|
SubG posted:Stropping kitchen knives is absolutely not a waste of time if you care about getting your knives sharp as possible. I mean if you're just coarse chopping an onion or something then it's not absolutely essential or anything. But literally anyone who's ever used a knife before would be able to tell the difference between, for example, cutting a tomato with the same knife before and after stropping. I stand corrected then. I usually just finish at 1200 grit. Never really felt a need to go beyond that unless I was going for a mirror edge. Probably because I spent quite a while just sharpening my knives with a Sharpmaker.
|
#
?
May 8, 2020 22:54
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 23:56 |
|
|
It's just two different things. Stropping sets the edge where a stone cuts. Honing can do either depending on hardness. I'm not sure how true this is but if you're a super nerd with straight razors you strop immediately before cutting and have 5 razors to rotate through. After use the metal is weakest so you realign the edge furthest from use. Any cutting will effect this edge. A potato less then a carrot.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2020 23:13
|
|
|
Grand Fromage posted:What's a good strop available on Amazon? I have a whetstone but never got around to a strop. Push comes to shove you can use the leg from an old pair of jeans, the cardboard backing from a pad of paper, or almost anything else, particularly if you buy some stropping compound. .Z. posted:I stand corrected then. I usually just finish at 1200 grit. Never really felt a need to go beyond that unless I was going for a mirror edge. Probably because I spent quite a while just sharpening my knives with a Sharpmaker. In terms of workflow or whatever I have a handful of knives (or rather Chinese cleavers) that I'm cycling through for just general prep poo poo, using them for whatever and just swapping out if one starts to feel like it's losing its sharpness, and I've got one set aside (my Takeda cleaver) that's only used when I want a pristine blade in perfect condition for some superfine knife work. As a practical matter, since I use cleavers for almost everything, my gyutos and other knives are generally also in pristine condition because they get so much less use.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2020 23:32
|
|
|
Nephzinho posted:I've been getting targeted ads for Misen knives a bunch the past week - anyone try one before or is it one of those companies that spends more on advertising than quality? Not even looking to buy, just curious. I love the feel and design. I got one from the first Kickstarter, and the tip cracked off. They redesigned it and used a different steel for the next Kickstarter, so I got another. It just cracked in the middle. Both garlic incidents, like with Carillon's.
|
|
#
?
May 9, 2020 16:27
|
|
|
I wonder if the knife they gave kenji which seemed to catapult their kickstarter was made of different steel than the production knives.
|
|
#
?
May 9, 2020 18:00
|
|
|
That sharpening video is real neat. I own at least three different sharpening systems and I hate them all except for my DuoSharp. The Sharpmaker is the worst; it's a system designed to give you the correct angle, but offers nothing mechanically to prevent you from messing up the angle -- you have to be sure you're holding it perfectly vertically. The second is a knockoff Edge Pro, and really the problem here is me, I've read the instructions and watched the official Edge Pro video but I still don't really understand how to use it. But I also don't trust the angle markings since it's a knockoff. The DuoSharp forces me to freehand, which I'm not crazy about, but I get by. Sharpened a few knives this afternoon and they came out all right. The Lansky and Wicked Edge systems look easy to get exact angles on and it doesn't seem like there's really a way to screw it up if you set the angle right. I might pick up the Lansky, I'm not sure I want to drop $250 on a system. Sometimes I wonder how to be sure of what the factory angle is, though, the documentation on it isn't always easy to find.
|
|
#
?
May 9, 2020 19:28
|
|
|
guppy posted:That sharpening video is real neat. I own at least three different sharpening systems and I hate them all except for my DuoSharp. The Sharpmaker is the worst; it's a system designed to give you the correct angle, but offers nothing mechanically to prevent you from messing up the angle -- you have to be sure you're holding it perfectly vertically. The second is a knockoff Edge Pro, and really the problem here is me, I've read the instructions and watched the official Edge Pro video but I still don't really understand how to use it. But I also don't trust the angle markings since it's a knockoff. If you've already got the Edge Pro knock off, why not give a blade angle gauge a try before spending money on another system? That would let you know for sure what angle you are setting on the edge. https://smile.amazon.com/Wixey-WR300-Type-Digital-Backlight/dp/B00T6YZ0K6 Or do this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JEX916UxXI
|
|
#
?
May 9, 2020 20:19
|
|
|
Yeah, maybe. I bought an Angle Cube (https://www.amazon.com/iGaging-AngleCube-Digital-Level-Bevel/dp/B002LL0BIC/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_bdcrb_top?ie=UTF8) a while ago but didn't open it for a while, and when I did I put batteries in and it wouldn't even turn on, and it had been long enough since I bought it that I didn't even bother trying to get it replaced. No reason to believe another will have the same problem, it's just left a bad taste in my mouth.
|
|
#
?
May 10, 2020 01:05
|
|
|
I was really surprised how noticeable the effect of stropping was. I bought a diamond stone (this one) that came with a strop (ie a scrap of leather on some wood and a block of stropping compound) and the combo has proven way more effective than the water stones or EdgePro knockoff I used in the past.
|
|
#
?
May 10, 2020 17:06
|
|
|
I use a free app on my phone to measure the angle. From what I’ve read this should be fairly accurate.
|
|
#
?
May 10, 2020 23:17
|
|
|
I'm not sure how many freehanders or freehand-curious are in here, but Murray Carter decided to upload his knife sharpening fundamentals video for free viewing. My disposition towards his new shtick of hawking a sharpening system that ranges from $355-$2,040 notwithstanding, I really felt like his original method really brought my sharpening game together.
|
|
#
?
May 14, 2020 03:04
|
|
|
Glockamole posted:I'm not sure how many freehanders or freehand-curious are in here, but Murray Carter decided to upload his knife sharpening fundamentals video for free viewing. My disposition towards his new shtick of hawking a sharpening system that ranges from $355-$2,040 notwithstanding, I really felt like his original method really brought my sharpening game together. Started watching this thinking what is this guy doing and why is he wearing this. I'm now 45min in and thinking 'huh, that makes sense, oh, I should do that.'
|
|
#
?
May 14, 2020 19:48
|
|
|
I don't know if it's been posted in this thread already, but I'm getting caught up in another thread (only a year behind now!) and this was posted in it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbPWitSTe2k
|
|
#
?
May 15, 2020 09:35
|
|
|
I needed to replace my lovely garbage-tier Amazon waterstones, since I'd been using them a couple of years, they're badly cupped and the 6000 grit stone is a loving lie, and then I got drunk and ordered a 1000/5000 set of discrete ceramic shapton waterstones instead of a single 1000/6000 king stone for half the price like a normal person. But in any case they do an amazing job, and in fewer strokes with less elbow grease. I spent 2 hours putting beautiful, gratuitous mirror finishes on all my blades, and my arm wasn't about to fall off at the end, and the stones are still perfectly flat as far as I can tell. I'm actually a lot better at this than I realized and I couldn't tell because my finishing stone was garbage.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2020 02:05
|
|
|
Glockamole posted:Murray Carter decided to upload his knife sharpening fundamentals video for free viewing. Thanks, this was really good.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2020 16:28
|
|
|
Glockamole posted:I'm not sure how many freehanders or freehand-curious are in here, but Murray Carter decided to upload his knife sharpening fundamentals video for free viewing. My disposition towards his new shtick of hawking a sharpening system that ranges from $355-$2,040 notwithstanding, I really felt like his original method really brought my sharpening game together. This thread inspired me to get some whetstones, as my pull-through sharpener just isn't working as well as I'd like. Had been putting off doing it so I could do some learning first. Opened the video and it's almost 3 hours!?! I feel like I have to set aside some serious time for this next step in knife life. [Edit: For anyone else in my shoes, he says he is going to go over the process once with the basics, then a second time in super detail. So it sounds like you can probably get away with the first bit, then watch the second after I've done it a few times.] Internet Explorer fucked around with this message at 20:55 on May 16, 2020 |
|
#
?
May 16, 2020 20:24
|
|
|
This inspired me to get me Edge Pro Apex back out. I didn’t do a great job the first few times I used it but I figured it out now and my knives are really sharp again. Feels good man.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2020 20:26
|
|
|
Internet Explorer posted:This thread inspired me to get some whetstones, as my pull-through sharpener just isn't working as well as I'd like. Had been putting off doing it so I could do some learning first. Opened the video and it's almost 3 hours!?! I feel like I have to set aside some serious time for this next step in knife life. You don't have to get razor sharp your first go. Watch the basics part and then go practice. Plan to work the knife for no more than 15 minutes, going through all the steps, and then go take a break and come back later or in a few days. Just get a feel for the process, it's not going to be the end of the world if the knife is just moderately sharp for a while. If you want to spend more time on it, go for it, but it really isn't necessary. After you've done this a few times and actually start to think you know what you are doing go back and watch the detail bits. Or, if you are happy with your edge, don't.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2020 21:59
|
|
|
Thanks for that, that's probably exactly what I needed to hear. I actually watched about half of his video until he was like "okay, now go take a break and do something else for a bit, this is too much to digest at once." It was really quite interesting. The knives that I have seem to be the type where the secondary edge is the entire side of the knife. That means I should be hitting the entire side when grinding? [Edit: I have a Victorinox - 45520 Fibrox Pro Chef's Knife that I bought for cooking while camping and specifically to learn sharpening on, so this won't be the first knife I try.] 
Internet Explorer fucked around with this message at 00:19 on May 17, 2020 |
|
#
?
May 16, 2020 23:40
|
|
|
I watched the summarized version of the 7 step process and sharpened a Victorinox Chef knife and Santoku today. I used a Shapton 1000 grit glass stone . It was my first time sharpening any knife. I literally have only honed my Victorinox knives for almost 10 years. I was able to go from dull to cutting paper. I'm not too sure on the secondary edge myself on the Victorinox. I have the same question as Internet Explorer.
|
|
#
?
May 17, 2020 00:08
|
|
|
Internet Explorer posted:The knives that I have seem to be the type where the secondary edge is the entire side of the knife. That means I should be hitting the entire side when grinding? Babylon Astronaut fucked around with this message at 05:14 on May 17, 2020 |
|
#
?
May 17, 2020 03:47
|
|
|
Babylon Astronaut posted:Nah. That just looks like it's there to prevent wedging and help the food fall off the knife. Knives that have a functional shinogi line use it to maintain the geometry of the knife. Ie; when you raise the bevel a millimeter when sharpening, you raise the shinogi line the same amount so the knife maintains its shape. For a double bevel chef knife, it can't possibly matter. Looking at it closer; you'd be sharpening the pommel too, which I don't really support. Trying to correctly parse what you are saying. So in that case, with these knives, just sharpen the primary edge?
|
|
#
?
May 17, 2020 17:45
|
|
|
Yes
|
|
#
?
May 17, 2020 18:02
|
|
|
 I finally revisited this 50yo LL Bean carbon steel chef's knife I grew up with and recently rescued from my parents' knife drawer. It was rusty and bent, the tip was chipped, and it had no secondary edge after being maintained with one of those rolling fixed-angle deals for decades. I cleaned it up, unbent it to the best of my ability, restored the secondary edge and worked out the chipped tip. The other face is a little uglier since I'm working on the ambidextrous Tek for the first time and my left hand is not quite there yet. It's not perfect, but it's probably better than it's ever been even when it was brand new  E: I need to find a file and grind the heel down a bit poverty goat fucked around with this message at 18:30 on May 17, 2020 |
|
#
?
May 17, 2020 18:23
|
|
|
Thank you. Something so simple, but when you're clueless, you're clueless. 
|
|
#
?
May 17, 2020 18:29
|
|
|
Internet Explorer posted:This thread inspired me to get some whetstones, as my pull-through sharpener just isn't working as well as I'd like. It's good to get away from pull through sharpeners. I'm sure others before me have mentioned it, but they don't really sharpen the knife. They sort of mangle the edge in such a way as to make it mimic the slicing aggression of an edge finished on a low grit stone. Somewhere in the depths of the internet I found this particular picture, but the second image is typical of any pull through sharpener. Not that you need me to convince you to try freehand sharpening, I just like to point this out when I can, because why spend the coin on a decent knife just to give it the performance characteristics of something you could get for $15 at Wal Mart?  Internet Explorer posted:The knives that I have seem to be the type where the secondary edge is the entire side of the knife. That means I should be hitting the entire side when grinding? If I'm picking up what you're putting down, the short answer is no. The longer answer is eventually. As the height of the blade, the distance from the cutting edge to the spine, gets shorter over time from repeated sharpening, the edge and blade geometry will begin to change and affect the cutting performance. But that takes a long time, usually years of use and maintenance. And in the case of examples where that secondary bevel runs from the spine thickness to the edge bevel, probably longer yet, especially if you have good sharpening habits. The biggest thing you might want to do is every so often thin out the transition between the primary and secondary bevels, but you'll do that naturally anyway to some degree just from the limitations of human motor coordination. Murgos posted:You don't have to get razor sharp your first go. Watch the basics part and then go practice. I'm just quoting this because I think it's great advice and a great attitude to have going in. I'm personally very prone to paralysis by analysis and the fear of making an irreparable error, and both things are big hindrances to developing the "feel" and skill for sharpening. If I may, I'll also add that there's no need for anyone to worry about making an irreparable mistake. You just aren't going to do that without power tools and some serious lack of situational awareness. I think most of my kitchen knives have rub marks somewhere on the blade from when I went too low with my angle on the stone here or there and they still work the same. I had a guy who leaves his Tojiros in the sink and runs them through the dishwasher. It took me like 45 minutes just to shorten the height of the blade enough to grind the chips out of his gyuto on my 150 grit waterstone. Damaged? You bet. Reparable? One hundred percent. Hell, even if you break the tip off from dropping it point first onto concrete, you can probably still round it out for a serviceable blade. Not that I advocate either of those things, but it's just to point out that nothing you do to that knife with that waterstone can't be fixed. Also, a waterstone isn't explicitly necessary for freehand. Murray mentions it, but it's worth repeating that it can be done with oilstones, diamond stones, or even automotive sandpaper. As poverty goat touched on, though, it's worth investing in something of good quality if you can.
|
|
#
?
May 17, 2020 18:49
|
|
|
xpostfrom kitche equipment: I have a pair of carbon steel opinel paring knives. My gf loves them and asked if they made a chef's knife. They don't seem to make something in the same steel. Could anyone recommend something that is lightweight, thin, and sharp (carbon is good because we love patina)? This would be used almost exclusively on vegetables. I was thinking maybe some sort of carbon steel nakiri or santoku.
|
|
#
?
May 17, 2020 22:52
|
|
|
I like my Moritaka, I posted a pic of the patina like ten days ago in here. Fake edit: https://imgur.com/a/wSdX4cE
|
|
#
?
May 18, 2020 00:05
|
|
|
I hone my knives every time I use them and spend like $30 sharpening them all at a truck that comes to my door once a year before the holidays. Maybe if I ever get a bigger kitchen or if these social distancing measures are going to last a few years I'll reconsider getting some stones, but there's nothing wrong with just getting your knives done.Chemmy posted:I like my Moritaka, I posted a pic of the patina like ten days ago in here. That is gorgeous. I fear the day I start buying knives for cosmetic reasons, but also know it is out there. Nephzinho fucked around with this message at 18:59 on May 18, 2020 |
|
#
?
May 18, 2020 18:56
|
|
|
I've officially sharpened off my fingerprints and am ready to begin my new career in knife crimes E: 
poverty goat fucked around with this message at 22:00 on May 18, 2020 |
|
#
?
May 18, 2020 21:52
|
|
|
I hate when that happens and when your blood starts the patina q
|
|
#
?
May 18, 2020 21:56
|
|
|
Nephzinho posted:I hone my knives every time I use them and spend like $30 sharpening them all at a truck that comes to my door once a year before the holidays. Maybe if I ever get a bigger kitchen or if these social distancing measures are going to last a few years I'll reconsider getting some stones, but there's nothing wrong with just getting your knives done. Babylon Astronaut fucked around with this message at 00:19 on May 19, 2020 |
|
#
?
May 19, 2020 00:17
|
|
|
Babylon Astronaut posted:It's fine until you have knives with more complex bevels. My yanagi for example, has a very, very specific compound bevel that requires maintaining a c shaped curve along the length of the knife. It is a serious pain in the rear end, so much that many pros say gently caress it and flatten them into a chisel edge. No one is going to sharpen a set of high carbon sushi knives for 30 bucks, and if they offer to, run like hell!!! I know so many people whose single bevel knives came back as 50/50 double bevels, because that's usually all they're set up to do. Also, when sharpening in large batches, you'll often use a buffing wheel, which is fine for a stamped knife, but will hurt the temper of a forged knife. Those are really the only situations where getting stones is 100% mandatory, or going through enough sharpening services to find one you trust. That's fair. I've got one I trust and don't use any knives with bevels that can be hosed.
|
|
#
?
May 19, 2020 00:37
|
|
|
poverty goat posted:I've officially sharpened off my fingerprints and am ready to begin my new career in knife crimes Look at that edge though. Worth it.
|
|
#
?
May 19, 2020 04:26
|
|
|
Honestly I've sharpened a couple knives with my edge pro knock off now and never bothered with an angle finder. I just set it to close enough and use a sharpie on the cutting edge to match the angle
|
|
#
?
May 19, 2020 04:49
|
|
|
Babylon Astronaut posted:Also, when sharpening in large batches, you'll often use a buffing wheel, which is fine for a stamped knife, but will hurt the temper of a forged knife. Do you have a source for this? My understanding is that knives are all tempered the same way regardless of how the shape of the blade is achieved. I know that different steels require different heat treat processes but all things being equal a knife stamped out of ten series high carbon steel should be heat treated the same way as a knife forged from ten series high carbon steel, right? Maybe the forged knife is thermocycled a few times to relieve the stress from the forging process but if you get either of them too hot after they've been heat treated you'll ruin the temper.
|
|
#
?
May 19, 2020 14:02
|
|
|
Stalizard posted:Do you have a source for this? My understanding is that knives are all tempered the same way regardless of how the shape of the blade is achieved. I know that different steels require different heat treat processes but all things being equal a knife stamped out of ten series high carbon steel should be heat treated the same way as a knife forged from ten series high carbon steel, right? Maybe the forged knife is thermocycled a few times to relieve the stress from the forging process but if you get either of them too hot after they've been heat treated you'll ruin the temper. I dont think there are stamped multi steel knives. It is not uncommon to have a core steel and a softer outer for japanese forged knives. Not a source on your direct question but something to consider before you take a knife to a wheel.
|
|
#
?
May 19, 2020 14:13
|
|
|
Submarine Sandpaper posted:I dont think there are stamped multi steel knives. It is not uncommon to have a core steel and a softer outer for japanese forged knives. Not a source on your direct question but something to consider before you take a knife to a wheel. Any temperature sufficient to ruin the temper on a knife with a hardened core and soft outer will be enough to ruin the temper of any other knife. I'm not here to stick up for buffing wheels, I'm just absolutely baffled how anybody could claim that the same process could be fine for a stamped knife but ruinous for a forged knife.
|
|
#
?
May 19, 2020 21:52
|
|
|
Stalizard posted:Any temperature sufficient to ruin the temper on a knife with a hardened core and soft outer will be enough to ruin the temper of any other knife. Take as an example 1095. If you have a blade that shipped at ~62 HRC, then it was tempered at just over 205 C/400 F. Heat it to 315 C/600 F and you'll have a blade that starts to move toward ~56 HRC. How much softer it actually winds up being depends on how long it's held at temperature and what's been done to it before. A blade that was tempered at the factory to 56 HRC won't be affected. Of course this gets more complicated when you're looking at different steels, different heat treatments and so on. And briefly exceeding the tempering temperature will not cause the blade to spontaneously melt or anything. But it isn't as if all metal used in knife blades has a single tempering temperature or anything like that. SubG fucked around with this message at 23:37 on May 19, 2020 |
|
#
?
May 19, 2020 22:41
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 23:56 |
|
|
Stalizard posted:Any temperature sufficient to ruin the temper on a knife with a hardened core and soft outer will be enough to ruin the temper of any other knife. Not all steels are the same as SubG said. It's much more complicated than "stamped vs. forged."
|
|
#
?
May 19, 2020 23:15
|
|
