- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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JT just bagging on Thielen's lack of speed is a good running bit (the LA Fitness comment almost had me crying), but he made sure to give him lots of props for the catches.
The lack of creativity in offense is still very apparent, and (like JT said) it really magnifies the deficiencies in talent on offense. They need to find some way to work around the lack of speed in the WR corps (or buy DJ Chark some stickum).
At least they'll be able to take MHJ with their high draft pick
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Nov 2, 2023 20:46
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May 14, 2024 19:08
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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It’s even on his drop back tho. No technique, no precision, just a relaxed few steps to the bounce around spot
I wonder how much of it is him sensing that he's not gonna get a lot of time in the pocket and bracing to scramble as soon as he needs to, tho
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Nov 6, 2023 18:16
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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Bryce Young / panthers / Reich:
Firstly - Bryce Young did not play well yesterday - Fiz was right in his assessment. Young's footwork didn't look great and he seemed to have the yips he didn't have the week prior. Both of the interceptions, that meant anything in the context of the game, came on off platform throws where he missed passes he normally makes. I'm not going to handwave them away because it did cost us the game, but overall - he's not really made those kind of dumb errors in the past and I don't think they're necessarily predictive of future performance. That being said - players tend to take on the personality of their team's coach and basically the Panthers loving stink from top to bottom right now. As a result - I have no idea what the path forward is but I'm kind of doubting there is one at this point - at least in the short term.
Leading from the front you've got the owner who came across from the Steelers - traditionally one of the smartest run organisations (despite obvious issues like employing a rapist for 15 years, refusing to fire an offensive coordinator who sucks and just generally being filled with grubby cheap shot artists for the last decade) in the NFL to Carolina. It seems that at least in part he came over with the intention of putting every idea he ever raised at an ownership meeting and got "lol no"'d into practice and the results have been loving dire.
Considering that the sexual harassing groper in charge was forced to sell the team after making the playoffs in 2015 and 2016 and having a legitimate shot (twice) at winning a super bowl in his tenure and since he left, the team hasn't come close to sniffing the playoffs it's close to impossible to consider the sale of the team a success.
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In the offseason I spoke about the Panthers being a good landing spot for a rookie Qb. Toward the back end of 2022 the Panthers switched to a more power style running game. McAdoo for all his faults was smart enough to recognise that the arm of PJ Walker or the brain of Sam Darnold was not going to get the team very far and basically handed the keys of the offensive unit to the recently rebuilt offensive line and D'Onte Foreman. As part of handing over the offense to the recently promoted lead back (after the CMC trade) he also implemented a simplified offense for Sam Darnold, to the point where some games it seemed like the philosophy was:
1. throw to DJ Moore
2. check down to a safety valve
3. scramble for a few
and for the most part the Panthers under Wilks got back on track. We had done the impossible, making an incompetent team seem competent and like it actually could compete for a division title (in the NFC:S such great heights, I know). We all knew change to the coaching staff was coming, but the bones of the team were there and the lessons learned over the past few years would surely hold some sway in the way the team would move forward.
The offense featured a running back who was effective at doing running back things, a pair of offensive guards who had found their feet, a bit of a cult hero at centre, a young left tackle that after a decade of searching had proven to be dependable and effective in a man to man scheme and a shiny bonafide WR1. In hindsight - it made some sense that the GM Scott Fitterer didn't trade Brian Burns for 2 first round picks to the Rams, he was going to sign an extension in the offseason and everything would be fine. Defensively we had a backfield that featured a former first round pick in the slot, a lockdown number one and contributors at safety and linebacker. The team lacked some steel, lacked some depth but there was enough talent in the roster to turn some losses into wins and make a run in a weak division.
Then the team hired Frank Reich. At first I thought the hire was a sound one. You were getting a HC with some super bowl pedigree due to his time in Philly, someone who had learned some harsh lessons with managing quarterbacks and dealing with ownership, he had dialled up an effective running game, he'd lived through the bad days rotating QBs and unearthing gems on a rebuilding roster- surely he'd have learned from his mistakes. The defense was to be mentored by one of the better coordinators in the league who simply wanted to forget the craziness of Denver. Two mentored with decades of experience were brought in to contribute on the offense and the defense. A Shanavay disciple at just 37 was coming in at OC and the best offensive position coach the team had - Dave Campen on the offensive line miraculously survived the night of the Tepperknives to keep his post.
Now if you were in this situation and you were going to draft a new quarterback and take the big swing (which I fully support) you would surely keep playing to the team's strengths. It doesn't take a genius to learn from the mistakes of the past made in the same building you now occupy. You would keep a run heavy game plan, you'd ensure you could staff that game plan with a running back who's proven in his abilities to work with a young Qb and run downhill in a power scheme. You'd do everything you can to keep that number one receiver, or you'd at least have a plan to replace him, you'd ensure that the rookie was given protection, support, targets and tailor an offense to his strengths... right?
Frank Reich and Fitterer basically changed all of that. The running back they should have kept they allowed to walk - to a very crowded Chicago backfield - on not very much money. They took the free agents and draft picks they'd spent millions in cap and no small amount of picks on acquiring at offensive line and completely changed the blocking and protection scheme. They shipped off the number one receiver and replaced him with a 33 year old who would have struggled to be the 4th receiver on the team he left. Then in lieu of play action, roll outs, bootlegs, things you do to get a guy into his timing, keep him safe physically they dialed up a static, unimaginative, unoriginal 20 year old offense and asked him to throw 40 times a game.
All of this is basically to say that the Panthers simply aren't deploying their resources properly. Some dumb stats to back up my point: Carolina currently has the 9th most passing attempts in the NFL.
They are 25th in rushing attempts but if you take away Bryce's "I'll do it myself" moments and subtract his scrambling its actually 30th in designed runs. 30th
This is a team that spent the last two offseasons bringing in assets and players who are suited to a man to man, down hill dominant rushing attack with an outside wide receiver who can blow the top off a defense and turn a slant into a touchdown into something resembling an offensive unit that would have barely worked in 2003. It's loving insane. On the surface the platform was right loving there to get this right and they haven't.
You've got an owner who defers to his wife on matters of hiring coaches, drafting players and signing general managers, who was happy to trade away his two best offensive players in the dreams it would get him the Steph Curry of QBs. A guy who's learned loving nothing from the people he was in the room with for close to a decade in Pittsburgh. Frank Reich has seemingly learned nothing from his time in Philly or Indy and the offensive mind we brought in to call the plays has been mired in a stagnant playbook from the early 2000s instead of a modern passing offense. They called PA scissors the other week. Something Dan Henning couldn't get to work in 2003 when he had Steve loving Smith and Mushin Muhummad running the routes.
No ones going to succeed in with this kind of thinking. They don't know what they have in the building and are instead trying to run poo poo that's either outdated or not suited to what they have. It's like if you took Jalen Hurts and put him in San Francisco and asked Brock Purdy to scramble ten times a game and run the tush push. It's beyond loving dumb and the problem is that Tepper thinks the problems is his coaches don't put his plans into action. The coaches haven't learned from the most obvious situations they've literally lived through and the GM is undoubtedly being pulled in three different directions between the two of them and his own knowledge of football.
It's a lot of words I know, but seeing what Bryce can do well. He's a legitimate NFL QB he's not in the right system, he doesn't have the right support and he doesn't have the personnel around him to succeed. Rookies are going to have bad days, and they're going to pick bad days to have bad days on, but I don't know how anyone can expect him to have a good day at this point.
This is an amazing effort post, better than the 2023 Carolina Panthers deserve
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Nov 7, 2023 14:46
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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He did not, in fact, absolutely ball out against the nonexistent Bears defense.
He willed Bears defense into existence
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Nov 10, 2023 14:56
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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E: lol not GDT
Black Lighter fucked around with this message at 02:26 on Nov 13, 2023
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Nov 13, 2023 02:21
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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To add onto this the Texans were also hellbent on making the rushing attack work and ran the ball 30 times for a sweet 110 yards. Stroud only attempted 24 passes and I think 4 of them were batted down by the Carolina D line. Since that game the Texans coaches have let him cook more than trying to force the running game to be something it’s not (good).
Is that just a function of the line being piecemealed together or has Pierce really fallen off (when healthy)?
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Nov 15, 2023 18:18
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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Fwiw I really don't like Drake Maye. I think he makes beautiful throws when he's got no pressure but the second there's adversity he fucks up horrifically. He also has a really long throwing mechanic that takes a while to get off compared to like McCarthy or Sanders or Caleb. I don't know how he's getting rated as the #1 right now it's perplexing, but it's still early.
Also, he looks like he should be asking his mom to buy him an extra order of mozzarella sticks
Only registered members can see post attachments!
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Nov 16, 2023 18:24
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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wasn't the whole deal with Carolina this year that they brought together this Superstar Coaching Staff?
Can't coach height
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Nov 22, 2023 02:25
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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In a way having Tepper as an owner has been absolutely freeing as a Panthers fan. I don't have to care anymore. The organization has a total moron as an owner and he just bought the team so he will be in place for loving forever.
There was a game against the Falcons where Chris Weinke completed four loving passes and Carolina still won due to the rushing game and Atlanta incompetence. I weep to have a Carolina team with that talent and hope again.
Don't worry, no matter how bad things get you can always hope for Atlanta to be worse
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Nov 22, 2023 02:53
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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As we’ve discussed before, make a “best player at X” award. Qb, rb, wr, OL, dl, etc.
But also add a “pluckiest player”award and give it to lil’ Bryce 
The Biggest Lil' Guy Award
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Dec 21, 2023 03:31
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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*Bryce Young threw the ball 527 times, the fifth-most of any season in team history, but only threw for 2,877 yards, the 18th-most in a season in team history. He's sandwiched between Chris Weinke's 2001 year (15 games total) and Jake Delhomme's 2006 season (where he only played 13 games).
*Young completed 315 passes, the fifth-most in a season, but his yards-per-completion of 5.5 only has two real competitors among full-season Panther starters - Kerry Collins in 1997 (5.6) and Chris Weinke in 2001 (5.4)
*Young threw for touchdowns on only 2.1% of his passes (11 total passing TDs). Among full-season starters, he's ahead of only Chris Weinke (2001) at 2.0%.
*Young's longest completion was for 47 yards. Among full-season starters, he is tied for the lowest longest completion stat with Weinke.
*Young was sacked 62 times, tied for the most in team history with Steve Beuerlein (2000).
*Young is the only Panthers QB to start 16 games and not throw for over 3,000 yards. If you include 15-game and 14-game starters, he is one of only three (along with Weinke and Rodney Peete).
Tbf, those are great numbers for a point guard
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Jan 8, 2024 22:23
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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I got a qb I’d trade for CJ stroud.
Why don't you believe in Andey?
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Jan 14, 2024 16:01
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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And they face each other Sunday as starting quarterbacks.
Sorry if I worded it poorly.
Secondary thought: who do you take if you're building a team? I was never real high on Goff and both he and Purdy are kind of "system" QB's that seem to need everything set up really well rather than carrying an offense. I think I'd take Brock Purdy straight up.
I think the only reason to take Purdy is contract considerations. Goff's shown twice that you can build a legitimate contender around him, despite his flaws, and there's still serious questions about what Purdy would even be if you took away this precise system and a roster of all-pros helping him out.
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Jan 25, 2024 16:25
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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The (Bryce) Young QB Thread - Tell me whether this fact is fun or not
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Jan 26, 2024 19:15
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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TLDR: The resources given to QBs, both in cap space and draft picks, is too much. The best teams of the future are going to shift away from schemes requiring elite pocket passing QBs. We're still building rosters in a world where Peyton Manning cost $10 million in his prime, and defenses weren't built in split-field coverages that crush pass-first teams.
imo
I think you're right to say that QBs take up too much cap space, but the idea that teams aren't going to prioritize elite passers is a bit much. It's more likely that the league would push to decouple QBs from the existing cap structure in some way than it would be for coaches and GMs to stop chasing players who can turn a team into an instant contender just by showing up.
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Jan 27, 2024 12:10
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May 14, 2024 19:08
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- Black Lighter
- Sep 6, 2010
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Just keep looking at what we're doing, keep watering and ask yourselves first and know 'Are you watering? And are you fertilizing every day?' So when it's time to pop, it'll pop.
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Stroud & Love are gonna enter Top 10 QB debates during the off-season and I am all for it. I also believe Bryce Young can turn it around and that Anthony Richardson could break out assuming he doesn't injure himself again.
Agreed, the more quarterbacks in the Top 10, the better. Hopefully we can pack an even 20 in there by 2025.
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Feb 2, 2024 03:55
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Nov 2, 2023 20:46
