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Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Tiny Rogues is a small (tiny?) game in concept. It's so small that the concept fits in a few gifs! :





That's the entire thing: a pretty arcade action roguelike that is played in small arenas, with some bullet hell influence. Enemies try to kill you, you kill them, advance stages, you level up, get randomized loot, reach the final boss, you kill it, game over.
But the important thing is that this "simple" concept is superbly well executed here: movement is tight, with a nice dash available to the player, there are dozens of enemies each with a different move and attack pattern, they are (and their projectiles) easily visible thanks to a very contrasty look with a visual style that is always clear, and there are many weapons and traits to make the experience very replayable. It's the type of game that I don't see how it could be better done than it is right now.

Although speaking of content, the game is having a big update... today, Dec 22nd 2023.
This is the total list provided by the single dev in a tweet:

555 Equipment items
32 Set Bonuses
400 Weapons
176 Consumables
115 Traits
68 Companions
43 Bosses
25 Different Levels / Zones
34 Player Class Characters

In fact with this last update the player progression and 'build' concept will be much more fleshed out, with more complex synergies and all that.

And here it's the last two trailers to give a better idea of how the game plays:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ir3XFF0RR08
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFQEyv3HaWc

It's one of those games that are ideal to have permanently installed in your computer: small, always fun, and varied enough.

The game also has good controller setup, several difficulty levels, it is Steam Deck verified, etc.

Wiki: https://www.roguepedia.net/w/Main_Page

https://store.steampowered.com/app/2088570/Tiny_Rogues/

The dev: https://twitter.com/RubyBenji

The game is still in Early Access, and it was cheaper before, the price increased now to $10 because the new updates doubles the size of the game, and there are planned many more content updates.

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Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Yes, the update is out. And... I'm rusty after not having played for months. Yeah, let's go with that excuse, it's me being rusty...

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



KittyEmpress posted:

This game is fun but I'm getting really annoyed at just the... utter lack of healing. I'll get multiple flask filling, taverns, even health fountain options when sitting at full HP... but when I'm at one heart and out of flasks I'll go through 3 floors without a single one.

What annoys me of the RNG is how in some runs I will play six floors without ever encountering the blacksmith. Or in other runs he appears, but he has to do it just when I spent the money in a shop.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Shaman Tank Spec posted:

Also! I've been playing on mouse + keyboard until now and figured that playing on controller would be a nightmare since you require so much precision with many attacks, but turns out the controller controls are really smooth. There's an auto lock mechanic where you just have to point in an enemy's general direction and then you will automatically shoot at that guy until it's dead.

I didn't explore the options further to see if there's a manual way of changing your target other than pointing the stick around, but it works really well which immediately means this is going to be a real fun Steam Deck game.

There is adjustable autoaim amount in the options, play with it.


Infinity Gaia posted:

I feel like that's probably the point. I honestly thought the pre-update version was kinda way too easy so I'm appreciating the extra challenge in this version, even if I've yet to manage a win at even Cinder 12, let alone 16...

There are people who still have to win at Cinder 1...

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Yeah, the game is definitely harder now, and not in a 'oh there are more stuff so it's all more diluted now' way (although that is true too). I actually mean, for example, they are attack patterns in floor 5 already that are way more tricky than they were in a previous version, before you had to wait until Floor 8 for the tricky ones. And the classes themselves were more powerful before, with some traits had made them gain a ridiculous amount of armor, soul hearts or stamina, now their traits are less 'meaty'.

Imo, a bad choice, people with skills can play with higher cinder, people without those skills can't beat the game anymore, as there is no way to make the game easier.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Ok, I got my first win, with the Priest (and a 'Deadly Galactic Bible'). Self-revives for the win. And honestly, I think not having to think on aiming with the orbital weapon, and focusing more that way on avoiding enemies helped me.


I just tried now the Pyromancer, and he dishes damage out of the wazoo, but he is the prototypical glass cannon, he doesn't have extra hearts, armor, soul hearts, block shields, anything to survive. Got only up to Floor 5 :P.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



explosivo posted:

Beat death on my second run with the Ranger, I had an extra shield but with the one charge of evade I don't think I took actual damage until the 7th floor or so. I definitely prefer it when the game is more about positioning and timing your dodges to avoid taking damage instead of relying on stacking extra dodges/shields/hearts. It is a huge help to jack the auto-aim up in the controller settings to max so literally all you need to do is hold RT and make sure you don't get hit, feels more like a vampire survivors sorta game this way and lets me focus more on my positioning.

Yes, and it's notably easier to play like that than trying it with mouse + keyboard...
Kinda the easy mode the game is lacking :P

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



No Wave posted:

Just to shill soul scarf.

Here's a not very unusual floor 4 position:



All but one of those soul hearts is from soul scarf.

You sure that's not very unusual? You had to find several times the place that refills the flask, right? In my past run, I found zero!


Speaking of, I had my second win, now with the Bandit (basically, it was a typical archer/crit hit/lucky hit build). It was weird, I did it on my second computer and even if Steam updated the game and got the save from the cloud, when I played the game did the tutorial again. And... the game was easier than usual, you know? Maybe it was the RNG, but I had lots of food in the first two floors, in addition to the three 'free' food that the tutorial gives you.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



How do you gain access to the second set of classes? I guess you need to advance first the world tier.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Teriyaki Koinku posted:

Sorcerer now comes with an extra soul heart each floor which is really nice. Having some shields to protect the soul hearts is a pro move, especially if you take Power Hungry trait.

The Power Hungry trait is really good, is what I'm saying.

I lost yesterday a Sorcerer run with Power Hungry and tons of soul hearts in the mid game. I'm still depressed about it. I really snatched defeat from the jaws of victory, I was totally deleting floors super easily, but on the last floors I didn't get good traits and I started to feel my power wasn't climbing up as it should anymore, then on the last four or five rooms I was hit several times, and finally Death killed me on the second form at 15% hp. :/

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Got my third victory, with the knight. And drat, I sweated for it.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



I'm trying to get all the basic classes, but of course when i do that the game won't ever give me a stupid polearm/spear weapon! (for the soldier unlock)

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Balance is definitely wonky right now, some classes are much safer than others and get on the latest floors more times and having an easier time. The same with weapons, I am finding short ranged weapons barely more powerful than far ranged weapons (as eventually damage comes from crits, lucky hits and synergies) but short ranged weapons are notably more risky.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Shaman Tank Spec posted:

So what's the deal with the souls you collect? I've had about six runs of the updated game, completed it on one character, and I've never seen a single place to spend them in.

Well, souls before were the thing that made you progress the mastery level progression, now it has changed, as now you advance with the crowns/counters from beating a boss. Now souls are an ancillary currency used for some shops.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011




This seems even more important, a place where you get a heart / stamina / mana. I wonder if it will be in a fixed place, instead of being rng dependent.

https://twitter.com/tiny_rogues/status/1739591546914091343

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



It seems the new version should release very soon. From the discord, these are the changes:

quote:

Added a new feature: From floor 2 onwards, the bonfire meets you in the spawn room and you can trade Souls for favours.
Weapon Upgrade Levels now grant 10% more damage, up from 5%.
The Blacksmith related meta perks "Loss Leader", "Worth Of A Soul" and "Loyality" all have been buffed.
There is 30 new items, including a lot of defensive options and items for melee builds. (I will announce the equipment items in a separate post after this.)
There have been some changes to existing items, such as:
Coward's Ring: It now also triggers your on dash effects on dropping a bomb.
Dragonscale Greaves: Add +1 Suppression and grant 30% melee damage now.
Fire/Ice/Thunder Dragon Gauntlets: Now grant +1 Suppression.
Trait: Double Trouble: Instead of doubling the critical hit multiplier of repeated attacks it now makes repeated attacks deal lethal hits.
Trait: Swagger, now also triggers your on dash effects every 5th primary attack.
Trait: One Step Ahead, now additionally doubles the critical hit multiplier of repeated attacks. (Repeats attack on dash.)
New Trait: Ignition Burst: Explosion DMG ignites and also power grants burn damage.
New "uncommon" companion: Camel, grants +1 Stamina.
Tavern: Nurse now also recovers flasks.
Tavern: NEW tavern NPC: the Dryad. She sells Green Blossoms and is good aligned, making you good and items become cheaper when you are good.
BUFFED all 1H swords by 10% to 30% across the board.
BUFFED giga everything on all hero sword variations and made improvements to the upgrade materials showing up.
BUFFED all daggers by 10% to 20% across the board.
BUFFED all axes by at least 10% and the "tricky to use axes" (2 projectiles) by up to 30%.
BUFFED all maces by 10% across the board.
BUFFED all polearms and scythes by 10% across the board.
NERFED: Death Tyrants now activate their laser beams staggered from each other.

Stamina Potion is now in the base pool of available potions.
Soul Heart rewards are slightly more common.
ALL dice now appear in the basic shops (Rat Merchant, Soul Peddler, Witch Doctor, ...)
Heart Containers now appear in those shops too.
Phoenix Feathers now appear in these shops too.
Rat Merchant now also has a chance by default to offer 4 offers.
Desert Floor "Alien Traders" and "Nomad Trader" now offer more offers.
Slot Machine breaks quicker but base win chance has been increased.
Slot Machine now awards Soul Heart instead of Souls.
Nerf Curse taking effect chance in the range of 0 to 3 curse.
Ethereal Dice are more common, more compareable to Red Dice now.
Meta Perk: Ethereal Roulette now grants +2 ethereal dice from dice rewards.
Tavern: Farmer boy and santa are 5G cheaper.
MASTERY XP CURVE: Adjusted so you level up quicker over all, especially the first 15 levels go very fast now.
Shellfish Surge and Oceans Bounty now last 10/20 rooms up from 1/10 rooms depending on the consumable.
Soul Economy Rebalance: Soul prices don't rise anymore like gold does.
Soul Economy Rebalance: all soul prices have been reduced.
Kelp Consumable: now adds +1 stamina permanently. (like the Starfish for mana)
Added 3 new meta perks:
Evergreen: Green Blossoms last 10 rooms up from 1 room.
Heart Seeker: Items with hearts are 25% more common.
Stamina Scout: Items with stamina are 25% more common.

New Item List:
Blossom Ring: +1 Stamina
Ring of Evasion: +1 Evade
Gunpowder Ring: 5% increased explosion damage per bomb you have, up to 100%.
Dreamcatcher Pendant: On picking up a mana star, trigger your on comabt start effects. (Funny with vision quest.)
Armor of Favour: +1 Heart, +1 Stamina, +1 Mana
Boxing Shorts: +1 Stamina, Grant 10% increased unarmed attack speed per stamina you have.
NEW SET: Fencing Set (Touche! Engarde!) uses Fencing Mask and new item: Fencing Suit. Set Bonus: Hits with repeated attacks from swords trigger your on kill effects and 4 seconds after that, your on combat start effects are also triggered.
Fencing Suit: +1 Stamina
Gaia Armor: +1 Heart, Green Blossoms are permanent.
Golem Armor: +2 Hearts, 50% increased damage with crushing hits
Soccer Kit: Periodically trigger your on taking damage effects every 5 seconds.
Elven Cloak: Part of elven set. Grants +1 evade.
Gambeson: +1 Heart, +1 Suppression
Turtle Armor: +2 armor, +1 heart
Breaker Gauntlets: +1 armor, Melee hits inflict armor break.
Dragonscale Gauntlets: +1 suppression, 20% melee damage
Red Riding Hood (epic helmet): +2 stamina
Traffic Cone: +1 evade
Space Helmet: +1 defy death, when an orbital completes a rotation, trigger your on dash effects (and I fixed it so bibles and flails can trigger this)
Clockwork Boots: Periodically trigger your on dash effects every 4 seconds.
Rondache: +1 block, +1 stamina
Skull Shield: +1 block, +1 suppression
Parsec Boots: Periodically trigger your on pick up mana star effects every 10 units moved.
New charm: Stamina Charm
New charm: Soul Heart Charm (Grants a Soul Heart on level up.)
New charm: Block Charm
New charm: Evasion Charm
New charm: Flask Charm
New charm: Suppression Charm

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



There are so many colored keywords and weird gotchas that I'm waiting until the wiki is more updated, yeah.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



I can confirm the game is now easier. Not as easy as the initial 0.1 EA version, but easier than 0.2 released a few days ago. Just enough that I could win with the Warrior on the first try, without a super legendary weapon or a multi item synergy.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011






Will the game have the decency of give a cold two-handed weapon? Not, of course not. Hell, for now it hasn't offered me either of the two.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Turin Turambar posted:




Will the game have the decency of give a cold two-handed weapon? Not, of course not. Hell, for now it hasn't offered me either of the two.

Eventually I got a bow, which I had forgotten they are two handed, of course.
In any case, this was the most ridiculous run I had of the game. I had three legendary items (pity two of them were both for offhand) and 1 legendary charm and a several other epic items. Just stupid. It was with the mystic, the double charm effect nets you a +40% magic find (to her starting charm) so I guess thanks to that I had higher chance of finding all this poo poo.

I totally could have continued playing ever increasing difficult dungeons as I was super OP, but I reached the boss after Death, and then I couldn't advance anymore because a gate was closed, I didn't have the required good stats.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Ciaphas posted:



i can quit whenever i want, ok

You can disable at least the mini health bar on top of the main character.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



I thought this was op




then I found this???



edit: and yeah, soul scarf is totally broken now, with the recent changes of the last update. 20 soul hearts? easy! 25, more? doable too!

Turin Turambar fucked around with this message at 18:00 on Dec 28, 2023

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Honestly, the game is very swingy. Yes, you are supposed to use the dice to compensate the RNG, but even with them, the difference between a bad run and a good run (never mind a crazy good run that happens from time to time) is like day and night. I wonder if for example rooms should have 3 doors instead of 2 to make thing less swingy.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



I finally unlocked the soldier class. Spear/polearms are just too rare right now. I had unlocked an advanced class (necromancer) before him, even.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Broken Cog posted:

To add to this, some companions have lower weight than others, for no particular reason. Like this:


has 0.5 weighting, which means you can summon 2 of them for each companion slot you have.

Well, it isn't 'for no reason', they usually are weaker companions, in exchange of having less 'weight'.



Note I said 'usually', that one seems pretty good and 0.5 weight seems hard to justify :P.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Jusupov posted:

Soul scarf getting a nerf in the next patch

Expected. I even deliberately avoided using it in my last three runs, because well, I could well use a trainer, because it felt like the same as a cheat. Clearly unintended interaction with the new 0.21 stuff.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



Broken Cog posted:



You weren't kidding lol. I was critting for 200k+

Edit: Are Paragon levels for anything?

Do you people really like to play like that?
With the CRT line effect, I mean.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



I agree the game is still needs some other way to interact with the morality system. Maybe some floors have enemies that if you kill them first before any other 'species' in the floor, you get +1 good or evil, etc. Or some item you can 'touch' modifies it, but it has to be done in a timer.

Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



ImpAtom posted:

Flasks are already the absolute bottom tier when it comes to ways to improve your overall health so sure let's toss in another reason they suck.


TooMuchAbstraction posted:

I guess hearts are a little better than they used to be, now that you can pay the bonfire and/or the tavern nurse to get them all back. I still feel like they're weak compared to armor/block/evade though. So yeah, I don't really get the nerf.

Make it so armor repair powder gives 1-2 armor back instead of fully restoring it, and they'd be on a much more even keel.

Yeah, you ideally don't want to reach to your heart healths, that's the value of armor, shield, evade, etc. Once you reach your hearts, you basically only can get 1 more error (from 2 to 1 hear) with most classes before dying. So you don't want to reach that point. And if you don't reach that point, you are not really using the flasks, and with this change, the soul scarf goes from very OP (it needed a nerf, yes...) to now be the worst item of the bunch, because you if you layers of armor, soul hearts, shield, etc, you won't reach the point of losing hearts, so the soul scarf won't do anything.

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Turin Turambar
Jun 5, 2011



That's cool yeah, and I agree with him in how it can improve in each class fantasy, and increase the differences between them.

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