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Which ghost of MMA still haunts you? This poll is closed. |
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| Nick Diaz |
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1 | 3.57% |
| Chuck Liddell |
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5 | 17.86% |
| Matt Serra |
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0 | 0% |
| Matt Serra |
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2 | 7.14% |
| Matt Serra |
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0 | 0% |
| Oh no you said his name three times |
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8 | 28.57% |
| Run |
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1 | 3.57% |
| RUN |
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11 | 39.29% |
| Total: | 28 votes | ||
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Dana White’s real passion is promoting the Dana White brand
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Oct 29, 2023 14:40
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| # ? Apr 29, 2024 01:31 |
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Dana wants people to love him. If you tell Dana you love him, he showers you with praise and money. See, e.g., McGregor and O’Malley. If you don’t tell Dana you love him, you might as well not exist. Francis doesn’t give a gently caress about Dana White. I was at Francis’ first UFC fight and knew then this guy was special. He walked out to the braveheart theme. I missed the match live and just watched now. It wad glorious. The announces said fury looked like a tall bag of milk at the start, and I loled. Then Francis outboxed him and was robbed.
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Oct 29, 2023 14:59
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rare Magic card l00k posted:Francis pulled off the actual Rocky I fight, right down to it not mattering that technically Fury won.
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Oct 29, 2023 15:07
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Boxing needs to explain why getting hit, then trying to lean on your opponent while falling to your knees isn't a knockdown. It wasn't when Wilder did the same to Fury, and for some reason it wasn't here, even though it's clear as day a knockdown. Fury got hit moving in and went to his knees. Boxing rules are so stupid. Francis won. In all of the boxing vs MMA bullshit we've had to endure over the years, it's really strange to me that people still think MMA guys can't box at all. Like, sure it won't usually be as good because the time investment, but these are still guys are still training boxing constantly. However, people going into this or any other crossover fight routinely talk about the MMA guy as if they've never worn big gloves before. Francis won this fight, and would win this fight again because Fury's style matches horribly with Francis. Francis is quite used to carrying the weight of big guys and sure it probably had some effect, but relative to how it worked on Wilder? Hysterical. Fury really needed to keep range and start reading how obvious Francis's counter left was. As the fight went, Fury wasn't getting hit by it really, but Francis is so wide open every time he moves that left arm, Fury should be embarrassed he couldn't land. Not to mention resorting to an elbow, that didn't phase Francis at all.
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Oct 29, 2023 15:18
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Boxing is more prone to calling things a slip when ambiguity is involved, rightly and wrongly at times, because the impact of scoring a knockdown in boxing is much higher than MMA.
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Oct 29, 2023 15:58
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Josuke Higashikata posted:Boxing is more prone to calling things a slip when ambiguity is involved, rightly and wrongly at times, because the impact of scoring a knockdown in boxing is much higher than MMA. i think it's prescient to air on the side of not a knockdown, because if it was a legit knockdown, he doesn't get 10 seconds of space to get his legs to respond, and so returns to danger almost immediately.
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Oct 29, 2023 16:26
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Super Deuce posted:In all of the boxing vs MMA bullshit we've had to endure over the years, it's really strange to me that people still think MMA guys can't box at all. i seriously used to think like you. i'd think to when i was training and like, yeah we work on our boxing regularly. watching askren and woodley box was shocking to me. i did not think it was possible to become nearly the best mixed martial arts in the world and look like that in a fight. i was embarrassed for the concept of mma. conor's effort was way, way less pathetic, but floyd absolutely tooled him. what i missed was that i already had a boxing background. i knew a lot of technical aspects of boxing that was never, ever even touched on in an mma gym during boxing time. i still can't explain francis looking that good in such a high pomp debut against that calibre of opponent. Actually, now that I think on it, his punches are so ridiculous it's actually a handicap in his favour to say that's all your allowed to do.
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Oct 29, 2023 16:39
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The way I encourage people to think about it is that the fastest NFL running backs are some of the fastest people in the world, but they're not winning Olympic gold in the 100m. Boxing habits will get you in trouble in MMA, and MMA striking habits will get you in trouble in boxing. That Francis adjusted those habits to hang with the world champ was possibly the most impressive thing he has ever done.
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Oct 29, 2023 16:43
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Sure they'll be less experienced, but people are acting like MMA fighters are neophytes to boxing, which is plainly stupid. Francis has been training boxing seriously the entire time.
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Oct 29, 2023 16:51
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As much as you want to poo poo on Jake Paul for being roided to the gills (fair) and having the money and resources to be boxing training full time (also fair), a late starting semi-professional boxer wouldn't have the chance to stand up to someone like expert level MMA strikers like Anderson Silva or Nate Diaz, even with them past their primes, in boxing unless the training he was receiving was of a standard significantly above the boxing required for MMA. Ngannou looking that good? I would assume it's part Fury being rusty, age catching up to him somewhat, not taking it as seriously as he should have leading in, part Ngannou knowing he's not getting taken down in this fight so he can have more comfort in his striking than in MMA, part Ngannou having elite level boxing training for a long while because you need that for facing the legitimate best heavyweight in boxing in the world right now, part Ngannou not being an old fighter overall in the ringworn sense and part Ngannou having a natural aptiude for fighting and just having the instinct needed to strike well. The punch power of course is a nightmare and as an opponent, it must always be playing on your mind. I can't imagine the likes of Deontay Wilder or Anthony Joshua seeing the fight last night and confidently thinking they can get in on the cash train and try to do their own fights against Ngannou for a big payday. They're still significantly skilled boxers and could very conceiveably outbox him, but that fire power of his is just terrifying and I don't know if they're beating a ten count. Either way, a rematch between Fury and Ngannou should be in MMA gloves.  Marching Powder posted:conor's effort was way, way less pathetic, but floyd absolutely tooled him. Also this, Floyd was absolutely never in any danger against Conor and it went absolutely to Floyd's script. Anyone who might tell you that Conor was in it and actually had a chance is either parroting Conor's delusions about the fight since then or knows nothing about boxing. Josuke Higashikata fucked around with this message at 17:00 on Oct 29, 2023 |
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Oct 29, 2023 16:55
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 How the judge giving Fury the fight 96-93 scored round 2 for Francis... I'm sorry, but did this guy watch the fight at all?
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Oct 29, 2023 17:26
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Mr. Nice! posted:The announces said fury looked like a tall bag of milk at the start, and I loled. Marching Powder posted:i still can't explain francis looking that good in such a high pomp debut against that calibre of opponent. Actually, now that I think on it, his punches are so ridiculous it's actually a handicap in his favour to say that's all your allowed to do. I think there’s some truth to boxers getting caught off guard by how shittily timed non-boxer punches can be, and hesitating more than usual on when they initiate, knowing the other fighter doesn’t even realize what’s feeding into their offensive timing. With Ngannou, the power of those situationally awkward punches got respect within the first few rounds, so Fury actually had some realistic incentive to hesitate instead of trying to bully through and lead every exchange to shut him down mentally with landed punches.
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Oct 29, 2023 17:36
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I think if Francis hadn't went headhunting after that knockdown and kept the same measured strategy that he would have knocked him out in the next few rounds. Calm Francis is terrifying, and he's going to absolutely destroy the next person that gets in the ring with him now that he's gotten some more experience under his belt.
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Oct 29, 2023 17:57
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Josuke Higashikata posted:As much as you want to poo poo on Jake Paul for being roided to the gills (fair) and having the money and resources to be boxing training full time (also fair), a late starting semi-professional boxer wouldn't have the chance to stand up to someone like expert level MMA strikers like Anderson Silva or Nate Diaz, even with them past their primes, in boxing unless the training he was receiving was of a standard significantly above the boxing required for MMA. Nate Diaz is shot and naturally 165 or 170 lb. He'd get outstruck by plenty of semi-profressional MWs or LHWs in MMA too. Silva was 47, possibly same for him.
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Oct 29, 2023 18:27
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CommonShore posted:The way I encourage people to think about it is that the fastest NFL running backs are some of the fastest people in the world, but they're not winning Olympic gold in the 100m. I remember when Conor fought Floyd that Conor's footwork would often end up with him behind Floyd, which, in an MMA ruleset, is a very advantageous position to be in. In boxing this is basically useless since there aren't a lot of legal attacks you can launch from directly behind somebody. Not needing to calculate for kicking range, takedowns, and elbow range etc would just naturally change your concept of footwork and pacing. Even if your punching and guard are technically correct from all your serious boxing training, learning where to move and when it is or isn't your turn to go would be the kind of thing experience is the best teacher for. Positions and postures and timing which are safe in one discipline are dangerous in the other, and that is something you need to be subconsciously aware of rather than merely trained to recognize. I think being at heavyweight here helps; the timing windows are bigger due to the fighters being slower, the positional rules are simpler due to the targets and openings being physically larger, and the rewards for landing successfully are more obvious and granular due to the greater power per punch.
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Oct 29, 2023 18:31
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rare Magic card l00k posted:to be fair boxing fans also generally hate fury Why’s this? Honest question
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Oct 29, 2023 19:03
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omg chael crash posted:Why’s this? Honest question His personality and his dad.
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Oct 29, 2023 19:58
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Apparently there is going to be some gimmick MMA tournament in Qatar with a $300m prize pool. Eddie Hall is one of the combatants. There is no way this is real.
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Oct 30, 2023 08:10
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There is literally no way anyone involved in that is getting paid.
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Oct 30, 2023 08:18
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Lid posted:There is literally no way anyone involved in that is getting paid. until the full total was sitting in an escrow service i wouldn't even board the plane lol
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Oct 30, 2023 08:37
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I can believe it. Rich people measuring dicks with how much money they are willing to spend trying to look badass by association while also sportswashing their international image is real. *Also, we are living in an increasingly shittier and dumber world. So why not this? Majkol fucked around with this message at 11:18 on Oct 30, 2023 |
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Oct 30, 2023 11:16
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https://twitter.com/phre/status/1719063470736314746 Sounds like the deal is done.
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Oct 30, 2023 20:24
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PFL/Bellator Super Fights to make: Ryan Bader vs Shoeface Patricky Pitbull vs Clay Collard
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Oct 30, 2023 21:39
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Not that I really think it would have happened anyways, but this news makes me even more sad that Rumble died. As soon as Francis came alone I dreamed of full bore heavyweight Rumble vs Francis.
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Oct 30, 2023 22:08
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Super Deuce posted:Not that I really think it would have happened anyways, but this news makes me even more sad that Rumble died. As soon as Francis came alone I dreamed of full bore heavyweight Rumble vs Francis. If their punches collided the universe would explode
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Oct 31, 2023 03:18
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Tom Clancy is Dead posted:Nate Diaz is shot and naturally 165 or 170 lb. He'd get outstruck by plenty of semi-profressional MWs or LHWs in MMA too. Silva was 47, possibly same for him. Nate Diaz is shot but also is not an "expert level striker" lol. He and Nick spend more time slapping than throwing closed fist punches. I love the Diaz brothers but they are 2/3rds personality and 1/3rd talent.
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Oct 31, 2023 03:46
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delightful posted:Nate Diaz is shot but also is not an "expert level striker" lol. He and Nick spend more time slapping than throwing closed fist punches. I love the Diaz brothers but they are 2/3rds personality and 1/3rd talent. I think Nate Diaz was one of the better MMA boxers during his prime at LW in 2011-2015, his glaring holes were always wrestling and kicking. His 1-2 was fantastic and he covered both his entries and exits, despite how slow and flat his feet were he did a lot of small adjustment steps with good distance management and smart angles (he was notably one of the best at working the inside angle from Southpaw), he had a strong inside and phonebooth game. He was somewhat hitable but it was a lot less than people think. When people got the better of him on the feet it was generally very temporarily or by stopping the boxing with other tools.
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Oct 31, 2023 04:48
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delightful posted:Nate Diaz is shot but also is not an "expert level striker" lol. He and Nick spend more time slapping than throwing closed fist punches. I love the Diaz brothers but they are 2/3rds personality and 1/3rd talent. nate diaz was the first one to beat conor, and he beat the loving poo poo out of him. either you mean that as a huge, huge compliment to their personality, or he is a pretty loving good striker.
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Oct 31, 2023 05:10
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This is Artemij Sitenkov erasure and I won't stand for it.
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Oct 31, 2023 07:48
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Marching Powder posted:nate diaz was the first one to beat conor, and he beat the loving poo poo out of him. either you mean that as a huge, huge compliment to their personality, or he is a pretty loving good striker. That's more an indictment of Conor. Got choked out by one half of the patty cake brothers.
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Oct 31, 2023 08:49
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Just my humble opinion but an elite level striker doesn’t get leg kicked into a casket
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Oct 31, 2023 08:58
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delightful posted:Just my humble opinion but an elite level striker doesn’t get leg kicked into a casket I am of this opinion too. Nate was so front leg heavy and he never adjusted
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Oct 31, 2023 10:31
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I think that's besides the point when the discussion is around them transitioning to boxing.
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Oct 31, 2023 14:40
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Tom Clancy is Dead posted:I think that's besides the point when the discussion is around them transitioning to boxing. I agree that it’s not relevant, but the discussion was around “elite level striker” so it strayed to typical mma striking context.
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Oct 31, 2023 16:08
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Speaking of Nate Diaz, Muhammad Ali has his moveset in UFC 5 almost 1:1. They might have took the stockton slaps and kicks off of him, but the punches are the exact same.
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Oct 31, 2023 21:27
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Josuke Higashikata posted:Speaking of Nate Diaz, Muhammad Ali has his moveset in UFC 5 almost 1:1. They might have took the stockton slaps and kicks off of him, but the punches are the exact same. This makes me irrationally angry.
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Nov 1, 2023 00:24
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Couldn’t EA have just used the mocap from Fight Night? I guess that’s slightly less lazy.
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Nov 1, 2023 00:44
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delightful posted:That's more an indictment of Conor. Got choked out by one half of the patty cake brothers. Was always bad is classic.
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Nov 1, 2023 00:56
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delightful posted:Just my humble opinion but an elite level striker doesn’t get leg kicked into a casket definitely a humble opinion because leg kicks only prove that the fighter doing them is a complete bitch rear end loser in the Unified Rules of Stockton. i posted a long attempted tribute to the Diazes before their last fight, but to slightly restate, the true answer to "are the Diazes great strikers or poor strikers?" is "Yes". They are phenomenal strikers under Stockton rules. They are also pretty phenomenal strikers under normal rules, since they are able to psychologically goad people into fighting Stockton style. Which you can call a skill or an attribute or a facet of their insane existence. But they should certainly get credit for it given that they managed to convince pretty much everyone except for like GSP, Ben Henderson, and Conor in the second fight to fight as if it was Stockton rules. I think I would call it a skill. I think they realize on some level that in order to choose to be a fighter, you have to have something wrong with you. And the thing that's wrong with you is generally a psycho desire to make sure you prove that you're not a bitch rear end loser. So they can set the true scoring criteria, which generally seem to be predicated around perceiving the fight as a fight to the death: 1) who is more damaged at the end of the fight 2) who came closer to actually ending the fight, i.e. KO/subbing the opponent and theoretically being able to defenselessly kill them 3) who would win if the fight kept going 4) who looks less like a bitch rear end ...not necessarily in that order. Based on that, you can see why something like Edwards-Diaz was actually a win for Diaz in Stockton. Yes, Nate lost on damage, but he came closer than Leon to ending the fight, and if the fight kept going, most people would have picked Nate to eventually win. Nick Diaz-Condit, neither were really damaged, but Condit can't run forever, and running is for bitches. So Carlos loses in a hypothetical fight to the death. Even something like Islam-Volk 1, it shows why it's a casually upsetting result. Islam was as damaged if not moreso, Volk came closer at the end to ending it, and Volk kills Islam if that goes to the death based on how Round 5 was going. Islam also had a bitch rear end look on his face as he was getting beat on. Now that I think about it, Condit was very much a "This Is A Sport" guy. Not a fight to the death guy. So he gets docked a lot in this scoring. It makes sense why despite the Robbie fight probably being a slight robbery everyone was okay with Robbie winning. Robbie did more damage, came closer to ending the fight, would have won if it kept going. Condit-GSP, equally damaged, Condit DID come closer to winning the fight, but GSP still takes it if it goes endlessly. Now, unfortunately for the Diazes they don't have much sway with athletic commissions or understanding of how the Unified Rules of MMA actually work, but it's hard to find a fight where they lost according to Stockton rules. The Josh Thomson fight, maybe the Rory/Dong fights where Nate was giving up tons of weight. I can't think of one Nick lost except maybe GSP. Nick seemed to have a weird (for him) respect for GSP's cardio and grind. e: forgot to add the original point of all this. Which is: the best way to win fights that are held under MMA rules and regulation but actually under Stockton scoring is to try and stand and bang and knock the Diazes out. So they convince guys that's the only way they can truly actually win the fight. And then guys try to do this instead of just easily legkicking them for 15/25 minutes. Which plays right into their strengths as fighters. And makes them phenomenal, because they've convinced like 50 different guys to all fight the same exact way despite it being completely tactically insane to do. DO YALL WANT A BOXC fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Nov 1, 2023 |
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Nov 1, 2023 00:59
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| # ? Apr 29, 2024 01:31 |
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Shumagorath posted:Couldn’t EA have just used the mocap from Fight Night? I guess that’s slightly less lazy. If they still have the data and it's useable. Sometimes game developers are really bad at preserving old assets once a product has been released. Also if Fight Night and UFC games are in two different engines there might be some technical problems.
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Nov 1, 2023 01:09
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