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We used to allow respecs on level up but it's been loosened a bit (not that we abuse it). I think I fiddled around with my Triforce several times for the first few scenarios but haven't done anything for my Two Minis.
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Jul 3, 2018 14:55
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My group allows free respeccing, but I don't think we've done all that much with it. We occasionally swap out a card after trying it for a scenario if it doesn't really pan out, and our Two Minis completely redid his deck after not liking how his first build played.
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Jul 3, 2018 15:51
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Been playing this for a few months and I am sad to say I am retiring my Spellweaver. Just right after adding a hex to coldfire too! If you ever get a chance to play SW with a mindthief, it's crazy fun. Now I get to try out Sun along with 2 other simultaneous retires. Party is now Brute, Sun, Music, Ubisoft.
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Jul 3, 2018 15:52
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Sun and Music Note have some disgusting synergy.
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Jul 3, 2018 17:26
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I think unlimited respects are fine. Our group does it. Most level up cards are not situational, so when you are trying to customize to an encounter, it's mostly your level 1/X cards you are swapping. Eg. (Two-mini spoilers and scenario 38 spoilers) We just did the "escort the orchid" mission where the dumb orchid runs ahead opening all the traps and generally being an idiot. So we got the Beast Tyrant to bring the "swap any 2 minis" card that he normally doesn't bring anymore. When the idiot was about to open the door, the rat just swapped places with him to send him back to the start and buy us like 3 extra turns.
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Jul 3, 2018 17:55
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Some Numbers posted:Sun and Music Note have some disgusting synergy. Music Note looks disgustingly good in general.
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Jul 3, 2018 18:37
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Something else I've been wondering that came to mind when I saw you guys saying oozes suck. I haven't noticed, from spoiler-free Gloomhaven chat at least, any complains about scenario design. That's boggling. Every other dungeon crawler I've seen has scenario design that's all over the place with frequent cakewalks paired against utter piles of massive bullshit. With those opinions reversed depending on who you are in adversarial dungeon crawlers of course! Are the scenarios just that eye-widening good in this game or are the complaints about bullshit hidden under spoiler bars?
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Jul 3, 2018 18:51
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xiw posted:It's a completely fine house rule. Yup, this is one of our two major house rules - respeccing is OK if it's limited (maybe once per level would be fine), including perks; and buying your character's solo scenario item is fine, as we're not set up to do solo scenarios, like at all.
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Jul 3, 2018 18:52
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My group's had some complaints about specific scenarios, but most of them are surprisingly well designed. Most of the poorly designed scenarios are guest scenarios and/or side scenarios (>51).
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Jul 3, 2018 18:53
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The scenarios are really well designed for groups of 3-4. Sometimes not that well for groups of 2. We've only had one boss that we thought mechanically was very very rng and kinda bullshit.
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Jul 3, 2018 19:00
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xiw posted:It's a completely fine house rule. This is technically still a house rule, but there's no reason you couldn't play a scenario or two with the level 1 + X cards on your new character to get used to it before you actually picked your higher level cards. As long as you don't actually play any of the higher level cards, I can't see anyone who isn't an absolutely insufferable rules lawyer objecting to you delaying your choice of which cards to pick. Another house rule I've seen suggested is to allow players to donate to the Sanctuary to respec one card choice instead of receiving Blesses for the next scenario. This provides both an actual (if small for most characters) cost to the respec and limits the rate at which you can do it, which seems like a nice relatively elegant solution to me.
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Jul 3, 2018 19:53
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Some Numbers posted:Sun and Music Note have some disgusting synergy. Gort posted:Music Note looks disgustingly good in general. Both correct. SuperKlaus posted:Something else I've been wondering that came to mind when I saw you guys saying oozes suck. I haven't noticed, from spoiler-free Gloomhaven chat at least, any complains about scenario design. That's boggling. Every other dungeon crawler I've seen has scenario design that's all over the place with frequent cakewalks paired against utter piles of massive bullshit. With those opinions reversed depending on who you are in adversarial dungeon crawlers of course! There have been complaints about one specific guest scenario designer a couple times upthread, but I haven't tried out the scenarios in question and I don't remember which ones they were from the spoilerfree part of the complaints. He's only done a few sidequests.
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Jul 3, 2018 20:20
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Yeah but he's the main designer of the expansion. Funny that he's the only one people complain about but Isaac still picked him. With how good the base game is, I'm assuming Isaac in all his wisdom must see a lot of potential in the new expansion stuff as opposed to the annoying mechanics people don't like.
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Jul 3, 2018 20:25
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Welp, won my solo scenario for my retirement goal~~~
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Jul 3, 2018 20:31
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KingKapalone posted:Yeah but he's the main designer of the expansion. Funny that he's the only one people complain about but Isaac still picked him. With how good the base game is, I'm assuming Isaac in all his wisdom must see a lot of potential in the new expansion stuff as opposed to the annoying mechanics people don't like. Based on what we have seen of the class so far and the info given out about the scenarios, it looks like the expac is going to be poo poo so
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Jul 3, 2018 20:33
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:There have been complaints about one specific guest scenario designer a couple times upthread, but I haven't tried out the scenarios in question and I don't remember which ones they were from the spoilerfree part of the complaints. He's only done a few sidequests. My group hasn't had complaints about scenarios and several people specifically said how they liked several of the scenarios from said guest designer. I suspect some group's playstyles clash with them. The scenario design overall seems to be pretty robust and I've seen multiple scenarios that went from "how can we possibly manage this one" to a decisive victory, as well as a few "just barely won at the last second."
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Jul 3, 2018 21:35
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Playing solo on TTS is pretty fun but it's really slow just because of how long it takes to move stuff around. Edit:. Oh and it turns out I'm illiterate or something because I was setting up scenario 1 incorrectly for 2 characters. I had another elite guard in the 2nd room. I managed to beat it twice with 2 different pairings so at least I don't suck at the game as much as I thought. Elephant Ambush fucked around with this message at 22:42 on Jul 3, 2018 |
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Jul 3, 2018 22:32
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WCL posted:Been playing this for a few months and I am sad to say I am retiring my Spellweaver. Just right after adding a hex to coldfire too! We've just started playing and done the first scenario as Cragheart, Spellweaver and me as the Mindthief. Mind going into some more detail as to why, am guessing it's the ease of generating frost but wasn't sure if there's anything else I should be looking to do?
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Jul 3, 2018 22:49
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PST posted:We've just started playing and done the first scenario as Cragheart, Spellweaver and me as the Mindthief. Mind going into some more detail as to why, am guessing it's the ease of generating frost but wasn't sure if there's anything else I should be looking to do? Yeah the frost. The SW used mine a lot. Getting stuns off though as MT probably helps control the positions of the enemy enough too though where the SW can move to a spot to maximize targets for things.
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Jul 3, 2018 22:54
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Not sure I like this game at 3p. 2p is really nice without tons of AP. I'm playing as a new Scoundrel and never feel like I can take advantage of her plus attack cards.
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Jul 3, 2018 23:55
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PST posted:We've just started playing and done the first scenario as Cragheart, Spellweaver and me as the Mindthief. Mind going into some more detail as to why, am guessing it's the ease of generating frost but wasn't sure if there's anything else I should be looking to do? 100% the frequent cold generation. I usually like to avoid spoiling too much as surprises/ new cards are half the fun in the game. You can spit hot fire but cold generation is scarce aside from +2 cold modifiers. Mindthief makes your class strengths run smoothly.
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Jul 4, 2018 00:02
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ShaneB posted:Not sure I like this game at 3p. 2p is really nice without tons of AP. I'm playing as a new Scoundrel and never feel like I can take advantage of her plus attack cards. the scoundrel pull card is really good for setting that up for you and helps with 3-4 players.
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Jul 4, 2018 00:34
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And every solo scenario I've done has been at least good, with the Triforce one being one of my favourite ones in the entire game.SuperKlaus posted:Something else I've been wondering that came to mind when I saw you guys saying oozes suck. I haven't noticed, from spoiler-free Gloomhaven chat at least, any complains about scenario design. That's boggling. Every other dungeon crawler I've seen has scenario design that's all over the place with frequent cakewalks paired against utter piles of massive bullshit. With those opinions reversed depending on who you are in adversarial dungeon crawlers of course! There are two scenarios potentially early on in the campaign (11/12)that are loving garbage and I will never play them again. They're built on a potentially neat concept that doesn't work in practice. I get why people who are masochists like them but they are wrong. One of the side scenarios (81) is basically unplayable as a certain class (Triforce, unless you are 7+) because it hard counters your main mechanic. There were initially some issues with scenarios that require you to use a loot action. They've (mostly) been fixed in the 2nd printing by adding in some loot actions and letting you substitute a bottom action for certain scenarios. Scenarios with random summons can have a huge variance in difficulty, which is something people find out very early. A few others have minor balance issues or rules oversights that require, and if you're going to have "reveal all rooms and kill all enemies " as a goal don't have an empty room unless the aim is to be a dick.
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Jul 4, 2018 02:15
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Man, my group had the exactly opposite reaction that you did. We loved that story scenario and I played that exact side scenario with that exact class and it was hard, but totally doable.
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Jul 4, 2018 02:41
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Our group did a lot of side scenarios relatively early with certain mechanics and now that we're running into those same mechanics in the main scenarios, they're actually a lot easier to deal with and make those scenarios trivial. So I think most of the side scenarios are supposed to be Steamed Hams but it's tuned to be more difficult. Except Rob Daviau's scenarios, gently caress that guy
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Jul 4, 2018 02:54
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Some Numbers posted:Man, my group had the exactly opposite reaction that you did. We loved that story scenario and I played that exact side scenario with that exact class and it was hard, but totally doable. The story scenario is garbage because the less you stick around and fight the easier the scenario gets (because you hit the spawn limit), but that also makes the massive amount of admin completely pointless. admittedly I only did 12, and 11 doesn't have quite as many problems, like a group of melee enemies who are trapped in an area away from the players. As for the side scenario playing an element reliant class in a situation where you will never have any elements is utter poo poo.
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Jul 4, 2018 02:59
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Doctor Spaceman posted:There are two scenarios potentially early on in the campaign (11/12)that are loving garbage and I will never play them again. They're built on a potentially neat concept that doesn't work in practice. I get why people who are masochists like them but they are wrong. We skipped scenario 3 and thus never played the first set of two scenarios. And we just played the last one mentioned above, but with characters who had no problem or an advantage (Sun, Circles, Cthulhu). But I am playing Triforce right now and I'd find that scenario an interesting challenge. Approach would depend heavily on how the other characters are equipped and what they play. The element change happens at the start of every turn, so any element someone else puts out is usable if you go later in the round. You could focus on going slowly and using those elements provided. Alternately, Formless Power plus a low init card allows you to consume both Light and Dark to deny it to the enemies, though the fast boss special cards will almost always beat you. (Infernal Vortex and Primal Duality can beat one of them.) Personally, the only scenario that seemed ill-conceived that we've seen so far was in the Seeker line, 54, the final of the three. With no spawning or other mechanic in the final room, the other characters have relatively little to do and if the questing character doesn't have much damage-dealing, it can take a long time to grind out a victory. Aside from making himself a target, our Brute had nothing much to do while my Saw-class Seeker gradually worked his way to winning. Characters with more healing or with disarm/stun might have had more to do, though. That isn't to say that you can't have frustrating experiences in other scenarios, either. There's so much variation in terms of who comes with which characters and cards and items that people could have wildly divergent experiences. I suspect the biggest X-factor is random item designs, some of which are game-changers for specific classes.
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Jul 4, 2018 18:52
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ShaneB posted:Not sure I like this game at 3p. 2p is really nice without tons of AP. I'm playing as a new Scoundrel and never feel like I can take advantage of her plus attack cards. Yeah, I'm not sure how I feel about the flow of 3p exactly as compared to 2p, but I do think that for a 3p party that class combo was probably the worst we could've come up with out of gate as far as synergy. We talked about it for a while after you left yesterday, and I think any two of those plus literally any of the other starting classes would've been better. Just tripping over each other too often, since we were all built to fill essentially the same role and acting at similar speeds.
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Jul 4, 2018 21:16
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Narsham posted:That isn't to say that you can't have frustrating experiences in other scenarios, either. There's so much variation in terms of who comes with which characters and cards and items that people could have wildly divergent experiences. I suspect the biggest X-factor is random item designs, some of which are game-changers for specific classes. Yeah. There have been a couple random/event-based items that have been instrumental to both our Scoundrel and our Music Note. I know I've been playing far more recklessly and spent more time on the frontline than any guides suggest in part because of items that they may never have had access to.
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Jul 4, 2018 22:40
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I think I hate Night Demons more than oozes now. Why the gently caress do they have an initiative 4 card? Why can any enemy go that fast? Edit: And the disadvantage thing is poo poo trash rear end dicks too. gently caress. Elephant Ambush fucked around with this message at 01:08 on Jul 5, 2018 |
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Jul 5, 2018 00:54
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Elephant Ambush posted:I think I hate Night Demons more than oozes now. Why the gently caress do they have an initiative 4 card? Why can any enemy go that fast? It makes an element so it isn't that big of a deal. What really pisses me off about them is their initiative 7 card. Unless you've already seen it come up since the last shuffle you need to plan around any darkness created last turn being gone by 7. And you really don't want them to turn invisible, it makes disadvantage look trivial in comparison. Edit: But once you've fought them you can play around their gimmick. Hopefully you have ways to quickly consume darkness.
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Jul 5, 2018 01:10
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Just retired my first character, a Scoundrel and unlocked phoenix beast tamer. Gloomhaven is prosperity level 2 so my new character will start at level 2 with 2 perks unlocked and 30 gold, right? I'm not sure if I want to play the beast tamer though. I really liked how stabby the scoundrel was with being able to regularly do strength 5 attacks and up to strength 9 if I set everything up right. Should I give the phoenix a chance or will I probably be happier with spellweaver or cragheart? Those are the other two classes that seem interesting right now. Party is Mindthief, Brute, and Tinkerer. Tinkerer rocks, but the Mindthief plays very cautiously so isn't bringing the stab like my Scoundrel was.
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Jul 5, 2018 02:15
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KPC_Mammon posted:It makes an element so it isn't that big of a deal. It is a big deal because they bum rushed us when we were not prepared and hurt us really bad. All 3 of them moved 3 or 4 and hit for 4 or 5. On 4. gently caress. That. Oh and none of us use that element. And the oozes in that room split twice in a row and we pretty much lost this scenario because of that and other bad RNG. My deck has 5 blessings in it and I keep drawing my 1 miss. I drew it 4 times so far. This is horse poo poo.
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Jul 5, 2018 02:16
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LLSix posted:Just retired my first character, a Scoundrel and unlocked phoenix beast tamer. Gloomhaven is prosperity level 2 so my new character will start at level 2 with 2 perks unlocked and 30 gold, right? I'm not sure if I want to play the beast tamer though. I really liked how stabby the scoundrel was with being able to regularly do strength 5 attacks and up to strength 9 if I set everything up right. Should I give the phoenix a chance or will I probably be happier with spellweaver or cragheart? Those are the other two classes that seem interesting right now.
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Jul 5, 2018 02:36
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Elephant Ambush posted:It is a big deal because they bum rushed us when we were not prepared and hurt us really bad. All 3 of them moved 3 or 4 and hit for 4 or 5. On 4. gently caress. That. I still think the 7 is worse. It has the potential to ruin your turn plus prevent you from even fighting back. I don't like the miss. Because you reshuffle at the end of every turn you draw it single target characters can end up incredibly swingy and draw it every loving turn. The only counter is advantage, and that won't even work when you have rolling modifiers in the deck. The game is far from perfect but it is also far better than the competition. This is a genre where I've seen people instantly die with their very first die roll. Still, I'm at the point where the warts plus my garbage class (triforce) has me way less motivated to organize my group to get together and play.
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Jul 5, 2018 02:39
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LLSix posted:Just retired my first character, a Scoundrel and unlocked phoenix beast tamer. Gloomhaven is prosperity level 2 so my new character will start at level 2 with 2 perks unlocked and 30 gold, right? I'm not sure if I want to play the beast tamer though. I really liked how stabby the scoundrel was with being able to regularly do strength 5 attacks and up to strength 9 if I set everything up right. Should I give the phoenix a chance or will I probably be happier with spellweaver or cragheart? Those are the other two classes that seem interesting right now. Give phoenix a chance. (Two minis spoilers) This class can do tons of damage. The build on Reddit uses just the bear and does lots of damage. But if you also run the falcon and wolf summons, you will be doing substantially more damage per turn than a scoundrel as long as you can manipulate your initiative and positioning to keep your flimsier summons alive. We're talking an average of 2 attack from each of the bear, wolf, and falcon before you play any cards, and your cards can typically command the bear to do 3 or 4 damage. The total is like an average dpr of 9 or 10 as long as you can keep all your summons alive and in range. (Which can be challenging. The bird moves 4 and flies, but nearly always dies in 1 hit, so you have to try put it in a spot where the monsters will attack your bear or an ally over it. Multi-attackers will ruin your day because they'll hit your allies and your bird and just kill it. The Wolf can survive a light hit, but only moves 3 on the ground, so the challenge is keeping it in range as well as making sure it doesn't get hit too hard. Tanky allies with fast initiative are a huge boon if you run summons.)
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Jul 5, 2018 02:40
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KPC_Mammon posted:What really pisses me off about them is their initiative 7 card. Unless you've already seen it come up since the last shuffle you need to plan around any darkness created last turn being gone by 7. And you really don't want them to turn invisible, it makes disadvantage look trivial in comparison. Yeah these fuckers and this card has produced more depressed moments as everyone at the table says 'well ... i do nothing this turn, and next turn is probably ruined too' than anything else so far.
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Jul 5, 2018 03:22
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The trick is to go slow the next turn - at that point they'll be no-longer-invisible and you can attack them. In general though any time there's Shadow up you should be thinking about them possibly hitting that card - so either try to get in earlier than them with someone who can consume it (item spoilers: both the boots that change your initiative and the circlet of elements can help with that, depending on which half you're having trouble with), or play cards that will still be useful even if they do flip it (e.g. "my main plan is to move here and attack this guy, but if that doesn't work I'll grab this coin and give someone a heal")
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Jul 5, 2018 04:02
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Jimbozig posted:We're talking an average of 2 attack from each of the bear, wolf, and falcon before you play any cards, and your cards can typically command the bear to do 3 or 4 damage. The total is like an average dpr of 9 or 10 as long as you can keep all your summons alive and in range. (Which can be challenging. The bird moves 4 and flies, but nearly always dies in 1 hit, so you have to try put it in a spot where the monsters will attack your bear or an ally over it. (Two-Minis Spoilers) It feels like you're doing way too much work here. The bear build can get 10 dpr trivially easily: take the '+3 damage on attacks if I give up my top action' sustain, bear moves and attacks for 2+3, you use your bottom action to tell the bear to attack for 2+3. 10 damage a round right out the gate - and this gets even more ridiculous when you start getting the cards that tell your bear to attack multiple times. Way less juggling than trying to manage 3 summons.
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Jul 5, 2018 04:04
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The good news is that despite us wiping on scenario 26, 2 of us got just enough regular xp to level up. My Mindthief is level 6 now and HOLY gently caress are both of these level 6 cards insane. I picked the better move one. Cannot wait until level 7. My perk was adding 2 rolling +1s. It's the only thing that makes sense with my damage build. I also got the chest on that scenario and that's a sweet item for me. Just to double check, you still get to keep chest items even if you all wipe, right?
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Jul 5, 2018 04:37
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