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ninjewtsu posted:Idk dude when you tell someone "be honest with me" and their answer is "ok, I hate your loving guts and I always have, is that honest enough? gently caress you. I've never wanted to be anywhere near you." that's a little bit more extreme than "ripping a bandaid off" yeah? Listen to everything that he's saying, though. He says he hate laios because he is rude and inserts himself into situations where he isn't wanted... but it's especially frustrating because Laios doesn't have any ill will when doing it. Laios always drones on about things and has no social skills... because he always says what is on his mind without working through 17 layers of filters, which Shuro says he is jealous of. Shuro is saying that he always hated Laios while also praising his strong points. That's not something you do for someone you don't care about.
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May 1, 2024 20:47
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Lt. Lizard posted:You don't really go "Hey, if it ever looks like the fantasy CIA is going to catch you due to that horrific crime your party committed, give me a call, I'll smuggle you out of country and hide you somewhere safe" to someone who you don't consider a friend. Or I just don't have the right kind of acquaintances, idk. i mean you might if the person you love is their sister and they're trying to save their sister, there's a little bit more going on here than "yo bud if you find yourself in a tight spot hit me up"
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May 1, 2024 20:48
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There's also a big element of Laios's reaction that reads stunned / disassociative / maybe intrusive thought territory to me. It's of a pair with the bit where he says if Falin wasn't eaten they wouldn't have ice cream, which happens because he feels safe enough to just let a thought out instead of self censoring. In this case it's that he has too much on the mind to filter it.
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May 1, 2024 20:48
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ninjewtsu posted:i mean you might if the person you love is their sister and they're trying to save their sister, there's a little bit more going on here than "yo bud if you find yourself in a tight spot hit me up" He gave up on Falin and switched to "she should at least have a proper death instead of running around as an abomination" a few scenes before he gave Laois the bell. It's literally the main reason he has decided to leave.
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May 1, 2024 20:51
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CuddleCryptid posted:Listen to everything that he's saying, though. He says he hate laios because he is rude and inserts himself into situations where he isn't wanted... but it's especially frustrating because Laios doesn't have any ill will when doing it. Laios always drones on about things and has no social skills... because he always says what is on his mind without working through 17 layers of filters, which Shuro says he is jealous of. Shuro is saying that he always hated Laios while also praising his strong points. That's not something you do for someone you don't care about. i don't think shuro doesn't care about laios, i think he doesn't like laios NmareBfly posted:There's also a big element of Laios's reaction that reads stunned / disassociative / maybe intrusive thought territory to me. It's of a pair with the bit where he says if Falin wasn't eaten they wouldn't have ice cream, which happens because he feels safe enough to just let a thought out instead of self censoring. In this case it's that he has too much on the mind to filter it. honestly i kinda took it as laios being pretty insulted too. shuro saying that laios wasn't serious about saving his sister, after laios just fought and killed a dragon to save her was way over the line and i'm glad laois didn't stand for that Lt. Lizard posted:He gave up on Falin and switched to "she should at least have a proper dead instead of running around like an abomination" a few scenes before he gave Laois the bell. It's literally the main reason he has decided to leave. "i think you're going to die trying to save your sister. but if you manage to accomplish that, give this a ring" i'm not so sure this "laios decides to bail but hasn't resolved the falin situation one way or the other" scenario is really what shuro had in mind, though he was being a bit nonspecific to include it
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May 1, 2024 20:54
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I think if you spend a lot of time in a group of people where you often put your lives on the line you are going to care about those people even if you don't consider one of them your friend.
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May 1, 2024 20:55
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ninjewtsu posted:
Oh oops I slow posted and I was talking about the 'she's so cool!' reaction people were discussing above, not Shuro.
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May 1, 2024 20:58
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Snooze Cruise posted:I think if you spend a lot of time in a group of people where you often put your lives on the line you are going to care about those people even if you don't consider one of them your friend. yeah, exactly this. i think what's going on between them is a bit more complex than being friends or enemies. shuro doesn't like laios and thinks what he's doing is stupid but he's willing to throw out a lifeline because even if he doesn't like laois, he still understands laois' situation and why laios made the choices that put him in that situation (hell kabru at the start of the episode points out that shuro would have almost certainly made the same choice). shuro is extremely on board with the save falin concept, if not laois' methods, and i'm sure on some level he appreciates and respects that someone is trying to save the woman he loves. and even if he thinks laois' plan is stupid and has very low odds of success, if it does succeed shuro absolutely wants to ensure that laois and pals (including falin) make it out of there. ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 21:03 on May 1, 2024 |
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May 1, 2024 20:59
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So what people are saying is that Shuro's feelings for Laios are more than simple friendship.
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May 1, 2024 21:03
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ninjewtsu posted:"i think you're going to die trying to save your sister. but if you manage to accomplish that, give this a ring" If he believed Falin could be saved, he would continue trying to do it himself. To Shuro, the most likely scenarios for Laios are either "Laios dies" or "Laios finally realizes there is no way to bring Falin back and puts her to rest". And he is willing to bail Laios out of whatever consequences his actions will have in the world above in the second scenario. Like you can say, "no, they are not friends, they are comrades, they absolutely care for each other and would save each other's life in a heartbeat", but that's kinda splitting hair. And also not exactly the kind of message the initial "Laios and Shuro are not friends, Shuro intensely dislikes Laios and Laios is hurt by Shuro and probably dislikes him back now" post communicated.
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May 1, 2024 21:11
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Look when you have two or more alpha males in a room they’re going to A) be best friends and B) beat each other up and be rude, not necessarily in either order. As a powerful alpha male myself I can explain in more detail but might I suggest the great documentary series Yakuza or your local Waffle House for more examples of this phenomenon.
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May 1, 2024 21:12
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Something to consider is that Shuro wanted to ask the elves of the west for help putting down Falin permanently. From his perspective, it hurts, but Falin is beyond saving and deserves to have her soul rest. Even when Laios declared that they're going to defeat the lunatic magician, their plan basically amounts to "beat the mage -> Marcille does magic -> ?????? -> Falin saved!" It's such a vague plan that someone who thinks chimera Falin should be put down wouldn't be convinced they can save Falin or whatever. So when he gave Laios that bell to use for when he needs to be smuggled out of the country, I highly doubt it comes with an ulterior motive to bring Falin along.
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May 1, 2024 21:14
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Rand Brittain posted:So what people are saying is that Shuro's feelings for Laios are more than simple friendship. I think we all just want Shuro to know that the Falin path is pretty shaky right now and he needs to be a lot more gentle with Plan B.
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May 1, 2024 21:17
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So I might have to rewatch the episode but when Shuro said "I'm out, I'm going home" did he mention if he was still going to go through with telling the Western Elves about Falin? Or did he drop that line of thought to give Laios and crew a chance to try it their way first?
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May 1, 2024 21:18
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Arc Hammer posted:So I might have to rewatch the episode but when Shuro said "I'm out, I'm going home" did he mention if he was still going to go through with telling the Western Elves about Falin? Or did he drop that line of thought to give Laios and crew a chance to try it their way first? Pretty sure he did not mention it. But also, like, they never even tried to get Kabru or his party to swear to secrecy so they might just be assuming that it'll get reported regardless.
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May 1, 2024 21:23
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Pretty sure he said he's going to report this to the governor of the island, who might report this to the elves? Considering how they cleared the air between them, maybe Shuro's going to conveniently forget to mention Laios's involvement and just report how there's a human-monster chimera roaming around the deeper levels of the dungeon and that adventurers need to steer clear of it. Now Kabru, though. I'd be worried about what that dude would do with the information he has.
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May 1, 2024 21:26
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Arc Hammer posted:So I might have to rewatch the episode but when Shuro said "I'm out, I'm going home" did he mention if he was still going to go through with telling the Western Elves about Falin? Or did he drop that line of thought to give Laios and crew a chance to try it their way first? He said that he'll give the governor of the island a heads up but didn't mention ratting them out directly after the fight.
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May 1, 2024 21:26
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Laois appears more deranged than usual to Shuro because Laois' brain is now running on full Dungeon Logic. Everything they have experienced and achieved up to that moment has completely recalibrated what Laois considers a reasonable expectation or outcome. He's become dungeontionalized.
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May 1, 2024 21:35
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Lt. Lizard posted:If he believed Falin could be saved, he would continue trying to do it himself. To Shuro, the most likely scenarios for Laios are either "Laios dies" or "Laios finally realizes there is no way to bring Falin back and puts her to rest". And he is willing to bail Laios out of whatever consequences his actions will have in the world above in the second scenario. Like you can say, "no, they are not friends, they are comrades, they absolutely care for each other and would save each other's life in a heartbeat", but that's kinda splitting hair. And also not exactly the kind of message the initial "Laios and Shuro are not friends, Shuro intensely dislikes Laios and Laios is hurt by Shuro and probably dislikes him back now" post communicated. i agree that shuro is probably thinking more along the lines of "i want falin to be put to rest, if you do that in my stead i'll do you a solid in return". i really don't think the idea is "i like you so i'll risk everything for you" going back to debate interpretations of my posts is always an exciting time that everyone loves, but i do want to point out a pretty crucial part of my original post if we want to talk about my initial message ninjewtsu posted:They're not out for blood and honestly it seems like laios and shuro probably won't see each other again for a really long time, so when they do it'll probably all be stuff they've processed and come to terms with by then. But at this moment I wouldn't call this stuff water under the bridge either, I do think at least part of why shuro gave laios the bell was that if laios rings it, he's probably got falin in tow. amigolupus posted:Something to consider is that Shuro wanted to ask the elves of the west for help putting down Falin permanently. From his perspective, it hurts, but Falin is beyond saving and deserves to have her soul rest. Even when Laios declared that they're going to defeat the lunatic magician, their plan basically amounts to "beat the mage -> Marcille does magic -> ?????? -> Falin saved!" It's such a vague plan that someone who thinks chimera Falin should be put down wouldn't be convinced they can save Falin or whatever. he doesn't think it will succeed which is why he isn't going down there, but laios thinks it'll succeed and laios just beat shuro to a pulp. shuro respects laios enough to toss something in the "just in case" gamble. laois is pretty adamant that they're going to save his sister and have demonstrably killed a dragon to do it, and like i said above whether it's resurrecting falin or putting her to rest one way or the other shuro is quite a bit happier if laois gets there. if he really just cared about laois, he'd probably try to do more to convince laois to turn back with him instead of almost certainly throw his life away accomplishing nothing (presumably the reason shuro is turning around now). but that's not even a consideration, their argument is very much about "revive falin" vs "kill her and let her rest". yes, if laois decides that shuro was right in the end and does the thing shuro wanted to risk his life to do, shuro will still smuggle him out. Arc Hammer posted:So I might have to rewatch the episode but when Shuro said "I'm out, I'm going home" did he mention if he was still going to go through with telling the Western Elves about Falin? Or did he drop that line of thought to give Laios and crew a chance to try it their way first? he said "i'm going to report to the governor" and that's it. whether that report includes laois' black magic or not is kind of implied to be "i'm going to tattle on you" but it's pretty ambiguous on the other hand i'm not super sure what else shuro would tell him 
ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 21:45 on May 1, 2024 |
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May 1, 2024 21:42
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It would be odd if Shuro sold them out after he said "if you need help ring this bell" given how afraid Marcille was about being charged with using black magic. Laios and crew seemed to part with them on good-ish terms, which I doubt would be the case if Shuro straight up said he'd tell the governor all the deals and effectively sign a death sentence for Marcille. Like was said above, I'm more worried that Kabru would say something incriminating than Shuro. However Kabru also likes to observe so if if had to guess I'd say that Shuro leaves an ambiguous report with the Governor, leading Kabru to start theory-crafting in his head on the variables in play if he told the Elves himself or not.
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May 1, 2024 21:53
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CuddleCryptid posted:Reducing Kabru's party to "always dies party" is so funny. Laios' party focuses on monsters and therefore fights monsters the best. Kabru's party focuses on humanoids and therefore are *terrifyingly strong* at fighting humanoids, whether socially or physically. They absolutely decimate the bandits that were trying to ambush them. That's *the whole point of the dynamic of the two parties*. I know but it's hard to deny it's been a recurring thing of them being found dead. It's just a silly. We know Kabru is great at cold blooded murder of humans. Poor choice by me to joke about them while whining like a baby about a bad review misunderstanding the show, admittedly.
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May 1, 2024 21:58
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Tommorow needs to be here already, next episodes gonna be good
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May 1, 2024 22:09
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Arc Hammer posted:It would be odd if Shuro sold them out after he said "if you need help ring this bell" given how afraid Marcille was about being charged with using black magic. Laios and crew seemed to part with them on good-ish terms, which I doubt would be the case if Shuro straight up said he'd tell the governor all the deals and effectively sign a death sentence for Marcille. really the big question for me is, what else would he tell them? "i went down to save a girl and she's a weird chicken dragon centaur now! it's insane, no idea how that happened. anyways i'm leaving the island." does the governor get reports on every adventurer dive or something? why doesn't he just... not report? some kind of vague hope that the governor or the elves will hear about the chicken dragon centaur and send an army down?
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May 1, 2024 22:12
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Hihohe posted:Tommorow needs to be here already, next episodes gonna be good I saw the next episode preview on youtube and I'm super excited.
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May 1, 2024 22:16
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Samurai are Lawful Alignment. Shuro has to tell the Governor.
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May 1, 2024 22:17
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Damned Paladins
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May 1, 2024 22:19
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Hihohe posted:Tommorow needs to be here already, next episodes gonna be good Spoilers! 
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May 1, 2024 22:25
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NmareBfly posted:Spoilers! Dungeon Meshi is good
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May 1, 2024 22:26
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asides from the falingon reveal, the other big turning point at this time in the manga is that the plot just goes full steam ahead after this point; every chapter after this point was a total banger
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May 1, 2024 23:31
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Yeah, what I consider to be the actual fantasy plotline is now starting. We've passed through the looking glass.
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May 1, 2024 23:38
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ninjewtsu posted:really the big question for me is, what else would he tell them? "i went down to save a girl and she's a weird chicken dragon centaur now! it's insane, no idea how that happened. anyways i'm leaving the island." does the governor get reports on every adventurer dive or something? why doesn't he just... not report? some kind of vague hope that the governor or the elves will hear about the chicken dragon centaur and send an army down? He doesn't have to go into detail but saying that he went dungeoneering and they were ambushed by something that can crush skulls and also cast spells seems pretty important to pass along. Like, I would assume Shuro is ethical enough to want to warn other people who might be planning dungeon dives that there's a previously unknown and extremely dangerous kind of monster roaming around. What the governor does with that information afterwards is out of his hands.
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May 1, 2024 23:53
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dragon enthusiast posted:asides from the falingon reveal, the other big turning point at this time in the manga is that the plot just goes full steam ahead after this point; every chapter after this point was a total banger Are they still gonna eat 
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May 1, 2024 23:57
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If Shuro breaks his Code of Honor requirements, then he loses access to his Samurai sub-class abilities. That includes Minions. If Shuro doesn't tattle on Laois, then he loses Tade as a companion. I think we can all live with this logic.
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May 1, 2024 23:58
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dragon enthusiast posted:asides from the falingon reveal When does the Karl Marx tornado appear?
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May 2, 2024 00:00
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What Pretend I made a shenyun joke
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May 2, 2024 00:04
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Alan Smithee posted:Are they still gonna eat 
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May 2, 2024 00:05
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They’re gonna eat nilbogs aren’t they
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May 2, 2024 00:07
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Mercury Hat posted:He doesn't have to go into detail but saying that he went dungeoneering and they were ambushed by something that can crush skulls and also cast spells seems pretty important to pass along. Like, I would assume Shuro is ethical enough to want to warn other people who might be planning dungeon dives that there's a previously unknown and extremely dangerous kind of monster roaming around. What the governor does with that information afterwards is out of his hands. It's also not for nothing that they don't want some random adventuring group showing up to murder Falin if there is a chance that she could be saved. So telling the governor "oh yeah there is a brand new monsters down there that is HELLA strong" is going to cause less people to move downwards if they can avoid it. Especially since he did knowingly let them get away when they could have dragged them through Surrogate Magic Mommy's wall scroll portal to face justice. Alan Smithee posted:Are they still gonna eat Yes but my wife is right there with you, living for the five seconds of cooking that recent episodes have had.
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May 2, 2024 00:08
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Alan Smithee posted:Are they still gonna eat Eating remains the focus of the series, it's honestly incredible how much Kui sticks to this as a theme through 100% of the manga. No more details obviously but yeah it's good. Good comic, good anime
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May 2, 2024 00:09
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Alan Smithee posted:Are they still gonna eat You bet your rear end they are. Eating is a core theme of this series, it's never going away.
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