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Usopp is the weakest straw hat but I think he has the best moments. Punching the butler. Being the most depressed man ever. That fight with Luffy. Everything sogeking Being a God Taking out that I've only seen stampede but the part where his greens activate on the robot. Getting Buff but still being sorta a coward after the timeskip Being part of a combination pirate robot thing. That episode with Daddy I don't care if it's filler. I feel like I am missing a few. Oh and he has the most heartbreaking scene in the series when he tries to tell the little girl whose dad just died that his snake oil doesn't really work I'm hoping that last sad part really somehow comes around for him in this arc in some way.
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Apr 18, 2020 18:35
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| # ? Jun 12, 2024 05:34 |
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That scene in Stampede was so good Also let it be known that while I do not know every name on that tier list thing I do remember every character and shame on that one guy who forgot Kalgara
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Apr 18, 2020 18:38
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Philosopher King posted:That fight with Luffy. still my favorite part in the series
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Apr 18, 2020 21:31
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CodfishCartographer posted:The only honest tier list Where's Pandaman?
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Apr 18, 2020 23:45
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Tir McDohl posted:I'm rereading One Piece from the beginning and am about to get to the big fights in the Arlong arc. This really is where the formula that we know and love started. That scene where Luffy gives Nami his hat and then the next couple of pages with Zoro, Sanji and Usopp readying up to fight for their friend is giving me chills. Really holds up. It really is one of the best scenes in the manga. Close 2nd to I WANNA LIVE.
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Apr 19, 2020 02:16
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Tir McDohl posted:I'm rereading One Piece from the beginning and am about to get to the big fights in the Arlong arc. This really is where the formula that we know and love started. That scene where Luffy gives Nami his hat and then the next couple of pages with Zoro, Sanji and Usopp readying up to fight for their friend is giving me chills. Really holds up. I did this last year, and highly recommend a re-read. With few exceptions, everything really does hold up, and if anything you get a lot of fun preview's of the poo poo to come. I'd completely forgotten that Dragon saved the Strawhats from Smoker, and small interlude stories like that.
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Apr 19, 2020 02:32
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I completely forgot that Luffy almost picked up a whole drat ship early on when he was hypnotised by jango.
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Apr 19, 2020 02:55
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Planning on re-reading from Little Garden onwards. Finally going to read the official instead of those disaster scans.
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Apr 19, 2020 03:26
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Philosopher King posted:I read the manga now but the early one piece episodes did some playing with the idea of the whole punch cutaway sound effect guys on the ground combo that you see when they don't want to trigger censors but kinda quickly moved away from it. I'm not sure what this is referring to.  Do you have a video clip as an example you could show that highlights this?Begemot posted:I vaguely remember him saying in SBS one time that he originally planned to end the series after Crocodile. Like, Baroque Works was gonna be the big final enemy, but it just didn't work out that way. Sometimes Oda plans stuff out years advance, sometimes he backfills connections, sometimes he just makes up new stuff and adds it in, and it's all fine!! I remember it as Oda saying he already had the Yonkou mapped out and that it would have been a lot quicker going from Grand Line to facing the Yonkou, but he kept filling out details in between like the Shichibukai that kept delaying things out more and more.
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Apr 19, 2020 10:07
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The best Usopp scene is in Nebulandia where he straight up snipes a bullet out of thin air like it ain't no thing.
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Apr 19, 2020 13:27
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Teriyaki Koinku posted:I remember it as Oda saying he already had the Yonkou mapped out and that it would have been a lot quicker going from Grand Line to facing the Yonkou, but he kept filling out details in between like the Shichibukai that kept delaying things out more and more. Yeah I think that's probably because the Yonkou are more integral to the main plot line while the Shichibukai are just supplementary to the main plot.
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Apr 19, 2020 13:46
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Teriyaki Koinku posted:I remember it as Oda saying he already had the Yonkou mapped out and that it would have been a lot quicker going from Grand Line to facing the Yonkou, but he kept filling out details in between like the Shichibukai that kept delaying things out more and more. I also heard this and that adding the Warlords also caused the power level scaling to rise way higher.
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Apr 19, 2020 20:22
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Because OP is the type of shonen where the cast gets stronger as it continues The power scaling was always going to be hosed since the longer the series goes the higher the ceiling must be pushed so it can appear to remain high.
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Apr 19, 2020 21:34
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Rigged Death Trap posted:Because OP is the type of shonen where the cast gets stronger as it continues The power scaling was always going to be hosed since the longer the series goes the higher the ceiling must be pushed so it can appear to remain high. On re-reading the series, I think Oda's actually done a really good job making the scale not terribly ridiculous. To contrast it to DBZ, for example, in that case the new power was always just: pain -> scream louder -> get a new hair color and become faster/stronger than the enemy. Emotionally satisfying, but it's kind of hand waved away why they're suddenly that much faster/stronger. With One Piece most of the power ups have been fairly consistent, slowly gained, and previewed in pretty clever ways. How many chapters was it between when Zorro can cut boats apart and when we saw Mihawk do it. Or Luffy learning to expand Haki and Silvers doing so to remove the mermaid collars. Upgrades have been pretty gradual (Nami just got the cloud boy for example), and usually explained via the plot. It's part of what makes this series so good!
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Apr 19, 2020 23:04
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Yeah, Mihawk was an early sign of where we'd be going, but somehow the series held off on that kind of power for a good while. Oda has the patience of a saint.
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Apr 19, 2020 23:21
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As a counterpoint: Enies Lobby is every single member of the crew gaining a new powerup out of nowhere with at most one line of explanation.
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Apr 19, 2020 23:25
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Ryaomon posted:As a counterpoint: Enies Lobby is every single member of the crew gaining a new powerup out of nowhere with at most one line of explanation. yeah turns out 'i just trained really hard and got better' is enough of an explanation for most shonen readers
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Apr 19, 2020 23:28
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Ryaomon posted:As a counterpoint: Enies Lobby is every single member of the crew gaining a new powerup out of nowhere with at most one line of explanation. Eh, training offscreen is better than just developing a new powerup in the middle of a fight.
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Apr 19, 2020 23:29
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Or just using "the power of friendship", the laziest kind of power up.
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Apr 19, 2020 23:30
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Ryaomon posted:As a counterpoint: Enies Lobby is every single member of the crew gaining a new powerup out of nowhere with at most one line of explanation. Yeah, Asura and Diable Jambe kind of come out of nowhere. Diable Jambe you could rationalize as an extension of Sanji’s past comments about fire not being able to hurt a true chef or something like that and Wanze (IIRC) demonstrating something similar, but I don’t think we ever actually get an explanation of Asura.
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Apr 19, 2020 23:50
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Silver2195 posted:Yeah, Asura and Diable Jambe kind of come out of nowhere. Diable Jambe you could rationalize as an extension of Sanji’s past comments about fire not being able to hurt a true chef or something like that and Wanze (IIRC) demonstrating something similar, but I don’t think we ever actually get an explanation of Asura. Diable Jambe also now has a connection to the way the Vinsmoke Brothers have odd elemental powers without having fruits either, so I wonder if that was roughly when the full nature of the Vinsmokes was first conceptualised.
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Apr 20, 2020 00:22
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Lord_Magmar posted:Diable Jambe also now has a connection to the way the Vinsmoke Brothers have odd elemental powers without having fruits either, so I wonder if that was roughly when the full nature of the Vinsmokes was first conceptualised. Wasn’t it said Sanji is just a normal human and has no powers?
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Apr 20, 2020 00:29
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RatHat posted:Wasn’t it said Sanji is just a normal human and has no powers? yes, it specifically undermined the annoying thing shonen likes to do where the good guy is actually just special because of their genetics. whatever gene therapy poo poo that made the vinsmoke boys powerful sociopaths failed on sanji, so any power he has is because of himself
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Apr 20, 2020 00:34
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RatHat posted:Wasn’t it said Sanji is just a normal human and has no powers? I thought it was that he was a failure and his powers weren’t activating. He still had the same genetic engineering as the others for the most part. Brother Entropy posted:yes, it specifically undermined the annoying thing shonen likes to do where the good guy is actually just special because of their genetics. whatever gene therapy poo poo that made the vinsmoke boys powerful sociopaths failed on sanji, so any power he has is because of himself But this is also true, I was just considering it an interesting thing not a guaranteed connection. If anything I could see it being that Sanji naturally unlocked what Judge was trying to artificially create. Or no connection at all.
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Apr 20, 2020 00:34
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I always thought gear second and third were kind of rear end-pulls tbh. We never see the thing that inspires Luffy to try them out, and we don't see him practicing them, or anything like that. We just get to Water 7 and suddenly he can do that now and are told "Luffy trained to do this in his spare time, trust us" without even an explanation of when he did so. Was it after landing from skypeia? If so, why didn't he use it against Aokiji when they fought on the long Island? They went straight to water 7 after that, did he train during that travel time? If so, it didn't feel like a very long period, was there a minor time skip? Etc. Like, most other power-ups are given an explanation that makes sense - there was a two-year time skip, or they were inspired by something the character had seen previously, etc. There's a believable point where you go "okay yeah I see where this came from" but the first two gears don't really get that.
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Apr 20, 2020 00:35
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CodfishCartographer posted:I always thought gear second and third were kind of rear end-pulls tbh. We never see the thing that inspires Luffy to try them out, and we don't see him practicing them, or anything like that. We just get to Water 7 and suddenly he can do that now and are told "Luffy trained to do this in his spare time, trust us" without even an explanation of when he did so. Was it after landing from skypeia? If so, why didn't he use it against Aokiji when they fought on the long Island? They went straight to water 7 after that, did he train during that travel time? If so, it didn't feel like a very long period, was there a minor time skip? Etc. [cinemasins ding noise]
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Apr 20, 2020 00:37
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CodfishCartographer posted:I always thought gear second and third were kind of rear end-pulls tbh. We never see the thing that inspires Luffy to try them out, and we don't see him practicing them, or anything like that. We just get to Water 7 and suddenly he can do that now and are told "Luffy trained to do this in his spare time, trust us" without even an explanation of when he did so. Was it after landing from skypeia? If so, why didn't he use it against Aokiji when they fought on the long Island? They went straight to water 7 after that, did he train during that travel time? If so, it didn't feel like a very long period, was there a minor time skip? Etc. I believe while fighting Blueno Luffy says something about how when CP9 does soru they kick their feet off the ground a bunch of times in a second, and that's how he got the idea for gear second. How that somehow translates to "Seeing that inspired me to then try using my rubber powers to pump my blood through my veins to give me super speed" I have no clue.
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Apr 20, 2020 00:38
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CodfishCartographer posted:I always thought gear second and third were kind of rear end-pulls tbh. We never see the thing that inspires Luffy to try them out, and we don't see him practicing them, or anything like that. We just get to Water 7 and suddenly he can do that now and are told "Luffy trained to do this in his spare time, trust us" without even an explanation of when he did so. Was it after landing from skypeia? If so, why didn't he use it against Aokiji when they fought on the long Island? They went straight to water 7 after that, did he train during that travel time? If so, it didn't feel like a very long period, was there a minor time skip? Etc. Luffy learns Gear Second from seeing CP9 use Soru. Gear Third is a natural extension of something he already does (Gum Gum Balloon) just applies in a more combat useful way.
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Apr 20, 2020 00:39
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luffy does mention that it's the aokiji defeat that motivates him to do something
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Apr 20, 2020 00:52
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Gotta say, Pirate Warriors really underlines how boring Zoro's fighting style is. Way too much of it is just 'pose, then charge forwards'. Even the other sword users usually have more going on.
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Apr 20, 2020 01:28
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Also, I seem to recall one of the One Piece movies taking place chronologically before Enies Lobby having a bit where Luffy accidentally experiences the effects of Gear 2nd before he understands how it happened.
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Apr 20, 2020 01:53
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oddium posted:luffy does mention that it's the aokiji defeat that motivates him to do something Ah, the nakama days.
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Apr 20, 2020 03:01
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Brother Entropy posted:yes, it specifically undermined the annoying thing shonen likes to do where the good guy is actually just special because of their genetics. whatever gene therapy poo poo that made the vinsmoke boys powerful sociopaths failed on sanji, so any power he has is because of himself Watch it as Oda has sanji's dormant germa genes activate at the eleventh hour right before series end
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Apr 20, 2020 03:26
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Parrotine posted:Watch it as Oda has sanji's dormant germa genes activate at the eleventh hour right before series end nah, oda's a good writer
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Apr 20, 2020 03:35
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Brother Entropy posted:nah, oda's a good writer He's good at settings and themes, and can definitely pull off great arcs like water 7, but his pacing can be kind of bad, he's bad at character development for most of the main cast, and especially post timeskip has made multiple really questionable writing choices (Birdcage, Big Mom Amnesia, Sabo Amnesia)
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Apr 20, 2020 03:42
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Julias posted:He's good at settings and themes, and can definitely pull off great arcs like water 7, but his pacing can be kind of bad, he's bad at character development for most of the main cast, and especially post timeskip has made multiple really questionable writing choices (Birdcage, Big Mom Amnesia, Sabo Amnesia) didn't think i was gonna get 'well, actually'd about thinking one piece is good in the one piece thread
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Apr 20, 2020 03:46
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Brother Entropy posted:didn't think i was gonna get 'well, actually'd about thinking one piece is good in the one piece thread we're living in a time of great upheaval and uncertainty
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Apr 20, 2020 03:53
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CodfishCartographer posted:I always thought gear second and third were kind of rear end-pulls tbh. We never see the thing that inspires Luffy to try them out, and we don't see him practicing them, or anything like that. We just get to Water 7 and suddenly he can do that now and are told "Luffy trained to do this in his spare time, trust us" without even an explanation of when he did so. Was it after landing from skypeia? If so, why didn't he use it against Aokiji when they fought on the long Island? They went straight to water 7 after that, did he train during that travel time? If so, it didn't feel like a very long period, was there a minor time skip? Etc. Luffy tries weird poo poo a lot when trying to figure out the limits of his power (like the rubber net). It fits his character that he would figure out pumping his blood vessels at some point, but not committing until needing to create 'gear second' when he gets inspiration from the Soru technique to make the metabolism boost more practical. Julias posted:He's good at settings and themes, and can definitely pull off great arcs like water 7, but his pacing can be kind of bad, he's bad at character development for most of the main cast, and especially post timeskip has made multiple really questionable writing choices (Birdcage, Big Mom Amnesia, Sabo Amnesia) beating a dead horse but you can basically include nearly everything with chopper and robin in this
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Apr 20, 2020 04:02
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also i'd argue that oda isn't 'bad' at character development so much as that the strawhats' time for character development ended with the timeskip and that that's fine. they're all who they need to be and they've conquered whatever internal doubts they might've faced up till then
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Apr 20, 2020 04:05
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| # ? Jun 12, 2024 05:34 |
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It's more like the Straw Hats are each well developed but their character progression doesn't have much beyond their introduction arc.
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Apr 20, 2020 04:44
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