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Hey my name's Shinji and my life sucks, thanks.
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Apr 12, 2018 22:20
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| # ? May 26, 2024 11:15 |
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Something awful forums > ADTRW > Makes a lot of sense but is also stupid. The Neon Genesis Evangelion thread!
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Apr 12, 2018 22:59
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Monaghan posted:Yeah I couldn't get passed how everyone got pissed at Shinji when you have Misato yelling in the background of 2.22 "gently caress Yeah Shinji! Do this because you want to!" Its almost like the characters of evangelion are not rational actors and their failures consistently revolve around reacting to their immediate emotional urges in unhealthy ways, or something.
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Apr 13, 2018 00:43
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They are not rational actors is the laziest hand wave.
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Apr 13, 2018 00:53
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It really isn't when a major part of literally every form of Evangelion is that the characters are hosed up individuals who make frequent bad decisions because of their own emotional and personal hangups. Like even in original Evangelion 95% of the plot could have been much more simply resolved in literally everyone wasn't making terrible decisions because of their trauma, their sex drive, their personal hangups, or some combination of the three. 3.33 puts Shinji into a world with people who've been living in a lovely apocalypse for years and those people weren't exactly dealing well when they were living in a moderately crap apocalypse for years. Edit: Like people point to "Misato says one thing in a heated emotional moment and then does another when she's supposed to be doing her job" as a flaw in the storytelling and not Literally Misato's Character In A Nutshell. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 00:57 on Apr 13, 2018 |
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Apr 13, 2018 00:53
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CharlestheHammer posted:They are not rational actors is the laziest hand wave. Why is it a lazy hand wave? The guy is saying "these people act dumb", and the answer is "yes, they are dumb (for reasons related to their emotional health)".
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Apr 13, 2018 00:55
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Yes it’s true but that doesn’t really have to do with the first part of three. They only act that way because it’s what the plot demands. Really in general three is a loving mess that feels incredibly rushed which makes sense as it has a lot it needs to do. I could maybe see the “rational actors” defense if we ever got to see their reasoning or their POV at all but it’s easier to handwave it away by intentionally not revealing anything. Leaving their motivation vague.
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Apr 13, 2018 00:57
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CharlestheHammer posted:Yes it’s true but that doesn’t really have to do with the first part of three. It absolutely does though. The vast majority of the cast in 3.0 are new characters who are living in a horrifying hellworld that is at least partially Shinji's fault, accident or no. The kid caused an apocalypse and "it was an accident" isn't really an explanation most people are going to take for a kid they don't even know. The returning cast members are Misato (who is intentionally walling herself off to try to do her job, which is again Misato's character in a nutshell), Ritsuko (who is loving Ritsuko), Asuka (who is loving Asuka) and Toji's sister who is basically the nicest person to him. Nobody sits down and talks to Shinji because they're either emotionally distancing themselves or are super pissed off or they're being literally attacked by robo-angels. Nobody explains poo poo to Shinji in the original show either you'll notice, it's just Shinji's in a vaugly more comfortable situation and when he discovers the big secrets they're just as traumatic to him. Like the only time anyone explains poo poo to Shinji in the original is when they're trying to gently caress someone else over.
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Apr 13, 2018 01:01
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Raxivace posted:Shinji caused Third Impact at the end of 2.22, which killed off humanity. They tell you that in 3.0 many, many times. Its why everybody is mad at him. The characters say it suspiciously often - and the mess we see in 3.33 looks way worse than what Shinji caused at the end of 2.22. In fact I'm wondering if there's maybe a little more to this whole story...
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Apr 13, 2018 01:06
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I actually don’t have a problem with explaining poo poo to him and think it alone could work as Shinjis motivation to do what he does but outside of Asuka I absolutely do not buy that for any of the returning characters would act the way they do outside validating what shinji does.
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Apr 13, 2018 01:07
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I think a lot of this could have been smoothed over if the opening battle was cut in like half.
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Apr 13, 2018 01:07
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BiggestOrangeTree posted:The characters say it suspiciously often - and the mess we see in 3.33 looks way worse than what Shinji caused at the end of 2.22. In fact I'm wondering if there's maybe a little more to this whole story... That's the thing. 3rd Impact was stopped. There's a post credit scene in which Kaworu stops Shinji. Scyantific posted:Well 14 years did pass by, plenty of time to realize that maybe it wasn't the best idea at the time. Then you have Misato and company actively opposing NERV, probably because they actually figured out what the real endgame was. The mark 4b "Angels" they fight in the opening sequence are a clear indicator of this. Everyone knows the final boss is the toughest. 
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Apr 13, 2018 11:20
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Ak Gara posted:That's the thing. 3rd Impact was stopped. There's a post credit scene in which Kaworu stops Shinji. ...and what we see in 3.33 is the aftermath of an entirely different incident (or multiple). Giant mouth in the landscape, giant Rei head, headless Lilith with two lances in the back, Eva Mk 6 with an angel trapped inside, the failures of infinity...
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Apr 13, 2018 14:21
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3.33 is such a beautiful movie. Where the flip is final
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Apr 13, 2018 14:23
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Ak Gara posted:That's the thing. 3rd Impact was stopped. There's a post credit scene in which Kaworu stops Shinji. The dialogue in 3.33 implies that 3rd impact was somehow restarted using the Mark 06 as a conduit instead of (or even maybe alongside) Unit-01.
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Apr 13, 2018 14:35
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Rebuild being a sequel and the time looping stuff isn't really concrete yet. I'm still of the opinion it's all kinda meta rather than in-universe.
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Apr 13, 2018 14:56
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The entire film makes a lot more sense if you view the setting and everyone in it as the kind of hell/punishment that Shinji would design for himself after being absorbed into Unit-01 following an averted Third Impact.
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Apr 13, 2018 15:36
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One thing I noticed in 3.33, when they get Shinji out of Unit-01 they give him a designation with a number. It was probably to dehumanize him, but they also didn't seem certain that he actually was Shinji, and with the number they knew because they'd already gotten things that weren't Shinji. So what in the hell did they manage to pull out of Unit-01? Fake Shinjis? Reis? hosed up angel monster things?
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Apr 13, 2018 22:11
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ImpAtom posted:It absolutely does though. There’s head people at nerv, I would get not telling Shinji anything. They are bastards and I can completely get them loving Shinji over and keeping him in the dark to advance their own ends. I admit, I haven’t watched the original show in over a decade, but from what I remember a key difference is the two shows is that, Misato, Asuka and the rest of the NERV crew also don’t know what’s going on. Misato knows angels are attacking, if they reach central dogma, they all die. She tells the pilots this. She’s investigating things as the series goes on. She doesn’t really get the whole truth into end of eva, in which poo poo’s now going on to high gear. The people are involved are rational enough to go- hey here’s what’s going on and why you can’t pilot an eva, rather than just sticking a loving collar bomb on him. Maybe 3.00 just pisses me off because the character growth and changes that happened in the first two movies might as well have been thrown in the goddamn dumpster, since it had zero effect on the story. The fact that there are seriously people speculating about time loops and all this other bullshit shows just what a mess the production of these movies has been. Monaghan fucked around with this message at 22:49 on Apr 13, 2018 |
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Apr 13, 2018 22:26
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BiggestOrangeTree posted:The characters say it suspiciously often - and the mess we see in 3.33 looks way worse than what Shinji caused at the end of 2.22. In fact I'm wondering if there's maybe a little more to this whole story...
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Apr 14, 2018 02:40
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I thought the first two flowed well enough, it isn’t really until the third when it feels like it decided to do something different Ironically three could probably work better as a stand alone film. It still would feel a bit rushed with some info missing but that is consistent either way.
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Apr 14, 2018 03:18
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Relin posted:the story is that the films are inconsistent. the vast difference in what is previewed at the end of each and the final product are sufficient evidence of that This is the first time I've heard of this particular interpretation and I'm already not a big fan of it. Why even bother discussing it at that point?
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Apr 14, 2018 04:50
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That’s not what interpretation means.
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Apr 14, 2018 04:52
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3.0 is the only worth-watching Rebuild because it's the only one that's different, Mari is a non-character so her inclusion in 2.0 doesn't really do anything for the story or w/e and aside from her it's just a polished retelling of the first half of the series 3.0 is good
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Apr 14, 2018 06:49
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I think the climax of 2.0 is one of the best things I've ever seen on film. 
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Apr 14, 2018 07:44
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Szmitten posted:Rebuild being a sequel and the time looping stuff isn't really concrete yet. I'm still of the opinion it's all kinda meta rather than in-universe. e: Or he's trying to pull a George RR Martin scam and stall long enough he dies of old age before he has to write the end of his series.
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Apr 14, 2018 11:42
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RealFoxy posted:Anno hates people, and especially his fans so I'm waiting for the reveal that his Godzilla was actually 4.0 I wish this misconception would die
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Apr 14, 2018 13:12
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The Rebuild movies were becoming something different every movie. The first movie was basically a one to one retelling. In the second one things started to diverge from the original series. Then the third movie comes along and goes way too hard in a different direction. If we had gotten another movie between the second one and the third one that made the transition smoother it would have worked much better.
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Apr 14, 2018 13:17
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I'm going to wait until it's done to start watching the Rebuilds. Do we know when that will be?
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Apr 14, 2018 15:26
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Agronox posted:I'm going to wait until it's done to start watching the Rebuilds. Probably never, and tbh you're better off.
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Apr 14, 2018 15:49
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Agronox posted:I'm going to wait until it's done to start watching the Rebuilds. The year 42069
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Apr 14, 2018 16:10
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Okay I'll watch whatever's out on my deathbed. As Anno intended
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Apr 14, 2018 16:33
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Paracelsus posted:I think the climax of 2.0 is one of the best things I've ever seen on film.
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Apr 15, 2018 08:00
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Ethiser posted:The Rebuild movies were becoming something different every movie. The first movie was basically a one to one retelling. In the second one things started to diverge from the original series. Then the third movie comes along and goes way too hard in a different direction. If we had gotten another movie between the second one and the third one that made the transition smoother it would have worked much better.
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Apr 15, 2018 10:10
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Agronox posted:I'm going to wait until it's done to start watching the Rebuilds.
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Apr 15, 2018 13:33
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Nessus posted:Well there is the whole Kishotenketsu concept which might come into play in a four-part Japanese film series. The films are also numbered like a Noh play(Jo-Ha-Kyuu), though I think they dropped the actual concept during the production of the second movie.
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Apr 15, 2018 13:39
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impossible, anno is a genius mastermind with a well thought out plan for all the films ahead of time
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Apr 15, 2018 22:05
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I really hated both 3.0 and the Last Jedi for similar reasons: They both
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Apr 15, 2018 23:54
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Luke was awesome, is the difference.
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Apr 16, 2018 00:06
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Were people really watching EVA all this time for the whatever plot about robots fighting monsters all this time and not the characters? That seems crazy to me. It's been a while since I saw 2.0 but I remember it being fairly different in the ways that mattered, even if the same story was there. Anyways I don't know how anyone can watch the piano scene in 3.0 and not like the movie.
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Apr 16, 2018 01:12
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