|
I'm thinking Headon must have told her. A lot of my theories depend on what role exactly Headon has in the story, and I don't really like that. I'm not a smart man.
|
#
?
Mar 6, 2017 18:23
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 30, 2024 02:01 |
|
|
She was born in the village Arlene escaped to, outside the tower. It's why she had access to Baam, the baby-corpse. *edit* If she's a descendant of Arlene, that means she and Bam are related... nimby fucked around with this message at 18:53 on Mar 6, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 6, 2017 18:46
|
|
|
Coffee Mugshot posted:I don't understand how Rachel has the information from Arlene's pocket diary? Based on how she refers to Arlene, it seems like she personally knows her or has met her in some way since she shares the same goal of seeing the starry sky. I've also never understood how Rachel has worked so closely with FUG this entire time or why this prophecy matter so much to her. Baam is just chilling and feeling at home. She seemed to know a lot of background from outside of the tower; but from a fairy-tale perspective. I would suspect that her dream of seeing the stars, thinking Headon was a fairy when she came in, and general things about Arlene are all coming from the same source.
|
|
#
?
Mar 6, 2017 18:47
|
|
|
Does siu still do the end of chapter notes and they just don't get translated ?
|
|
#
?
Mar 6, 2017 19:27
|
|
|
Jose posted:Does siu still do the end of chapter notes and they just don't get translated ? He has weekly blogs that are translated here: https://www.reddit.com/r/TowerofGod/comments/5xqiuo/blog_translation_season_2_chapter_240/ I think there might be a google doc that's kept up to date somewhere too. He's stopped giving overarching setting notes, though. 
|
|
#
?
Mar 6, 2017 19:43
|
|
|
Kind of disappointed that "child of prophecy" is the direction the author is going with. The whole setup didn't even need a prophetic aspect, but it's thrown in there anyway.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 00:35
|
|
|
eh it was just something arlene said. baam seems unlikely to want to kill them all even knowing the truth
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 00:46
|
|
|
Jose posted:eh it was just something arlene said. baam seems unlikely to want to kill them all even knowing the truth Yeah, the confirmed crazy lady was apparently saying things as she left through a secret exit from the tower. Actual prophesy may or may not be involved and it seems more likely that baby Baam just wasn't actually dead, especially since he's the son of the secret 11th and 12th "families".
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 00:49
|
|
|
Gyges posted:Yeah, the confirmed crazy lady was apparently saying things as she left through a secret exit from the tower. Actual prophesy may or may not be involved and it seems more likely that baby Baam just wasn't actually dead, especially since he's the son of the secret 11th and 12th "families". I mean, if speculation about Wangnan is correct, it looks like the rules of the immortality are the really awful TNO version where you can and will still suffer horrifying amounts of damage, but will always come back. So it makes sense that a baby might take a very long time to recover. ...Still, the part about the baby being made an offering to a god does explain why Baam was alone in a cave for so long.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 00:56
|
|
|
Shugojin posted:I mean, if speculation about Wangnan is correct, it looks like the rules of the immortality are the really awful TNO version where you can and will still suffer horrifying amounts of damage, but will always come back. So it makes sense that a baby might take a very long time to recover. I feel like the issue with Jahad specifically is that he can't even be harmed by the tower's residents?
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 02:01
|
|
|
I don't know how to feel or react about this chapter. It's so good, but at the same time, I hate being kept on the edge of my seat. What I want to know is, where's Rak? It seems apparent to me that Arlene exited the tower and eventually came to wherever Rachel was, and Rachel adored her and looked up to her, but this must have been thousands of years in the past and Rachel wouldn't have existed. Also holy poo poo Rachel, you literally know that Baam is the kid of the woman you revere and you choose to betray him constantly anyway? How much more despicable can you get? So the 13th Month series, all together, is the Key that Jahad made to seal the way to the 134th Floor, and Enryu is apparently an acquaintance of either V (I think his name is Viole, but whatever), Arlene, or both of them, which makes it seem that he should also know the other 11 Leaders, who entered the Tower for revenge against Jahad. That's what I'm getting right now. Garam, never stop talking.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 03:58
|
|
|
It's important to remember that time means gently caress all in the Tower and it's surroundings. People will do things for centuries without aging, and then comment on how someone else is a kid, and then that kid transforms back and forth between teenagerish and kid. People can die, but unless you're killed you keep on going because time is only strong enough to enforce causality and nothing more.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 04:31
|
|
|
IIRC, time kind of freezes for you if you're a regular trying to climb the tower. Remember that it took Rankers decades to get their positions, yet few of them are shown to be old people.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:05
|
|
|
Learning to use Shinsoo slows the aging process, the more powerful you become the slower you age. Once you become a ranker you are pretty much immortal, which is convenient since most people need 500 years or so to reach the top of the tower.
Avulsion fucked around with this message at 07:00 on Mar 7, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 06:57
|
|
|
Jose posted:that was a lot of information and explains why rachel thinks baam is a monster. also why urek is interested in him. wonder when we're getting a full explanation of the thorn or why it required enryu killing the administrator Considering Urek's whole thing is trying to find a way out of the tower, which Grace and Baam did, then he better be interested in Baam's deal.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 07:14
|
|
|
I mean does betraying Baam even mean anything to Rachel? He's a literal zombie. Killing him just means he's gone for a couple hundred years and then he gets better and doesn't seem to remember anything.Gologle posted:I don't know how to feel or react about this chapter. It's so good, but at the same time, I hate being kept on the edge of my seat. What I want to know is, where's Rak?
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 07:21
|
|
|
i really want to know more about outside the tower and what the world is like/the towers appearance on the outside. Magic has been mentioned a few times in the series now between this chapter and White but we've never actually seen what it is
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 09:39
|
|
|
Gologle posted:Remember that it took Rankers decades to get their positions, yet few of them are shown to be old people. I think that 100 years is considered a fast time to climb the tower and Urek Mazino, who was the fastest and an irregular, took only 50. So it might be more like centuries for many rankers. Oh, and to reinforce the fact that you don't need to be a regular or ranker to become ageless, I think that both Endorsi and Anak Jahad were hundreds of years old before they start climbing the tower. So basically just learning some degree of shinsoo control is sufficient to become effectively ageless (and Endorsi/Yuri are both basically pedophiles* for being interested in Baam, who is mentally only in his early 20s I guess?). *Or more accurately some word that means "such a big age difference it's really creepy/bizarre" edit: Speaking of which, how long has Baam been climbing now? Like 7-8 years? Getting almost 1/3 of the way up the tower in that amount of time seems pretty fast, though I imagine it might get slower higher up (though I certainly hope it doesn't for narrative reasons!). Ytlaya fucked around with this message at 09:59 on Mar 7, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 09:53
|
|
|
baam is somewhere between a quarter and third of the way up and i think its been quite a bit longer than that if you include the time skip. part 2 has taken over 5 years i think If Enryu entered the tower to get revenge for Arlene and Viole it seems a bit strange he didn't just get it himself Jose fucked around with this message at 10:17 on Mar 7, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 10:14
|
|
|
Two Tone Shoes posted:Considering Urek's whole thing is trying to find a way out of the tower, which Grace and Baam did, then he better be interested in Baam's deal. I don't think he knows yet but if he ever learns about it he'll be super interested. Which, considering that IIRC he's headed to the Floor of Death right now..  e: Oh my god he is, this floor is going to be so turbofucked with all the people on it right now 
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 12:07
|
|
|
Is hwaryun a regular?
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 18:40
|
|
|
Jose posted:Is hwaryun a regular? If she's in the tower and she's not a Ranker, Irregular, Administrator, or...fauna, she's a regular. Guides are treated as Regulars/Rankers in every other facet we've seen them, even if they are a bit unique. Even people native to the middle section of the tower are regulars. Maybe Hwaryun is special and outside of that classification (she probably is special, at least), but we haven't seen anything yet that would imply she's not a regular.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 18:50
|
|
|
I can't remember if this one thing was addressed - what happens if regulars/rankers have children in the inner tower? I seem to remember the deal being that the children can live on the floor where they were born, but can't climb higher unless they're selected as regulars and sent back to the bottom. So you can live in the inner tower without being a regular, but you can't climb. edit: Regarding how long it takes the climb the tower, Leroro apparently took 300 years. And since I think he's supposed to be an above average Ranker, I imagine it generally takes centuries to climb the tower. Ytlaya fucked around with this message at 19:06 on Mar 7, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 19:02
|
|
|
Ytlaya posted:I can't remember if this one thing was addressed - what happens if regulars/rankers have children in the inner tower? That's the situation with some of the Family kids. We saw in Hoaqin's flashback that he was in Arie's personal test floor. They are just regulars who, when they decide to climb the tower, get sent to the bottom floor. They stay in their native floor until then but can't leave because they haven't passed any of the tests that allow them to visit the floors above or below them. Being born in the Tower or chosen by the Tower to come in (and accepting) is what makes you a regular, more or less. Both of those states contract you to the will of the Tower. The people born in the tower who haven't started climbing are technically regulars but don't do any of the stuff regulars are associated with doing. They just live around. If you're not a regular then you're an Irregular. Irregulars are people who either forced their way in (Baam, Enryu, Z/Jahad, Phantaminum, Mazino) or followed someone who did (Rachel following Baam, the 12 disciples following Zahard). Though I think the latter could probably use its own definition. People born in the tower obviously aren't irregulars and it's a binary system. Two Tone Shoes fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Mar 7, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 19:22
|
|
|
Two Tone Shoes posted:That's the situation with some of the Family kids. We saw in Hoaqin's flashback that he was in Arie's personal test floor. They are just regulars who, when they decide to climb the tower, get sent to the bottom floor. They stay in their native floor until then but can't leave because they haven't passed any of the tests that allow them to visit the floors above or below them. Being born in the Tower or chosen by the Tower to come in (and accepting) is what makes you a regular, more or less. Both of those states contract you to the will of the Tower. The people born in the tower who haven't started climbing are technically regulars but don't do any of the stuff regulars are associated with doing. They just live around. Are you just talking about the inner tower, though? Because I know that folks in the Outer Tower have to be chosen by Headon to climb the Tower; they can't choose themselves. The wiki says that a regular is someone chosen to climb the tower, so I don't think someone born in the tower would be a regular until they're chosen to climb. edit: So I think it's a binary system but only applies to "people climbing the tower" rather than "everyone living in the tower."
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 20:44
|
|
|
It seems like Rachel was so infatuated with pursuing Arlene's goals that she started to have disdain for her son who had no ambition or knowledge at all and judged him as unworthy to be the child to inherit all that destiny. It's not particularly crazy that she feels justified.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 21:26
|
|
|
Ytlaya posted:Are you just talking about the inner tower, though? Because I know that folks in the Outer Tower have to be chosen by Headon to climb the Tower; they can't choose themselves. The wiki says that a regular is someone chosen to climb the tower, so I don't think someone born in the tower would be a regular until they're chosen to climb. I think you're right; even if you're born in the inner tower you still have to be chosen to be a regular. Which doesn't mean you're an irregular until then; just that you're a nobody.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 21:46
|
|
|
Ytlaya posted:Are you just talking about the inner tower, though? Because I know that folks in the Outer Tower have to be chosen by Headon to climb the Tower; they can't choose themselves. The wiki says that a regular is someone chosen to climb the tower, so I don't think someone born in the tower would be a regular until they're chosen to climb. Yeah, I'm talking about the inner tower. Folks in the outer tower are just people. Does Headon have to choose people who are already in the tower for them to start their climb, too? I suppose so since everyone has to do the newbie test and that's his job. It just seems like there's a whole lot of people who chose to start climbing themselves but it's been so long since the beginning I guess that identity has been lost in the wash. Two Tone Shoes fucked around with this message at 21:48 on Mar 7, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 21:46
|
|
|
Two Tone Shoes posted:Yeah, I'm talking about the inner tower. Folks in the outer tower are just people. Does Headon have to choose people who are already in the tower for them to start their climb, too? I suppose so since everyone has to do the newbie test and that's his job. It just seems like there's a whole lot of people who chose to start climbing themselves but it's been so long since the beginning I guess that identity has been lost in the wash. Apparently even children of the 10 Families aren't shoo-ins to become Regulars (though they would obviously have a much higher chance): Wiki posted:Most children of the 10 Families usually live in the "Suspended Castles" until they are chosen to become Regulars. Children who are not chosen to climb the Tower settle down in the Middle Area or help around in their family's Suspended Castles, although they are discriminated compared to those who come back as Regulars or Rankers. It seems like the Middle Tower is sort of the residential area for Regulars (though Regulars can obviously also live in the Outer Tower), while Outer Tower areas are separate areas where most people will never leave the floor they were born on and many aren't even aware of the existence of other floors or the Middle/Inner Towers. So I think that Outer Tower residents who weren't chosen as Regulars can't enter the Middle Tower (which you pass through when going to the Inner Tower). Do we know anything about how big the Inner Tower is? We know the Outer Tower is roughly the size of North America, but I imagine the Inner Tower is far smaller.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 23:00
|
|
|
Ytlaya posted:Apparently even children of the 10 Families aren't shoo-ins to become Regulars (though they would obviously have a much higher chance): Being chosen as a Regular must feel awful for a lot of folks. The success rate is so dang low. It's like winning the reverse lottery.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 23:34
|
|
|
Two Tone Shoes posted:Being chosen as a Regular must feel awful for a lot of folks. The success rate is so dang low. It's like winning the reverse lottery. You don't have to keep climbing the Tower if you're chosen. I'm not even sure if you have to take the first test. You can also stop at any time while climbing, and any Regulars who make it past the 20th Floor or so will always have a privileged position in society relative to normal people.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 23:39
|
|
|
Ytlaya posted:You don't have to keep climbing the Tower if you're chosen. I'm not even sure if you have to take the first test. You can also stop at any time while climbing, and any Regulars who make it past the 20th Floor or so will always have a privileged position in society relative to normal people. Yeah they said that but then we go to these floors and there's always this horrible system or oppressed people or some horrible nonsense that the main characters have to push through.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 23:45
|
|
|
Two Tone Shoes posted:Yeah they said that but then we go to these floors and there's always this horrible system or oppressed people or some horrible nonsense that the main characters have to push through. I think that was just the name-steal station where this was the case? And it's apparently an exception of sorts. The Hell Train and Floor of Death are both optional areas that most Regulars avoid.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 23:50
|
|
|
Ytlaya posted:I think that was just the name-steal station where this was the case? And it's apparently an exception of sorts. The Hell Train and Floor of Death are both optional areas that most Regulars avoid. Floor 20 was basically ruled by a payday loan scam.
|
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 23:53
|
|
|
Ytlaya posted:I think that was just the name-steal station where this was the case? And it's apparently an exception of sorts. The Hell Train and Floor of Death are both optional areas that most Regulars avoid. The beneficent, high status floor 20 you were talking about was literally a massive super slum loan shark menagerie. We were introduced to the story with a giant murder battle royal situation. Mortality is high, success is low. Most people don't pass any given test! The overarching theme of the whole story is Baam struggling against a system that rewards people stepping over and throwing away those close to them for personal success (getting pretty real here). I suppose they do gloss over a lot of easy, no terrible poo poo floors by just beating the challenge and moving up over the course of a couple of panels and the bad is magnified, but still. Two Tone Shoes fucked around with this message at 00:02 on Mar 8, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 7, 2017 23:54
|
|
|
Two Tone Shoes posted:The beneficent, high status floor 20 you were talking about was literally a massive super slum loan shark menagerie. We were introduced to the story with a giant murder battle royal situation. Mortality is high, success is low. Most people don't pass any given test! The overarching theme of the whole story is Baam struggling against a system that rewards people stepping over and throwing away those close to them for personal success (getting pretty real here). No wonder why I love Tower of God so much on a personal level. This entire comic is a glorious piss take on all those lovely Xianxia novels that glorify the lovely system that is Jahad's rule. All I need is an arc where Khun humiliates a Xianxia protag shitbird and I'll be set for life.
|
|
#
?
Mar 8, 2017 00:23
|
|
|
Two Tone Shoes posted:The beneficent, high status floor 20 you were talking about was literally a massive super slum loan shark menagerie. We were introduced to the story with a giant murder battle royal situation. Mortality is high, success is low. Most people don't pass any given test! The overarching theme of the whole story is Baam struggling against a system that rewards people stepping over and throwing away those close to them for personal success (getting pretty real here). No, it's beneficial if you get past floor 20. Floor 20 is apparently a filter of sorts, with most people not getting past that point (but more people progressing floor to floor beyond that). That's why getting past floor 20 conveys some level of prestige. Also you can always choose to just work and live normally at that point. You only end up in the loan shark situation if you decide to keep taking the test (though obviously it's really easy to fall into this hole since most people don't bring much money into the Tower, so if you don't succeed the first time or two you probably end up financially hosed). There's no doubt that climbing the tower is super dangerous and most people don't make it to the top, including many dying. I was just pointing out that merely getting selected as a Regular isn't a bad thing, since nothing is forcing you to continue climbing.
|
|
#
?
Mar 8, 2017 01:13
|
|
|
Ytlaya posted:No, it's beneficial if you get past floor 20. Floor 20 is apparently a filter of sorts, with most people not getting past that point (but more people progressing floor to floor beyond that). That's why getting past floor 20 conveys some level of prestige. I thought getting to floor 20 is what allows you to stay in the tower indefinitely without being kicked out, which is WHY everyone bottoms out there and it's so populated with hopeless people. All the people just good enough to get there stop their journeys and fall into a debt spiral, and the test to get out of floor 20 is super hard relative to previous tests to ensure it. Rent is extraordinarily high in that place because population is increasing without many people advancing to the next floor. It's why there's such a loan shark business culture, and why so many people are destitute despite nominal success as a regular. It's not climbing the same ladder, it's getting tossed to the bottom rung of a new ladder. People try super hard to live their lives their until they can start climbing again and get in that hosed situation. These people are victims of a broken system, and their reward is more poo poo. I can't talk about the floor of tests thing, because we've only really seen Baam's that I remember and his was unusually tough, but directly after your entrance exam you get tossed into a big murder orgy where half the people die. That's an awful reward for being chosen.
|
|
#
?
Mar 8, 2017 01:16
|
|
|
I want to say that Floor of Tests was a love letter to the Hunter Exam arc, at least at the beginning. Also don't forget that out of the half the people who didn't get murdered, a bunch more were automatically failed by Leroro when they couldn't get through the shinsoo wall. e: I kinda miss dumb rear end Baam who was all  Uhm hi, sorry, I think you missed me with the wall thing do you want me to go out and back in?Which was a really good way to set up how dumb powerful he was just incapable of noticing the wall that knocks everyone else back. It was similar to the explanation about the eel's tank on floor 1 but without other people around that didn't feel the same. Shugojin fucked around with this message at 01:24 on Mar 8, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 8, 2017 01:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 30, 2024 02:01 |
|
|
Shugojin posted:I want to say that Floor of Tests was a love letter to the Hunter Exam arc, at least at the beginning. Yeah but I mean, the murder royale is still an awful introductory to the tower, tho. I miss kind of dumb Baam too, but slowly badass-ifying Baam is a million times better than melancholic FUG Baam. Two Tone Shoes fucked around with this message at 02:11 on Mar 8, 2017 |
|
#
?
Mar 8, 2017 01:37
|
|