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safely sodomized posted:*extremely pol pot voice* hell yeah dude Didn't you probate me for saying Pol Pot was right
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Sep 21, 2017 19:17
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Enjoy posted:Is it really racism to point out basic supply and demand? Since most of the rich parts of the world are majority white and the poor parts aren't and with the majority of the world being poor; in a word, yes. Also lol at the anarchist quote, I guess some of the left and right libertarians have exactly the same blindspots.
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Sep 21, 2017 19:33
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Plutonis posted:Didn't you probate me for saying Pol Pot was right i have never probated you apparently, though lol you have 3 pages of probatiosn. also, i was being Ironic, the kr were bad
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Sep 21, 2017 19:36
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i thought you were homework explainer for a long time cuz you both changed your usernames at the same time
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Sep 21, 2017 19:37
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im a social fascist imperialist running dog compared to homework explainer
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Sep 21, 2017 19:40
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They were bad all right. Bad at killing every city slicker!
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Sep 21, 2017 19:40
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safely sodomized posted:im a social fascist imperialist running dog compared to homework explainer i think we all are (lov u homework explainer)
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Sep 21, 2017 19:41
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Plutonis posted:They were bad all right. Bad at killing every city slicker! 
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Sep 21, 2017 19:43
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Plutonis posted:They were bad all right. Bad at killing every city slicker! *pushes up glasses*
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Sep 21, 2017 19:51
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that werner herzog documentary about how they didn't go far enough was really good
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Sep 21, 2017 19:53
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namesake posted:Since most of the rich parts of the world are majority white and the poor parts aren't and with the majority of the world being poor; in a word, yes. The specific allegation was that Corbyn was a racist for saying Eastern European migration to Britain lowers the wages there. Are Eastern Europeans not white?
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Sep 21, 2017 20:08
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safely sodomized posted:*extremely pol pot voice* hell yeah dude *nods* inception level of irony 24/7
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Sep 21, 2017 20:14
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Enjoy posted:The specific allegation was that Corbyn was a racist for saying Eastern European migration to Britain lowers the wages there. Are Eastern Europeans not white? Language is moving a little strangely here in the UK, 'racism' and 'xenophobia' as words are getting fairly intertwined and if you said 'racism against Eastern Europeans' British people would understand what you're talking about.
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Sep 21, 2017 20:21
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Enjoy posted:The specific allegation was that Corbyn was a racist for saying Eastern European migration to Britain lowers the wages there. Are Eastern Europeans not white? The Slawische Untermenschen?! White?!
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Sep 21, 2017 20:27
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Enjoy posted:The specific allegation was that Corbyn was a racist for saying Eastern European migration to Britain lowers the wages there. Are Eastern Europeans not white?
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Sep 21, 2017 20:36
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slavs are as white as the irish also 'basic supply and demand' or not, the claim that immigrants reduce wages isn't supported by economists who study the topic last I heard and shouldn't be promoted by left figures (or anyone else)
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Sep 21, 2017 20:37
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namesake posted:Language is moving a little strangely here in the UK, 'racism' and 'xenophobia' as words are getting fairly intertwined and if you said 'racism against Eastern Europeans' British people would understand what you're talking about. But you were the one who brought up whiteness Dreddout posted:Considering wealth and power disparity has always mattered far more than race wrt prejudice, Eastern European might as well be the UK's Mexican migrants. But then why pretend Corbyn is a racist? Peel posted:also 'basic supply and demand' or not, the claim that immigrants reduce wages isn't supported by economists who study the topic last I heard and shouldn't be promoted by left figures (or anyone else) Who are the economists
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Sep 21, 2017 21:53
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Enjoy posted:But you were the one who brought up whiteness To what I thought was a general point about migration which usually involves people from poor countries moving to richer ones. Invoking 'supply and demand' and anti-immigration in an general international context usually translates to 'why are all these [ethnic minority] people here?', Eastern Europeans are sadly the common target these days because the UK can severely limit the number of immigrants from predominantly non-white countries but can't do anything about European migration and so the target has changed but the tactic and sentiments haven't. In part I think that's why the language is blurring because we're realising it's all the same nonsense.
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Sep 21, 2017 22:12
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If the entirety of your takeaway from the essay is "this writer thinks Corbyn is racist" then I'm not sure you read it? Which is fine, but don't get defensive about it. Christ, Salvage is Richard Seymour's pet project and he's been one of Corbyn's staunchest defenders.
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Sep 21, 2017 22:13
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Proletarian revolution? no Agrarian revolution? no Incarceral revolution?  https://twitter.com/ComradeSnorlax/status/840747240213872640
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Sep 22, 2017 04:09
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Proletarian revolution? no  
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Sep 22, 2017 04:18
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Peel posted:slavs are as white as the irish Maybe it lowers wages as racists or xenophobic people pay them less.
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Sep 22, 2017 05:41
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Karl Barks posted:what's the official communist line on USSR's ethnic population .... "transfers" 
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Sep 22, 2017 06:12
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Coincidentally, this is also socdems stance on Rosa
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Sep 22, 2017 07:01
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Karl Barks posted:i think we all are (lov u homework explainer) i take no actual pleasure in the actual material circumstances but the radicalization of several posters itt post-trump does give me a certain morbid satisfaction
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Sep 23, 2017 01:34
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Rated PG-34 posted:who's grover a man a plan a bad house also lots of iraq war boosting
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Sep 23, 2017 03:42
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Sep 23, 2017 03:45
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https://twitter.com/3liza/status/891482017229029377 holy poo poo i didn't know this was how he came up with the design
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Sep 23, 2017 03:47
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This sums up so much in so many different areas
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Sep 23, 2017 04:41
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cheese posted:This sums up so much in so many different areas Pretty much every time there's a police killing.
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Sep 23, 2017 04:46
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Enjoy posted:Who are the economists forgive my vox but i'm no expert myself and i want to close these tabs. there's a famous canonical study that found no effect, and some more recent disputing of it but nothing solid for something supposedly so obvious and important. the whole debate seems very much like 'minimum wage increases tank employment' - a plausible sounding econ 101 story that gets a lot of play thanks to serving rightist interests, but which people can't find much evidence for in the real world.
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Sep 23, 2017 11:43
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if you're willing to accept that capitalist exploitation of low skill foreign labor can hurt low skill domestic laborers, then why wouldn't you also be willing to accept that capitalist exploitation of low skill immigrant labor could hurt low skill domestic laborers?
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Sep 23, 2017 19:00
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Unless you can point to immigration having a particularly abnormal aspect to it then the left-wing response to it is 'solidarity, join your local unions to defend all our pay and conditions as we are all working class'. Ideally that would also be the response when they're foreign Labour but international unions haven't taken off as much as they're needed. If you can't even definitely demonstrate that there are negatives then it's just bigotry.
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Sep 23, 2017 21:05
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comedyblissoption posted:if you're willing to accept that capitalist exploitation of low skill foreign labor can hurt low skill domestic laborers, then why wouldn't you also be willing to accept that capitalist exploitation of low skill immigrant labor could hurt low skill domestic laborers? this is the sort of argument you don't need to rely on any more when people have investigated the thing in question directly
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Sep 23, 2017 22:38
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Peel posted:this is the sort of argument you don't need to rely on any more when people have investigated the thing in question directly https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2017/1/24/14363148/trade-deals-nafta-wto-china-job-loss-trump
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Sep 23, 2017 23:25
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namesake posted:Unless you can point to immigration having a particularly abnormal aspect to it then the left-wing response to it is 'solidarity, join your local unions to defend all our pay and conditions as we are all working class'. Ideally that would also be the response when they're foreign Labour but international unions haven't taken off as much as they're needed. A race to the bottom for labor in a particular occupation does hurt domestic laborers in that occupation.
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Sep 23, 2017 23:27
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in a sane economic system, a bunch of immigrating workers wanting to generate wealth for your society would be an unequivocal good. capitalism is not sane.
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Sep 23, 2017 23:29
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Sep 24, 2017 01:57
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comedyblissoption posted:A race to the bottom for labor in a particular occupation does hurt domestic laborers in that occupation. Yes but you must prove that immigrant labour is spurring any such race beyond the abstract concept of more labourers: any additional influx of labour might be only compensating for increased demand or failing to do so meaning supply and wages are increasing at the same time, or it might only be an aspect of native labour moving around as well. Even if an influx is slowing an increase in the price of labour I feel that is a satisfactory trade off because of solidarity. Capitalists drive wages down, it is the role and duty of socialists to illustrate that it is their constant motivation that impoverished the working classes, not their methods of the moment. comedyblissoption posted:in a sane economic system, a bunch of immigrating workers wanting to generate wealth for your society would be an unequivocal good. capitalism is not sane. Yes. We should end capitalism and move towards a better system. What does that have to do with your earlier post about labour?
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Sep 24, 2017 02:44
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Went to a Science for the People event in New York today. A lot of sharp, interesting people involved but still really clearly a young org. Huge overlap with ISO and SWP which I'm not a huge fan of but what can you do.
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Sep 24, 2017 03:26
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