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In Training
Jun 28, 2008

It's the same composer so I think it's alright

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Stairmaster
Jun 8, 2012

Actually its the greatest crime of all to rob oneself

Parallax
Jan 14, 2006

i was looking for info about what work anno did on sailor moon and instead found this thing from ikuhara

quote:

「そのままの君はいいよ」という魔力

The magical power of "You're fine just the way you are"

「カヲルのモデルなんですか?」とは、今までに何人かにも直接訊かれたことがある。どこからの情報なの?本人としてまったく関知していないんだよね。カヲル君はルックスもかっこいいだし、僕がモデルなんて言ったらファンの人たちから苦情が来ると思うんだけど。でもね、まったく思い当たる節がないというわけでもない。庵野さんとは、まだ『エヴァンゲリオン』が準備中だったころ、密に交流があった。あるとき、『セーラームーン』のスタッフみんなで慰安旅行として温泉に行ったんだけど、そのメンバーに庵野さんも入っていたんだよね「1」。なんだかその夜は2人でずっと話しててね。みんあが潰れてしまったあとにも延々と、酒を飲んでは語り、露天風呂に2人並んでつかっては語り過ごしたんだ。

I have been asked directly by a few people before now if I was the model for Kaworu. Where did that information come from? I was completely uninvolved [in Kaworu's creation] as one of the principals. Kaworu is very good-looking, so if I said I was his model I imagine I would recieve complaints from his fans. However, it's not the case that I have no idea at all [what the speculation might refer to]. During the period when Evangelion was still in its preparatory stages, I was in very close contact with Anno-san. At that time, the staff of Sailor Moon went on a company trip to an onsen, and Anno-san was also among our members. [1] The two of us ended up talking the whole night. Even after everyone else had collapsed we went on and on, drinking sake and talking, sitting side by side in an open air bath and talking.

だから、その夜にカヲルとシンジのやりとり同じ匂いのする会話を僕らもしていたかもしれない、とは思うよ。それは実際に弐拾四話を見たときにも感じた。まあ、お風呂っていうシチュエーションも同じだし、わかりやすいよね。ただ、「好意に値するよ」というセリフを僕が庵野さんに言ったとか(笑)、そういう噂があるみたいだけどそれはよくわからない。僕がカヲルで庵野さんがシンジとか、そういうことではないと思うんだよね。だって、どっちかと言えば庵野さんのほうがカヲルみたいなシニカルなことを言うそうじゃない?そこで思春期のころの話をした記憶がある。僕は14,15歳の時には本当に絶望していて人生真っ黒だと思っていたんだよ。受験なんかのこともあって、少しの失敗も許されていないような気がしてね。今はさ、負け組のほうにも注目が集まっているというか、ダメになる自由もあるという感じがするけど、そのころは一回でも負けたらその先は闇でしかないように感じられた。'70年代まで安保闘争があったわけだけど、それも終わって、「ああ、やっぱり世界を革命するなんてことはできないんだな」って空気が蔓延してたんだ。だから自分は20歳までには死ぬんだろうと思っていたし、それ以降の人生なんてオマケみたいなものだって思っている―その話をしたんだ。もしかしたら、そういう話ができること自体がお互い貴重だったのかもしれないね。

So, I think the conversation we had that night had perhaps the same flavor as the exchange between Kaworu and Shinji. I also felt this way when I saw episode 24 for myself. Well, the situation with the bath was the same; that's easy enough to understand. But, it seems there are rumors - I'm not really sure - that the line of dialogue, "You are worthy of love," was something I said to Anno-san, and so on (laughs). I don't think it was a case where I was Kaworu and Anno-san was Shinji. Only, if I had to say which [is which], Anno-san seems to say more Kaworu-esque cynical things, right? So, I remember telling [Anno] a story about the time of my adolescence. When I was 14 or 15 years old, I was truly in despair, thinking my life prospects were very bleak. With tests and such things, I had the feeling that I was not permitted even a slight failure. Today it seems like even failures receive attention, or that there is freedom to be "dame," but at that time it seemed that you would have no future after failing even once. Up until the 70s there was the anpo toso, but when that ended, an atmosphere - "ah, as we suspected, you can't revolutionize the world" - began to spread. So, I thought that I would be dead before I was twenty years old, and any life I lived beyond that would be a kind of omake - that was the story I told [to Anno]. Probably, just the fact that I was able to tell that story was of value to both of us.

あと庵野さんはセーラームーン好きでいてくれて「ああいう楽しい作品を僕もやりたい」とも言ってた「2」。SF的な世界設定だったりマシンのディテールだったりと、リアリズムを追求する方向にあった意識が、セーラームーンみたいな作品に触れて揺り返しが起こったのかなって思う。普通に楽しめるアニメーションの楽しさ、みたいのものが庵野さんのなかで新鮮に感じられた時期だったのかもしれない。僕のなかの庵野さんの印象というと、なんかそれこそ「人じゃない」ような感じ。大きくて、猫背で、なんかエヴァンゲリオンみたいだよね。よくカッターを持って、チキチキチキって出して「やあっ」ってやってたし(笑)。

Beyond that, Anno-san loved Sailor Moon and told me he wanted to make a similarly enjoyable work. [2] I wonder if an aftershock had occured when this consciousness that was moving towards the pursuit of realism - a science fiction-like world setting, the details of machines, and so on - came into contact with a work like Sailor Moon. Maybe that was a period where something like the pleasure of an ordinarily enjoyable anime seemed novel to Anno-san. My own impression of Anno-san is a feeling like he's not human. He's big, hunches over, and seems to resemble an Evangelion. [For example,] often he's had a utility knife, and cried out "Yah!" as he slid the blade out (laughs).

父親に「帰れ」と言われたり、綾波から平手打ちを食らったり、アスカから「バカァ?」と言われたり、ミサとから「しっかりしなさい」と怒られたり……シンジはなかなか他者から肯定してもらえないよね。そんな中、唯一「そのままの君でいいんじゃないのか?」と言ってくれて存在がカヲルだったじゃないかと思う。「頑張らなくてもいいよ」って。だから、おもしろいけど男の子たちみたいには熱狂なになれないって思いながら『エヴァ』を見ていた女の子たちも、カヲルが出てきて初めて、ようたくシンジに感情移入ができるようになったのかもしれない。だから、みんなカヲルを好きなのかもしれない。ん?「そのままの君でいい」って僕が誰かに言ったことがあるかって?そんなのいつだって言ってるに決まってるじゃないか。

He's ordered to come back by his father, he's slapped by Ayanami, he's called stupid by Asuka, he's yelled at to straighten up by Misato... Shinji doesn't recieve much affirmation from others. I think, in this situation, the only one who tells him that he's fine just the way he is is Kaworu. "You don't have to try to so hard." Perhaps because of that, after Kaworu appeared, the girls who had been watching Eva and who found it interesting but didn't feel the kind of enthusiasm that the boys felt about it were able to finally connect emotionally with Shinji. Perhaps because of that everyone loves Kaworu. Hm? Have I ever said to anyone, "you're fine just the way you are"? Isn't that something I'm always saying?

「1」『エヴァンゲリオン』監督・庵野秀明も制作スタッフとして参加。『美少女戦士セーラームーンS』103話原画、ウラヌス&ネプチューン変身バンク演出や、幾原監督作『劇場版美少女戦士セーラームーンR』の原画などを手がけている。

[1] Evangelion director Hideaki Anno participated as a staff member. Among other things, he directed the bank transformation sequences of Uranus and Neptune in Sailor Moon S, and worked on the genga of episode 103 of Sailor Moon S and of the Ikuhara-directed series Sailor Moon R.

「2」『セーラームーン』主役の月野うさぎ役の声優三石琴乃(ミサト役)の起用や、『R』に少年役として出演していた緒方恵美(シンジ役)の起用など、強いリスペクトの意が感じられる。

[2] Among other things, the appointment (as Misato) of Kotono Mitsuishi, the voice actress of Sailor Moon's protagonist Usagi Tsukino, and the appointment (as Shinji) of Megumi Ogata, who had voiced a young boy in R, give an indication of Anno's strong respect [for the series].

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
I just watched Don Hertzfeldt's It's Such a Beautiful Day and the ending was rather similar to Yui's desires for the Eva in End of Evangelion. Memory, existence. Bill is the Eva I guess. Not such a depressing movie.

A Pinball Wizard
Mar 23, 2005

I know every trick, no freak's gonna beat my hands

College Slice
Has there been a blu-ray/high def release of end of Eva yet?

Sakurazuka
Jan 24, 2004

NANI?

Yes, Japan only still but obviously you can find subtitled rips online.

CottonWolf
Jul 20, 2012

Good ideas generator

I hold a naive hope it might come west one day.

Punkin Spunkin
Jan 1, 2010
Wow I still have my old DVD of eoe so it never occurred to me. How in the heck do they have rebuild blurays in the west but no release of eoe yet?

A Pinball Wizard
Mar 23, 2005

I know every trick, no freak's gonna beat my hands

College Slice
Yeah, I was watching mine last night and I was like "wow... This looks way worse than I remember."

In Training
Jun 28, 2008

Punkin Spunkin posted:

Wow I still have my old DVD of eoe so it never occurred to me. How in the heck do they have rebuild blurays in the west but no release of eoe yet?

Almost definitely a licensing thing, EoE is a gainax production and the rebuilds have been a new work under Studio Khara with separate agreements

Sakurazuka
Jan 24, 2004

NANI?

The western EoE DVD was always garbage even when that was the best quality you could get, Manga Ent were poo poo.

Midjack
Dec 24, 2007



Sakurazuka posted:

The western EoE DVD was always garbage even when that was the best quality you could get, Manga Ent were poo poo.

This. EoE wasn't part of the remasters that ADV did several years ago, and I think Manga retains the license even today. I imagine Funimation has made some effort to acquire the rights to all the Evangelion TV and movie properties but I suspect whoever has the licenses is sitting on them.

Raxivace
Sep 9, 2014

If I could get my way the Criterion Collection would put out the next release of EoE on blu-ray, and it would have cool analysis and commentary and special features and a pristine transfer of the film. :colbert:

Unfortunately my campaign of mentioning this occasionally on Facebook doesn't seem to be working...

Punkin Spunkin
Jan 1, 2010
That's true but it's not like we got many good anime DVD releases back then I still love and treasure the teenage horror my dumb eoe DVD first caused in me
IMO and experience the best age to first binge watch the series and then watch EoE is when you're the age of the pilots
I didn't stop listening to The Cure that whole summer. Thanks anno!

GhostofJohnMuir
Aug 14, 2014

anime is not good

Raxivace posted:

If I could get my way the Criterion Collection would put out the next release of EoE on blu-ray, and it would have cool analysis and commentary and special features and a pristine transfer of the film. :colbert:

Unfortunately my campaign of mentioning this occasionally on Facebook doesn't seem to be working...

you have my full support in your quest

In Training
Jun 28, 2008

I started watching NGE again and I like to take a bunch of screenshots and such, so I'll keep dumping them here for anyone who wants to revisit wonderful images from this show!

Episode 1 - Angel Attack

Episode 2 - Unfamiliar Ceiling

Episode 3 - The Phone that Never Rings

Szmitten
Apr 26, 2008

In Training posted:

I started watching NGE again and I like to take a bunch of screenshots and such, so I'll keep dumping them here for anyone who wants to revisit wonderful images from this show!

Episode 1 - Angel Attack

Episode 2 - Unfamiliar Ceiling

Episode 3 - The Phone that Never Rings

There is something weirdly off-model about the design and the choice of palette in this series until you get past the midway point.

Srice
Sep 11, 2011

In Training posted:

I started watching NGE again and I like to take a bunch of screenshots and such, so I'll keep dumping them here for anyone who wants to revisit wonderful images from this show!

Episode 1 - Angel Attack

Episode 2 - Unfamiliar Ceiling

Episode 3 - The Phone that Never Rings

drat, now I wanna rewatch but I don't have time for it!

SHISHKABOB
Nov 30, 2012

Fun Shoe
The first time I watched this series I couldn't tell what these things were. The shots would change so quickly, and the tanks are so densely stacked. Their individual shapes are almost completely obscured. I also like to contrast it against the many landscape shots of urban Japan where you see basically all the stuff that's in the water right there, but how it normally looks. Like those live-action shots, which I forget if they were in the last 2 episodes or EoE, but they are really just generic yet beautiful shots of Japan.

The way all these mushed together tanks sit overlooking the drowned city.

In Training
Jun 28, 2008

The first six episodes are really good about presenting the city in complete standstill. There's a plethora of shots of empty streets, or streets occupied by weaponry, or trains with nobody on them etc. It's very unsettling from the outset and helps drive home the feeling of isolation all the kids and adults are experiencing in the shelter while they watch Shinji and the Angels destroy their home

GimmickMan
Dec 27, 2011

Speaking of standstills and isolation.



This is one of my favorite shots in the series. It's a quiet sunset watching these two inert giants while listening to the cicadas in the background, as if they had always been part of the scenery and not causing collateral all over the place an hour or so ago. It puts us in the shoes of NERV employees, who created monsters to fight monsters, looking up at them and realizing just how tiny we are.

In Training
Jun 28, 2008

I think my favorite shot in the tv show is either the elevator or the final shot of 24 with the music for very similar reasons. Animation is generally stylistically very adverse to still shots; often when a shot consists of a single frame they will pan over it or include lip flap. Pure stillness often is equated to "bad" animation because audiences assume production constraints but it's a very deliberate choice and can be quite powerful, just as it is live action cinema.

GET IN THE ROBOT
Nov 28, 2007

JUST GET IN THE FUCKING ROBOT SHINJI
A lot of people love to discuss the plot, characters and philosophy of Evangelion, but they often seem to gloss over the show's amazing cinematography:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6O-id9uLvU

Part of why I loved Shin Godzilla so much is because it just oozes Anno's style of cinematography and his knack for framing interesting shots, often of otherwise mundane things. I just love his imagery.

In Training
Jun 28, 2008

You should check out his other live action work because it's similarly entrancing. I could watch hours of his footage of power lines

GET IN THE ROBOT
Nov 28, 2007

JUST GET IN THE FUCKING ROBOT SHINJI

In Training posted:

You should check out his other live action work because it's similarly entrancing. I could watch hours of his footage of power lines

Somehow, Anno has the magical power to make still shots of power lines and train tracks really interesting.

sharktamer
Oct 30, 2011

Shark tamer ridiculous
Shiki-jitsu really does the empty city thing just as well, especially the locale where the main female character lives. It ends up feeling like this vast empty city where only one person lives.

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

Gammatron 64 posted:

Somehow, Anno has the magical power to make still shots of power lines and train tracks really interesting.

I feel like a lot of it is context - at least in regards to Eva. I loving love all the technobabbl-y shots in Rebuild's take on operation Yashima, where it's just showing all the generators and wires and infrastructure carrying power to Shinji and the positron cannon, in large part because it helps emphasize the scope of the operation and the sheer number of people putting their fate entirely in Shinji's hands. Of course, the music and editing help a lot - the way it cuts from all the massive machinery and automated weapons at work, with the music swelling dramatically, to Shinji in the cockpit just trying to keep his breathing steady is incredibly powerful to me.

GET IN THE ROBOT
Nov 28, 2007

JUST GET IN THE FUCKING ROBOT SHINJI

Spiritus Nox posted:

I feel like a lot of it is context - at least in regards to Eva. I loving love all the technobabbl-y shots in Rebuild's take on operation Yashima, where it's just showing all the generators and wires and infrastructure carrying power to Shinji and the positron cannon, in large part because it helps emphasize the scope of the operation and the sheer number of people putting their fate entirely in Shinji's hands. Of course, the music and editing help a lot - the way it cuts from all the massive machinery and automated weapons at work, with the music swelling dramatically, to Shinji in the cockpit just trying to keep his breathing steady is incredibly powerful to me.

I think it also kind of adds a sense of gritty realism to a degree, too. Both Eva and Shin Godzilla have all these crazy, insane fantastical things happening juxtaposed with the mundane. NERV has all this amazing technology, but outside of NERV HQ, things look like 1990's Japan and not particularly futuristic (other than the buildings sinking into the ground). Even though it's in the future, they have (at the time) current technology like cassette players and Sega Saturns.

Then End of Evangelion comes along and it kind does weird stuff with my brain and blurrs the line between animation and live action. This is why I said a while back that it could work well in live action, because sometimes it makes me forget I'm watching animation. And sometimes while watching Shin Godzilla, I forgot I was watching a Godzilla movie and not Evangelion.

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

Gammatron 64 posted:

Then End of Evangelion comes along and it kind does weird stuff with my brain and blurrs the line between animation and live action. This is why I said a while back that it could work well in live action, because sometimes it makes me forget I'm watching animation. And sometimes while watching Shin Godzilla, I forgot I was watching a Godzilla movie and not Evangelion.

My only option to watch Shin Godzilla while it was in theaters would have involved a three-hour bus ride (each way!) at a time when I was basically too sick to leave the house.

I almost did it anyways

Raxivace
Sep 9, 2014

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

My only option to watch Shin Godzilla while it was in theaters would have involved a three-hour bus ride (each way!) at a time when I was basically too sick to leave the house.

I almost did it anyways
You should have done it anyways tbh. Sure it may have caused a health epidemic, but the WHO would have understood that seeing Shin Godzilla outweighs all of that.

smenj
Oct 10, 2012
All those shots are reminding me of one of my favourite things about the original Eva series, which was the pacing. Right up until the last three or four episodes, where I thought the DC episodes went on a little too long (though I haven't watched the normal eps to compare), the whole show was just impeccably paced. So much happens each episode without you even realising things are happening so quickly, especially at the beginning, all the 'monster of the week' sorta stuff the series starts out with ends just before it starts to get stale, and you just so desperately want to see what happens next every time an episode ends. Watching the series for the first time over a period of a few days with a friend, we couldn't help but watch two or three episodes more than we'd intended every time we started.

All in all, the pacing was probably the thing I came away from the show most impressed with.

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007

https://twitter.com/dogrunes/status/792148536368304128

Raxivace
Sep 9, 2014

This is simultaneously the most Japanese thing ever and the most American thing ever.

It owns.

Zeruel
Mar 27, 2010

Alert: bad post spotted.

I'm tearing up
Holy poo poo.

GimmickMan
Dec 27, 2011

The gospel of a new century.

Moose-Alini
Sep 11, 2001

Not always so

Raxivace posted:

This is simultaneously the most Japanese thing ever and the most American thing ever.

It owns.

I was surprised at how much of a cultural staple Eva is in Japan. Nge themed soda vending machines, billboards for random products, commercials, posters, elevator music. That poo poo is everywhere.

Safety Biscuits
Oct 21, 2010

image

Taipei Gay Pride on Saturday

In Training
Jun 28, 2008

Episode 4 - Rain, After Running Away

Episode 5 - Rei, Beyond the Heart

Episode 6 - Decisive Battle in Tokyo-3

I like these parallel shots (first image is from Episode 5 and the second is from the climax of Episode 6)



ImpAtom
May 24, 2007

One of the most impressive bits of art in Evangelion I think is how Gendo Ikari looks a shitton like Shinji but his beard and general design is just different enough that it only becomes clear at very specific times.

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Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

ImpAtom posted:

One of the most impressive bits of art in Evangelion I think is how Gendo Ikari looks a shitton like Shinji but his beard and general design is just different enough that it only becomes clear at very specific times.

Yeah. It only hits you at very specific moments exactly how much of an older, more broken Shinji Gendo is.

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