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fartknocker posted:Fleet numbers chiasaur11 posted:I mean, the original is much, much smaller than the Origins version. You can see on that chart that the Dolos from 079 is about standard ship size, while the Origins Dolos is big enough it doesn't fit on the chart. drat I'm an idiot I saw the gigantic dolos and couldn't look away long enough to see the Regular version.
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Feb 11, 2021 06:16
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chiasaur11 posted:And before it, there was Gihren's flagship, the Dolos, the largest MS carrier ever built. Only 7 Catapults, so the turnaround was slower, but it carried 182 Mobile Suits. I was looking through the last few episodes of 0079 a week or two back to try and see how large Kycilia's fleet is when she leaves Granada, when she fights the White Base etc. along with the size of M'Quve's fleet and noticed that Kycilia's fleet also has a Dolos class carrier. Which appears to be destroyed during the fighting with the White Base, because when she arrives at A Baoa Qu, it's basically just her Gwadan that makes it that far. Even Char's Zanzibar gets lost in the fighting. I'm pretty sure she even notes that she's down to a single ship at one point. Delaz also apparently had one under his command, that Gato was based out of, because of course he loving did. The ships I could make out, for what it's worth are: 1 Dolos class 2 Gwazine class 2 Zanzibar class 3 Musai class 10 Pazock class (supply ships, basically) M'Quve on the other hand, has: 1 Gwazine class 3 Chivay class 10 Musai class 14 Jicco class (assault boats) Which is when he sets out from Granada to reinfornce Solomon, and ends up picking up Zenna and Mineva. When next we see him at Texas though, his fleet is much, much smaller and all that can be see is 1 Chivay class and maybe 3 Musai class. Whether they were lost in fighting retreating from Solomon, or returned to Granada is unclear. The movies might have different numbers too, since I was just looking at the TV episodes. There's some ambiguity though, since it's just taking a look at sequences of animation and noting the number of a given type on screen at once and then using that as the maximum number in the fleet full stop. There could have been meant to be 4 or 5 Musais and they're just shown in different shots etc. Which is how I assume fartknocker calculated ships too, because the fleet at the Zanscare home colony that is destroyed by the Keilas Guile is about 12 or 13 ships on screen at once, but there are several cuts that could be the same ships being destroyed from a different angle or different ships. tsob fucked around with this message at 11:44 on Feb 11, 2021 |
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Feb 11, 2021 11:19
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tsob posted:I was looking through the last few episodes of 0079 a week or two back to try and see how large Kycilia's fleet is when she leaves Granada, when she fights the White Base etc. along with the size of M'Quve's fleet and noticed that Kycilia's fleet also has a Dolos class carrier. Which appears to be destroyed during the fighting with the White Base, because when she arrives at A Baoa Qu, it's basically just her Gwadan that makes it that far. Even Char's Zanzibar gets lost in the fighting. Delaz also apparently had one under his command, that Gato was based out of, because of course he loving did. The ships I could make out, for what it's worth are: Fartknocker might have been working from Entertainment Bibles or similar as well. Gundam's got a lot of official and official-ish material on fleet numbers and the like, and most of it only gets translated in snippits and small chunks. They sometimes contradict each other, and even themselves, but they give more solid numbers than trying to count from the show.
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Feb 11, 2021 11:24
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Their numbers are more definite, certainly, but I'd personally take them with a pinch of salt and if they heavily contradict what the show seems to be trying for, just ignore them because the staff of a show rarely have any input on those books.
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Feb 11, 2021 11:42
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tsob posted:There's some ambiguity though, since it's just taking a look at sequences of animation and noting the number of a given type on screen at once and then using that as the maximum number in the fleet full stop. There could have been meant to be 4 or 5 Musais and they're just shown in different shots etc. Which is how I assume fartknocker calculated ships too, because the fleet at the Zanscare home colony that is destroyed by the Keilas Guile is about 12 or 13 ships on screen at once, but there are several cuts that could be the same ships being destroyed from a different angle or different ships. Pretty much, although the numbers I got were a consensus from not just myself, but a few other people way back in the day. I tend to say “about” and treat most numbers as estimates, as various novels and reference books that sometimes work, sometimes don’t. Within the animation itself, it can also be tricky, as it’s not always consistent, but it can also be easy to miss stuff. The AEUG attack on Jaburo in Zeta is a good example. There’s a really good panning shot of the fleet before the attack that seemingly shows all of it, but at least one Salamis is easy to miss at first because it’s either partially behind or below another ship in the formation, so it threw off counts from even official sources. It’s easier and safer to assume there’s another ship or two around just off screen in a lot of cases, even for stuff where it’s usually fairly consistent like Char’s fleet in CCA, but it can still get you a reasonably accurate assessment in most cases.
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Feb 11, 2021 14:12
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Darth Walrus posted:Warships are much more dangerous in Victory, thanks to advances in armour and beam shield technology. The protagonists spend six whole episodes trying and failing to stop the Motorad Fleet, for instance. Well giant motorcycle battleships that drive over cities are kinda their own thing.
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Feb 12, 2021 00:34
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Running over cities and running over moms
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Feb 12, 2021 02:18
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When I do get around to G-Reco, do people advise the series or the movies (which I understand are still being made?)?
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Feb 12, 2021 02:31
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The Notorious ZSB posted:Well giant motorcycle battleships that drive over cities are kinda their own thing. The Motorad Fleet also make up the core of their space forces once they're launched, and are equally formidable in zero-G.
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Feb 12, 2021 02:39
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Ibblebibble posted:When I do get around to G-Reco, do people advise the series or the movies (which I understand are still being made?)? I haven't seen the movies but the series already feels a bit like they were cramming a longer series into 26 episodes so I can't imagine a shorter run time helps anything.
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Feb 12, 2021 02:46
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Tulalip Tulips posted:Running over cities and running over moms The biking traditions of the middle ages are unstoppable. I've talked before about IBO's ships (on multiple occasions), but I still love how obscenely durable they are. Even when you've got ace pilots doing lightning raids on them, they're usually able to survive long enough for reinforcements to show up. Unlike in the UC, one Mobile Suit going up against multiple battleships usually results in a dead MS pilot. (Also, did some more calculations. Assuming that my earlier Gjallarhorn numbers were more-or-less right, there are about 3,000 Grazes in service, with 146 destroyed on screen. That's fairly similar to the number of Jegans produced by the Federation according to databooks, (fitting their similar roles) and a much larger number of battleships, which fits with how battleships declined in importance in the UC. WrightOfWay posted:I haven't seen the movies but the series already feels a bit like they were cramming a longer series into 26 episodes so I can't imagine a shorter run time helps anything. I actually saw comments that the films work better. Apparently, exposition is better managed, so even though you lose ten minutes, it's easier to understand what's happening. (Five movies for 26 episodes is also much less compressed than 3 movies for 43.) chiasaur11 fucked around with this message at 02:52 on Feb 12, 2021 |
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Feb 12, 2021 02:50
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I'd always advise the series first. The gundam compilations have had varying levels of success but u don't think there's a one that's been more effective at telling it's story than the series itself.
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Feb 12, 2021 02:55
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Gaius Marius posted:I'd always advise the series first. The gundam compilations have had varying levels of success but u don't think there's a one that's been more effective at telling it's story than the series itself. So far, G-Reco's movies seem to be. Artum posted:Having finally tracked down the g-rec movies I have to say I'm impressed at them losing 10 minutes of screen time while covering all the same ground and ending up significantly easier to follow because they actually take the time to establish plot points rather than being show don't tell to a fault.
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Feb 12, 2021 03:00
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The Notorious ZSB posted:Well giant motorcycle battleships that drive over cities are kinda their own thing. Well, besides that part of it, the battleships in Victoy were usually treated as things that you probably don't want to try to solo or take on with very few mobile suits or without covering fire from a friendly battleship, which is a change from say... the 0079-Zeta days where one mobile suit getting close to a ship is pretty bad (lol Radish, or even those random Feddie ships Cima just casually flew up to and blew up in 0083).
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Feb 12, 2021 03:01
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Gaius Marius posted:I'd always advise the series first. The gundam compilations have had varying levels of success but u don't think there's a one that's been more effective at telling it's story than the series itself. The Thunderbolt movies are an obvious exception, since the OVAs were just chopped-up previews of the finished product with less total footage. The Destiny movies - and, more debatably, the SEED movies - are also more effective than the series - they still aren't great, but the CE was padded to fuuuck, and cutting down on flashbacks, repeated footage, and retreading of 0079 helps a lot.
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Feb 12, 2021 03:02
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chiasaur11 posted:(Also, did some more calculations. Assuming that my earlier Gjallarhorn numbers were more-or-less right, there are about 3,000 Grazes in service, with 146 destroyed on screen. That's fairly similar to the number of Jegans produced by the Federation according to databooks, (fitting their similar roles) and a much larger number of battleships, which fits with how battleships declined in importance in the UC. I was thinking about stuff like this earlier, what are MS production levels like in the UC? What are the top 5 MS production runs? I'd assume the Zaku II, GM, maybe a few more fed grunts?
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Feb 12, 2021 04:00
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wdarkk posted:I was thinking about stuff like this earlier, what are MS production levels like in the UC? What are the top 5 MS production runs? I'd assume the Zaku II, GM, maybe a few more fed grunts? Presumedly the Jegan given its long service time.
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Feb 12, 2021 04:23
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wdarkk posted:I was thinking about stuff like this earlier, what are MS production levels like in the UC? What are the top 5 MS production runs? I'd assume the Zaku II, GM, maybe a few more fed grunts? Probably due to the scale of the conflict Zaku II, GM, Doms, Balls, probably after that the Jegan. Alternate answer: RX-78 Gundams with new paint jobs and additional toy gimmicks.
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Feb 12, 2021 04:26
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wdarkk posted:I was thinking about stuff like this earlier, what are MS production levels like in the UC? What are the top 5 MS production runs? I'd assume the Zaku II, GM, maybe a few more fed grunts? Depends on the source, but the One Year War is generally treated as the peak, yeah. The lowest estimate for Zaku production was 2,000 for both the Zaku I and the Zaku II, and the highest estimate put them at 8,000 combined. The most recent figure I've seen puts the Zaku II at 3,200 models and the Zaku I at 800. The F type was by far the most common. (The 8,000 total figure had 3,246 of the Zakus produced as F type) Neither the Dom nor the Gelgoog reached the production numbers of the Zaku I, capping out below 800 for both. (Although Rick Doms and regular Doms put together might reach over 1,000, depending again on source). The most recent numbers for the Gelgoog apparently put them below 200 units, not even charting. GMs get even messier, if you can believe it, with numbers ranging from a mere 288 produced to 3,800. (This one's a case where the low end figures look less ridiculous than the high end, even allowing for the usual fog of war exaggeration. By those numbers, Johnny Ridden would have destroyed the overwhelming majority of all GMs ever produced.) The Jegan's probably third place, with under 3,000 produced. (And only 100 in service at the time of Char's counterattack.) No single large production run, but 30 years of service counts for something. As for Balls, we just know that 1,200 were deployed between Solomon and A Baoa Qu. Going to AUs... probably the Leo, the Geirail, and the Graze are towards the top. Again, long service life, large organizations, standard production unit. As good reason as any to have a lot of them.
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Feb 12, 2021 04:36
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The Jenice and daughtress might be up there for au series. We don't see a whole lot of the previous space war but it looks like they're fighting with comparable number to the uc timeline.
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Feb 12, 2021 04:39
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wdarkk posted:I was thinking about stuff like this earlier, what are MS production levels like in the UC? What are the top 5 MS production runs? I'd assume the Zaku II, GM, maybe a few more fed grunts? chiasaur11 touched on some of these, and as with everything else, it's a mess. Zaku numbers are quite all over the place, but presumably are the largest since even the MS-06C entered production before the war and they were doing variants until the bitter end. A figure of 800 is given for either just the Rick Dom or the entire MS-09 line, depending on source. The Gelgoog is an interesting example of number shenanigans. One of the most commonly cited figures is 165 units, I believe from one of the Master Grade manuals, but this only applies to the basic MS-14A/B/C/S body style, not all the other variants. IIRC, there's around 60 MS-14F Marines, half ending up with Cima, and stuff like handfuls of MS-14Jg Jagers, it probably puts the total production at a max of 250. However, not all of them made it into combat, as I think a chunk of the 165 regular units didn't leave Side 3. Keep in mind, the B-type High Mobility and C-type Cannon units are mainly just sticking on new backpacks on the basic MS-14A body, and it's said that Zeon built 122 cannon backpacks by the end of the war, even though only a handful actually got used. For the GM, it's whole history is a mess, although in an odd way it actually makes it slightly more realistic as you basically have multiple factories working on the same basic guidelines rolling out slightly different units. Off-hand, for stuff we do have numbers on, the pre-production RGM-79[G] has at least 50-60 units built, although this number probably needs inflated as that figure predates stuff like IGLOO showing them more widely deployed. At the same time, you also get the mass production RX-79[G], of which around 30 units are built, but again, I suspect that number could be bumped up a bit. The initial production of the basic RGM-79 at Jaburo, sometimes referred to as the RGM-79A, is 42 units. These units have some issues, particularly in combat on Earth around Odessa, and minor internal updates lead to the RGM-79B, which would be the one seen getting produced in mass in the original series. Supposedly, 288 units are built, giving a total of 330 'basic' GMs. Later sources have worked around this by saying this total likely doesn't include variants and special units (Such as 58 RGC-80 GM Cannons, ~25 Guard/Intercept Customs, ~25 Sniper Customs, a handful Light Armors, etc). Another thing is to say it's only what was built at the main factories on Earth at Jaburo, and doesn't include other "unregistered" production sites elsewhere, to the point that I think one of the later Master Grade manuals basically says the true production run of the GM is impossible to determine. I’ve also seen it suggested that the well known 288 figure only refers to the number of GMs sent from Jaburo to space for the offensives at the end of the war. I think this has been discounted as mixing up numbers and sources, as was very common in the English fandom for years, such a the -79[G] often being given the incorrect production figure of 42 for years that applies to the first basic RGM-79 based on the English-speaking fan are trying to connect what crumbs we had back in the day... Anyway, numbers on variants like the -79D, -79G, and -79GS are lumped into that previously mentioned 'unknown' area, probably ending up in the same 25-50~ area as most of the others, while the RGM-79SP GM Sniper II's production run is generally said to be among the smallest, and probably 20 units at best. There's also a legit question of if the basic RGM-79 design is ever built at Luna II, or if they only developed and built the RGM-79C during the war. The -79C's history has been changed a few times over the years. Originally, it was just a post-war variant, but then 08th MS Team had the almost identical RGM-79[E] running around, so it became a variant developed by Luna II that barely made it to the front for A Baoa Qu, only for IGLOO to come along and show them in sizeable numbers with the EFSF weeks prior to that. Now, it's possible that the -79C could even be the second most heavily built version of the GM, with Luna II producing large numbers of them, but nothing is clear on it! Anyway, if you add up the numbers we kinda know and round them up a bit, it gets you to around 500-600 GMs built during the war, with most of them only seeing combat during the last 2~ months of the war. I personally would inflate those numbers up a bit, and as mentioned, the RB-79 Ball's production has been consistently said to be around 1,200 units. After the OYW, production run data is less well documented in sources, just because those eras aren't as heavily focused on. One random thing I remember is the GM III supposedly "only" got 800 units (Both newly built machines and those upgraded from older models) and it was supposedly the smallest run of a basic GM, so that may have come from one of those sources giving the basic GM a 4-figure run. fartknocker fucked around with this message at 06:26 on Feb 12, 2021 |
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Feb 12, 2021 06:14
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fartknocker posted:After the OYW, production run data is less well documented in sources, just because those eras aren't as heavily focused on. One random thing I remember is the GM III supposedly "only" got 800 units (Both newly built machines and those upgraded from older models) and it was supposedly the smallest run of a basic GM, so that may have come from one of those sources giving the basic GM a 4-figure run. I mean, this isn't an original sentiment, but I lean towards the four digit interpretations for GMs, myself. They're not usually presented as so overwhelmingly powerful that they can take Doms four-on-one with no difficulty, so the Federation fielding a tiny faction of Zeon's MS numbers feels odd when they're the economic juggernaut.
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Feb 12, 2021 06:30
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Yeah, I feel the same way. Even if you want to say Jaburo built the most of any one location, the various other locations certainly can add a lot to easily get the run over a thousand units. Luna II is a great wildcard in all this, as they can easily add a few hundred more -79B units, possibly in addition to whatever large number of 79C they cranked out. I’d just bump all the variants up a little as well to inflate the numbers. The -79[G] pro production Ground GM is a good example, as the 50-60 figure really doesn’t cover what we now see in filmed works, so that could be inflated to 70-80 without much issue.
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Feb 12, 2021 06:44
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Despite the general obsession with sidestories for the OYW era UC I would really like to see the Unicorn era explored more. While it shits the bed at the end and the other two big projects in the time period (Twilight Axis and Narrative) are poorly edited crap I find the notion about the first generation of people to grow up after the OYW to be a compelling hook for future stories. The Federation limps along while the remnants of Zeon impart their grudges onto their children to keep the fight going, until you start getting into the notion of generational conflicts waged by people who weren't even born when the OYW nearly killed humanity. I would like to see how other non-Zeon spacenoid groups start developing on their own without a hot war to undo all their progress because some jumped up crimson rear end in a top hat in a lame mask decides he wants to be the next Char clone. When Unicorn isn't being explosions, bombast and a greatest hits recap of the Universal Century it occasionally has some really good quiet moments like Marida showing Banagher the original chapel on Palau. I could go for a Gundam series that is mainly quiet moments and a bit of action rather than the other way around, but I know I'll probably have to resign my hopes to a sidestory manga rather than Sunrise greenlighting a mecha drama without the mecha.
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Feb 12, 2021 07:43
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Personally, given some stuff revealed in G-Reco, I'm super curious to see how some of the post UC stuff went down so badly I don't know how long after Victory it took, but wide-spread food shortages and cannibalism is... intense
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Feb 12, 2021 07:49
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MechaX posted:Personally, given some stuff revealed in G-Reco, I'm super curious to see how some of the post UC stuff went down so badly Worth noting that G-Reco is in dialogue with Turn-A which means that the future it takes place in is probably vastly far into the future past UC.
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Feb 12, 2021 08:16
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That level of fuckup could honestly only be caused by a catastrophic man-made apocalypse rather than legitimate shortages from climate. Once you're in space and you have reliable means of travel and habitation your resources are basically limited only by how far you want to go to get them. You could farm strawberries out past Pluto if you wanted to. So I imagine there was something beyond even a calamity war that must have just turbofucked whatever food supply humanity had left.
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Feb 12, 2021 08:18
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MechaX posted:Personally, given some stuff revealed in G-Reco, I'm super curious to see how some of the post UC stuff went down so badly If we're looking for backstory, widespread food shortages form the basis of the plot for G-Savior, and Unicorn talks about how Earth is reliant on the colonies for basic necessities in the late UC. There's at least some leadup just from what we've got filmed. On the other hand, Tomino has said G-Reco comes after an alternate UC, but Tomino also said that it came after Turn A, so... basically, Tomino is inherently and intentionally untrustworthy when it comes to Gundam timelines.
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Feb 12, 2021 08:38
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If we're doing 'Gundam without Gundams', I want a UC remake of Sorcerer. Yazan Gable and a bunch of other runaway fuckups driving a Zaku Tanker full of distressingly sensitive explosives across the steaming jungles of Jaburo.
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Feb 12, 2021 09:09
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When it comes to UC suggested production numbers I usually mentally take those figures and depending on the figure in question either double it or stick an extra zero afterwards and that usually feels more acceptable, or at least it gives more leeway for all the various side stories and games the original numbers muck up
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Feb 12, 2021 09:14
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MechaX posted:Personally, given some stuff revealed in G-Reco, I'm super curious to see how some of the post UC stuff went down so badly Not very long, the food shortages comes up as a plot point in G-Savior, and that's only about maybe two generations after Victory
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Feb 12, 2021 09:18
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Ibblebibble posted:When I do get around to G-Reco, do people advise the series or the movies (which I understand are still being made?)? If you get around to G-Reco once the movies are done (or don't mind waiting), there seems to be so little cut from them that it's mainly just stronger pacing, but who knows how that'll turn out for the last 3 movies? There's also the issue that getting them means paying Japanese Blu-ray prices at the moment; you can probably get all of the series a comparable price to the first movie. The movies seem like they'll be the best way to watch G-Reco, since so far they feel smoother and I hope that makes it more approachable than the TV series was for some people, but the series is still good.
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Feb 12, 2021 09:37
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Arcsquad12 posted:Despite the general obsession with sidestories for the OYW era UC I would really like to see the Unicorn era explored more. While it shits the bed at the end and the other two big projects in the time period (Twilight Axis and Narrative) are poorly edited crap I find the notion about the first generation of people to grow up after the OYW to be a compelling hook for future stories. The Federation limps along while the remnants of Zeon impart their grudges onto their children to keep the fight going, until you start getting into the notion of generational conflicts waged by people who weren't even born when the OYW nearly killed humanity. I would like to see how other non-Zeon spacenoid groups start developing on their own without a hot war to undo all their progress because some jumped up crimson rear end in a top hat in a lame mask decides he wants to be the next Char clone. When Unicorn isn't being explosions, bombast and a greatest hits recap of the Universal Century it occasionally has some really good quiet moments like Marida showing Banagher the original chapel on Palau. I could go for a Gundam series that is mainly quiet moments and a bit of action rather than the other way around, but I know I'll probably have to resign my hopes to a sidestory manga rather than Sunrise greenlighting a mecha drama without the mecha. I mean, War in the Pocket and IBO show that you can get a less action heavy series, and they both were pretty popular, both in Japan and abroad. (They also moved a lot of plastic, which deals with the most obvious objection Bandai might have.) You also have pretty minimal mobile suit action in the Origin anime, and that got six movies. I think getting a more meditative UC series isn't impossible. It's just going to need something in the premise to draw eyeballs beyond "It's a Gundam anime... but with less fighting!" (You might like Gundam: Behind the Front if you haven't seen it yet. Fake documentary interviewing One Year War survivors.)
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Feb 12, 2021 09:45
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chiasaur11 posted:I mean, War in the Pocket and IBO show that you can get a less action heavy series, and they both were pretty popular, both in Japan and abroad. (They also moved a lot of plastic, which deals with the most obvious objection Bandai might have.) You also have pretty minimal mobile suit action in the Origin anime, and that got six movies. IBO works as a less-action-heavy because its action is a deliberately brutal affair. Any time a fight's starting you immediately know that it is not going to be pretty and a lot of people are going to die horribly.
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Feb 12, 2021 10:11
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drrockso20 posted:Not very long, the food shortages comes up as a plot point in G-Savior, and that's only about maybe two generations after Victory Broke: There was a really unfortunate crop blight that kneecapped a core productive agricultural crop. Colonies were used to "Just in time" agriculture due to the high productivity possible, so there were not substantial reserves. Solutions were found within a couple of years, but... those were a bad couple of years. Woke: As above, but it is being done by some people pursuing the dream of Crux Dogatie, that everyone ought to be miserable and suffer for some goddamn reason or other. If you have agro-terrorists running around dropping blights like they were hot EPs, you really could gently caress things up. Bespoke: People's hunger for the true warm natural embrace of Earth's environment was expressed by spontaneous cannibalism, and the food shortage thing is a polite lie advanced by the SU-Cordist religion to conceal that people taste deeeelicious, raw or fried.
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Feb 12, 2021 10:35
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Nessus posted:I can think of a few explanations... The most recent(and probably final) Crossbone spinoff apparently goes into it as it's set after Victory, basically that last hoorah of the Federation at the end of Victory led pretty much immediately to the Federation collapsing for good and pretty much all of inhabited space to collapse into Mad Max style anarchy(complete with everyone using ridiculous Mobile Suits pieced together from miscellaneous junk) due to resource scarcity, which seems to be setting things up both for G-Savior and G-Reco
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Feb 12, 2021 11:24
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I imagine the end of UC as described on G-Reco has to be pretty far past anything else we've seen because they've got the G-Lucifer flying around with the Moonlight Butterfly.
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Feb 12, 2021 12:04
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Darth Walrus posted:The Motorad Fleet also make up the core of their space forces once they're launched, and are equally formidable in zero-G. Legs and wheels are both really efficient and impressive ways of moving in space according to Gundam, and even treads are pretty decent but just using thrusters like a Ball or the older fighters like a TinCod is pokey and kind of poo poo  chiasaur11 posted:Going to AUs... probably the Leo, the Geirail, and the Graze are towards the top. Again, long service life, large organizations, standard production unit. As good reason as any to have a lot of them. The grunt suits used by the Moonrace seen in Turn A (and possibly some in G-Reco) are quite possibly in contention too, just because it's implied some of the designs (like the SUMO and WaDom) have been in use for thousands of years, and while the Turn A was able to bury lots of units in caches that became Mountain Cycles so that they were basically as good as new even thousands of years later due to the nanomachines cocooning them, the Moonrace didn't have that kind of technology and so it's unlikely they only had a small number of units from any design and just kept them in good shape for the 5,000 to 10,000 years that their society lasted. Syd Mead also mentions in one interview that he was directed to make the legs on the WaDom organic looking, because they were apparently grown on the Moon and are biomechanical to some degree. Which isn't actually something shown or even implied in the series itself, but is presumably why the legs have that weird, veiny look/texture. Plus, with Turn A, you can probably add a bit more to the Zaku II's production numbers. Arcsquad12 posted:That level of fuckup could honestly only be caused by a catastrophic man-made apocalypse rather than legitimate shortages from climate. Once you're in space and you have reliable means of travel and habitation your resources are basically limited only by how far you want to go to get them. You could farm strawberries out past Pluto if you wanted to. So I imagine there was something beyond even a calamity war that must have just turbofucked whatever food supply humanity had left. Maybe one of Char's spiritual descendants finally got off an Axis type attack, and hosed over the Earth so the Spacenoids could have self-determination. jackhunter64 posted:If we're doing 'Gundam without Gundams', I want a UC remake of Sorcerer. Yazan Gable and a bunch of other runaway fuckups driving a Zaku Tanker full of distressingly sensitive explosives across the steaming jungles of Jaburo. I read a bit of a book a couple of years back about the birth of the SAS and how Churchill had special forces operating behind enemy lines in occupied territory with no official support or definite objectives beyond "cause chaos we can exploit" for an extended period, so they basically had to rob German troops or territory to fund themselves and use materials they'd taken from German troops like German tanks etc. to pull off any operations they decided on. I would love a Gundam series about a Federation troop within Zeon territory for an extended period, as they cause chaos while blending with the local population as a way to explore the setting a bit, and flesh out Zeon and the Federation with only minimal mobile suit action when they occasionally steal a Zaku II or Dom to facilitate some new plan.
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Feb 12, 2021 13:14
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I've stalled out on episode 13 of Gundam Seed. Kira isn't as annoying as I remembered but Flay definitely is just as crazy as I remembered. Also Lacus's initial intro was annoying but not as bad as I remember. I'm just not super invested in anything at this point. Even Victory had something that got me a bit interested by this point. Mu is the only character I like even knowing how poo poo turns out.
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Feb 12, 2021 21:51
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Tulalip Tulips posted:I've stalled out on episode 13 of Gundam Seed. Kira isn't as annoying as I remembered but Flay definitely is just as crazy as I remembered. Also Lacus's initial intro was annoying but not as bad as I remember. I'm just not super invested in anything at this point. Even Victory had something that got me a bit interested by this point. Mu is the only character I like even knowing how poo poo turns out. SEED is just 0079 with a few shades of variance for around the first 20 episodes, so its not the most compelling stuff (not to say that its bad story, just that its very familiar ground) until they get to Orb. SEED remains on the whole just very okay.
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Feb 12, 2021 22:00
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