|
DBD still sucks, but TCM has been fun so far. Although Johnny feels like a bad jack of all trades, he can't kill you like Bubba, he can't chase you like Hitchhiker or Sissy, he doesn't have any powerful utility like Cook, it feels like he finds your footsteps and 99% of the time it just leads to something he can't get past while the victim's long gone, hell I was playing a level 0, no points invested at all Sonny yesterday, just kept slipping between one of the small gaps on this Johnny over and over and over, nobody else ever came to do anything and he DC'd after enough of it, literally helpless in the face of my ability to turn sideways. I've seen some people suggest that maybe in the face of a redesign, he could like, put some corrugated metal or something on top of wells like a hatch, which victims would need to struggle to pull off for a second and honestly that'd be cool, but I feel like that ain't happening. Yardbomb fucked around with this message at 12:10 on Aug 28, 2023 |
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 12:01
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 19:37 |
|
|
I haven’t played hitch or cook yet but yeah johnny is for lf mains that dont get lf. I think going stamina/bloodgathering on him might be best. Force utility
canada jezus fucked around with this message at 12:33 on Aug 28, 2023 |
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 12:27
|
|
|
Yardbomb posted:DBD still sucks, but TCM has been fun so far. That'd be neat. Blocking off the places the survivors can worm through would make it a fun choice between risking doubling back and Johnny getting you or trying to push forward into who knows what.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 12:27
|
|
|
canada jezus posted:I haven’t played hitch or cook yet but yeah johnny is for lf mains that dont get lf. I think going stamina/bloodgathering on him might be best. Force utility Next time you're on gas station map try out Cook, he may as well be a requirement on it to stop people from getting the actual gas station exit as easily as they do, with his padlocks making it take marginally longer. That and while he's a slow little old man, he hits harder than people think he will, which has gotten me some fun kills.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 12:54
|
|
|
That 10 stamina fills me with all kinds of dread Edit:i also still have trouble with the maps. canada jezus fucked around with this message at 13:05 on Aug 28, 2023 |
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 13:01
|
|
|
canada jezus posted:That 10 stamina fills me with all kinds of dread Really he's not bad for learning the map on either imo, him and Hitchhiker might be the best blood collectors for grampy feeding, so you'll start noticing more and more where those drain buckets are, plus Cook is just flatly nice for even obvious stuff, slap a padlock on the front door of the family house, put one on that sorta back porch door that exits to the backyard etc. and you're already bringing some value even if you just trundle around the map the rest of the game. That and typically nobody will begrudge you if you're not getting sikk killstreaks like Leatherface would when you're the old Cook with his arthritis.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 13:08
|
|
|
my little brother plays this game religiously so back earlier this year when i was living at home again, at nearly all hours of the day id step out into the hallway and hear AAAUUUUGGHH and AAAIIIYYYEEEEEEE and the sounds of beaten jello
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 13:35
|
|
|
Yardbomb posted:DBD still sucks, but TCM has been fun so far. Johnny's power is also pretty hard to use imo. The few times I've played him I've found that you basically have to be standing on top of the footprints for them to spawn in, and if you aren't quick enough on the draw you have to kind of wiggle around trying to get them to spawn again in order to interact.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 13:52
|
|
|
CuddleCryptid posted:Johnny's power is also pretty hard to use imo. The few times I've played him I've found that you basically have to be standing on top of the footprints for them to spawn in, and if you aren't quick enough on the draw you have to kind of wiggle around trying to get them to spawn again in order to interact. Yeeeah, he's definitely the most lacking family-side right now it feels like, he ends up just being kind of another body on patrol duty. I do hope they help him out somehow though, cause he's a good looking dude and I wish I felt like playing him more.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 13:56
|
|
|
Didn't get a whole lot of time to play TCM this weekend, but man is it more confusing and difficult and deep than you'd think just watching streams. Especially for Victims, like you think passively watching a streamer it's going to be boring and repetitive, no tension, just do tasks and repeat but nope, it's scary as hell when you're mid-action and you hear a chainsaw getting closer. I tried Victim a few times, I think my record for staying alive was like five minutes. Never made it out of the basement. The Killer side is an entirely different game. The horror is gone, and you're just trying to get those drat kids off your lawn and keep your Grandpa hydrated. I think I'm going to stick with Killer for a while to learn the maps, learn the limitations of the Killer side and use whatever skill points I don't put into the family into my Victims of choice. It seems like it'll be a lot of fun, for a while at least. I was skeptical but it's actually pretty good!
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 14:07
|
|
|
Johnny has a very strong use that I think you guys are sleeping on. You absolutely cannot hide in a bush anywhere if he's looking for you, in any direction. I've lost countless matches because I was flushed into an area and managed to dodge two other killers by hiding around a corner in the dark or in a bush somewhere, but then Johnny comes along and ruins it because he can find my footprints and know exactly where I am. Even if he can't immediately catch me himself, the fact that he forces mebout into the open where other killers can also see me practically guarantees I die in situations like that, which are way more common than you'd think. Cook has to at least have a general idea of your location to find you and being behind him makes it a lot more complicated for him to find you, but that doesn't affect Johnny. There aren't any scratch marks in this game so losing Killers is way easier as long as you have even a little bit of distance on them or there are a bunch of corners where they have to guess them where you went. That doesn't affect Johnny. Umbreon fucked around with this message at 14:26 on Aug 28, 2023 |
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 14:24
|
|
|
Yeah Johnny has the potential to be very strong, he just is mechanically implemented in a really weird way. It seems like if they wanted to do the footprints the way they are now, where you have to be really close, notice them, and then interact with them to make it work then it shouldn't be a cooldown power. If they want a cooldown on it then just having the paths appear without having to interact with the prints would be more fitting. Both of those would probably end up OP to some extent which is probably why they make you do both, but the weird middle ground he's in make it awkward to use. A good middle ground might be to have footprints appear but have the ability go on cooldown if you interact with them to actually track them. It would still be very strong since you wouldn't need to interact to know someone was in the area, but you'd still need to pop the power if you want more detail.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 14:33
|
|
|
My problem with Johnny, the one time I played him, was that I'd be chasing somebody so I knew for a fact they came through an area, but then I'd pop my ability and wouldn't see a "clue" anywhere. Unless I'm just missing something, or the clue system can put footprints in places where you can't find it like inside the tall grass or stuck under the floor.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 14:59
|
|
|
Pyrolocutus posted:Killer Klowns From Outer Space is going to be the next contender (to get knocked out after a few months). Added to OP.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 15:09
|
|
|
King Vidiot posted:My problem with Johnny, the one time I played him, was that I'd be chasing somebody so I knew for a fact they came through an area, but then I'd pop my ability and wouldn't see a "clue" anywhere. Unless I'm just missing something, or the clue system can put footprints in places where you can't find it like inside the tall grass or stuck under the floor. They tend to spawn right in front of you in a way that can easily cause you to run right over it. I would guess any surface is valid as well so tall grass would work. They glow yellow to help with this but they are easy to miss. I once triggered it while looking at the other two killers slicing up a guy who ran for the front gate of the family house, so just a wide open road with no obstructions, and it was still hard to make work.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 15:15
|
|
|
Relyssa posted:Added to OP. There's also Ghostbusters: Spirits Unleashed which is an assymetrical as well.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 15:16
|
|
|
Medullah posted:There's also Ghostbusters: Spirits Unleashed which is an assymetrical as well. Added, thank you.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 15:28
|
|
|
Medullah posted:There's also Ghostbusters: Spirits Unleashed which is an assymetrical as well. I always forget that one exists and it seems a shame because historically busting has made me feel good but I remember seeing of the originals you could only play Ray and Winston which felt weird. At least throw in some people from Extreme Ghostbusters or Answer the Call.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 15:31
|
|
|
Dawgstar posted:I always forget that one exists and it seems a shame because historically busting has made me feel good but I remember seeing of the originals you could only play Ray and Winston which felt weird. At least throw in some people from Extreme Ghostbusters or Answer the Call. I bought it and Evil Dead full price because the guys I play DBD with were all in on them (Ghostbusters specifically). The week it came out I was in Vegas for work so I didn't get a chance to play the opening weekend, which they did all weekend....and then never played again. It's the main reason I didn't buy TCM at launch, I hate playing with random teams in DBD, I really only play Survivor as SWF, only playing alone if I've got a specific challenge I'm going after. Otherwise I play killer if I'm playing alone. For the OP, another suggestion is to move the roadmap closer to the top so returning players can get a rough estimate of where the game is at. Edit - The biggest problem with Evil Dead and Ghostbusters that caused them to be largely DOA, the fact that they were Epic store exclusive.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 15:41
|
|
|
Medullah posted:For the OP, another suggestion is to move the roadmap closer to the top so returning players can get a rough estimate of where the game is at. Good shout, moved it to the top of the second post.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 15:56
|
|
|
Umbreon posted:Johnny has a very strong use that I think you guys are sleeping on. You absolutely cannot hide in a bush anywhere if he's looking for you, in any direction. I've lost countless matches because I was flushed into an area and managed to dodge two other killers by hiding around a corner in the dark or in a bush somewhere, but then Johnny comes along and ruins it because he can find my footprints and know exactly where I am. Even if he can't immediately catch me himself, the fact that he forces mebout into the open where other killers can also see me practically guarantees I die in situations like that, which are way more common than you'd think. Cook has to at least have a general idea of your location to find you and being behind him makes it a lot more complicated for him to find you, but that doesn't affect Johnny. I didn't manage to get his power working properly the times i played him but noted. I also don't have him at 10 yet. Gotta say its hilarious to me that i main the same killer in two games with the same cosmetics. I also make bank as lf, 2000points are no an exception. Does perk progress go away if you respec? Side not updating nvidia drivers did good work for game stability and framerate. edit: seems like perk progress stays. Thank god. canada jezus fucked around with this message at 16:14 on Aug 28, 2023 |
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 16:12
|
|
|
Medullah posted:The biggest problem with Evil Dead and Ghostbusters that caused them to be largely DOA, the fact that they were Epic store exclusive. I played quite a bit of the game at launch and imo the problems with Evil Dead went deeper than that. Due to how the spawns worked survivors had to stay together and move from place to place as one, and doing that with randoms was like herding cats. On the other hand, if you had a team that was sticking together and using their perks then it was essentially impossible to win as a killer. That changes as you go up the tech tree but if a game isn't balanced at level 1 then you are going to lose most of your base. On a ground level there was also some gamebreaking issues that didn't really have a workaround. Doing execution moves on staggered enemies made survivors invincible during the animation, which was necessary or you would just get mobbed and a key way to regain resources would be useless. But that meant that survivors could grab a high stagger weapons and chain those animations together tight enough that they would be able to avoid 99% of damage on an objective, including from the boss spawn. A few characters had truly gamebreaking perks, like the one with the infinite ammo special that was nerfed soon after launch because it was insane on anyone with decent aim. Killers had to burst hard on groups to actually down them which means that 90% of fights was just generating XP for the powers system, and that meant that matches were always long as hell. You could revive survivors but doing so usually meant having to go back for their gear, which is good from a meta angle but is annoying to a player. It just had enough gaps in the design that playing it outside of a group (for survivor) was frustrating and playing it as killer against a group or good solo survivors was maddening CuddleCryptid fucked around with this message at 17:13 on Aug 28, 2023 |
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 17:11
|
|
|
CuddleCryptid posted:It just had enough gaps in the design that playing it outside of a group (for survivor) was frustrating and playing it as killer against a group or good solo survivors was maddening Also it seemed like they ran into some licensing issues and couldn't release any new content for a while?
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 17:14
|
|
|
CuddleCryptid posted:It just had enough gaps in the design that playing it outside of a group (for survivor) was frustrating and playing it as killer against a group or good solo survivors was maddening Which leads us to a second problem that, judging by thread chatter, both Evil Dead and Ghostbusters had: they both had advancement schemes where a new player cannot play with an experienced player and actually have a decent time. Evil Dead has a big meaty skill tree for every character that give you major upgrades for the core gameplay, and if someone with a fully unlocked skill tree is matched against someone who just started the person with the skill tree is going to win on raw numbers. Ghostbusters' balance was fun at the start, but the busters get upgrades and the ghosts don't so the match balance got worse immediately. Games in this genre already have a massive skill difference between new and experienced players. This just makes the problem so much worse. Of course, there's two reasons I think DBD isn't hit as hard by this. One, advancement in DBD just isn't that deep. Once you have four good-enough perks at tier 3, any advancement from there on that character is basically just giving you a wider variety of potential builds. Even as a new player, you can get a decent starter build going after like four games if you're playing a character with decent starting perks and you're basically as good mechanically as any other player. Two, the gameplay itself has a very simple win/lose state. It's not a big L4D-style team shooter where you're slowly bleeding resources and if your skills give you too many resources your opponent can't interact with. You just run in a circle and when one side gets hit twice they lose. The perks (barring a few huge balance gently caress-ups like the period where Dead Hard may as well have been a third injury state) are never so important that the core gameplay loop breaks. Even if a new player goes against a max-rank opponent, they can technically still play the game without it being invalidated entirely. (While I haven't looked too closely at TCM, I'm pretty confident it will fall closer to DBD than Evil Dead here. The core gameplay seems like it's built on "survivors run away from killers, and if they get cornered they just die", and I don't think they'll make perks so busted that it short circuits that whole dynamic.)
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 17:49
|
|
|
Lurks With Wolves posted:And I don't think they'll make perks so busted that it short circuits that whole dynamic. Oh they already did a bit, mainly some of Connie's perks are dumb as hell and are almost always the culprit as to why you'll occasionally see like, 2 minute escapes, because she gets to skip locks existing.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 17:52
|
|
|
Lurks With Wolves posted:
Yeah, plus with Stranger Things going into the vault, you have a pretty decent set of perks that are general perks so you're pretty good with whatever character you decide to start with. Self-Aware is a great movement speed buff plus helps you understand scratch marks, Inner Healing is a pretty good "oh poo poo I need to heal" perk. All three of Steve's perks aren't bad if you don't have any other option. Add Resilience, Kindred, Deja Vu (my current must have on any build perk), We'll Make It, Spine Chill, etc and you have quite a few options even if you've only got the basic survivors.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 17:59
|
|
|
Lurks With Wolves posted:Which leads us to a second problem that, judging by thread chatter, both Evil Dead and Ghostbusters had: they both had advancement schemes where a new player cannot play with an experienced player and actually have a decent time. Evil Dead has a big meaty skill tree for every character that give you major upgrades for the core gameplay, and if someone with a fully unlocked skill tree is matched against someone who just started the person with the skill tree is going to win on raw numbers. Ghostbusters' balance was fun at the start, but the busters get upgrades and the ghosts don't so the match balance got worse immediately. Games in this genre already have a massive skill difference between new and experienced players. This just makes the problem so much worse. Imo DBD also benefits the "newbie survivor vs master killer" match up because getting caught and then hooked is the newbie experience anyways. You get chances to escape it, more experienced survivors can rescue and heal you, and generally it's just the normal experience but much faster. And since chase perks are so popular if you are a spooked newbie and hide a lot then it has even less of an effect on you. Whereas in games like Evil Dead it is more "you just can't do this objective now and the game is over because the boss has a 50% damage boost that you are mathematically unable to overcome, and now the game is over". There is also the issue that when you get unhooked in DBD you are injured but are otherwise reset to a neutral state. By most metrics it is actually a pretty forgiving system. In Evil Dead if you have to get rezzed then you lose all your weapons and items, and you have to either go back for them while under attack and weak, or give up and hope you find something good later while touting the first poo poo weapon you find lying around. CuddleCryptid fucked around with this message at 18:33 on Aug 28, 2023 |
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 18:30
|
|
|
Evil Dead's main issue is that it's an asymmetrical game instead of just a co-op horde shooter/beat-em-up. Everything would've been better if they just jettisoned the entire Kandarian Demon play option and they just had a generic AI "director" like L4D's campaign mode, then beefed it up and balanced it. I mean, you could just play co-op without a human demon, but the game seems like it was balanced around having a human player on the other side. Asymmetrical games are fine and good, but not every drat licensed horror game needs to be a team-based, player-vs-player multiplayer game 
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 19:37
|
|
|
And here I was going to say that the ideal Evil Dead game would be team based from the side of the Deadites where you torture NPCs for high scores.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 19:43
|
|
|
Fair enough, or a The Thing type game where one player starts as a deadite and every player they kill turns into a deadite. And like F13, have a way to call Ash on a ham radio or whatever. Ash mains can lobby up solo, waiting for the call.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 19:59
|
|
|
Voice chat in lobbies getting a little too spicy for me already. Kinda sad, helps a lot if you can call out dudes to your teammates.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 22:30
|
|
|
I need to hunt down other goons that also suck at this game and we all suck together in fun matches for an evening.
|
|
#
?
Aug 28, 2023 23:32
|
|
|
canada jezus posted:Voice chat in lobbies getting a little too spicy for me already. Kinda sad, helps a lot if you can call out dudes to your teammates. First word a friend heard on TCM's chat was a... Heated Gamer Word from some 13 year old. He hasn't turned it on since.
|
|
#
?
Aug 29, 2023 00:14
|
|
|
Zeg posted:I need to hunt down other goons that also suck at this game and we all suck together in fun matches for an evening. There's the co-op discord. https://discord.gg/7jchqejN
|
|
#
?
Aug 29, 2023 00:27
|
|
|
Dawgstar posted:First word a friend heard on TCM's chat was a... Heated Gamer Word from some 13 year old. He hasn't turned it on since. The literal first thing I do to a voice chat in games nowadays is turn it the gently caress off, so I can't say I blame him. Overwatch cured me of my desire to hear other Gamers in pretty much any semi anonymous scenario. It's why i don't understand when people say dbd needs a voice chat for soloq balancing. You wanna give this community an unfiltered way to call you slurs?
|
|
#
?
Aug 29, 2023 01:11
|
|
|
curiousTerminal posted:It's why i don't understand when people say dbd needs a voice chat for soloq balancing. You wanna give this community an unfiltered way to call you slurs? Seriously. Gamers in general get weird about a feminine-sounding voice, DBD's community would crank that up to ridiculous levels. It's bad enough that it feels necessary to hide everything on my steam profile so I don't get harassed, if there was voice chat I'd get to hear the death threats in real time too.
|
|
#
?
Aug 29, 2023 01:20
|
|
|
Medullah posted:There's the co-op discord. Joined that so fast. Thank you for the link!
|
|
#
?
Aug 29, 2023 01:55
|
|
|
Game really needs a ping button that shouts "he's over at the X"!!
|
|
#
?
Aug 29, 2023 02:02
|
|
|
i still really liked REsistance and Evil Dead started dipping back into this and i feel like i'm not getting any better as a killer because every pubby group i've gotten is just braindead
|
|
#
?
Aug 29, 2023 03:10
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 19:37 |
|
|
Relyssa posted:It's bad enough that it feels necessary to hide everything on my steam profile so I don't get harassed I hid my hours a while back so people would stop dodging me for having over or under X hours, but I leave everything else open. It's one click to delete angry comments, and my friends and I love to spam copypasta stuff on each others comment sections.
|
|
#
?
Aug 29, 2023 03:15
|
|