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This was a more optimistic prediction. 2012 for book 7!
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Feb 6, 2021 08:26
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This discussion made me look up what happened with The War Against the Chtorr, a SF-series by David Gerrold I used to read. After his fourth book in 1993 the series just ground to a halt, with the author occasionally piping up that yep, he was still writing. Sounding familiar? Well, he actually managed to finish book 5 (manuscript first draft only) in 2015, and the book was slated to release in 2017. In 2017, Gerrold announced that now he would need a book 6. Book 5 was renamed and the title of book 5 is now the title of book 6. For some reason I'm getting now this really bad feeling of déjà vu. 
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Feb 6, 2021 12:55
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I was thinking about this recently: If I had to choose a fantasy/sci-fi author who'd be GRRM's polar opposite it'd probably be... Ursula K. Le Guin. Treats her creations with dignity and respect, always meets deadlines, writes with astonishing brevity and clarity. Earthsea, her most marketable work (arguably) has never been successfully adapted despite many failed attempts - whereas the sole adaptation of GRRM's work became the most successful TV show in history, probably. Kind of sad, really.
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Feb 6, 2021 13:21
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Definitely not the sole adaptation: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x73w1ys Part of GRRM's whole mass appeal was that he had TV experience and knew how to structure a narrative with loads of episodic cliffhangers for each POV chapter. I remember my very first readthrough "Aw man a Dany chapter? I was so into Tyrion's thing..." and by the end "Aw man a Jon chapter, I wanted to see what happened with Dany's thing..." and that whole sense of momentum to resolve each thread keeping me pushing through the story.
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Feb 6, 2021 21:52
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Enjoy....found in Volume 19a of the SF-LOVERS mailing list. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 94 02:28:40 GMT From: spamman@u.washington.edu (Michael Pearce) Reply-to: sf-lovers-written@Rutgers.Edu Subject: Re: George R. R. Martin According to the December issue of Locus. George R.R. Martin sold an epic fantasy trilogy, "A Song of Ice and Fire," to Bantam for a large amount of money. The three titles are: A Game of Thrones A Dance With Dragons The Winds of Winter Bad news is that the first novel isn't due until early 1996. Michael Pearce ------------------------------
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Feb 9, 2021 15:43
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quantumfoam posted:Enjoy....found in Volume 19a of the SF-LOVERS mailing list. What are we looking at here?
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Feb 9, 2021 15:57
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the spiritual beginning of tbt
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Feb 9, 2021 16:05
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Is that like usenet or something
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Feb 9, 2021 17:17
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The Outlander series has actually been going on for longer than ASOIAF but I’m not sure how many of the fans care because most of the original ones are probably dead.
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Feb 9, 2021 17:21
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quantumfoam posted:Enjoy....found in Volume 19a of the SF-LOVERS mailing list. And he’s still only 2 for 3 in delivering that! 27 years!!!
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Feb 9, 2021 22:37
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latinotwink1997 posted:And he’s still only 2 for 3 in delivering that! 27 years!!! Yeah, but how long has he taken in like Time Cube math?
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Feb 10, 2021 06:57
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Evil Fluffy posted:. Like, even as a kid when I heard that prophecy my immediate thought was "how do none of these people, including YODA, grasp that the prophecy requires the Sith rising to power and being on equal footing, or overthrowing the Jedi to 'balance' the Jedi having been in power?" That didn't bother me. That is something that makes sense in retrospect, but not when you are in the middle of it ( for the participants ). I think what I hate most about these movies is that the trailers manage to push all my emotional buttons, it's like they know what makes me tick. I have found myself literally tearing up over the years when I watched a new trailer, and I hate that. Because I know the movies will be underwhelming and fail to deliver to my expectations. If they know me well enough to make these trailers that hit all the right buttons, why do they f up the movies over and over? They always feel so "designed by committee". But anyway, I just stopped by to see if any new books were out
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Feb 13, 2021 09:37
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pseudanonymous posted:I often got the feeling there was more to the Rhaegar story, because for a not batshit insane guy he did a batshit insane thing. Like he must've known his father was nuts and that just grabbing Lyssa would cause problems. Supposedly only 50% of Targs are nuts and he was supposed to be one of the not nuts ones, and he doesn't come across as nuts just stupid. Yeah and the story about him reading something, deciding he needed to learn to fight, etc etc. He must have assumed he was the prince that was promised or w.e. Not sure what that had to do with Lyssa though. Maybe he was just loving crazy and losing it.
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Feb 13, 2021 13:14
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In a world where dragons and magic are real, can a person really be diagnosed with a mental illness if he gets convinces he's the subject of some old prophecy? That's kinda how the whole 'gritty fantasy genre' has its cake and eats it too, imo. Like yeah, rhaegar did a crazy thing but also it's completely rational, but is it??? oh we don't know this is gritty fantasy!
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Feb 13, 2021 15:10
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Even the "good" royalty will start a war that kills your family if they get a notion that they are more important than they already think they are.
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Feb 13, 2021 15:35
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emanresu tnuocca posted:In a world where dragons and magic are real, can a person really be diagnosed with a mental illness if he gets convinces he's the subject of some old prophecy? What if the prophecy just straight up tells you "this dude is insane"?
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Feb 13, 2021 15:43
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TERFherder posted:Yeah and the story about him reading something, deciding he needed to learn to fight, etc etc. He must have assumed he was the prince that was promised or w.e. Not sure what that had to do with Lyssa though. Maybe he was just loving crazy and losing it. I think he figured that the prince that was promised would come about from his union with a Stark, he was probably already promised/married to Elia at that point so he knew that any way to make the prophecy happen would lead to conflict, hence his decision to learn how to fight. That's how I've always interpreted it anyway.
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Feb 13, 2021 15:54
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TERFherder posted:Yeah and the story about him reading something, deciding he needed to learn to fight, etc etc. He must have assumed he was the prince that was promised or w.e. Not sure what that had to do with Lyssa though. Maybe he was just loving crazy and losing it. I think he got the idea from the prophecy that he was the father of the prince who was promised, not the promised one himself. He needed Lyanna to be the mother because the prince was supposed to be "the song of ice and fire." And as it turned out, he was, so chalk up another one for prophecy I guess 
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Feb 13, 2021 15:54
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So just finished AFfC and started ADwD... Was/does anyone think there will be any payoff to this quote?Archmaester Marwyn posted:Who do you think killed all the dragons the last time around? Gallant dragonslayers armed with swords? The world the Citadel is building has no place in it for sorcery or prophecy or glass candles, much less for dragons. Ask yourself why Aemon Targaryen was allowed to waste his life upon the Wall, when by rights he should have been raised to archmaester. His blood was why. He could not be trusted. No more than I can. Octy fucked around with this message at 09:03 on Feb 14, 2021 |
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Feb 14, 2021 08:54
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Octy posted:So just finished AFfC and started ADwD... Was/does anyone think there will be any payoff to this quote? yes, in the next book 
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Feb 14, 2021 10:26
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Octy posted:So just finished AFfC and started ADwD... Was/does anyone think there will be any payoff to this quote? Actually, that quote was paid off just a couple years ago - or part of it was, at any rate. I am referring to the 2018 release Fire & Blood, which is part 1 of an in-universe book written by 'Archmaester Gyldayn' , who apparently served at Summerhall during the reign of Aegon V. Part 1 covers Aegon's Conquest through to the end of The Dance of The Dragons and the reign of Aegon III 'Dragonsbane', which is a pretty comprehensive period of time. As the book is written by a prominent Archmaester, it definitely interprets and filters these events and characters through the inherent biases of the Citadel. It explores various reasons why both the Maesters and the Faith of the Seven (both are centered in Oldtown, remember) may have had a mutual vested interest in wiping out the Dragons, and the book specifically covers the period of time when all but one of the ~18 or so known remaining dragons died over a period of like 2-3 years during the Dance of the Dragons. There are some other pretty intense sections, too, that refer to reasons why the Maesters/Faith might have an interest in obliterating whatever trace of magic/sorcery shows up in their world - the fate of Aerea Targaryen comes to mind, for instance. There's some other amusing stuff - for instance, Gyldayn has a massive man-crush on Jahaerys I "The Conciliator/Old King" and discourses at length about what a great and brilliant king, husband, father, warrior and scholar he was, and how he was just the absolute greatest king that there ever was. But in truth, while his reign was long and prosperous, he was a deeply flawed king and ruler whose tendency to play favorites, and indecisiveness concerning the line of succession truly laid the groundwork and set the seeds for the 'Dance of the Dragons'. So as much as Maegor the Cruel with his multiple wives is a riff on Henry VIII, I'd say that Jahaerys the Conciliator is a riff on Louis XV, or 'Louis the Beloved' whose rule nevertheless led rapidly to The French Revolution after he was gone. kaworu fucked around with this message at 11:26 on Feb 14, 2021 |
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Feb 14, 2021 11:23
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It really just reads as generic "We hate this bloodline for being corrupt nobles but in this particular case they also had actual giant monsters attached to their name so we're extra-thorough in clamping down on them" posturing.
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Feb 14, 2021 11:30
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kaworu posted:Actually, that quote was paid off just a couple years ago - or part of it was, at any rate. I think the "payoff" in this case is the answer to why they shouldn't trust Marwyn, aka "What the gently caress is Marwyn up to?" along with the corollary "why is that one Sand Snake there at the Citadel in disguise?"
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Feb 15, 2021 21:45
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Phenotype posted:I think the "payoff" in this case is the answer to why they shouldn't trust Marwyn, aka "What the gently caress is Marwyn up to?" along with the corollary "why is that one Sand Snake there at the Citadel in disguise?" Yeah, true enough. The glass candle tells us quite a bit, one of the cooler theories I remember hearing was that Maester Aemon's dreams were being invaded by Marwyn/Sarella, and they were disguising themselves as Egg and Dunk while getting Aemon drunk at the inn that serves the great cider on the Honeywine in order to essentially wring information from him. I have no idea if glass candles are *that* badass, but it's a cool explanation as to why Marwyn claims to already know Sam's story before he hears it. Another interesting theory is that Marwyn may be politically allied with Prince Doran on one level or another, and that by extension Qyburn is also his agent and has been purposely working to undermine the Lannisters from within. Hard to imagine that Qyburn doesn't have some ulterior motives, and I tend to subscribe to the theory that The Brave Companions were the sellsword company started by Oberyn Martell after he left the Second Sons, which would link Qyburn more solidly to Dornish interests. Marwyn's probably been my favorite enigma of the entire series. On the one hand, he seems like a pretty cool and forward-thinking guy who's got a lot figured out. But on the other hand, he's directly linked to some of the darkest, sketchiest, most magical and murderous people in the series - Qyburn, Mirri Maz Duur and Jaqen are the three that immediately come to mind. I have a hard time thinking he'd have Pate in his inner circle if he thought he was the same fuckup acolyte we met in the prologue.
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Feb 16, 2021 07:12
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Vichan posted:I think he figured that the prince that was promised would come about from his union with a Stark, he was probably already promised/married to Elia at that point so he knew that any way to make the prophecy happen would lead to conflict, hence his decision to learn how to fight. That's how I've always interpreted it anyway. Kylaer posted:I think he got the idea from the prophecy that he was the father of the prince who was promised, not the promised one himself. He needed Lyanna to be the mother because the prince was supposed to be "the song of ice and fire." And as it turned out, he was, so chalk up another one for prophecy I guess OK thanks. that makes sense. I think I skipped over much of the prophecy when it would come up. Same with Dany's hallucinations in the house of purple bald guys she burned down. I'm not super patient for sorting that poo poo out. I [kept] waiting for GRRM to spell more things out - Maybe Barristen would tell stories that started to hint that Rhagar was actually delusional or something. I don't know how GRRM planned that out. kaworu posted:Marwyn's I forgot he existed. I haven't thought of him in like 15 years.
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Feb 16, 2021 14:47
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The glass candles are a cool image. It's one of the few things I remember about the series that wasn't in the tv show. The sorcery at the edges of the world thing was a major draw of ASOIAF. Too bad we'll never find out how it all plays out.
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Feb 16, 2021 16:26
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All GRRM ever did was pile onto it tbh. I'm not feeling like it was too big a loss considering how little ultimately played out in the show.
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Feb 16, 2021 18:00
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It'd be amazing if they brought on Damen Lindelhof to like co-write a series with Martin, just endless questions with no payoff or meaning to them. Intriguing mysteries that get you interested, and then final acts that are the equivalent of "and then he woke up, it was all a dream".
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Feb 16, 2021 19:46
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pseudanonymous posted:It'd be amazing if they brought on Damen Lindelhof to like co-write a series with Martin, just endless questions with no payoff or meaning to them. Intriguing mysteries that get you interested, and then final acts that are the equivalent of "and then he woke up, it was all a dream". Neither The Leftovers or Watchmen were like this.
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Feb 16, 2021 20:31
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Klungar posted:Neither The Leftovers or Watchmen were like this. The Leftovers was absolutely like that, and boring as gently caress, I stopped watching, so maybe it had a payoff but it wasn't worth reaching. I don't have access to HBO anymore so I can't comment on that.
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Feb 16, 2021 21:14
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The Leftovers is good, but is a bit like that I remember the big mystery of the show being revealed on a short conversation on the last episode was pretty underwhelming
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Feb 16, 2021 21:22
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That’s because you’re there for the very good character interactions and not for the ~mystery~. I get wanting to know what happened but you’re there to see these very flawed people come to grips with a huge chunk of the worlds population just popping out of existence.
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Feb 16, 2021 21:27
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Invalid Validation posted:That’s because you’re there for the very good character interactions and not for the ~mystery~. I get wanting to know what happened but you’re there to see these very flawed people come to grips with a huge chunk of the worlds population just popping out of existence. I know, I still liked it. But Im a sucker for mysteries so yes, I was pretty curious for the whole how and why of it and got a bit disappointed
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Feb 16, 2021 21:37
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pseudanonymous posted:The Leftovers was absolutely like that, and boring as gently caress, I stopped watching, so maybe it had a payoff but it wasn't worth reaching. How can you claim The Leftovers didn't provide any payoff or meaning in the end when you never actually finished the show?
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Feb 16, 2021 21:42
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pseudanonymous posted:It'd be amazing if they brought on Damen Lindelhof to like co-write a series with Martin, just endless questions with no payoff or meaning to them. Intriguing mysteries that get you interested, and then final acts that are the equivalent of "and then he woke up, it was all a dream". The Lubeman that was promised
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Feb 16, 2021 21:45
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emanresu tnuocca posted:In a world where dragons and magic are real, can a person really be diagnosed with a mental illness if he gets convinces he's the subject of some old prophecy? This always drove me nuts in fantasy worlds where monsters and magic demonstrably exist and there are whole histories of apocalyptic events that happened, but nobody can find it in themselves to believe Sir Honorable of House Trustworthy when he says that a big, big monster is gonna come and hurt people. Pennsylvanian fucked around with this message at 01:28 on Feb 17, 2021 |
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Feb 16, 2021 22:28
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Ccs posted:The sorcery at the edges of the world thing was a major draw of ASOIAF. Too bad we'll never find out how it all plays out. I really was hoping for background on what was happening. Why was magic "coming back" into the world? Are there really gods? Do those gods fight other gods? Is it all just blood magic with everyone shaping what happens to pretend there are gods? I didn't want it spelled out, but I thought we would get more along those lines. Did anyone here read Thieves World books? Because of all the different authors, how magic worked ( or didn't ) was different from one story to the next. And that was cool - but GRRM was writing like that too, and I would have expected some kind of overarching theme tying things together, instead of just random cool "teaser" stacked on top of the last cool "teaser". I mean I don't the other side of the pendulum with a Sanderson-esque "He then casted MagicMissle +1" or whatever - but yeah. I want some closure on WTF is happening at the macro Gods/Magic level.
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Feb 17, 2021 14:19
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Klungar posted:How can you claim The Leftovers didn't provide any payoff or meaning in the end when you never actually finished the show? Shut up Damon.
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Feb 17, 2021 14:30
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Invalid Validation posted:That’s because you’re there for the very good character interactions and not for the ~mystery~. I get wanting to know what happened but you’re there to see these very flawed people come to grips with a huge chunk of the worlds population just popping out of existence. Yea the whole story is “how do people react to a literally unexplainable event”. Even the last episode “reveal” doesn’t reveal the “how” or “why” and in fact may just be the character outright lying
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Feb 17, 2021 15:08
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Pennsylvanian posted:This always drove me nuts in fantasy worlds where monsters and magic demonstrably exist and there are whole histories of apocalyptic events that happened, but nobody can find it in themselves to believe Sir Honorable of House Trustworthy when he says that a big, big monster is gonna come and hurt people. there's literally a temperature based apocalypse with plenty of evidence that people deny is occuring in the real world right now
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Feb 17, 2021 15:27
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