USCE 2024: Macklemore Is The New Michael Moore

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > USCE 2024: Macklemore Is The New Michael Moore

The Glumslinger: Sep 24, 2008; Coach Nagy, you want me to throw to WHAT side of the field?; Hair Elf

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

The first publicly available gene therapy treatment procedures in the U.S. will become available this year.

This gene therapy for a rare type of hemophilia is the second ever FDA-approved gene therapy treatment. Another gene therapy treatment for treating a specific form of sickle cell is also becoming available in 2024.

These gene therapy techniques require only a single dose to treat the disease, but how long that dose lasts is still an open question. In clinical tests it has lasted for over a year, but they will be monitoring the impact on patients for the next 15 years for study.

The process has a 60% success rate at fully curing hemophilia.

The process has a list price of $3.5 million wholesale, but it isn't clear how much it would actually cost the average patient.

https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1783842256060899815

As someone who knows quite a lot about these treatments, its a lot more complicated that a just a single treatment. You're taking their bone marrow, editing it in a lab, then giving them person chemo to wipe out some of their existing bone marrow to make space for the fixed stuff you are re-adding. If you have good uptake, it should last for life and that has generally been true for successful treatments over the past 15-20 years because the fixed cells will continue to pump out whatever protein or correctly made cell that you had previously been unable to make.

Part of why the treatments are so expense is that its a lot of initial patient care and that the labs that do the gene editing need to stay fully operational and functioning for very few treatments per year. Its something that should come down quite a bit over time as more things are approved, but that also relies on getting to the point where resources are pooled and you dont have 50 little drug startups each running their own low volume lab.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 17:46

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# ? May 8, 2024 12:37

Bar Ran Dun: Jan 22, 2006

Aztec Galactus posted:

Resolves what? Cutting funding for public education is the goal

It will be a big deal in FL. Rich places in the state have decent schools and some of the magnet schools are the best in the country.

The universities are also fantastically cheap for in state tuition.

They don�t want to defund the schools they want to transform them into conservative generating institutions. What they doing at New College is a good example.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 17:49

Hieronymous Alloy: Jan 30, 2009; Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!; Morbid Hound

Bar Ran Dun posted:

It will be a big deal in FL. Rich places in the state have decent schools and some of the magnet schools are the best in the country.

The universities are also fantastically cheap for in state tuition.

They don’t want to defund the schools they want to transform them into conservative generating institutions. What they doing at New College is a good example.

They absolutely want to defund and privatize secondary and high schools. Can't grift nearly as well on a public.school system.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 17:55

FLIPADELPHIA: Apr 27, 2007; Heavy Shit; Grimey Drawer

Lol the fascists will LOVE that Noem story because it's the kind of solution they'd consider. Also casually murdering pets triggers the libs so her stock just went up.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 18:27

maruhkati: Sep 29, 2021; NAZ REID

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

Speaking of Biden's fairly rare sit-down interviews:

Biden is doing his first live sit-down interview since March 9th right now.

This was previously unannounced and just started about 6 minutes ago.

Probably not going to make the NYT happy.

https://twitter.com/seungminkim/status/1783861443244208593

This is the first good thing Biden's done in years.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 18:35

Shooting Blanks: Jun 6, 2007; Real bullets mess up how cool this thing looks.

-Blade

How granular is Florida's control over federal education funding? Is it given to the state to be disbursed to various institutions/districts? If so, I expect every dime of that lost funding will be taken away from liberal schools, to preserve the integrity of the conservative ones the state wants to strengthen.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 18:42

Leon Trotsky 2012: Aug 27, 2009; YOU CAN TRUST ME!*

_{*Israeli Government-affiliated poster}

Shooting Blanks posted:

How granular is Florida's control over federal education funding? Is it given to the state to be disbursed to various institutions/districts? If so, I expect every dime of that lost funding will be taken away from liberal schools, to preserve the integrity of the conservative ones the state wants to strengthen.

If they receive ANY federal funds, then they have to comply with Title IX or else they lose all federal education and grant money. Some of the money, like for school lunches, is technically not "educational" spending and they can keep it, but they would lose everything else they get for education.

Nobody has ever refused to have an entire state comply before (because it was strictly about sex discrimination), so there isn't really a precedent for what happens. Some schools have not complied out of laziness or neglect, but they always get warnings and then straighten up rather than outright refuse.

It is also on a per institution basis, so DeSantis is going to have to require all public universities and public schools to enforce Florida law and ignore federal law.

I don't know the specifics of how Florida law determines how that plays out if he requires it or what he does if some schools comply with federal law and break Florida law.

A lot of the specifics are going to be determined by what the Florida legislature and DeSantis decide to do 5 months from now.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 18:56

Willa Rogers: Mar 11, 2005

Kagrenak posted:

I would assume that one just immediately hits their out of pocket maximum.

A few of these gene therapies only charge if it works, which is kind of interesting.

I would be pretty interested to see the costs on this if they were operating as a non-profit and just covering costs and R&D. I work too much earlier in the process of drug discovery (not in gene therapy either) to really have a handle on the total costs of programs like this. But I do have some insight into the work involved for each patient and the overall development and these therapies are huge projects and many of these gene therapies have limited patient populations.

Wouldn't the out-of-pocket maximum be irrelevant if the treatment isn't approved by one's health-insurance policy?

Insurers (and self-insured employers) are starting to reject coverage of the new weight-loss drugs except when prescribed for treating diabetes (I'm not sure about pre-diabetes) and those are a pittance of the costs of gene therapies.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 19:04

Fork of Unknown Origins: Oct 21, 2005; Gotta Herd On?

Willa Rogers posted:

Wouldn't the out-of-pocket maximum be irrelevant if the treatment isn't approved by one's health-insurance policy?

Insurers (and self-insured employers) are starting to reject coverage of the new weight-loss drugs except when prescribed for treating diabetes (I'm not sure about pre-diabetes) and those are a pittance of the costs of gene therapies.

That seems insane considering the costs they would avoid by having their customers be at a lower weight.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 19:09

Bar Ran Dun: Jan 22, 2006

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

They absolutely want to defund and privatize secondary and high schools. Can't grift nearly as well on a public.school system.

In general yes,

But it�s more complicated in FL specifically. Here�s an example Florida has the best public gifted and talented school in the country. It�s not privatized it�s run by the public school district in Sarasota. That�s that district. Remember crazy moms for liberty married to the Florida head of the GOP and the swinging / her husband raping someone scandal. That school is in her district.

That school is also the �curly hair� school fyi

https://youtu.be/qpTVyozS7M0?si=12zO0XPJuv4VZI_t

Teachers at that school directly inspire young adult fantasy characters.

Now look at Ft. Myers and compare, private charters underfunded more minority students.

Florida does both things. It runs well funded high end public programs where rich white peoples are and it �defund(s) and privatize(s) secondary and high schools� where poorer and minority students are.

Here�s another way get what�s going on. In state tuition at UF is $6,381.

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/university-of-florida-1535/paying

It�s fantastically cheap to goto university in Florida. Who is going into to that affordable university, the kids in the well funded well run public programs from rich areas.

The covid response was similar. Desantis rolled out early free easy to get vaccines for rich GOP heavy areas while making GBS threads on vaccines publicly and making it very very hard to get them if one was poor.

It�s both things. They want things to be run well where the rich are and to privatize and dismantle where the poor are. Losing title IX funding hurts them in the catering to rich areas like Sarasota side of the equation, and they�ll hear about from those areas.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 19:13

Leon Trotsky 2012: Aug 27, 2009; YOU CAN TRUST ME!*

_{*Israeli Government-affiliated poster}

The NHTSA released the findings of their multiyear study of Tesla self-driving safety and found that Tesla FSD was involved hundreds of crashes and dozens of deaths.

The critical distinction they make is that the FSD modes are not necessary directly responsible for all of those incidents, but that Tesla programming and marketing encourage drivers to not pay attention to the road when "Full Self Driving" mode is engaged and instead just put a warning in their manual that Full Self-Driving mode is not actually meant to be fully self-driving.

If FSD or autopilot were being used properly, then many of those crashes could have been avoided. However, they assert that FSD and autopilot have features and marketing that are designed to incentivize users to not use them properly.

They determined that the "Full Self-Driving" and "autopilot" marketing were both misleading and lead drivers to pay less attention to the road under the assumption that it was fully under control by the FSD system. In most of these Tesla accidents, the drivers had at least 5 seconds to react to avoid the accident, but were not engaged with driving and proceeded to crash.

Other manufacturers who have driver-assist technology use different marketing and methods that require drivers to hold the wheel or pay attention and have significantly better safety records.

Tesla already issued a voluntary recall and software update for their FSD and autopilot system designed to change some of these features, but the NHTSA has announced a new investigation into Tesla autopilot and FSD safety based on these findings.

Tesla is also being investigated for intentionally misleading marketing around their FSD and autopilot systems.

quote:

Tesla�s Autopilot and Full Self-Driving linked to hundreds of crashes, dozens of deaths

NHTSA found that Tesla�s driver-assist features are insufficient at keeping drivers engaged in the task of driving, which can often have fatal results.

In March 2023, a North Carolina student was stepping off a school bus when he was struck by a Tesla Model Y traveling at �highway speeds,� according to a federal investigation that published today. The Tesla driver was using Autopilot, the automaker�s advanced driver-assist feature that Elon Musk insists will eventually lead to fully autonomous cars.

The 17-year-old student who was struck was transported to a hospital by helicopter with life-threatening injuries. But what the investigation found after examining hundreds of similar crashes was a pattern of driver inattention, combined with the shortcomings of Tesla�s technology, resulting in hundreds of injuries and dozens of deaths.

Drivers using Autopilot or the system�s more advanced sibling, Full Self-Driving, �were not sufficiently engaged in the driving task,� and Tesla�s technology �did not adequately ensure that drivers maintained their attention on the driving task,� NHTSA concluded.

In total, NHTSA investigated 956 crashes, starting in January 2018 and extending all the way until August 2023. Of those crashes, some of which involved other vehicles striking the Tesla vehicle, 29 people died. There were also 211 crashes in which �the frontal plane of the Tesla struck a vehicle or obstacle in its path.� These crashes, which were often the most severe, resulted in 14 deaths and 49 injuries.

NHTSA was prompted to launch its investigation after several incidents of Tesla drivers crashing into stationary emergency vehicles parked on the side of the road. Most of these incidents took place after dark, with the software ignoring scene control measures, including warning lights, flares, cones, and an illuminated arrow board.

In its report, the agency found that Autopilot � and, in some cases, FSD � was not designed to keep the driver engaged in the task of driving. Tesla says that it warns its customers that they need to pay attention while using Autopilot and FSD, which includes keeping their hands on the wheels and eyes on the road. But NHTSA says that in many cases, drivers would become overly complacent and lose focus. And when it came time to react, it was often too late.

In 59 crashes examined by NHTSA, the agency found that Tesla drivers had enough time, �five or more seconds,� prior to crashing into another object in which to react. In 19 of those crashes, the hazard was visible for 10 or more seconds before the collision. Reviewing crash logs and data provided by Tesla, NHTSA found that drivers failed to brake or steer to avoid the hazard in a majority of the crashes analyzed.

�Crashes with no or late evasive action attempted by the driver were found across all Tesla hardware versions and crash circumstances,� NHTSA said.

NHTSA also compared Tesla�s Level 2 (L2) automation features to products available in other companies� vehicles. Unlike other systems, Autopilot would disengage rather than allow drivers to adjust their steering. This �discourages� drivers from staying involved in the task of driving, NHTSA said.

A comparison of Tesla�s design choices to those of L2 peers identified Tesla as an industry outlier in its approach to L2 technology by mismatching a weak driver engagement system with Autopilot�s permissive operating capabilities,� the agency said.

Even the brand name �Autopilot� is misleading, NHTSA said, conjuring up the idea that drivers are not in control. While other companies use some version of �assist,� �sense,� or �team,� Tesla�s products lure drivers into thinking they are more capable than they are. California�s attorney general and the state�s Department of Motor Vehicles are both investigating Tesla for misleading branding and marketing.

NHTSA acknowledges that its probe may be incomplete based on �gaps� in Tesla�s telemetry data. That could mean there are many more crashes involving Autopilot and FSD than what NHTSA was able to find.

Tesla issued a voluntary recall late last year in response to the investigation, pushing out an over-the-air software update to add more warnings to Autopilot. NHTSA said today it was launching a new investigation into the recall after a number of safety experts said the update was inadequate and still allowed for misuse.

The findings cut against Musk�s insistence that Tesla is an artificial intelligence company that is on the cusp of releasing a fully autonomous vehicle for personal use. The company plans to unveil a robotaxi later this year that is supposed to usher in this new era for Tesla. During this week�s first quarter earnings call, Musk doubled down on the notion that his vehicles were safer than human-driven cars.

�If you�ve got, at scale, a statistically significant amount of data that shows conclusively that the autonomous car has, let�s say, half the accident rate of a human-driven car, I think that�s difficult to ignore,� Musk said. �Because at that point, stopping autonomy means killing people.�

https://www.theverge.com/2024/4/26/24141361/tesla-autopilot-fsd-nhtsa-investigation-report-crash-death

# ? Apr 26, 2024 19:18

Willa Rogers: Mar 11, 2005

Fork of Unknown Origins posted:

That seems insane considering the costs they would avoid by having their customers be at a lower weight.

A lot of health insurers never provided coverage for the weight-loss drugs from the jump. From January:

quote:

Most employer insurance plans don�t cover popular GLP-1 medications like Wegovy and Zepbound � or any other medications for weight loss, for that matter. Medicare also doesn�t pay for weight loss medications.

According to a survey conducted in October 2023 by the International Foundation of Employee Benefit Plans and another by the employee research firm Savanta, only about 1 in 4 employers covered GLP-1 drugs for weight loss in 2023, although both indicate that more employers � as many as 43% � are planning to offer them as part of their health plans this year.

At the same time, some employers who were part of the first wave of companies to cover the drugs are now narrowing the criteria people need to meet to qualify for coverage.

The International Foundation of Employee Benefit Plans survey shows that roughly 30% of employers who currently cover the medication for weight loss say they�re considering restricting that coverage to control costs.

The main ways they�re doing this are through what insurance companies call utilization management, which means looking at each person�s eligibility on a case-by-case basis or by requiring that they try other therapies such as lifestyle management or older weight loss medications before they qualify for GLP-1 drugs.

�It�s very common for insurance companies to create these hoops that patients have to jump through,� said Dr. Dan Azagury, medical director of the Stanford Bariatric and Metabolic Interdisciplinary Clinic.

Azagury said patients may be required to try a cheaper drug that�s not expected to be effective and known to cause side effects like diarrhea.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/08/health/weight-loss-drug-insurance-denials/index.html

The story goes on to discuss the long-term benefits of weight management but also mentions that insurers aren't the ones who will be left holding the bag down the road, as well as the unknown longterm effects of the drugs.

quote:

Still, if treating obesity could lead to such big cost offsets, why aren�t more insurers jumping to cover the new drugs?

Dr. Bryan Tysinger, a research assistant professor at USC who worked on the analysis, said there are two reasons.

�The first is that the long-term effects of these drugs aren�t fully known yet,� he said. �If people do need to stay on these drugs long-term, are there long-term health benefits? We just don�t know.�

The second reason is what Tysinger calls a misalignment of incentives.

An insurer covering a 45-year-old, for example, might shoulder the cost of weight lost medications for a decade or so, but sooner or later, those employees will retire, and their health care costs shift to Medicare.

Medicare would also then reap the benefits of preventing their obesity.

�So maybe investing in prevention isn�t worth as much to you as it is to Medicare,� he says.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 19:23

BRAKE FOR MOOSE: Jun 6, 2001

Willa Rogers posted:

Wouldn't the out-of-pocket maximum be irrelevant if the treatment isn't approved by one's health-insurance policy?

Insurers (and self-insured employers) are starting to reject coverage of the new weight-loss drugs except when prescribed for treating diabetes (I'm not sure about pre-diabetes) and those are a pittance of the costs of gene therapies.

Yeah, insurance coverage is a giant question mark here. This is an article about the insurance situation regarding the approved sickle cell treatments: https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/gene-therapy-casgevy-lyfgenia-elevidys-insurance.html

For all of us who've spent time fighting over routine specialist visits and prescriptions, it is more promising than you might intuit, but there's still going to be a lot of uneccessary anxiety and battles over potentially lifesaving treatments.

There's not a great way to reduce the costs; gene therapies are an outrageously expensive thing to develop, the diseases are rare, and the winning products need to pay back the costs of the losers (and generate value for shareholders!!!). Even under ideal conditions where this was fully socialized and non-profit with the revenue just paying back development and production costs, it would still be expensive, just not to the patient.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 19:40

DeadlyMuffin: Jul 3, 2007

BRAKE FOR MOOSE posted:

Even under ideal conditions where this was fully socialized and non-profit with the revenue just paying back development and production costs, it would still be expensive, just not to the patient.

Under a fully socialized and non-profit condition there would need to be a decision made whether to support something like this or not.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 20:24

Nonsense: Jan 26, 2007

Reps. Ritchie Torres (D-N.Y.) and Mike Lawler (R-N.Y.) plan to introduce the College Oversight and Legal Updates Mandating Bias Investigations and Accountability (COLUMBIA) Act, in the wake of pro-Palestinian encampments, protests and arrests on college campuses nationwide.

The bill would allow the Department of Education to create a third-party monitor for antisemitic activity on college campuses that receive federal funding. The legislation was first reported by Jewish Insider.

Torres said in a statement announcing the bill that college antisemitism since Hamas invaded Israel on Oct. 7 has been �at an all-time high� and �American universities are not capable of handling it when left to their own devices.�

[i]The bill would allow the Department of Education to create a third-party monitor for antisemitic activity on college campuses that receive federal funding. The legislation was first reported by Jewish Insider.

Torres said in a statement announcing the bill that college antisemitism since Hamas invaded Israel on Oct. 7 has been �at an all-time high� and �American universities are not capable of handling it when left to their own devices.�

Torres said there are �blatant violation[s] of Jewish students� civil rights� happening at schools across the country, and the federal government �cannot allow this to continue unchecked.�

https://jewishinsider.com/2024/04/ritchie-torres-mike-lawler-campus-antisemitism-legislation-columbia/

edit: Correction accepted, apologies

DC is out of control with their Israeli outrage talking points

Nonsense fucked around with this message at 20:47 on Apr 26, 2024

# ? Apr 26, 2024 20:38

Devor: Nov 30, 2004; Lurking more.

DeadlyMuffin posted:

Under a fully socialized and non-profit condition there would need to be a decision made whether to support something like this or not.

But it's a much easier thing to justify when you are looking at it over the life of the patient from the socialized medicine standpoint, rather than a 1-year enrollment under your employer-sponsored plan

# ? Apr 26, 2024 20:38

Leon Trotsky 2012: Aug 27, 2009; YOU CAN TRUST ME!*

_{*Israeli Government-affiliated poster}

Nonsense posted:

Reps. Ritchie Torres (D-N.Y.) and Mike Lawler (R-N.Y.) plan to introduce the College Oversight and Legal Updates Mandating Bias Investigations and Accountability (COLUMBIA) Act, in the wake of pro-Palestinian encampments, protests and arrests on college campuses nationwide.

The bill would allow the Department of Education to create a third-party monitor for antisemitic activity on college campuses that receive federal funding. The legislation was first reported by Jewish Insider.

Torres said in a statement announcing the bill that college antisemitism since Hamas invaded Israel on Oct. 7 has been �at an all-time high� and �American universities are not capable of handling it when left to their own devices.�

The bill would allow the Department of Education to create a third-party monitor for antisemitic activity on college campuses that receive federal funding. The legislation was first reported by Jewish Insider.

Torres said in a statement announcing the bill that college antisemitism since Hamas invaded Israel on Oct. 7 has been �at an all-time high� and �American universities are not capable of handling it when left to their own devices.�

Torres said there are �blatant violation[s] of Jewish students� civil rights� happening at schools across the country, and the federal government �cannot allow this to continue unchecked.�

What is this? Why is the Democratic House Leader wasting time on this poo poo, when Republicans are going after DEI, but this makes sense how?

Ritchie Torres is not the Democratic House Leader. That is Hakeem Jeffries. They are both southern NYC congressmen, but different people.

Torres is from a southern NYC congressional district and is always doing whatever he can to promote himself to Dominican and Jewish NYC voters. He tweets constantly about the Dominican Republic and Israel. He loves the camera and this is a easy messaging bill that doesn't really do anything he can attach his name to in order to look good.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 20:43

Willa Rogers: Mar 11, 2005

Medicare sets the treatment standards for a lot of non-Medicare insurers, and Medicare recently approved weight-loss drugs for some medical conditions:

quote:

For the first time, Medicare will allow coverage of one of the new blockbuster weight-loss drugs for enrollees in Part D plans.

The plans may now cover Wegovy when prescribed to prevent heart attacks and strokes, according to a new policy issued this week from the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services.

Wegovy is a GLP-1 agonist, a class of obesity drugs promising a sea change in weight loss. They act on hormones and the brain to drastically reduce appetite, among other things.

But Medicare is prohibited from paying for weight-loss treatments so seniors have had to pay out of pocket for the drugs or use supplemental insurance. In early March, the Food and Drug Administration expanded the approval of Wegovy to say the drug can be used to reduce the risk of cardiovascular death, heart attack and stroke in people with cardiovascular disease and either overweight or obesity.

In clinical trials, Wegovy was found to reduce risks of cardiovascular events by 20% in higher weight patients.

That finding prompted CMS to change its Medicare Part D drug program to cover Wegovy, although it noted that this applies only for those patients struggling with both weight and heart disease. In other words, the injections, which can cost well over $1,000 a month out of pocket, will not be covered for enrollees only seeking to lose weight.

The new guidance also applies to state Medicaid plans, which also would be required to cover Wegovy for patients with both higher weight and heart disease risk.

Obesity doctor Angela Fitch says that the move to cover it even for a limited subset of patients is still significant. She's president of the Obesity Medicine Association, a group that advocates for treatment.

"It's certainly a big step forward, compared to no coverage at all," she says. "At least now we'll have coverage for those people who have a known history of heart disease," she says. "So hopefully that will trickle down into covering it for everybody with overweight and obesity."

And, Fitch notes, Medicare sets the standard for coverage in insurance generally, so this move could ultimately affect more patients. "My hope would be that commercial insurance would follow."

In a statement, a CMS spokesperson said: "CMS is committed to ensuring that people have access to treatments and treatment options that improve health outcomes."

The Medicare guidance could also expand the use of other similar medicines. It states that anti-obesity medications that receive FDA approval for an additional condition other than weight-management alone, can be considered a Part D drug for that specific use. For example, if one of the drugs receives FDA approval to treat diabetes or prevent cardiovascular disease, Medicare part D plans may cover it for that use.

A fully socialized healthcare system also would likely have stricter controls on pharma pricing.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 20:44

lobster shirt: Jun 14, 2021

medicare should be allowed to pay for weight loss in general imo

# ? Apr 26, 2024 20:52

Sundae: Dec 1, 2005

As much as I hate to admit it, I can absolutely understand why insurers would try so hard to keep from covering Ozempic / Wegovy / Mounjaro / etc.

Here's a 90-day of my 5mg-dose Mounjaro, as an example. I am fortunate to have good insurance, or I would simply not be able to take the medication.

I know the insurers pay a different rate and all, but with how prevalent the weight-loss equivalents of this medication could become with wider adoption, even paying 1/4 of that rate would be catastrophic to their margins. Not that I give a poo poo about their margins, but I understand why they care.

quote:

medicare should be allowed to pay for weight loss in general imo

Yep, at bare minimum it should absolutely cover cases of actual obesity. It's not just a cosmetic thing to get out of the obese range; it's a serious thing and cuts the likelihood of other medical conditions by doing so.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 20:54

Leon Trotsky 2012: Aug 27, 2009; YOU CAN TRUST ME!*

_{*Israeli Government-affiliated poster}

lobster shirt posted:

medicare should be allowed to pay for weight loss in general imo

They should, but they are barred by law from paying for "purely cosmetic" surgery or weight loss drugs. Congress needs to repeal the law that bans them before they can even think about covering it generally.

The new regulation they announced recently is basically their way of trying to legally cover it by sidestepping the law because it is being used "medicinally" to lower heart attacks (by reducing their weight).

# ? Apr 26, 2024 20:55

Professor Beetus: Apr 12, 2007; They can fight us
But they'll never Beetus

Healthier weights lead to better health outcomes but also weight loss is cosmetic. The state of healthcare, ladies and gents.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:03

Fork of Unknown Origins: Oct 21, 2005; Gotta Herd On?

Professor Beetus posted:

Healthier weights lead to better health outcomes but also weight loss is cosmetic. The state of healthcare, ladies and gents.

We can charge more for a pound of cure than an ounce of prevention?

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:10

Killer robot: Sep 6, 2010; I was having the most wonderful dream. I think you were in it!; Pillbug

Even aside from insurance the whole use of anti-diabetes drugs being used for weight loss is pretty fraught right now because demand has increased far more rapidly than production can spool up, and there's a whole spectrum from people who absolutely need it for health issues not directly related to weight to healthy people who are absolutely using it cosmetically and want the wonder drug that makes it easier to diet, with medically obese people somewhere along the way.

I expect it will become a routine part of weight management in the future but right now costs/availability are real weird and insurance companies aren't the primary driver of why.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:11

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Professor Beetus posted:

Healthier weights lead to better health outcomes but also weight loss is cosmetic. The state of healthcare, ladies and gents.

Teeth and eyes aren't related to health either, purely cosmetic.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:14

Butter Activities: May 4, 2018; Can't post for 12 hours!

Uglycat posted:

Hey guys

If your gunna do medium risk direct actions, like encampment

Make sure you have a photographer that's savvy
A medic
A green hat lawyer
When arrested, go limp. Takes 4 to carry you off, wears out the pigs, and your media team gets epic pics of you bloodied and limp with 4 military cosplayers carrying you to a cage

From experience

Also

Crazies and agents and clowns will show up.
Them's the breaks.

It's my understanding that it is reasonably well established in US case law that going limp is called "passive resistance" in most police training, and is usually sufficient for a resisting/interfering charge, and at least enough justification for use of force by police that you're probably not going to have a hope of beating qualified immunity. Not so fun fact.

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:18

TheDeadlyShoe: Feb 14, 2014

Seems to me that medicare's basically done an end run around the weight loss restriction. We can't treat obesity, but we *can* treat the risks caused by obesity...lmao

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:33

DeadlyMuffin: Jul 3, 2007

Devor posted:

But it's a much easier thing to justify when you are looking at it over the life of the patient from the socialized medicine standpoint, rather than a 1-year enrollment under your employer-sponsored plan

And without having to make a profit. Completely agreed.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:36

Leon Trotsky 2012: Aug 27, 2009; YOU CAN TRUST ME!*

_{*Israeli Government-affiliated poster}

TheDeadlyShoe posted:

Seems to me that medicare's basically done an end run around the weight loss restriction. We can't treat obesity, but we *can* treat the risks caused by obesity...lmao

Only a partial end run for a specific group of people. You have to get heart disease first.

Good if you want weight loss drugs and have heart disease. Getting heart disease is probably not worth it just to get free weight loss drugs, though.

The rule does open the door for broader general coverage in the future If they can clinically prove other medical benefits or new drugs are invented that do.

Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 21:40 on Apr 26, 2024

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:36

TheDeadlyShoe: Feb 14, 2014

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

Only a partial end run for a specific group of people. You have to get heart disease first.

Good if you want weight loss drugs and have heart disease. Getting heart disease is probably not worth it just to get free weight loss drugs, though.

The rule does open the door for more broad coverage in the future If they can clinically prove other medical benefits or new drugs are invented that do.

It's something like 50% of Americans with some form of condition that can be labeled cardiovascular disease, since it includes high blood pressure.

Though i'm not sure if thats the standard Medicare uses.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:40

Freakazoid_: Jul 5, 2013; Buglord

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

Speaking of Biden's fairly rare sit-down interviews:

Biden is doing his first live sit-down interview since March 9th right now.

This was previously unannounced and just started about 6 minutes ago.

Probably not going to make the NYT happy.

https://twitter.com/seungminkim/status/1783861443244208593

How relevant has Howard Stern been to politics? I haven't paid attention to him since the 90's and I'm pretty sure he had no political interests until his interview with Hillary a few years ago. Is his political interests a recent turn or has he done other notable interviews with political figures that I just completely missed?

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:47

PharmerBoy: Jul 21, 2008

Butter Activities posted:

It's my understanding that it is reasonably well established in US case law that going limp is called "passive resistance" in most police training, and is usually sufficient for a resisting/interfering charge, and at least enough justification for use of force by police that you're probably not going to have a hope of beating qualified immunity. Not so fun fact.

Can any lawyers in the topic speak to this? I can see, by stretching, where to get to going limp is resisting arrest, but going limp being sufficient to justify use of force is a new aspect to the hellscape that's still surprising.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 21:57

Leon Trotsky 2012: Aug 27, 2009; YOU CAN TRUST ME!*

_{*Israeli Government-affiliated poster}

PharmerBoy posted:

Can any lawyers in the topic speak to this? I can see, by stretching, where to get to going limp is resisting arrest, but going limp being sufficient to justify use of force is a new aspect to the hellscape that's still surprising.

Going limp is not enough to justify use of force, but if you are doing it for the explicit purpose of delaying or avoiding arrest, then it is called passive resistance and can be enough to get you charged with resisting arrest. I'm not familiar with every state law, but many states have a separate charge for "non-violent" resisting arrest that is a class lower than a standard resisting charge.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 22:00

Hieronymous Alloy: Jan 30, 2009; Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!; Morbid Hound

PharmerBoy posted:

Can any lawyers in the topic speak to this? I can see, by stretching, where to get to going limp is resisting arrest, but going limp being sufficient to justify use of force is a new aspect to the hellscape that's still surprising.

My advice as an attorney is to avoid situations that could result in arrest. Ideally avoid all cops entirely. If they want a reason to charge you they will find one. There is no course of action that will avoid a "resisting arrest" charge if the cop wants to charge you.

Later, the way to beat a resisting arrest charge down the road is to beat the underlying charge that gave rise to the arrest, proving the arrest itself was unlawful. Then the resting charge will also have to be dropped. That doesn't do diddly for you at the time of arrest tho.

Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 22:08 on Apr 26, 2024

# ? Apr 26, 2024 22:05

DeathChicken: Jul 9, 2012; Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

Freakazoid_ posted:

How relevant has Howard Stern been to politics? I haven't paid attention to him since the 90's and I'm pretty sure he had no political interests until his interview with Hillary a few years ago. Is his political interests a recent turn or has he done other notable interviews with political figures that I just completely missed?

There was that time he ran for governor of New York in 1994, won the Libertarian nomination and then had an "Oh poo poo" moment and backed out of the election

# ? Apr 26, 2024 22:06

fischtick: Jul 9, 2001; CORGO, THE DESTROYER; Fun Shoe

Freakazoid_ posted:

How relevant has Howard Stern been to politics?

Honest question: how relevant is Howard Stern? We got a 4 month SiriusXM subscription and the music stations are awful and repetitive. I imagine Stern fans get it, but there can�t be enough of them paying $30/mo or whatever� can there?

# ? Apr 26, 2024 22:06

Rappaport: Oct 2, 2013

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

My advice as an attorney is to avoid situations that could result in arrest. Ideally avoid all cops entirely. If they want a reason to charge you they will find one. There is no course of action that will avoid a "resisting arrest" charge if the cop wants to charge you.

It's great that American media regularly portrays cops as awful people trying to make arrests, looking at you Law and Order franchise, and we're kind of made to think of them as the good guys.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 22:09

Hieronymous Alloy: Jan 30, 2009; Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!; Morbid Hound

Rappaport posted:

It's great that American media regularly portrays cops as awful people trying to make arrests, looking at you Law and Order franchise, and we're kind of made to think of them as the good guys.

I mean, not to be a cop apologist, but there's a reason they do lots of Law and Order: Special Victims Unit and not so many episodes of Law and Order: Non-Violent Protestors

# ? Apr 26, 2024 22:34

Rappaport: Oct 2, 2013

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

I mean, not to be a cop apologist, but there's a reason they do lots of Law and Order: Special Victims Unit and not so many episodes of Law and Order: Non-Violent Protestors

That's true! But the Special Victims unit has a specific story where Chris Meloni points out he messed up, and someone is in prison for life for that mistake. And Chris Meloni regularly assaulted people, too. Looked at it from a distance, that show did not paint a good picture of law enforcement in America.

# ? Apr 26, 2024 22:38

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# ? May 8, 2024 12:37

Boris Galerkin: Dec 17, 2011; I don't understand why I can't harass people online. Seriously, somebody please explain why I shouldn't be allowed to stalk others on social media!

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

The Biden administration released new Title IX regulations governing all public school or schools that receive federal funds in the country.

The main changes:

- Removes a Trump-era rule that required students who claimed to be raped to make themselves available to be cross examined by the person they accused.

- Previously, schools were only required to investigate sexual harassment claims that were made through a formal process and met a certain degree of criminal seriousness. Now, they will have to investigate when they are made aware regardless of whether the victim filed a formal report.

- Lifts a ban on schools investigating accusations of rape or sexual assault that happened off campus.

- Attempts to make transgender students use the bathroom of a gender they don't identify with are considered federal civil rights violations.

- Schools cannot require teachers to use the birth name or pronoun of a transgender person if they have a different identity.

- All federal requirements for sex discrimination also apply to LGBT students.

Florida says it will not comply with the new rules and could lose federal education funding.

If Florida does not comply, then they could lose the 13.9% of their annual education budget that comes from the federal government.

The rules go into effect in August and Florida has until then to make a final decision.

https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1783797190734852338

There's gotta be a better way to punish the state than to take away education funding, isn't there? There's an actual person that is making the order to not comply. Why can't that person or persons get hosed instead?

# ? Apr 26, 2024 22:59

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