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Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Pontificating rear end posted:

Any terms we use to try to suss out the mechanics of consciousness will never work, because we'll just end up in the weeds. Best we can do is some sort of philosophical Occam's razor, which imho is that consciousness is in inherent in life; yes, every living thing has some form of a "soul." I'd go so far to say consciousness is inherent to the universe (or a greater metaphysical multiverse), and furthermore if a universe does not include consciousness it essentially never exists at all.

On a somewhat technical level: I think free-will is inherent to consciousness, so when you make a choice information is enforced onto a certain point in time (consciousness causing a probabilistic wave collapse, quantum or otherwise), which demarcates a point in time. Therefore a universe with no consciousness has nothing to demarcate time, and is nothing more than a failed singularity.

-Pontificating rear end

The quantum uncertainty principle has nothing to do with consciousness. Conscious observation doesn't change anything in the physical world. That's all just new age woo bullshit.

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Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010
Serve me a dragon meat steak and I will listen to your tales of immortal 3 year olds

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010
If you can't achieve nirvana by the time the universe is over then I'm pretty sure the collective consciousness is better off without you

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

The Hello Machine posted:

Aren't 3-year-olds a little too young to be reincarnated souls? I would feel uncomfortable allowing a strange adult be that near my child.

It's reincarnation, not possession. Your child is the strange adult.

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

McGavin posted:

Imagine isekaiing into this world. :negative:

Sonic seemed to handle it pretty well :shrug:

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010
Would being a cockroach even be all that bad? We speak of them disparagingly because they suck for us, but the cockroaches themselves seem to be having a blast most of the time.

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

redshirt posted:

As long as I am a cognizant individual? I'm good!

You'll get there some day, buddy

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Pontificating rear end posted:

Billions of years and an entire unknown existence beyond this universe, and you think you just happened to spawn at this current time by complete happenstance, and you will soon die and never exist again. just lmao lol etc

I don't think it's very funny =/

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Pontificating rear end posted:

Dawg you are literally talking about the mechanics of quantizing the soul (into exactly one [1pc] unit) and the specifics of when it enters the body, leaves it, and whether it can be created or destroyed as if it follows thermodynamic laws of matter.

Good point, guess we should all believe in some weird arbitrary bullshit for no reason

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Pontificating rear end posted:

Kids under 3 cant even process the words into concepts, they're not retaining every word ever heard and then repeating it later after they've learned to speak. I'm sure you could find a thousand stories about kids that age talking about things they have had absolutely no exposure to.

Are you actually suggesting that this is a testable phenomenon?

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010
What if we end up with so many living things one day that there aren't any souls left in the soul bank? Will it be impossible for women to get pregnant at that point, or will the children just come out soulless?

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010
Who are they reincarnated from? If it's like Mike Tyson or something you're hosed against even just a few of them.

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010
I like how modern spiritually-minded people will scoff at the question of how much a soul weighs or what it's made of, as if that's some kind of intentionally inane mischaracterization of the subject at hand.

But that's kinda what people used to believe, or at least thought could be true https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/21_grams_experiment

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

happyhippy posted:

Collective delusions.

It's the same thing with alien reportings. When B movies showed them coming to earth in hubcap shaped ships, everyone saying they were abducted mentioned hubcap shaped ships.
When the collective trope was 'little green men', abductees would say the aliens were little green men.
Then when the 'greys' hit the media in the 70s, all were saying they were abducted by grey aliens.

Same with past life hypnosis.
Everyone was either a famous person, or directly involved with a famous historical person. And also from recorded history.
You never got any saying they were a poor as poo poo dirt farmer who lived and died in the same 10 miles of barren as poo poo land in the middle of nowhere.
And no one has ever said they were from 20000BC or can tell us any historical information lost and not known until now, like their written or oral language.
Funny no one went 'Ah great, can you translate these hieroglyphics we lost how to read them' to fuckwits saying they were once Cleopatra's slaves.

Let's not forget claims of Satanic possession and Satanic ritual abuse, both of which curiously spiked after the release of The Exorcist

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Pontificating rear end posted:

Believing in a spiritual soul is a fantasy? You really think a person dies forever and there is nothingness for all infinity (even though there is actually provably somethingness for all infinity)?

There's absolutely no reason to believe otherwise.

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Pontificating rear end posted:

You're just putting words in my mouth, I only said it was unprovable, which it is, objectively. You have exactly as much evidence one way as I do the other

There is, quite literally, an infinite amount of unfalsifiable bullshit that one could cook up about anything. What if I told you there's a tiny asteroid shaped like a teacup on the far side of Andromeda, and inside that teacup there's an ant, and if you ask nicely, the ant will teach you how to speak Portuguese? I have just as much evidence of this being true as you do if it being false (that is, zero all around). Accepting arbitrary bullshit is not an equally valid stance as dismissing it, and constructing an argument so that it's unfalsifiable doesn't make it sound, it just makes it pointless.

And you didn't just say that reincarnation was unprovable; you made it clear that you really do think it's true, while throwing an argument from incredulity at the idea of nothing happening after you die.

Pontificating rear end posted:

Believing in a spiritual soul is a fantasy? You really think a person dies forever and there is nothingness for all infinity (even though there is actually provably somethingness for all infinity)? Call me the quantum soul guy, but I'm guessing what you believe is a nihilistic oversimplification mostly influenced by conventional physics?

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Pontificating rear end posted:

Y'all talk about "burden of proof" like Im prosecuting someone in court, it doesn't even apply. There is 0 evidence you dissipate into nothingness when you die, however reincarnation simply implies you live again-- it's NOT the same as "you turn into a butt" which is provably insane. Studies like this are more evidence than you guys have (none):

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26299061/
https://www.scientificamerican.com/...ly-just-cynics/

Meaning I'm not making this up out of nothing, it's a culturally significant and fairly simple concept that millions or billions of people have believed (however not a single conscious individual has ever believed you will turn into a butt).
Now that I have more evidence than your side, the burden of proof is on you because we get to use that term however we want.

When you blow out a match, where does the flame go?

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Rubber Chicken posted:

Someone's always striking a match someplace, it goes there, obviously

Silly to think it just disappears, what a claim!

I was clearly suggesting that it goes to flame heaven, please don't straw man my argument tia

Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Pontificating rear end posted:

If you completely cease to exist when you die you would be dead right now.

I had no idea Jaden Smith was a goon

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Devils Affricate
Jan 22, 2010

Funky See Funky Do posted:

In one of them, I think Hinduism, cow and bird are higher on the hierarchy. So a particularly good human could be reincarnated as a cow or a chicken. Now, I don't know if you've notice the sort of lives cows and chickens tend to live but for one would sin on purpose to avoid being reincarnated as one if I believed in that horseshit.

Pictured: the final cycle of Samsara

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