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silvergoose posted:The post wasn't the beginning. There is no beginning to the bad posts. But it was a beginning. 
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Jun 4, 2020 00:37
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Japanese swords have an edge geometry closer to a kitchen knife than western swords did, because Japanese swords were designed to cut people and cloth/bamboo armor. Western swords needed blunter edges because they were designed to survive and not break or chip against people wearing metal armor. The top tier swords that highly trained swordsmen use in WoT are Japanese swords though; not western ones. Rand’s sword is literally a katana.
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Jun 4, 2020 04:07
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And not just any katana, but an unbreakable, never dulling one.
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Jun 4, 2020 04:10
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The Lord Bude posted:The top tier swords that highly trained swordsmen use in WoT are Japanese swords though; not western ones. Rand’s sword is literally a katana. Technically there are some slight differences, both in handle and blade length & shape The RJ-approved Museum Replica design is here: https://www.museumreplicas.com/heron-mark-sword It's similar to a katana but not precisely the same. That said yeah if you have a blade that magically can't break or chip, makes sense ot make it katana-sharp or sharper, even.
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Jun 4, 2020 04:29
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On the topic of quick lines easily missed, which I'm catching better now with an audiobook, from late in Lord of Chaos: The entire incident had begun because al’Thor discovered Min was in the camp, after one of the Warders carelessly allowed her to walk in the darkness instead of keeping her closely confined in her tent. Who would have thought that al’Thor, shielded and surrounded, would have gone mad that way? Not just trying to break through the shield, but killing a Warder with his bare hands and severely wounding another with the dead man’s sword, to such an extent that the second died in the Healing. All that in the moments required for the sisters to overcome their shock and bind him with the Power. Holy poo poo, Rand. Killed a warder with his bare hands and then mortally wounds a second, all in the time that the Aes Sedai are still trying to figure out what happened. I guess all that training about fighting with his hands and feet was worth something.
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Jun 4, 2020 08:17
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now if it had been FARMERS guarding him...
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Jun 4, 2020 09:32
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I think warders wear swords because trollocs are like 50% taller and more massive than humans, and also usually heavily armored? I guess a quarterstaff isn't that useful against such an enemy.
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Jun 4, 2020 11:33
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It seems like you'd want something with more punch than a sword in that case. Do power-wrought weapons cut through armour?
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Jun 4, 2020 15:07
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Torrannor posted:I think warders wear swords because trollocs are like 50% taller and more massive than humans, and also usually heavily armored? I guess a quarterstaff isn't that useful against such an enemy. You'd think halberds would be more popular in that case. Best of both worlds.
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Jun 4, 2020 15:11
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Remember borderlanders are the only ones who have fought Trollocs in centuries. Most people don’t think they’re real. Also I just got to the Sharan section in AMoL and what the Christ? Why introduce a completely new culture in the last book?
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Jun 4, 2020 15:14
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Colonel Cool posted:It seems like you'd want something with more punch than a sword in that case. Do power-wrought weapons cut through armour? I ... don't think so? They are basically regular swords, just ones that will not dull or shatter. They're not like lightsabers or shardblades or anything like that. (Except Perrin's hammer, which seems to be a ter'angreal, imbued with additional magical damage)
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Jun 4, 2020 15:15
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Invalid Validation posted:Remember borderlanders are the only ones who have fought Trollocs in centuries. Most people don’t think they’re real. I mean it's introduced long before that, but wasn't really fleshed out until the end.
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Jun 4, 2020 15:49
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Invalid Validation posted:Also I just got to the Sharan section in AMoL and what the Christ? Why introduce a completely new culture in the last book?
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Jun 4, 2020 15:59
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Invalid Validation posted:Remember borderlanders are the only ones who have fought Trollocs in centuries. Most people don’t think they’re real. Because there'd been hints that the Forsaken were screwing around over there in earlier books, though admittedly those hints were for Graendal who had some Sharan leaders in her harem, not Demandred. But once people figured out the Taim = Demandred twist, Jordan switched things around so that it had been Demandred who'd been subverting Shara all along, making Taim a modern Forsaken instead. Which I personally think would have worked better if there were some other modern Forsaken, maybe Alviarin say, rather than just Taim. Or even better, if he'd been happy that his readers had correctly read the clues and just kept Demandred as Taim. 
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Jun 4, 2020 16:03
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I think the real problem with taimandred was that as less Theron came more and more to the forefront it was less and less believable that Rand didn't just drop a mountain on his head on sight.
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Jun 4, 2020 16:17
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The black tower was generally handled like poo poo. The entire plot of it was just dropped until Sanderson. I guess that happens when the antagonist may or may not be someone.
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Jun 4, 2020 16:19
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on a similar topic, it's definitely kind of funny when the forsaken pretending to be dashiva just gets utterly obliterated when he's about to attack rand and the person who guides the circle who does it is a darkfriend thinking 'gee it would suck if i hurt any of the chosen, good thing that's just dashiva' why yes, i just cleaned up on reading winter's heart. only now do i notice that like all mention of perrin sort of falls off at some point into that book.
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Jun 4, 2020 16:24
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I think the real problem with taimandred was that as less Theron came more and more to the forefront it was less and less believable that Rand didn't just drop a mountain on his head on sight. It made very little sense that Rand didn't tear Taim into tiny pieces after the Ashaman traitor attack that nearly killed him and Min. The most charitable reading is that Taim's reaction - snarling like a boss who is angry that his underlings botched an important job rather than someone concerned for his liege lord and the prophesized savior of the world - just confirms Rand's mindset at that time that everyone is out to betray him, he can't trust anybody, and better to have his enemies where he can see them and maybe use them for his own ends. However, given that we're talking about Taim in particular...obviously that blows up in a very very bad way and Rand should've seen that coming sufficiently to put the dude in a box if nothing else. Looking forward to seeing that action sequence on the show if they make it that far. Mat Cauthon fucked around with this message at 16:32 on Jun 4, 2020 |
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Jun 4, 2020 16:25
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I'm slowly going through the Lord of Chaos audiobook, and it is wild, in retrospect, how much Taim is Demandred. Every single thing revealed about Demandred in the Prologue and in the Forsaken's mental asides is paid off point for point by Taim within the book. Demandred joined the shadow because he was jealous of Lews Therin? Rand thinks "Huh, I wonder why Mazrim Taim's face keeps showing murderous rage every time I stand on this dais and put him literally in my shadow. Oh well!" Moghedien tells Nynave that, in the previous age, "stilling" and "gentling" were both called "severing"? Taim casually refers to Ashaman as being "severed" s few chapters later. Also, on a more subtle note, I love how Alanna gets secondhand PTSD from just feeling a fraction of what Rand goes through every minute of every day, and just slowly unravels throughout the series..
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Jun 4, 2020 16:28
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I like the Seanchan who thinks "I've known some hard people in my time but holy gently caress dude just lost a hand and doesn't even get fazed"
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Jun 4, 2020 16:39
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I think the real problem with taimandred was that as less Theron came more and more to the forefront it was less and less believable that Rand didn't just drop a mountain on his head on sight. If we were to believe that "Lews Therin" was real and could see through Forsaken disguises Dashiva shouldn't have made it past a single page. VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Jun 4, 2020 |
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Jun 4, 2020 16:41
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Oh i never connected the dashiva dotsq
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Jun 4, 2020 16:45
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VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:If we were to believe that "Lews Therin" was real and could see through Forsaken disguises Dashiva shouldn't have made it past a single page. At the initial meeting LTT clearly recognizes him and tries to kill him. At the time it's just MadnessTM though. Later when Rand is listening more, though, yeah.
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Jun 4, 2020 17:05
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i suppose it's always possible that lews therin never really got to know some of the forsaken, so he's not as inherently brushed up on who's who. demandred is absolutely a dead ringer, though, and someone that lews would immediately want to obliterate.
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Jun 4, 2020 17:07
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VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:If we were to believe that "Lews Therin" was real and could see through Forsaken disguises Dashiva shouldn't have made it past a single page. Wasn't Dashiva one of the body snatched Forsaken, though? It wasn't a disguise, it was just some poor s.o.b. who got his body stolen to rehome a soul.
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Jun 4, 2020 17:13
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Guiness13 posted:Wasn't Dashiva one of the body snatched Forsaken, though? It wasn't a disguise, it was just some poor s.o.b. who got his body stolen to rehome a soul. Yeah, he was Osan'Gar, who was the re-homed soul of that Forsaken that got wasted in Eye of the World. Bethamel, I think? Aran'Gar was Halima, who was Aginor, whose soul got stuck in a female body. He also got wasted in EotW.
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Jun 4, 2020 17:19
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Funny thing is I don’t think you know he’s forsaken until right before he gets smoked.
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Jun 4, 2020 17:44
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Taking this over to the TV show, I do think that if they're compressing characters, maybe they need to compress some of the Forsaken. There are just so many of them, and most of them seem to just show up in one book, scheme for a bit ineffectually, then get smoked by Rand (or occasionally Moiraine) in the climax of the book.
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Jun 4, 2020 17:52
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ConfusedUs posted:Yeah, he was Osan'Gar, who was the re-homed soul of that Forsaken that got wasted in Eye of the World. Bethamel, I think? I thought it was the other way around, Balthamel was mad on sexual pleasure and was like well now I get to experience it the from the other side
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Jun 4, 2020 17:53
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Invalid Validation posted:Funny thing is I don’t think you know he’s forsaken until right before he gets smoked. On the re-read there are a couple little clues. Rand picked him at random to join him after Dumai’s Wells and Taim was very surprised and put off by it. Later, when Flinn heals Rand he says Dashiva proposed a bunch of ideas for healing but was unable to do them himself. Not nearly as clear as the LoC Taim clues.
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Jun 4, 2020 17:58
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14 forsaken doesnt seem like too many, not over the course of 14 books. If anything, maybe put a damper on some of them recurring. Dashiva does loving nothing after reincarnation, just have him smoked permanently in the first book.
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Jun 4, 2020 19:30
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Or you could always expand a little. Even if Osan'gar gets blown up at Shadar Logoth, that's fine, a lot of Forsaken were pulled, unhappily, away from their own plans at the last minute to try to deter Rand's plans. We know that he is a reincarnated Big Bad, so show him off as if he's the main source of shadow corruption around the Black Tower. Play some sleight of hand with the actual shadow plot.
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Jun 4, 2020 19:44
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You could also just merge some. Like Sammael and Rahvin both fill very, very similar story spaces and have almost exactly the same plot and downfall. You also have characters like Mesaana and Demandred that do almost everything completely offscreen before the big reveal in the final battle who could easily be cut or have their bits merged into other Forsaken.
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Jun 4, 2020 21:07
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I disagree. It's fine to combine supporting characters, but the main named villains should not be. I mean, first, it's ok for a Forsaken to get unceremoniously dumpstered, particularly during while other important things happen. But even aside from that, there's a pretty good story beat for the contrast between the resolution of Rahvin and Sammael--Moiraine was pushing Rand hard towards invading Illian to take Sammael, and he may well have but ended up deciding to take his forces against Rahvin to avenge Morgase and save Andor for Elayne. These are good character moments
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Jun 4, 2020 23:53
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Zore posted:You could also just merge some. Like Sammael and Rahvin both fill very, very similar story spaces and have almost exactly the same plot and downfall. Yeah but they fill those similar spaces simultaneously in two very important nations with two very different methods of control. I feel like trying to squeeze one Rahvmael into both Andor and Illian would end up being way worse than just having a Rahvin and a Sammael. I can't really see any Forsaken that you could cut or combine without making more problems than just including them all would cause.
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Jun 4, 2020 23:59
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Asmodean, just have Taim teach saidin
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Jun 5, 2020 00:43
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I just realized if they go long enough a good chunk of the TV show will be Rand being very edgy and emo.
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Jun 5, 2020 01:26
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It's really hard to play actual paranoia and despair without it being edgy emo poo poo yeah
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Jun 5, 2020 01:47
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Invalid Validation posted:I just realized if they go long enough a good chunk of the TV show will be Rand being very edgy and emo. I mean, it was the 90's.
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Jun 5, 2020 03:22
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I'd expect them to focus more on unstable rage crazy man, personally.
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Jun 5, 2020 06:46
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