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Elliptical Dick posted:Right, I had assumed that all mobo's carried some sort of basic graphics chipset. Thanks for clearing that up for me. Yeah, no motherboards have onboard graphics that I know of. Just ports that only work if the CPU has its own integrated graphics.
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Aug 30, 2020 15:13
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Funso Banjo posted:Do we know anything else about this. I've spoken with Ebuyer, my supplier for a few items over the years here in the UK, one of the biggest suppliers of stuff over here, and they told me apart from a very very small shipment just before release day, which sold out before they were received, they haven't had a single unit since. Unlike the sister model, the 3100, which they had plenty of before release, and have had more coming in regularly. It seems really wierd to make way less of the model that was obviously going to be way more popular. This is one of the more confusing things this year. The 3300X was their ace if the cheap Comet Lake chips had been competitive with the 3600, but they aren't. So they're not gonna undercut their own product with something better and less profitable. Meanwhile, the 3300X's particular requirements for 4/4 good cores in one CCX means that it likely is competing with high end ryzens for good dies. If they can make one 3900X or two 3300Xs, they're gonna go with the one that sells for $450. The only die that would naturally be good for a 3300X and nothing else would be one with 4/4 working cores in one CCX and 3/4 dead on the other side, which seems like it'd be rare. tl;dr the shoe is on the other foot and if Intel tries to put out The Continuing Adventures of Skylake on 14nm++++++ next year we're gonna see some funny poo poo like AMD charging premiums.
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Aug 30, 2020 15:52
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Some Goon posted:78 under load is perfectly normal. I'd think that cooler could do better in a different case, but it's well below the threshold on concern, so dont sweat it. Cool, thanks 
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Aug 30, 2020 16:48
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Is it generally better to have speakers or a headset? I’ve been using a Sennheiser headset for years but my AMEX sent me an email telling me I can get a special discount at the Edifier store for speakers. Now I’m debating getting a set of speakers so I’m not always dependent on a headset. Is Edifier any good for speakers? Is there anything from them this thread would recommend?
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Aug 30, 2020 16:55
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Do front and rear also io use the same sound hardware on a motherboard? I bought a motherboard with a DAC and something other than realtek audio, and it has the usual rear io's for speakers, headphones, and microphones but it also has a header for front headphone and microphones input; would those be the exact same or would there be a difference plugging into the rear motherboard io instead?
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Aug 30, 2020 17:07
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Kraftwerk posted:Is it generally better to have speakers or a headset? This is like asking "is it generally better to wear jeans or shorts?" It is generally known that headphones have better sound quality than speakers of the same price, but it's not like all headphones are made the same and there's a wide range of sound qualities. Other than that it's completely preference. Also this really isn't the thread for it, head to Inspect Your Gadgets subforum. PageMaster posted:Do front and rear also io use the same sound hardware on a motherboard? I bought a motherboard with a DAC and something other than realtek audio, and it has the usual rear io's for speakers, headphones, and microphones it also has a heart for front headphone and microphones input; would those be the exact same or would there be a difference plugging into the rear motherboard io instead? Also with mobo audio interference is a regular problem, despite mobo makers trying to isolate the sound section more. So you should try both front & rear inputs and see if there's a difference in noise floor (like background hiss when recording). Klyith fucked around with this message at 17:12 on Aug 30, 2020 |
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Aug 30, 2020 17:07
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Klyith posted:This is like asking "is it generally better to wear jeans or shorts?" It is generally known that headphones have better sound quality than speakers of the same price, but it's not like all headphones are made the same and there's a wide range of sound qualities. Other than that it's completely preference. It’s also very much about your physical space - my office/gaming space is in my basement with the HVAC and a dehumidifier so there’s a lot of ambient noise so headphones are generally better, but in the past I’ve had it in rooms which were quiet and there speakers can be better, though it also depends on the room size/shape/contents as to how speakers will sound. So “better” is going to be almost completely in the eye (ear) of the beholder (...behearer?) for that question.
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Aug 30, 2020 17:11
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Kraftwerk posted:Is it generally better to have speakers or a headset? If you spend a lot of time needing sound but A) it doesn’t have to be 100% perfect MMMONSTER quality audiophile grade and/or B) you get uncomfortable wearing a headset all day, then speakers are great. I’m thoroughly of the opinion that whatever $80 2.1 PC Speakers going for used or sale in your area are going to be Good Enough and the range from $80-$500 is super marginal improvements for the money. At that point you’d be better off spending that balance on nicer headphones or an interface or something instead. But I’m sure this isn’t the accepted thread wisdom, just the calculus I went through recently before settling on a set of Logitech speakers that sound just fine.
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Aug 30, 2020 17:31
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I have both because sometimes I like to talk to people while playing games and not subject them to endless feedback, and sometimes I like to play games or listen to music without something on my head.
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Aug 30, 2020 18:22
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Everyone keeps using less ram than I imagine would be needed, is this a side effect of games being installed on SSDs or something? I like lots of ram for my many tabs and keep wanting to put 32gb in.
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Aug 30, 2020 18:23
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Harold Fjord posted:Everyone keeps using less ram than I imagine would be needed, is this a side effect of games being installed on SSDs or something? I like lots of ram for my many tabs and keep wanting to put 32gb in. No, you just don't need that much ram. If you have enough tabs open that it's using 8+ gigs of memory A. close some tabs, you'll never get back to them B. older tabs will be paged out of active memory by your browser automatically and C. if you really are maxing out your ram such that it's effecting performance, buy more ram, but almost no one is doing that.
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Aug 30, 2020 18:43
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Harold Fjord posted:Everyone keeps using less ram than I imagine would be needed, is this a side effect of games being installed on SSDs or something? I like lots of ram for my many tabs and keep wanting to put 32gb in. Games generally don't need more than 16gb for a number of reasons: • consoles have ~8GB so cross-platform stuff sticks to that limit • the biggest assets in games are textures and other graphical stuff that needs to be on the video card for good performance. video cards have much less vram, so there's reasons to not go too hog wild. • more memory in use = bigger, more detailed worlds and assets = more expensive games to make. game development lags hardware advances because budgets are finite. OTOH flightsim 2020 can use 32gb. It's the first game ever to do so, but more games may start taking advantage of large amounts of ram on PC (possibly as an alternative to requiring NVMe drives equal to nextgen consoles). As for lots of tabs, if you have a SSD swapping memory to disk is easily fast enough to cover switching to a background tab. Plus if you are a tab packrat with 500 tabs, most of them are probably taking up zero memory because browsers leave old tabs unloaded until you interact with them. (They started doing this because people complained about using too much memory instead of just closing some drat tabs.) All that said, ram is cheap and getting cheaper so 32gb is a totally valid buy for a build above $1k. But it isn't necessary at all.
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Aug 30, 2020 19:02
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Yeah I regularly see 32 gig kits on sale for ~$100 and at that price I would probably grab it.
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Aug 30, 2020 19:05
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Thanks. I'm looking at upgrading my 2500k to something like: PCPartPicker Part List: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/VhLWx6 CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor ($199.99 @ Best Buy) CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($34.99 @ Amazon) Motherboard: MSI B550M PRO-VDH WIFI Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard ($109.99 @ Newegg) Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL19 Memory ($59.99 @ Newegg) Power Supply: Thermaltake Toughpower GF1 PE 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($109.99 @ B&H) Total: $514.95 Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-08-30 15:30 EDT-0400 With my existing RX 570 for now and case/various drives.
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Aug 30, 2020 20:35
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Harold Fjord posted:Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL19 Memory ($59.99 @ Newegg) I want to check this ram vs the mobo QVL, the cas19 makes me suspect it may not be a good one (ryzen typically wants even numbers). But the MSI website is making GBS threads itself in two different browser right now and I can't see it.
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Aug 30, 2020 21:01
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fwiw, I got the 3600x cause it's $8 more than the 3600 and has a slightly faster clock and bigger cooler.
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Aug 30, 2020 22:28
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I’m planning on doing some upgrading. This build is about three years old (I think? I’m dumb). Current build is as such PCPartPicker Part List CPU: Intel Core i7-7700K 4.2 GHz Quad-Core Processor ($179.00) CPU Cooler: CRYORIG H7 49 CFM CPU Cooler (Purchased For $31.45) Thermal Compound: Noctua NT-H1 3.5 g Thermal Paste (Purchased For $7.90) Motherboard: Asus MAXIMUS VIII GENE Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (Purchased For $134.30) Memory: G.Skill Trident Z 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16 Memory (Purchased For $135.00) Storage: Samsung 960 EVO 500 GB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (Purchased For $199.00) Storage: Toshiba X300 4 TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive Storage: Toshiba N300 8 TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($248.99 @ Staples) Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 1060 6GB 6 GB Strix Video Card Case: Fractal Design Define Mini C MicroATX Mid Tower Case (Purchased For $79.99) Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS Plus Gold 550 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (Purchased For $54.90) Monitor: Dell S2719DGF 27.0" 2560x1440 155 Hz Monitor ($380.65 @ Amazon) Keyboard: Logitech G513 Carbon RGB Wired Gaming Keyboard ($269.99 @ Amazon) Mouse: Logitech G903 HERO Wireless Optical Mouse ($99.99 @ Best Buy) Total: $1821.16 Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-08-30 17:40 EDT-0400 I use the thing for daily gaming and as a household Plex server (remote and local, a lot of use but just 3 people). I have a few specific objectives for this upgrade. 1.) RTX 30XX card, probably the 3080? I dunno but that’s what’s pushing this whole upgrade. It’s rare I can get any game to push to 144, even on low settings. 2.) PSU I’ll undoubtably need for the aforementioned GPU upgrade. 3.) additional cooling if needed. I only have the two base case fans in there. Temps are fine for now, but I imagine with a monster GPU temps will get higher. 4.) I’m considering a case change. The case lives in my living room in a pretty small space so I don’t want to go much bigger, however I really need additional space for 3.5 drives. My 12TB is full, and I’ve got tons of 1-4TB drives laying around I’d love to use instead of shelling out for additional large capacity drives for now. Here’s what I’m looking for advice on. Trying to be somewhat cost conscious on everything because the GPU appears like it’s going to hurt. What would be a good PSU with enough headroom to run the GPU/additions 3.5s without breaking my wallet? I prefer modular if possible but can sacrifice on that. Is additional cooling worth it here? And what should I get? Looking for air cooling only. What’s a good case these days? What I would really love would be a M-ATX that has a bunch of 3.5 bay space and can hold a 3 slot GPU, but I’d settle for a smaller ATX that achieves the same goals. I really like the Define 7, but A it’s kinda huge and B it seems enormous.
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Aug 30, 2020 23:24
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Kingnothing posted:I’m planning on doing some upgrading. This build is about three years old (I think? I’m dumb). If you like Fractal and want better cooling the obvious suggestion is the Meshify line. A little case with shitloads of 3.5 drive bays and room for the (rumored to be) huge rear end 3080 is generally an oxymoron though.
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Aug 31, 2020 00:54
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sean10mm posted:If you like Fractal and want better cooling the obvious suggestion is the Meshify line. A little case with shitloads of 3.5 drive bays and room for the (rumored to be) huge rear end 3080 is generally an oxymoron though. Shitloads of 3.5 is probably an exaggeration, but I’d like more that two. I’d probably be happy with 4.
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Aug 31, 2020 00:58
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Please recommend some 120mm case fans with good airflow/static pressure and noise metrics. Ideally, I'd also like: - White LEDs - White plastic But I value performance over aesthetics so I'm not hellbent on that. Right now I am considering: - Be Quiet! Silent Wings 3 - Be Quiet! Shadow Wings 2 - Noctua NF-A12x25 PWM I'm gonna have to buy 6 or 7 of these, but I'm willing to spend a bit if it means a quieter machine and a better fan. I don't want to spend like $500 on fans though, that'd be silly (I say having just learned that those popular Corsair RGB fans are like $50 each). Chimp_On_Stilts fucked around with this message at 01:27 on Aug 31, 2020 |
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Aug 31, 2020 01:25
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Noctua Redux fans perform the same in testing and are cheaper and not poop brown.
sean10mm fucked around with this message at 01:47 on Aug 31, 2020 |
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Aug 31, 2020 01:43
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It's pretty baller that they charge more money for the poop color and a few accessories
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Aug 31, 2020 01:52
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I ordered a white version of the case cause it was $30 less than the black and it won't match any of the all-black, high speed, low drag of my gpu and mobo and now I'm just sad I don't have any poop brown to complete the aesthetic mess
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Aug 31, 2020 01:56
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Elliptical Dick posted:It's not an issue to build a PC with all the parts except the GPU and add that later, is it? I can hold off on gaming for a while but I want to pass my laptop on and need a machine to just browse the internet and do some work with while I wait for the 3070 release. The three options I'm considering are: 1) Use my current GPU in the new rig until I am ready to upgrade 2) Buy a budget card for <$200 for the new rig until I am ready to upgrade 3) Wait for Tuesday and see if I am willing to take the EVGA 90-Day Upgrade Challenge... 
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Aug 31, 2020 02:08
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Kingnothing posted:Shitloads of 3.5 is probably an exaggeration, but I’d like more that two. I’d probably be happy with 4. Silverstone has a bunch of actually smaller than a mid-tower mATX towers with a bunch of drive bays including the PS07, TJ08-E, PS08 and PS09. They are probably smaller than most ITX towers. They all have 5.25” bays that you can convert to 3.5” if you need more than 4 or 5.
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Aug 31, 2020 06:42
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So sounds like I should wait a bit for GPU upgrades, but is it an okay time now to do mobo/cpu upgrade? I had this list a few months ago, is it still valid? Is there anything that would be better at this price point or would be a substantial improvement for a small price bump? ASRock X570 Phantom Gaming 4 - $295 Noctua NH-U12S Cooler - $123 AMD Ryzen 5 3600 - $349 Some ram from kingston or corsair I dunno. Keep in mind I'm in Oz so availability and prices might be slightly strange. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 08:20 on Aug 31, 2020 |
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Aug 31, 2020 08:16
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:The three options I'm considering are: I've sort of gone with option 2. I bought a GTX 1660S for 240 euros which is gonna go in my girlfriend's rig when I upgrade. She games and plays less demanding titles but it will be a good upgrade over the gtx 760 that is currently in there.
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Aug 31, 2020 08:38
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Chimp_On_Stilts posted:(I say having just learned that those popular Corsair RGB fans are like $50 each).
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Aug 31, 2020 08:51
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MikeJF posted:So sounds like I should wait a bit for GPU upgrades, but is it an okay time now to do mobo/cpu upgrade? I'd say if you don't have a specific need for the 570 motherboard you could save a bit of money by getting a B550 instead, which are good for the majority of people's use cases. Edit: it looks like you can get 16GB crucial ballistix 3600 RAM for only a few bucks more than the average price, which people itt recommend because it plays nicer with Ryzen processors Butterfly Valley fucked around with this message at 11:17 on Aug 31, 2020 |
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Aug 31, 2020 11:12
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MikeJF posted:So sounds like I should wait a bit for GPU upgrades, but is it an okay time now to do mobo/cpu upgrade? Depending on what you're using your PC for, a B550M Bazooka could be plenty of motherboard for you. I love Noctua coolers, but if you want to shave a few buck off an Arctic Freezer 34 CO is plenty for a 3600 and quite a bit cheaper. Whatever board you go with, check the QVL and buy some RAM listed on that. 3600 CL16 is optimal but 3200 CL16 is going to be almost the same performance IRL.
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Aug 31, 2020 12:54
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I installed my Noctua tower cooler in the wrong orientation, so it's pulling air directly from the top of the GPU. The cooler has one fan in the center, and there's an exhaust fan at the back of the case pulling air in the other direction through the heatsink. I have two hyper-silent noctua fans installed in the side panel of the case blowing air directly at the GPU and PSU, as well as a 140mm Noctua case fan blowing air out of the top of the case right above the RAM, and two 140mm BeQuiet! intake fans CPU: Ryzen 3900X GPU: Asus Dual OC 2070 Super Case: be quiet! dark base 901 My question is, how much performance or system longevity am I potentially losing by not fixing the heatsink orientation? I almost hosed up my CPU installing it in the first place and I know for a fact that there's waaay too much paste on there so I'm worried I'll finish the job if I try it again. Especially because of how much I had to force it when I had to fasten it on top of the CPU. My current idle temperatures are: CPU Package: 40-50C All others: hovering around 38C I tried out some stress test program which stressed the whole system and it seemed like it topped out at a stable 85C or so, while maintaining either base clock of 3.8 or a stable boost of 4-4.2 across all cores, but I don't know if that's a reliable way to tell if it's throttling? Or if that result is even good? The only thing that seemed to be struggling was my 970 Evo SSD which kept climbing steadily in temperature throughout the test. After a test it very quickly stabilizes back at around 40C for all sensors. How much would you recommend fixing this? Joda fucked around with this message at 16:39 on Aug 31, 2020 |
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Aug 31, 2020 16:28
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Joda posted:I installed my Noctua tower cooler in the wrong orientation, so it's pulling air directly from the top of the GPU. The cooler has one fan in the center, and there's an exhaust fan at the back of the case pulling air in the other direction through the heatsink. I have two hyper-silent noctua fans installed in the side panel of the case blowing air directly at the GPU and PSU, as well as a 140mm Noctua case fan blowing air out of the top of the case right above the RAM, and two 140mm BeQuiet! intake fans I'm having trouble picturing what you did, but the GPU is literally the hottest object in the case so sucking air off that probably isn't great. Especially since there's barely any space between like a D15 and the video card so the airflow is gonna be really bad. And those temps seem really high if you're using a Noctua tower cooler. Not OH poo poo GONNA DIE high, but really defeating the point of using a big tower cooler. Put another way, I'd expect the stock cooler to peak at like 85. "Too much paste" basically never matters unless you went *comically* overboard, excess pasted is just pushed out the sides and that only matters if you're using electrically conductive paste (which most paste isn't for exactly that reason.) GamersNexus tested it and barely anything happened between ideal vs. overkill paste application, so that's probably the least of your worries. It should look like this: https://pcpartpicker.com/b/NjJbt6
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Aug 31, 2020 16:40
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sean10mm posted:I'm having trouble picturing what you did, What I did is that but remove the secondary fan and rotate the heatsink 90 degrees clockwise. So like the worst configuration you can imagine I guess.
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Aug 31, 2020 16:44
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sean10mm posted:I'm having trouble picturing what you did, but the GPU is literally the hottest object in the case so sucking air off that probably isn't great. Especially since there's barely any space between like a D15 and the video card so the airflow is gonna be really bad. And those temps seem really high if you're using a Noctua tower cooler. Not OH poo poo GONNA DIE high, but really defeating the point of using a big tower cooler. I think your link is wrong?
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Aug 31, 2020 16:45
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Joda posted:What I did is that but remove the secondary fan and rotate the heatsink 90 degrees clockwise. So like the worst configuration you can imagine I guess. Gotcha. Yeah that's real bad because air can't move through the thing, the video card is basically plugging one end. If you just used normal thermal paste it shouldn't be stuck on like super glue or anything. At most you should just have to twist it gently to unstick the heat sink from the CPU. Don't yank up hard on it. Kingnothing posted:I think your link is wrong? It should just link to a random pc part picker build where the guy put the D15 in correctly? e: GamersNexus talking about too much paste (within reason) not really doing anything here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUWVVTY63hc sean10mm fucked around with this message at 16:56 on Aug 31, 2020 |
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Aug 31, 2020 16:48
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sean10mm posted:It should just link to a random pc part picker build where the guy put the D15 in correctly? On my end it's just a build list with one external case pic and talking about upgrading.
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Aug 31, 2020 17:00
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Kingnothing posted:On my end it's just a build list with one external case pic and talking about upgrading. And that case picture shows the correct orientation of an installed D15.
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Aug 31, 2020 17:38
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Butterfly Valley posted:And that case picture shows the correct orientation of an installed D15. Oh I'm just an idiot. I thought he was trying to show correct amount of paste.
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Aug 31, 2020 17:54
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Vir posted:The Corsair ML fans also come in multi-packs. The single-color or non-LED ones are usually cheaper than the RGB ones. They aren't quiet at max RPM, but they're fairly quiet at low and medium speeds, and can run at the lowest RPMs I've ever seen. I see these as either out of stock or $40 each (incl. when sold in 3 packs) on Amazon and Newegg. What's up with that? Is there a shortage that drove the price up, or have they always been this expensive?
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Aug 31, 2020 18:24
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Joda posted:My question is, how much performance or system longevity am I potentially losing by not fixing the heatsink orientation? I almost hosed up my CPU installing it in the first place and I know for a fact that there's waaay too much paste on there so I'm worried I'll finish the job if I try it again. Especially because of how much I had to force it when I had to fasten it on top of the CPU. So, the CPU doesn't throttle until 95C. Running at high temperatures probably does not hurt lifespan on a CPU, definitely not a concern when they last for decades anyways. Overvolting is the thing that removes lifespan. You are probably not getting as much boost as you could be getting, but it's not a crippling loss in any way. It's crazy hot for having a noctua D15 on there, even with only one fan. Though you didn't say what the fan RPM is, you may just need to increase some of the fan curves to lower temps. With your ambient case temp being 38C even at idle, I'd guess you have all the fans set pretty low. If you care more about silence than performance, you can leave them as-is. Using the side panel intakes removes some of the concerns about the GPU heating up the CPU intake air. With fresh air coming in right there the CPU will be getting some and the area won't be as much of a hot zone as a normal case layout without side intakes. However, I'm concerned when you say you had to use a ton of force to fasten the noctua. You shouldn't need to, the 4 screw & post method noctua (and pretty much everyone else) uses doesn't need a lot of muscle. You just set the heatsink on the CPU, line up the screws, and tighten down. Unless you were installing the noctua with the motherboard already in the case, and upright? That's very awkward because you have to hold a 5 pound cooler in the right orientation and manage screws with one hand. Chimp_On_Stilts posted:I see these as either out of stock or $40 each (incl. when sold in 3 packs) on Amazon and Newegg. What's up with that? Is there a shortage that drove the price up, or have they always been this expensive? The ML fans were always expensive and I think they're legit expensive to make, not just something they can throw $2 of RGB onto and then charge $15 extra for. The ML have a magnetic bearing that is cool and high tech, and supposedly has great lifespan. The neat thing about the ML fans is they have a crazy-high PWM range. Very few fans can go from 400-2000 RPM. So if you want you can have fans that go from silent to screamingly loud. (Why tho?) I'm not sure they're worth the premium, especially as case fans. I kinda see their advantages being good for a CPU tower and not much else.
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Aug 31, 2020 19:13
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