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Man, your Thany does NOT wanna get hit. If she keeps that up I'd throw an Energy Ring at her (if you can spare it and her strength isn't beyond hope).
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May 5, 2015 20:09
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From Astol/Lilina C: Astol...you don't change, do you? My father was saying that you'd be doing a lot better than you already are if you were more serious.And A:  Lady Lilina, I can say this to anyone, at any time. Your father was truly an honorable man.And Astol/Bors B: I heard there was a traitor in the Lycia Alliance... If I'd have gotten off my lazy rear end and had been doing my job properly, that wouldn't have happened... Lord Hector would never have lost...as long as he had the right information...Basically he didn't fully apply his aptitude and Leygance slipped right under his nose, and because of that, the man who he respects, who gave him a new life, died. Most of Astol's supports are just trying to cope with that. He's suspicious and he's miserable.
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May 5, 2015 22:43
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:From Astol/Lilina C: In some supports. In others he makes no mention of that. In some he's a drunk. In some he's not. In one he apparently married Igrene under a different name, lived with her a while, and then left after pretending to get killed. For reasons that don't actually make sense when you think about them.
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May 5, 2015 22:55
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FoolyCharged posted:Nonsense! You clearly made a tactical choice that her lockpicks were more valuable to your funds rank than she was as a unit. Could there not be value in allowing her to appear all 6(?) times and stealing her lockpicks every time, only recruiting her on the last one?
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May 5, 2015 23:15
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Melth posted:In some supports. In others he makes no mention of that. In some he's a drunk. In some he's not. In one he apparently married Igrene under a different name, lived with her a while, and then left after pretending to get killed. For reasons that don't actually make sense when you think about them. He has five supports. Lilina is about his boss, Wendy and Igrene are about other parts of his past, and Barth and Bors are about the present. If he were drunk and talking about his job and Hector and his leg scars and that time he married a lady from a mythical desert village in every single support the whole thing would be monotonous and leave no intrigue or surprises. So instead they each touch different aspects of his character. Like, the drinking is only in the Bors support because it's not about the drink itself, it's about why: he's put all the blame for Leygance's betrayal on himself, and he drinks to cope with the grief and responsibility. It's similar to the theme with Barth: he's suspicious of everyone in Roy's crew because he blames himself for etc. etc. Hell, the problem is that Astol's supports are about him, and the other party doesn't really add anything. 4/5 of them are all about him. The Igrene support is the only one where the other party really adds anything.
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May 5, 2015 23:33
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Melth posted:In some supports. In others he makes no mention of that. In some he's a drunk. In some he's not. In one he apparently married Igrene under a different name, lived with her a while, and then left after pretending to get killed. For reasons that don't actually make sense when you think about them. Yeah that's what we call not being repetitive. Awakening showed us what happens with being repetitive. You get Yarne overcoming his cowardice what feels like 100 times or. Looking at just this game. Endless reminders for Thany to Watch out for Archers because they are dangerous to Pegasus Knights. and what do you mean apparently? His B support with Wendy mentions his leg scar, (though if you want to go into actual plotholes, he somehow got from Bern to Nabata while injured. But he's probably just bullshitting Wendy because explaining the whole story would be confusing.) that he staunchly denies having to Igrene. He expresses his sorrow over what happened to Barth and Lilina, while only being a drunk in Bors support, and the fact that you got him as a drunk in general from quote:Astohl: Oh, Bors. Long time no see. Rather than him drinking heavily out of depression is kind of weird, you're usually better at picking up the subtle things and this isn't that subtle. Instead of looking at each support as showing his whole character, look at it as the composing pieces. Wendy establishes the leg injury and that he drinks Barth and Bors establish why he drinks, depression and the fact that he's beating himself up over the rebellion and Hectors death. Lilina establishes his past and how much he respected Hector and how his life was changed by him Igrene establishes the rest of his past, and collaborates with Igrene's own. He was a spy who wound up in Nabata injured, got nursed back to health and fell in love with Igrene, marrying her and having a child before eventually returning to Ostia when he got his memory without Igrene and his child because being with him while he was a spy was a danger to them. We also see Astohl continuing to beat himself up over his actions, referring to himself as a real bastard, and that he has a habit of blaming himself for every problem under the sun. So there is a hole in that he tells Wendy he was injured in Bern only to somehow wind up in Nabata, but if you assume he's just covering up to Wendy, then it's fine. Astohl is actually one of the better characters in the game and showcases exactly what you should do with supports, learn more about a character from multiple sources and see his interactions. EDIT: Sheep was faster and more to the point. MarquiseMindfang posted:Could there not be value in allowing her to appear all 6(?) times and stealing her lockpicks every time, only recruiting her on the last one? There would be if Funds were in any way hard to get in FE6.
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May 5, 2015 23:47
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MarquiseMindfang posted:Could there not be value in allowing her to appear all 6(?) times and stealing her lockpicks every time, only recruiting her on the last one? If cath gains levels with every appearance, from what melth has said the exp loss/added difficulty to level would undermine any gain you would get.
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May 6, 2015 00:02
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FoolyCharged posted:If cath gains levels with every appearance, from what melth has said the exp loss/added difficulty to level would undermine any gain you would get. If you needed to use Cath to hit the EXP rank, but FE6 has a lot of units, so it becomes trivially easy. Honeslty (and he mentioned this last thread) if he wanted to he could send a few units near the end of arena maps to just grind out the arena while he clears out the rest of the level, since there's almost always a point by the end of an FE6 chapter where really just your Aces need to do things. That takes care of the EXP and Funds problem quite well (by hauling it out the back and putting a bullet in its brain) Of course, Melths showcase is that you don't need the Arena to get the S-Rank, it's like how an overall test when hacking should be "Can I do this chapter without save states?" because if you can't it's proof you've maybe crafted something too hard or bullshit.
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May 6, 2015 00:09
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Onmi posted:Oh yeah and Lilina, as another Lord, can Seize thrones. Random curiousity question, since the talk of your hack is interesting to me; does that also mean Lilina dying = game over? (Related to the main thread: I've always had a soft spot for her both as a character and as a unit. Even if Lugh is objectively better, I still basically always use Lilina.)
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May 6, 2015 01:16
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SMaster777 posted:Random curiousity question, since the talk of your hack is interesting to me; does that also mean Lilina dying = game over? Yes, Lilina, Roy, Guinevere, Eliwood, Lyn or Hector dying all trigger game overs (which is funny because you can skip recruiting the final 2) Elphin just retreats if he's 'killed' and the other major change I made was that there's plot scenes featuring all the characters talking (such as the lead in to the new chapter 9 where Zealot, Dieck, Marcus, Barth and Erk are all involved in discussing what the hell they should do with Narshen about to attack the city, who should stay behind and where to get Roy and Lilina) and if someone died then... you don't get it. Basically I'm rewarding perfect play with more character interaction.
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May 6, 2015 01:24
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 Durandal, "The Blazing Sword" really feels misnamed in a game where you get a different sword which actually is on fire when used. Well this is the first of the 6 sidequests. In each of these you get one of the 8 legendary weapons (Additionally you receive one for free at the beginning of Chapter 21 and the 8th is Zephiel’s unobtainable transformer sword-staff-scepter toy). Collecting each legendary weapon and making sure none of them breaks unlocks the chapters after 22 and the true ending. Failing to find even one or letting one of the legendary weapons breaks means the game ends prematurely at chapter 22. This one is a nice fun breather level and a good chance to train some weak people. It’s also unlocked really easily; just don’t let Lilina die on the previous chapter. Chapter Summary: With Narshen and his band approaching, Lilina and Roy make the dubious strategic decision to go running off to some volcano cave elsewhere to retrieve Durandal, the blazing sword of legend.It was hidden in a cave full of lava where the air is painful even to breath. Inexplicably, there are bandits there. These are dispatched and the sword is retrieved and then Roy walks back to find Narshen has arrived in Ostia while he was gone. Oops.  True. Fortunately they’re not coming full force at us. It’s just Narshen and a few guys in a small group. I have no idea what he did with his army, but it isn’t coming. And it hasn’t been doing anything since chapter 3.  Wheeeee, let’s go adventuring instead of preparing a defense and waiting for the Etrurians!  AND THEN BANDITS ATTACKED! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjPF3AwVPM4 It’s as random a random battle as can be imagined.  This makes no sense in character. There are specific floor tiles where lava spurts up? Why hasn’t it hardened into rock and filled this place up or at least covered those tiles? Anyway, pretty much each of these sidequest levels has some kind of trap gimmick. This is one of the least annoying ones.  You know, why isn’t this place still full of guardian ghosts? It was pretty clear in Valorous Roland and The Berserker that we weren’t fighting all of the guardians, and in fact that was part of the point of bringing so few people.  Lilina says she’s mostly alright, but more importantly she has a duty to continue with. Considering that, I have no idea why she’s gallivanting about up here in this cave when Ostia really needs defending right now.  Just in case you didn’t know they’re the game’s quasi-official couple.  Once again, someone is explaining really basic history to Roy. And once again, it makes no sense whatsoever that Roy in particular would know absolutely nothing about this sword since his father came here in person and retrieved it and used it and fought dragons with it.  But Roy knows nothing about Roland –who his father met- or Durandal. Again, this makes way more sense if you assume FE6 and FE7 aren’t both in the same continuity.  Regardless, Roy should know this. But he seems to know absolutely nothing about the basic history or religion of his world so that people can explain it to the player. There’s absolutely no need for this really, the player already knows most of this stuff or could be informed of it in the pre-chapter narration.  Is no one going to ask why there are bandits just hanging out inside a volcano? We’ve got lava spraying everywhere all the time, Eliwood said it hurts even to breathe because their air is so hot, the place is haunted, it should probably have been being watched by Hector, and there should be poison gas everywhere. The War Room, Part 42: This chapter is basically nothing but a chance to farm XP, so it’s about time to discuss the XP ranking. See the War Room Part 25 (http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3701153&pagenumber=16#post442637935) for details on how XP is gained. It’s exactly the same in this game as in FE7 basically. Besides battle XP of course, there are 2 other sources: healing and dancing. Every time you use Lalum or Elphin, they gain 10 XP. One should take full advantage of that and make sure whichever one you have gets to level 20 before the end of the game. That’s 190 turns of dancing, quite a lot but well worth it. Every staff has a pre-set amount of XP it generates per user, ranging from 11 for heal to 85 for Warp. To take full advantage of this, heal every single wound every battle. If you can spare the funds, use up the expensive staves that give tons of XP in the final battles. You can also work to create additional wounds to heal or otherwise increase your heal XP in several ways: 1) Use weapons with weapon triangle disadvantage, don’t use terrain, or otherwise increase the odds of the enemy hitting you. Obviously, this can be dangerous so don't get carried away. 2) Stand on trapped squares. Several of the sidequest chapters have squares that damage those who stand in them, sometimes repeatedly. You could grind any amount of heal XP off of those if you wanted to. 3) Heal people who are about to be injured again (or about to level up). The amount of HP restored doesn’t matter, every use of a healing staff grants exactly the same amount of XP. So, say, letting a unit missing 10 HP get a level up and THEN healing it only gives you 11 XP for healing. But healing that unit first puts it at full, then if it levels up and gains HP it can be healed again, for a total of 22 healing XP. Any time an injured person is injured again such that they can still be restored to full HP in one cast, you have lost 11 XP. Any time a person levels up and gains HP when they were injured, you have lost 11 XP. 4) Spend extra turns at the end of each battle healing all injuries. 5) Don’t heal with promoted units. Promoted units gain only half staff XP (plus most of them have more Mag, which means the number of injuries that take 2 uses to heal goes down). 6) Bring many healers. The more healers you bring, the faster you can heal injuries as they arise. Besides that, the only other thing you can do to increase XP gained is basically just to keep using low level units against the enemy at all times. A total of 50100 XP (or about 501 levels) must be gained in total over the course of the game’s 31 chapters. That’s more than 16 levels per chapter. Quite a few. It can’t even be done on many early chapters. Most people recommend arena grinding to get the needed XP, but I’m going to try to do without that. At the very least, it’s prudent to harvest all available reinforcements on every chapter though. Reinforcements not fought are XP wasted. Battle Preparations & the Map:  Secondary Objective:Build some supports Reinforcements: None. It’s as simple as it looks. Turn Limit: 20. More than enough time even at a leisurely pace. Sorry about the ugly picture, it’s pretty close to impossible to get the shifting fiery glows to match up while also avoiding the cursor appearing and other such things. There’s very little to say here. All the bottom left enemies move so there’s no reason to send anyone down there. A random assortment of the rest do. Most mages standing near clusters of the red squares do not. Unlike Valorous Rolan, only some of the red tiles erupt every turn in this map. I’m not entirely sure what the pattern is, but I’m pretty sure it’s a 2-3 turn cycle. Doesn’t really matter, just don’t end your turns on the things. If you do and they erupt, you take 10 damage.  Units Allowed: 9 + Roy. Moderately restrictive since you need to bring some healers, some good units, and some weak units too. Units Brought: 1) Roy. He’s handy because he’s bad. He can’t quite one-round kill most things even with support bonuses; perfect for weakening targets. I also really want him to get his final supports with Lance and Alan. 2) Alan. When things get rough, Alan can kill any target I need dead. Cavaliers can smash anything on this map and with supports (which I want to build further) he’ll be solid vs the boss too. 3) Lance. Like Alan but worse, as usual. 4) Dieck. I want to build his support with Rutger and Clarine. Plus sword users are great on this map. He can weaken targets or smash problematic ones. 5) Rutger. Same as Dieck. 6) Oujay. My first weak(ish) unit is Oujay. This is a sword map, so he’ll have an easy time training here. Plus he’s just a solid unit, so it’s not hard to start using him to begin with. 7) Lugh. Mainly here to effectively deal with mages and provide some much needed ranged support. 8) Treck. My second unit to train. As a cavalier, Treck can beat anything on this map. As a low level cavalier, he can score major XP in so doing. 9) Clarine. The usual suspect as far as healing goes, plus she needs to build more support with Dieck and Rutger. 10) Saul. A second healer is necessary. Notable Units Rejected: 1) Chad & Astol. They get enougb XP on chapters where they’re needed and are decently high level anyway. And there’s not much to steal. 2) Ellen. A third healer for a group this small would be completely superfluous. 3) Lilina. Might have been a good choice, but a lot of the enemies on this chapter are a bit too dodge-y for her. Plus, as usual, magic-users are much easier to start training late in the game than physical units are, so I might actually save her for later. 4) Thany. Too many fighters and archers around. 5) Sue. If I don’t bring Thany, I don’t bring Sue. I need to avoid Sue getting ahead in XP gained. 6) Most other people. Too high level already. 7) The knights. Horrible and too slow. Henning, the boss, looks like a handful so most people have at least one really solid weapon on them. Other than that it’s standard gear. The Characters: You know, I actually forgot to get a picture of Henning it seems and I don’t have an earlier save file to get it from. This site has his stats: http://www.fireemblemwod.com/fe6/guiafe6/ENG_cap8x.htm Mine ended up with +1 speed, making him very fast indeed. There’s nothing at all to say about him as a character. He comes from nowhere, shouldn’t be here, has no reason to fight, and is never again acknowledged. He doesn’t even know about the sword he’s standing next to or anything. A particularly absurd filler villain. It’s oddly appropriate for him not to even get his picture here. Playing Through:  A bit of rescue-dropping of Rutger establishes a solid defensive line immediately.  Treck moves to where both mercenaries can juuuust hit him and the rest move in. As usual Dieck and Rutger are next to each other and Lance and Alan are next to Roy.  Oujay gets things off to a nice start with a lucky critical.  Treck also handles himself well.  The random lava spurts happen, affecting nothing as usual.  Roy weakens a target for Oujay.  And Lance can support him! Yes!  Don’t listen to him! He just wants all the XP for himself!  No, no, no, that’s a common misconception. It’s only when you lose your THRONE that you lose the battle. You can be dead atop it and still win.  Roy makes a counterpoint that if he just stays back, no one will listen to him.  Treck continues to move just far enough to continue tanking as the bottom left enemies keep running after us. And Saul keeps healing him from just out of range. Together they can’t be defeated.  This mage passed up an opportunity to attack, revealing that it's stationary.  I continue to give most kills to Oujay.  Awesome! He’s off to a very good start.  He’s pulled off the lava spot by some rescuing.  Saul keeps Treck fighting and the rest move in as usual, maintaining support formations. There’s little else to say really.  Next turn it’s time to kill that mage.  This square is the one Treck wants to end up in (for purposes of continuing to fight the pursuers), and right now he can attack from there as he moves in, so it’s perfect.  Killing this mercenary actually proves complicated and the result is that I’m forced to leave people besides Treck in range of the pursuers. Oh well.  At least Lugh got a great level out of it.  Oujay just crams himself in here, mostly out of the way.  The pursuing mage is wrecked by Lugh’s brand new +1 Mag.  Finally someone is hurt by one of the fire spouts.  Roy weakens an archer and gets a pretty mediocre level. He’s lousy and can barely kill weak things with maximum offensive supports. This despite being 2 ahead on Str.  Treck prepares for the next pursuer.  More healing.  Nice! Treck is doing great, though falling behind on Def.  Saul is back to his old trick.  These guys don’t move.  Another one for Oujay.  Solid.  So that’s turn 8, and I’m rounding the corner to begin the next stretch of level.  Phew! I did not notice that guy had a halberd. Total newb mistake.  Of this group, only the myrmidon moves for whatever reason.  Oujay gets another great level. He’s on a roll. There’s really not much more to say about this chapter. It’s just me moving units, keeping people in support formation, and giving kills to Oujay.  Clarine continues to suck.  These guys have handaxes so it’s a slow fight.  Ok it WAS a slow fight. Now he can double them. This is a really fast Treck. And he even got the Def he was missing.  Saul, at least, continues to be below average.  At last Rutger and Dieck support!  Apparently Rutger makes a habit of sneaking up and attacking him mid-battle.  Rutger is a griefer. Cry more, noob.  The bubbles are now messed up for some reason.  This support has nothing to do with their other two really. Those are better.  Treck traps this enemy, so it will die a turn early.  Support formations are maintained as I move into the boss room.  Treck comes running to get some heals now that the enemy are gone.  Oujay kills the last weak enemy.  Welcome to the team! We’ve never had an audition go that well before.  You’re one to talk…  He’s really dodge-y so I’ve got to keep the heat on him with as many attackers as I safely can.  Alan and Roy get their last support at a perfect time.  Wait, squad? Major evidence for the "each unit is actually a bunch of guys led by the face character" theory. Of course, things like Rutger personally sneaking up to attack Dieck in other supports undermine that.  Roy continues to not grasp how FE combat works.  Roy began waxing philosophical and then Alan asked this almost-question.  Even with maximum supports and weapon triangle advantage this guy is hard to kill. So I break out the heavy weapons and do some rescue-dropping to let multiple people attack from up close.  Next turn, Lugh moves in to finish him. And misses.  But kills him with his counter on the enemy turn. A darned good Lugh all in all. The Mag is awesome.  After some final healing, I win on turn 19.  It’s a lot smaller than in FE7.  That’s… what? Ok yes, that’s true, and I’ve always thought his title “The Little Knight” was kind of cool, but what does that have to do with anything? Eliwood was a small man and he wielded Durandal, and that hurt his speed badly but was still doable.  At least she doesn’t come right out and say you need an S rank in swords.    Amusingly, he pretty much can’t. To get an S rank, you need to promote. And he can’t promote till near the end of the game, at which point he immediately has the Sword of Seals. Which only he can use and which is much better for him than the hugely heavy Durandal.  One of the best legendary weapons.  On with the plot! Maybe we shouldn’t have left the castle undefended when we knew they were coming!  Roy walks right into the middle of them like an idiot instead of securing the castle or anything. We could totally beat this group in the castle from last level actually. Just need to chokepoint them and then run Narshen’s runesword out of charges.  You’re one to talk. Narshen is the only guy stupider than Leygance.  Plot twist, Roy was on Narshen’s side all along!  Ok, fine, maybe not. Apparently he really hates Narshen. Though actually, I’m not sure why since he hasn’t seen any of the cutscenes we did. At all. I’m pretty sure he hasn’t heard of Narshen by name except maybe as one of the guys who attacked Castle Araphen.  Well now he knows that at least. Narshen here is claiming credit for someone else’s win. Which is basically his modus operandi as we learn.  Who could it be?! And why does them speaking prevent Narshen from just taking a swing and killing the stupidly undefended Roy?  You suck, Narshen! No scouts to warn you about this giant army approaching? Your entire group is air units for goodness sake.  I’ve always thought his portrait looked really stupid.   That letter got there fast! And then Etruria mobilized its whole army and two of its generals and ran across Etruria and into Lycia ready for battle in less than a day apparently. Yeah that doesn’t make any sense. Particularly since we’re about to learn this wasn’t part of any plan and Cecilia had to persuade the king to try this after getting the letter. What a ridiculous deus ex machine.  Clearly not. Maybe if Narshen had brought the actual darned army he could win this.  And then she introduces herself. She’s Pent’s successor I guess.  Your fault for not scouting and checking for expansion bases, man. You let them get the resources to tech up and build a giant army while you were just massing one thing they could counter.  Dun dun dun! This will pay off never!  And there they go. Not being attacked. It’s ok, they’ll continue to do nothing at all.  Roy introduces himself.  That probably should have arrived a long time ago.  If you had defended the darned castle, things might have gone differently.  This makes Percival seem like kind of a twerp since he implies he didn’t really want to help- unlike Cecilia. Which makes him really dumb too since, as she points out, it’s clearly in Etruria’s interest to help.  Which just makes it more absurd that a giant army under two of their generals was ready to be in Ostia in less than a day.  They know each other; she taught him to fight in Ostia. That’s what the tutorial consists of actually. Why this Etrurian mage is teaching him to fight rather than his father or Hector I’m not sure.  Me too. Otherwise something unexpected might have happened. Or Roy might have been defeated temporarily for once.  She explains the politics.  Pretty sure it will be already. Bern with the resources of Ilia and Sacae can definitely smash Etruria anyway.  It’s like 6 people! So many he can’t even count them on one hand!  Uh, no he hasn’t. He was just being completely shy and deferential with Percival seconds ago and belittling his skills in some of his supports among other things. The game can’t even keep people’s shallow characterizations straight. Total Restarts: 3 Turn Surplus: -9 (More progress) Things I Regret Missing: A couple of uses of Marcus’s silver lance on Rude, a Chapter 5 nomad Marcus had to kill Melth fucked around with this message at 06:00 on Jul 30, 2015 |
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May 6, 2015 05:02
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Percy is clearly being the humble soldier there, and you didn't complain about those lava spurts in FE7. Seriously this chapter read like a lot of reaching with some fair points. Fair point that Roy shouldn't be asking about stuff he should know about, Not a fair point to bring up Eliwood having used it before since that came after this game. Honestly Roy serves as the audience surrogate when he's not the right character for it, that should be the job of... I dunno, Wolt? Regardless said cutscene is something I addressed, by having Roy send the note earlier and... by the new Chapter 9. Which isn't replacing the old one, it's just slotting itself in. Note: This map has been edited from the image I'm posting  Welcome to the Defense of Ostia. Etruria may be on there way, they may not, but regardless, Roy has to confront the fact that right now Bern is at his doorstep, and having just spent the past 5ish chapters running away, he's sick of it. so instead of following the suggestions of Dieck and Zealot buying time while Marcus ferries them away or the opposite, he's going to stand and fight. So this is a defense map, each turn more Bern soldiers will arrive, higher leveled than the last. they will push back the players lines, they will strike like an unrelenting tide. After it, Roy will have to retreat into the city, this scene plays out, except Narshen getting all his Dracoknights to attack Roy. a crushing defeat. The end of the Lycia arc in general is a defeat for Roy. He didn't win anything, Etruria bailed him out here, but in the case of his goals? complete failure. If you've kept everyone alive, there's a scene as some of the Pheraen knights get some character interactions, a nice capstone cutscene. Not too long (because gently caress we don't want to turn into Sacred Dawn) but decent to give some other guys something to do. As for this chapter, this is the chapter where you get the Sealed Durandal! Why Sealed? Because Melth raised a good point, having the end of the game be determined by the Gaidens is a dick move, but I'd still want to give the player a reward for collecting the weapons and not breaking them. So upon completing 21x, if you have all of the divine weapons, Roy will use the Sword of Seals to unlock their potential, essentially making them the vanilla weapons, while the weapons you get before this have reduced might, only a 2x effective bonus vs Dragons, and no stat boost. They are still S-Rank though, so they are still very helpful to have around. I think it encourages the player to get the gaidens, while not punishing them for not getting all of them. Oh yeah, and if you want the Divine Weapons you're going to have to pry them from the bosses dead hands, since each of the bosses will be using their respective weapon.
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May 6, 2015 06:06
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Onmi posted:
The other thing about all this is, and I'm not picking on you, I'm just trying to encourage self-awareness, you complained about the exact opposite with Florina. Florina had one major character trait and it was central to practically every conversation and even her ending, and you couldn't stop complaining about how boring and annoying and flat she was. This is just Astol having multiple facets, and not everything is going to come up in every conversation. 'S character development.
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May 6, 2015 10:22
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about Astol
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Onmi posted:As for this chapter, this is the chapter where you get the Sealed Durandal! Why Sealed? Because Melth raised a good point, having the end of the game be determined by the Gaidens is a dick move, but I'd still want to give the player a reward for collecting the weapons and not breaking them. So upon completing 21x, if you have all of the divine weapons, Roy will use the Sword of Seals to unlock their potential, essentially making them the vanilla weapons, while the weapons you get before this have reduced might, only a 2x effective bonus vs Dragons, and no stat boost. They are still S-Rank though, so they are still very helpful to have around. Would you have the enemies of the chapters be the ghosts, or just people occupying the shrines? Also, would you still have the 20 Durability to them, or would they receive a buff to that pre or post unsealing? Although mentioning that, I realise that it was likely a deterrent towards abusing them when you get the first relatively early. Melth posted:That’s… what? Ok yes, that’s true, and I’ve always thought his title “The Little Knight” was kind of cool, but what does that have to do with anything? Eliwood was a small man and he wielded Durandal, and that hurt his speed badly but was still doable. I don't mind that aspect from a retrospective in universe perspective, since I can see Eliwood not telling Roy about his crazy adventures.
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May 6, 2015 11:00
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Emperordaein posted:Would you have the enemies of the chapters be the ghosts, or just people occupying the shrines? Also, would you still have the 20 Durability to them, or would they receive a buff to that pre or post unsealing? Although mentioning that, I realise that it was likely a deterrent towards abusing them when you get the first relatively early. Oh yeah you reminded me of something, did anyone know that Ogier is intended to be Roland's direct descendant? that's why he shares Roland's title of "The Little Hero" and they have a buff to their durability, mostly because I buffed everythings Durability, at the opposite effect of making things more expensive. And I'll be editing some of the enemies, and implying that maybe some of the guardians were in fact people Bern sent in there to secure or destroy the weapons and.. well... found themselves slaves to the weapons powers and the shrines defenses. a sort of "You have slain the previous guardian and are unworthy, you will serve as the new guardian." curse deal.
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May 6, 2015 11:19
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Eliwood was, what, 16 or 17 when he went on is crazy adventure. Roy is only 15. I'm sure Eliwood would have told him once he came of age, but Roy is just too young to go on a globe-spanning military adventure! Also, am I the only one who tends to prefer the other cavaliers? For some reason, the red/green cavalier very rarely seems to pan out for me, but there'll always be room Lowen, Treck, Percival, Makalov, Astrid, or someone reclassed to cavalier.
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May 6, 2015 11:26
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Kajeesus posted:Eliwood was, what, 16 or 17 when he went on is crazy adventure. Roy is only 15. I'm sure Eliwood would have told him once he came of age, but Roy is just too young to go on a globe-spanning military adventure! 17, and Alance are probably the most boring, I like Lance for his supports with Lot and Clarine (Where he completely no-sells her poo poo) and Alan for his supports with Ward and Tate (Where he's the biggest lovable doof) Treck is.... well he's one note but the notes pretty chuckle worthy. I like Noah if only because Noah is trying his darndest to be considered a professional warrior, and then he's going goo-goo for gaa-gaa over Fir. But his supports show that really, the mercenary thing is basically his life and he doesn't have much of a personal life beyond it, to the point that his friends death doesn't really effect him. Percy on the other hand encapsulates the Spirit of the Professional he's a bit dull, but I've always liked the no-nonsense humble soldier, and Percy's got that. Zealot's honestly the most interesting of the FE6 cavs, with basically being king and in fact becoming king at the conclusion of the war, he's an important figure, he's clearly seen a lot of poo poo go down and while he realizes that he can't stop fighting, ultimately his goal is to make his frozen homeland prosperous. Percy and Zealot are some of the characters I have the most fun writing new stuff for.
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May 6, 2015 12:08
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Dr. Buttass posted:The other thing about all this is, and I'm not picking on you, I'm just trying to encourage self-awareness, you complained about the exact opposite with Florina. Florina had one major character trait and it was central to practically every conversation and even her ending, and you couldn't stop complaining about how boring and annoying and flat she was. I'm aware. Characters with only one trait -especially one that's totally lame- are bad characters. Characters who are totally inconsistent are also bad characters.
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May 6, 2015 13:58
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Melth posted:I'm aware. Characters with only one trait -especially one that's totally lame- are bad characters. Characters who are totally inconsistent are also bad characters. I agree, totally inconsistent characters are bad characters.
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May 6, 2015 14:33
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Onmi posted:You didn't complain about those lava spurts in FE7. Nah, what I'm complaining about is less the lava spurts themselves (kind of silly but it's a common videogame trope and it was semi-interesting tactically in Valorous Roland) than the mention of floor tiles where lava spurts in particular. Because the original floor should be covered and unrecognizable if lava has been spurting there. It was, admittedly, a nitpicky complaint. Edit: So I'm up to chapter 9 now, where the route splits. As I went over in Chapter 7's war room, it looks to me like the Bartre route is actually superior to the commonly recommended Echnidna route. However, the Echnidna route is -as I said- popular. Would people prefer if I took that route to show how it (and particularly the infamous chapter 11A) is done? Melth fucked around with this message at 18:20 on May 6, 2015 |
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May 6, 2015 18:00
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Would it be possible to show both off while going for the max rank, with one of them being "canon"? Otherwise I'm all for seeing the infamous 11A.
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May 6, 2015 18:26
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Nah, pick the one you feel is the better route for your purposes.
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May 6, 2015 18:51
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I'd like to see how you handle 11A, even if you don't keep that route going forward.
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May 6, 2015 19:45
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Nihilarian posted:Nah, pick the one you feel is the better route for your purposes. I think this is best too. This LP is going for efficiency, so whichever one is more efficient is what you should go for. I wouldn't mind "side" updates for it but it shouldn't be a priority.
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May 6, 2015 20:09
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Melth posted:I'm aware. Characters with only one trait -especially one that's totally lame- are bad characters. Characters who are totally inconsistent are also bad characters. I agree, just, my point is, these characters don't get a lot of time to develop properly (their supports are the only time they really say anything, remember). If you want what I'm understanding you to mean by consistent you've basically only got time for one note. These characters just plain need more attention so we can explore how the different facets of their personality actually fit together, so that Astol has a chance to actually be inconsistent in the first place.
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May 6, 2015 20:53
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Lotish posted:I'd like to see how you handle 11A, even if you don't keep that route going forward. This please. Also, thank you for the regular updates instead of dragging this out.
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May 6, 2015 21:25
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Lotish posted:I'd like to see how you handle 11A, even if you don't keep that route going forward. quote:Now the X factor here is that for no good reason, Gonzalez joins 6 levels lower in Echidna’s route with the same stats. That means he’s basically 4.8 HP, 3.6 Str, .9 Skill, 3 Speed, 2.1 Luck, 1.5 Def, and .3 Res better in Echidna’s route. The HP and Str bonuses are meaningless since he caps those stats in 3 seconds regardless, but the other bonuses can be noticeable. Perhaps more importantly, that’s 600 more XP you can gain using him before he hits 20/20 as must be retired.  Oh yeah, your comment on the Horseslayer made me notice a pattern: Melth posted:
Lucky that axes are so inaccurate in this game.  Finally, one thing I really like about FE6 is that you get a bunch of fun stuff pretty early:       An early Longbow, a second Rapier, a second Killing Edge, a Killer Bow, and a Light Brand are all awesome, and non-Secret Shop Physic in Ch 7 is super awesome. fade5 fucked around with this message at 01:40 on May 7, 2015 |
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May 7, 2015 01:35
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fade5 posted:A bunch of stuff I mean, Bartre is bad but Echidna isn't good. Her solid bases mean she's good enough to steal your XP on her chapter and kill Tate's minions who you're trying to keep alive, but her growths are barely better than Marcus's. Like 5% better in most stats. Neither should see use, especially in a max ranking run. So that's a non-factor really. The thing about 3x super effective is it doesn't really mean anything for lances and axes. You 2-hit killed easily with 2x Might and you still won't instant kill with 3x Might usually. What's more important is the stat changes. Binding Blade horseslayer has FOUR more Might than Blazing Sword. And a bit more accuracy too! 3x a lousy might isn't as good as 2x good might. If Binding Blade horseslayer had x2 Might, that would be 22. x3 Blazing Sword horseslayer would only be 21. And just so you know it's not all a one way progression to weaker special weapons, the Blazing Sword hammer is way better with +2 Might and a VERY nice +10 accuracy. For swords and bows, yeah I'll concede having the 3x multiplier helps. Though bows are still lousy. It is pretty cool to be getting so many fun items early, though they also are giving out lots and lots of junk items early too. Basically they just give you truckloads of treasure every chapter, which takes some of the fun out of getting it. And of course, some of this (like Durandal and Physic) is unusable now. In conclusion though, I'm probably not going to do both routes. Every chapter is a lot of work. So it's either the smart (Bartre) route or the route other people more often do and might have questions about.
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May 7, 2015 02:29
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Whichever route gets you the lower level/stronger Gonzales Gonzalez seems cool
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May 7, 2015 02:51
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I'd actually rather you do the harder route, if only to show that it can still be done.
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May 7, 2015 02:54
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Cat Army 
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On the one hand, this is a max ranking run so you should take the most useful route. On the other, this might mean you get a worse Gonzalez and that's just lame. ...poo poo, I have to vote with my head and say you should do what you think is best for the max ranking. My heart says otherwise though.
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May 7, 2015 03:12
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Dr. Buttass posted:I agree, just, my point is, these characters don't get a lot of time to develop properly (their supports are the only time they really say anything, remember). If you want what I'm understanding you to mean by consistent you've basically only got time for one note. These characters just plain need more attention so we can explore how the different facets of their personality actually fit together, so that Astol has a chance to actually be inconsistent in the first place. You can only have 5 support conversations for any character in a single save file, so all characters are uncertain waveforms of characterization that only collapse when you observe support conversations. Schrodinger's Astol.
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May 7, 2015 03:31
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i81icu812 posted:You can only have 5 support conversations for any character in a single save file, so all characters are uncertain waveforms of characterization that only collapse when you observe support conversations. Schrodinger's Astol. Certainly true. Relatedly, you never learn the full background of someone like Renault on one playthrough and what you do learn can LOOK contradictory (This guy is a morph and a mercenary? Or a fighting bishop who punches out Bartre and a crazy thief who killed Lucius's father?) but importantly the character has the same personality and the backstory pieces fit together when you actually get to look at the whole. Anyway, it sounds like people are voting overall for taking the less beneficial Echidna route. I'll be a bit busy for a day or two here so there's still time for other people to cast their votes. Once I'm done crunching some numbers, I'll probably post something about my XP and funds progress.
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May 7, 2015 03:43
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Melth posted:Certainly true. Relatedly, you never learn the full background of someone like Renault on one playthrough and what you do learn can LOOK contradictory (This guy is a morph and a mercenary? Or a fighting bishop who punches out Bartre and a crazy thief who killed Lucius's father?) but importantly the character has the same personality and the backstory pieces fit together when you actually get to look at the whole. How useful is Gonzalez in hard mode? If he's not that great anyways and you won't be using him, then you could go with Bartre.
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May 7, 2015 03:46
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Abrasive Obelisk posted:How useful is Gonzalez in hard mode? If he's not that great anyways and you won't be using him, then you could go with Bartre. Gonzales is amazing in normal mode and even better with Hard Bonuses. Frankly, he's going to cap everything important anyway so you might as well go Bartre since that's going to be more beneficial in the long run, unless the extra 6 levels are going make or break your EXP rank.
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May 7, 2015 03:59
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I'm in favor of whichever route has tougher/more tactically interesting maps to play, personally, if there's much of a difference. That's the most interesting thing to read.
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May 7, 2015 04:07
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Artix posted:Frankly, he's going to cap everything important anyway 
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May 7, 2015 04:19
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It is always amusing to go the A route since Gonzales has a decent shot of capping HP at 20/1 and just being this huge wall of health and pain for the rest of the game. However, since Lot is actually good in this game, let's go see his family in Route B
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May 7, 2015 05:03
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Let's go for Bartre's route, since that's supposedly more efficient. I mean, this is a Max Ranking run. It's the only logical choice.
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May 7, 2015 05:03
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| # ? Jun 8, 2024 15:07 |
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As always, my vote is for whatever route the LPer thinks best. So if we're officially casting votes, then mine would be for Bartre.
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May 7, 2015 05:40
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