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Bel Shazar
Sep 14, 2012

If you're an adult American you're responsible for the American government regardless of whether or not you voted for it. It feels to me that nuanced discussion around this point is an effort in deflecting that responsibility.

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Bel Shazar
Sep 14, 2012

is pepsi ok posted:

I don't think this is correct based on the conclusions of Martin Gilens and Benjamin Page's famous study on policy preferences vs policy outcomes.

Here's a couple key quotes:



I think the situation we find ourselves in is in fact the exact opposite of what you state here. If you're an average adult American you have no control whatsoever over the American government. It feels to me that the nuanced discussion around just how much responsibility the average voter bears is an effort in deflection from this reality.

Oh I wholly agree we have no CONTROL, but we're still responsible for the government.

None of the control, any benefits from the government are incidental at best, and yet we're still responsible for it.

Bel Shazar
Sep 14, 2012

Civilized Fishbot posted:

What's the difference between "good" and "morally valuable"?

People are only responsible for what they can control.

I respectfully disagree. In the end, it's a democracy, flawed and corrupted and forged on innumerable lies and depravations... but it's our democracy.

Bel Shazar
Sep 14, 2012

hooman posted:

I don't assume they know why I am withholding my vote at all. I am saying to withhold votes from candidates that are bad and give them to candidates that are good. I am not saying to never vote, but to only vote for good candidates in order to change the overall grouping of views within the party. That is the only way we (as non super donors) can influence the views of the party or feed back to them.

For most people, when considering national offices, only voting for good candidates is functionally equivalent to not voting.

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