible builds into the ether If you motherfuckers (goons collectively) get me to read two PMF threads in one day so help me god Leperflesh posted:I'm told threadbans have been effective in the politics forums, but are also a maintenance nightmare because there's no actual support for them in the forums software. Threadbans that I've seen work best are the ones where the thread regulars are all supportive of it because they'll be glad the person is gone and report pretty reliably if they pop back up. There were a couple in the ukmt in d&d that everyone hated and they always got promptly bopped for trying to make a return.
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Sep 13, 2023 05:13
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Nuns with Guns posted:I think there is a point to be made that Jeffrey did say something to the effect of "If someone sucks in a general sense, but isn't terrible enough to prompt strong mod action, this website is the kind of place that's welcome to tell them to gently caress off until they do." I'm sure that's not exactly what he said but there was some sentiment expressed in that way. My expectation, were I to do that in TG, would be that I would get probated and the person I was telling to gently caress off would get away clean
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Sep 13, 2023 17:45
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Vando posted:However, I'm pretty sure that when multiple people are making the same misreading it absolutely is on the person being misread to do a better job at communicating and not the readers to magically have the intended interpretation appear in their brains. Pages and pages of people saying the LC message for Toshimo's probe sucks and Leperflesh telling them that actually it's perfectly clear and they're intentionally reading the worst into it suggests TG mods do not agree with you
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Sep 13, 2023 18:11
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I'm glad I got distracted before posting that I thought Arivia had been more chill lately. Good grief.Leperflesh posted:You have an incredible talent for taking the barest hint of charity or conciliatory tone and openly interpreting it as an admission of guilt for some profound wrong done to you. Everyone, absolutely everyone here, loving hates it, and as literally the most tolerant mod on SA for your poo poo, your habit of vigorously biting the hand offered to you is self-destructive as hell. We haven't been seeing eye to eye all that much in this thread but this is right on the money.
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Sep 13, 2023 20:28
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Leperflesh posted:Because as I just said, I believe I was seeing a long-term positive trend. My first reflex when talking to people who have a posting problem is to try to work towards them solving their problems and if I see results I think that's the best outcome. This is the right instinct imo. I think you have been overvaluing progress with what you see as long term project posters vs. the overall health of the community. While you might have data that says someone is improving because you can see that their probations are getting further apart, you have to remember that most people are responding emotionally to the way that those posters make threads feel.
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Sep 13, 2023 20:36
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Leperflesh posted:I don't like or want to be a punching bag or a pushover and I don't want to act or fail to act out of fear of being yelled at. I do want to foster a sense that no matter what our pre-existing relationship, any poster can come to me in public or private with any issue and know that I will at least listen and do my best to be fair, and if I know I cannot, I'll recuse myself and hand off to a co-mod or admin or, occasionally when the stakes are very low, an IK. When anyone is telling me I've got it wrong I am going to do my best to listen, even if it's someone who has a long long history of weaponizing those discussions, because the day I stop listening is the day I shouldn't be a mod any more. Well, as someone who might very well have pissed you off by pushing the domino that led to an IK you were happy with quitting, I think you do a pretty good job living up to this standard. I don't always agree with you but I haven't felt you've been unfair to me at any point in this discussion Leperflesh posted:It's a basic truth that everything a mod posts "as a mod" like on duty, can and will be dissected word for word for any flaw or misstatement or hint of bias or contempt etc. etc. People in SAD complain of "mod voice" but it's just a natural adjustment you make in response to being held to account for every word by an audience that is highly motivated to find fault. I don't think this is universally true and it's also a spectrum rather than a binary. I think that it's possible to adjust too far and create more distance between yourself and users, which leads to more dissection and then we're in another undesirable feedback loop. Maybe I'm not the right person to comment on this though since I'm generally ok with mods being a bit more formal if that makes them more comfortable, but I definitely get a weird vibe if a post feels like it's trying to pre-emptively shut off every possible counter argument
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Sep 13, 2023 21:46
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Leperflesh posted:If you are hanging around in the painting thread or the historicals thread or the yu-gi-oh thread or the gloomhaven thread, and you see bad posting, I invite you (this is the collective you) to file the first report that thread has had in years. Multiple people itt have told you that they just don't report any more because they don't think it will achieve anything
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Sep 16, 2023 15:56
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sebmojo posted:oh that button (laughs politely) do you take me for a villain in a Republic serial This vibe tbh https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krsj2bcnRlM
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Sep 17, 2023 23:39
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Framboise posted:Trad Games: Watch your perception of money change in real time as you try to justify spending over $100 on a single cardboard rectangle Ouch
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Nov 3, 2023 16:20
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