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https://x.com/mxmimosa/status/1783201990278869414 College campuses across the country are heating up. All they’re simply doing is protesting Israel, but local and state governments are meeting them with brutality
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Apr 24, 2024 21:25
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Meatball posted:He was my rep until a recent redistricting. I recently moved to the state and this got me to look up my congresscritter. He's apparently a huge member of the Clinton faction. Yaaaaaaayyyy.... 
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Apr 24, 2024 21:32
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theCalamity posted:https://x.com/mxmimosa/status/1783201990278869414 Has there actually been widespread brutality? I thought they just arrested people who refused to leave the green and school buildings at Columbia. And the protestors cooperated because refusing to leave and getting arrested is sort of the point of a protest where you refuse to leave someone else's property. I haven't heard about any mass police brutality across multiple states. A WaPo article from yesterday says there were no injuries at Columbia.
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Apr 24, 2024 21:33
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Given what I know about Texas, I'm sure that will remain true for another 45 seconds or so.
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Apr 24, 2024 21:34
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Has there actually been widespread brutality? I thought they just arrested people who refused to leave the green and school buildings at Columbia. And the protestors cooperated because refusing to leave and getting arrested is sort of the point of a protest where you refuse to leave someone else's property. I haven't heard about any mass police brutality across multiple states. A WaPo article from yesterday says there were no injuries at Columbia. I heard an interview with one of the Columbia organizers on Chapo, and she said that people had shoulders and fingers dislocated. I would trust her before WaPo, tbh.
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Apr 24, 2024 21:36
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selec posted:I heard an interview with one of the Columbia organizers on Chapo, and she said that people had shoulders and fingers dislocated. I would trust her before WaPo, tbh. I would too. Police absolutely love petty brutality on protesters.
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Apr 24, 2024 21:57
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The sit-ins ramped up this week, as did the arrests because of the heinous violations of sitting on private property. Police actions seem to have ramped up over the last 24 hours, which is also the time period in which we learned that the FBI is advising universities on how to quell the protests. I'd give it time before trying to downplay a student movement that's pretty much obviously spreading across the country & the militarized responses we're seeing in several cities now. What universities have in their favor is the end of the term in a few weeks; otoh, it's likely that the students now protesting on campus will take a far wide approach in expressing their anti-genocide sentiment.
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Apr 24, 2024 22:00
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e: shits wild and hard to predict , like i thought the Israel counter bombing would have had a bigger slpash both in real life and here, but apparently no one cares about a sunday event anymore. but I do think the term ending soon is a bit of a coolant. Kavros posted:Tiktok got really weird with user data, phone memory and mobile data scalping real fast. I recommend at least keeping the app off your children's phones. you should also get a track blocker app, ive been using the duckduckgo mobile browser app has one along with a email address proxy deature. PhazonLink fucked around with this message at 22:04 on Apr 24, 2024 |
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Apr 24, 2024 22:01
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selec posted:I heard an interview with one of the Columbia organizers on Chapo, and she said that people had shoulders and fingers dislocated. I would trust her before WaPo, tbh. I can't find anyone else, even other protest leaders, claiming that. One of the students from Columbia who was representing the protestors was on NBC news and noted that they were peaceful protests and nobody has been injured. The Jewish and Palestinian student reps both just said there has been an "increasing exchange of antisemitic and Islamophobic rhetoric" in the last week since they started, but no mention of injuries. https://www.nbcnews.com/now/video/columbia-students-representing-jewish-and-pro-palestinian-sides-speak-about-protests-209610309512 Willa Rogers posted:The sit-ins ramped up this week, as did the arrests because of the heinous violations of sitting on private property. Police actions seem to have ramped up over the last 24 hours, which is also the time period in which we learned that the FBI is advising universities on how to quell the protests. It would be kind of silly to claim that it will never happen. But, there is a pretty big difference between "mass brutality" and "literally 0 people injured at peaceful protest" just as a matter of fact. Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Apr 24, 2024 |
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Apr 24, 2024 22:03
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You can listen to the interview here: https://on.soundcloud.com/JKBMytxeWkLEsKBi9 The organizer is a niece of Shireen Abu Akleh, to give a sense of the stakes here.
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Apr 24, 2024 22:08
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:
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Apr 24, 2024 22:21
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theCalamity posted:I’ve seen students thrown down while being arrested. And having police officers in full riot gear while carrying lethal weapons confront peaceful protestors is pretty brutal imo. Not saying the response is logical, but I don't think police having a holstered gun and wearing a helmet would be what most people think of when they use the term police brutality. I thought something might have gone down yesterday that I missed based on your description. Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Apr 24, 2024 |
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Apr 24, 2024 22:27
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:It would be kind of silly to claim that it will never happen. But, there is a pretty big difference between "mass brutality" and "literally 0 people injured at peaceful protest" just as a matter of fact. You were the one who used the term "mass brutality"; the post to which you responded simply said "local and state governments are meeting [protestors] with brutality." Maybe it's hair-splitting but given the video of police actions we've seen today from NYC, Austin, and Los Angeles (as well as the old standby "recorded history") I didn't consider that to be hyperbole, and I also said the police crackdowns only just began in the last day or so. Give the police some time in addition to the benefit of your doubt and I have a hunch which of the two of you will be proven correct.
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Apr 24, 2024 22:37
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https://twitter.com/robinmonotti/status/1783217609065824733 Already happening. Good to know we'll beat the poo poo out of Americans if they dare question where their tax money goes when it leaves the border. That poo poo is for TikTok, not real life.
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Apr 24, 2024 22:40
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Willa Rogers posted:You were the one who used the term "mass brutality"; the post to which you responded simply said "local and state governments are meeting [protestors] with brutality." It's not really hair splitting because there isn't really any nuance between "it happened" vs "it didn't." You're being kind of silly and asserting that saying it hasn't happened is some sort of endorsement of any future action. It's just a literal factual statement based on the linear nature of how time works and not some value statement. As of today, there have been no reported major injuries at Columbia.
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Apr 24, 2024 22:41
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:It's not really hair splitting because there isn't really any nuance between "it happened" vs "it didn't." In the sources you read. I posted a link to an interview from an organizer who said there have been shoulder and finger dislocations. Are those not major enough?
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Apr 24, 2024 22:44
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Not saying the response is logical, but I don't think police having a holstered gun and wearing a helmet would be what most people think of when they use the term police brutality. I thought something might have gone down yesterday that I missed based on your description. I didn’t say police brutality though. I said that these protestors are being met with brutality. Also I’m not speaking for most people I’m speaking for me and when I see police officers in riot gear and lethal weapons deployed against peaceful protestors, I consider that to be a brutal response. Mostly because there is a threat of violence from the police.
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Apr 24, 2024 22:44
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The way this is being phrased is like none of you have seen footage from or been to other protests before. Like it sucks that this is the normal course of things but this crackdown looks like every other protest I've been to that got broken up. The cops always push people and grab people in ways that cause minor to moderate injuries, to say nothing of the effects from "less than lethal" weaponry. The state so routinely inflicts medium levels of violence against protesters that it's become mundane. It was no different when my camp got cleared during the occupy protests, it was no different during either round of BLM protests. Leon has a point, the language being used here and elsewhere made me think something particularly bad had happened but as far as I've seen none have even been cleared using rubber bullets or tear gas yet. theCalamity posted:I didn’t say police brutality though. I said that these protestors are being met with brutality. Also I’m not speaking for most people I’m speaking for me and when I see police officers in riot gear and lethal weapons deployed against peaceful protestors, I consider that to be a brutal response. Mostly because there is a threat of violence from the police. This is how every protest gets met, even the fascist ones the cops agree with have cops show up in riot gear and cops don't even direct traffic without their guns because they're little baby cowards. Real edit: tbh maybe I've just become innured to the banal acts of violence in a maladaptive way Kagrenak fucked around with this message at 22:51 on Apr 24, 2024 |
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Apr 24, 2024 22:45
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theCalamity posted:I didn’t say police brutality though. I said that these protestors are being met with brutality. Also I’m not speaking for most people I’m speaking for me and when I see police officers in riot gear and lethal weapons deployed against peaceful protestors, I consider that to be a brutal response. Mostly because there is a threat of violence from the police. That's fine. I didn't think you were intending to speak for everyone, but most people would assume something different from the term brutality. Met with brutality by the police vs. police brutality is also something that confused me. That seems like the same thing to me? It's just a pedantic definition thing, though. I think we all agree on what has actually happened.
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Apr 24, 2024 22:47
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:It's not really hair splitting because there isn't really any nuance between "it happened" vs "it didn't." Police brutality can encompass more than major injuries; it can include the use of (and threatened use of) tear gas, lrads, kettling & various other intimidation tactics short of those requiring broken bones or hospitalization. And, for the third time, we're talking about police actions that began over the last 24 hours; I think you're being kind of silly in assuming a static police response given its first day, as well as the police response to other protest movements in the recent past such as BLM and Occupy. Willa Rogers fucked around with this message at 22:50 on Apr 24, 2024 |
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Apr 24, 2024 22:47
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selec posted:In the sources you read. I posted a link to an interview from an organizer who said there have been shoulder and finger dislocations. Are those not major enough? Do you have a timestamp? It is a 1 hour and 26 minute audio file. Also, is there anyone else who has claimed that? None of the 108 students arrested at Columbia asked for or received medical attention, so it would be wild if dozens of students were resetting their own shoulders and fingers on the bus ride to the campus security office. The other student protest leader on ABC said nobody was injured and WaPo says the same, so it doesn't seem really clear cut to me if nobody else says it.
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Apr 24, 2024 22:50
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Injuries at these sorts of things are almost always flooding social media the moment they happen, really shouldn't be a lack of sources if there was poo poo going down.
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Apr 24, 2024 22:52
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Do you have a timestamp? It is a 1 hour and 26 minute audio file. i mean, what else do you have to do that's so important
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Apr 24, 2024 22:59
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:i mean, what else do you have to do that's so important Just got out of work, so I'm going to take the foster dog to the vet and make tortellini with my wife. Neither of those situations are conducive to listening to two hours of audio.
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Apr 24, 2024 23:00
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I'm probably memory holing a bunch of incidents, but I feel like that the authorities didn't care that much about the BLM protests for instance. People can take a stance on guns or abortion or whatever controversial issue, but something about I/P gets a harsher response than just about anything else
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Apr 24, 2024 23:00
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Do you have a timestamp? It is a 1 hour and 26 minute audio file. Also, is there anyone else who has claimed that? None of the 108 students arrested at Columbia asked for or received medical attention, so it would be wild if dozens of students were resetting their own shoulders and fingers on the bus ride to the campus security office. The other student protest leader on ABC said nobody was injured and WaPo says the same, so it doesn't seem really clear cut to me if nobody else says it. it should be in the first half hour or so, the bulk of the episode is after the interview and consists of the hosts yakking about articles e: might be in the first ten or fifteen? i remember listening to it while running an errand yeterday and the place i went was about that long of a drive from my house
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Apr 24, 2024 23:02
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Do you have a timestamp? It is a 1 hour and 26 minute audio file. Also, is there anyone else who has claimed that? None of the 108 students arrested at Columbia asked for or received medical attention, so it would be wild if dozens of students were resetting their own shoulders and fingers on the bus ride to the campus security office. The other student protest leader on ABC said nobody was injured and WaPo says the same, so it doesn't seem really clear cut to me if nobody else says it. Interview is right at the beginning. You can listen if you're interested in hearing from someone on the ground, or you can keep getting your views mediated through sometimes-trustworthy mainstream sources. It's really all about how informed you want to be. I read your long-rear end articles, the least you could do is return the favor.
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Apr 24, 2024 23:04
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:I'm probably memory holing a bunch of incidents, but I feel like that the authorities didn't care that much about the BLM protests for instance. People can take a stance on guns or abortion or whatever controversial issue, but something about I/P gets a harsher response than just about anything else Most of the many smaller BLM protests post-2021 were largely ignored by authorities, but the BLM protests in the summer of 2020 definitely did not receive a low-key police response and included the entire state of Missouri going into lock down and the national guard enforcing a curfew with APCs. selec posted:Interview is right at the beginning. You can listen if you're interested in hearing from someone on the ground, or you can keep getting your views mediated through sometimes-trustworthy mainstream sources. It's really all about how informed you want to be. I read your long-rear end articles, the least you could do is return the favor. I would like to listen my friend. That is why I was asking for a timestamp. Just linking a 1.5 hour audio file is not something I can check in 15 minutes is all. Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Apr 24, 2024 |
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Apr 24, 2024 23:04
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:I'm probably memory holing a bunch of incidents, but I feel like that the authorities didn't care that much about the BLM protests for instance. People can take a stance on guns or abortion or whatever controversial issue, but something about I/P gets a harsher response than just about anything else They absolutely cared about them and many of them were met with harsh tactics and tear gas. A journalist in MN lost an eye from a rubber bullet iirc and that was during a tamer protest. The bigger thing here imo is that people are setting up camps. They really don't want a repeat of the Occupy style protests where people were out there every day and got really quite dug in in some places.
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Apr 24, 2024 23:05
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:I'm probably memory holing a bunch of incidents, but I feel like that the authorities didn't care that much about the BLM protests for instance. People can take a stance on guns or abortion or whatever controversial issue, but something about I/P gets a harsher response than just about anything else They discuss this in the same episode I posted, and I think they make a good point. The argument is over. Biden, and the entire DNC/GOP, is unable, not just unwilling, to change course. This course is set in stone. So the argument is over, but these student camps keep making the contradiction visible, which is intolerable to any form of authority that is certain it will not change course. What is happening in Palestine is visibly, easily readable as a genocide when you read the news. But then you gotta read that somehow we're supporting it. That's untenable. So you have to shut down the site of the contradiction being shoved in people's faces. Because policy isn't going to change, that's written into the political economy of the globe-spanning empire we sit atop. So what's left but to remove the fools who insist on pointing out the contradiction? They're the problem, now. We're not going to change policy, so there's no point in them being there, within the liberal imagination such as it exists in DC. selec fucked around with this message at 23:10 on Apr 24, 2024 |
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Apr 24, 2024 23:07
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Most of the many smaller BLM protests post-2021 were largely ignored by authorities, but the BLM protests in the summer of 2020 definitely did not receive a low-key police response and included the entire state of Missouri going into lock down and the national guard enforcing a curfew with APCs. Minneapolis police shot rubber bullets at a lady who was in her own house.
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Apr 24, 2024 23:09
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Deuce posted:Minneapolis police shot rubber bullets at a lady who was in her own house. Yeah, it was insane. I get why people would want to blank the summer of 2020 from their minds, but I'm not sure how you can forget how wild it got.
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Apr 24, 2024 23:12
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Just got out of work, so I'm going to take the foster dog to the vet and make tortellini with my wife. Neither of those situations are conducive to listening to two hours of audio. Car rides and cooking are two activities very compatible with listening to podcasts in my experience
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Apr 24, 2024 23:13
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Car rides and cooking are two activities very compatible with listening to podcasts in my experience Not conducive to making my wife happy, though.
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Apr 24, 2024 23:14
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Not conducive to making my wife happy, though. Understandable. Another alternative then might be to take it on good faith that the posters in this thread are telling you the truth.
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Apr 24, 2024 23:15
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:I'm probably memory holing a bunch of incidents, but I feel like that the authorities didn't care that much about the BLM protests for instance. People can take a stance on guns or abortion or whatever controversial issue, but something about I/P gets a harsher response than just about anything else I'm not sure what the rules say about linking or quoting a post from cspam but I urge you to check out DJJIB-DJDCT's analysis over the last couple pages of the I/P thread there; he answers that bolded part incredibly well in context of western politics (he's a military scholar & instructor, I believe).
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Apr 24, 2024 23:15
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Understandable. Another alternative then might be to take it on good faith that the posters in this thread are telling you the truth. I wasn't doubting him. Check up a few posts. Just saying that nobody else is claiming it and other leaders are contradicting her, so it doesn't seem clear cut. Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Also, is there anyone else who has claimed that? None of the 108 students arrested at Columbia asked for or received medical attention, so it would be wild if dozens of students were resetting their own shoulders and fingers on the bus ride to the campus security office. The other student protest leader on ABC said nobody was injured and WaPo says the same, so it doesn't seem really clear cut to me if nobody else says it.
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Apr 24, 2024 23:22
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:I wasn't doubting him. Check up a few posts. Just saying that nobody else is claiming it and other leaders are contradicting her, so it doesn't seem clear cut. then why did you need a timestamp?
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Apr 24, 2024 23:24
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Kagrenak posted:They absolutely cared about them and many of them were met with harsh tactics and tear gas. A journalist in MN lost an eye from a rubber bullet iirc and that was during a tamer protest. The bigger thing here imo is that people are setting up camps. They really don't want a repeat of the Occupy style protests where people were out there every day and got really quite dug in in some places. Putting aside cops for a sec, I guess I meant the government in general. Like, there have been collegiate protests against everything for a while now, but I don't remember witchhunt congressional inquiries and university presidents getting whacked until the Israeli protests. Again, there is probably a bunch of stuff I memory holed away Willa Rogers posted:I'm not sure what the rules say about linking or quoting a post from cspam but I urge you to check out DJJIB-DJDCT's analysis over the last couple pages of the I/P thread there; he answers that bolded part incredibly well in context of western politics (he's a military scholar & instructor, I believe). I'll check it out
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Apr 24, 2024 23:24
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:then why did you need a timestamp? Because I wanted to hear her full description directly since I didn't have time to listen to the whole 1.5 hours.
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Apr 24, 2024 23:25
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