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NihilCredo posted:Do high-rank pariahs actually kill psykers by proximity? I thought they just shut down their powers and made them extremely uncomfortable as a result. Jurgen caused a psyker to start having seizures so I imagine a higher level one basically gives people aneurysms.
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Mar 1, 2021 04:16
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abrosheen posted:I haven't read Mortis, and I haven't read any Horus Heresy past Mechanicus, which I had just started when Penitent came out. How much will I appreciate all this more having read Mortis? I have a condensed reading list for the heresy that I might finally be motivated to get through. I haven't read Penitent yet, so I am just assuming I am guessing the connection correctly. There is definitely some stuff in Mortis that relates to Abnett's inquisitor books though. That being said, I don't think its a really huge thing, but it definitely provides some background. I wouldn't jump right to Mortis, you really should read the whole SoT series to get the full experience, I have loved it. First Wall was probably the worst, but I still enjoyed it and wouldn't skip it. There are some more HH you should read as well like Master of Mankind, although there is a lot you can skip.
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Mar 1, 2021 05:56
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I think in one of the books it's stated that pariahs have degrees of blankness in the same way as psykers do — just in the negative rather than the positive. With that in mind, for the original Bequin, it *sorta* makes sense that originally, when she was just an 18-year-old who didn't even know what she was, she was only mildly off-putting, even if she was capable of much more later on, in the same way that both Eisenhorn and Ravenor increase their psyker levels as they get older. In the first Eisenhorn book, he just as the "will" thing and that's it. In the Magos, he's described as an Alpha. Of course, it's unclear what's based on skill and increased experience, what's based on tech (e.g., Ravenor's chair) or forbidden warp magic or items (e.g., Eisenhorn's staff) that amplify your existing level, and what's just plain ol' thematic power creep or an author forgetting what they'd said earlier in the series. But I think there is a fair implication that time + experience let you amplify whatever you've got. Then again, it's 40k, so there's also probably something in the lore that contradicts everything I just said.
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Mar 1, 2021 16:47
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That does not make a lot of sense to me. Having a soul/warp presence seems like it should be pretty binary-either you have it or you don’t. And it definitely shouldn’t be something you can like, practice.
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Mar 1, 2021 19:26
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It’s not just a lack of presence, it’s anti-presence. Positive and negative rather than on and off.
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Mar 1, 2021 19:34
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von Metternich posted:That does not make a lot of sense to me. Having a soul/warp presence seems like it should be pretty binary-either you have it or you don’t. And it definitely shouldn’t be something you can like, practice. Nah, if it hasn't been outright stated its fairly well established that there are grades/levels of presence. Tau have very weak warp presence which explains part of their delio. Iron Hands warp presence gets weaker the more augmentic they become, in theory. (There is an Iron hand psyker in one of the books that noticed that as his brothers become more and more bionic it becomes harder and harder to detect/see them psychically. Pyskers are easier to see/detect in warp related matters than Joe Blow. Probably a ton more examples.
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Mar 1, 2021 19:42
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Yeah but the Tau aren’t blanks, they don’t suppress psychic powers and people don’t feel freaked out by them on a visceral level (any more so than other aliens anyways)
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Mar 1, 2021 19:53
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Tau do have a very faint Warp presence. It's enough to weird out a Psyker looking to probe their minds (see Eliphas in Dark Crusade) but not actively harmful to warp entities like anti-warp blanks.
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Mar 1, 2021 19:57
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Telsa Cola posted:Jurgen caused a psyker to start having seizures so I imagine a higher level one basically gives people aneurysms. I stand by my theory that Jurgen is pretty high up there as far as being a blank goes. An honest to goodness daemon prince burned when she touched him. The Culexus have the benefit of their Animus Speculum to enhance their aura. Knowing what a speculum is it probably sends a anti-psychic goatse at whatever it's aimed at. "By Tzeentch it's got eight fingers... and a ring! " *dies*
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Mar 1, 2021 20:04
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von Metternich posted:Yeah but the Tau aren’t blanks, they don’t suppress psychic powers and people don’t feel freaked out by them on a visceral level (any more so than other aliens anyways) ...so? It's just showing there are absolutely different levels of warp presences and that blanks and psykers are on opposite ends, with the Tau being closer to blanks than psykers. Pyskers get weirded out by Tau I think because yeah they are all very faint and that's not normal. I envision blanks as basically being blackholes/sinks of warp energy.
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Mar 1, 2021 20:07
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I feel like even these replies are problematic / leading, and should be in spoiler tags too. Maybe go fix it, as someone who finished it this morning, I’d be furious if I’d seen this first.
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Mar 1, 2021 21:40
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Telsa Cola posted:...so? It's just showing there are absolutely different levels of warp presences and that blanks and psykers are on opposite ends, with the Tau being closer to blanks than psykers. More Tau are closer to 0 than most. It’s not they’re blanks or psykers, they’re just not particularly present. Of course THAT is also kinda problematic in a world where it describes +1 (Human) as ‘having a soul’ and +100 being the brightest Psyker, to say a whole species is ‘not really there’ is really... uh... yeah. Basically it’s not a line GW are particularly keen to delve because it creates problems. I always liked to think it’s more true Pariahs (Culexus, etc.) are -100; They cause genuine revulsion/horror in Humans, Psykers & Daemons literally begin to die near them, etc. Blanks & Nulls are the numbers between -100 & 0 - Varying degrees of the above, from simply making people uncomfortable onwards. E: Now I’ve just realised that given the Abnettverse grades Psykers by Greek letter, with Beta being the most powerful known (presuming Primarchs/Emperor are Alpha) then they totally should have graded Nulls inversely, and had Omega level Nulls as Pariahs, and people like Alizebeth Bequin be Zeta, etc. I’m actually annoyed authors haven’t already done this. Shockeh fucked around with this message at 21:49 on Mar 1, 2021 |
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Mar 1, 2021 21:44
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Arcsquad12 posted:Tau do have a very faint Warp presence. It's enough to weird out a Psyker looking to probe their minds (see Eliphas in Dark Crusade) but not actively harmful to warp entities like anti-warp blanks. A demon pointed out in the Farsight novels that Tau souls are just weak sauce, the diet coke of the warp.
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Mar 1, 2021 21:53
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Angry Lobster posted:A demon pointed out in the Farsight novels that Tau souls are just weak sauce, the diet coke of the warp. RC Cola.
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Mar 1, 2021 23:18
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I'm mad at myself for putting off the Ravenor books for this long because they fuckin' rule.
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Mar 1, 2021 23:22
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As far as I can tell, Mortis is supposed to be out on amazon as an ebook on the 18th? Am I way off on this?
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Mar 1, 2021 23:39
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Inspector_666 posted:I'm mad at myself for putting off the Ravenor books for this long because they fuckin' rule.
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Mar 2, 2021 00:55
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Shockeh posted:More Tau are closer to 0 than most. It’s not they’re blanks or psykers, they’re just not particularly present. Of course THAT is also kinda problematic in a world where it describes +1 (Human) as ‘having a soul’ and +100 being the brightest Psyker, to say a whole species is ‘not really there’ is really... uh... yeah. It's not consistent across the lore, but they have started referring to the strongest nulls as Omega level.
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Mar 2, 2021 06:59
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Telsa Cola posted:Jurgen caused a psyker to start having seizures so I imagine a higher level one basically gives people aneurysms. This is one of the "my immersion" issues I have with the Ciaphas Cain books (which lets face it, aren't exactly hardcore 40k). The fact that Jurgen is this extremely powerful anti-psyker, a goddam badass soldier, fiercely loyal and too dumb/stubborn a believer to be tempted to chaos and yet when an inquisitor discovers him she allows this super rare, invaluable, ready-to-go resource stay in the guard where statistically he's likely to be thrown into a pointless meat grinder war in the rear end-end of the sector and die on a pointless hill somewhere. I guess maybe there's the angle that she knows Ciaphus Cain is utterly dependant on him and having an inspirational hero to the imperium increase his chances of staying alive does more for moral and the large scale wars than an inquisistion crew, but still...
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Mar 2, 2021 09:28
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Dog_Meat posted:This is one of the "my immersion" issues I have with the Ciaphas Cain books (which lets face it, aren't exactly hardcore 40k). The fact that Jurgen is this extremely powerful anti-psyker, a goddam badass soldier, fiercely loyal and too dumb/stubborn a believer to be tempted to chaos and yet when an inquisitor discovers him she allows this super rare, invaluable, ready-to-go resource stay in the guard where statistically he's likely to be thrown into a pointless meat grinder war in the rear end-end of the sector and die on a pointless hill somewhere. Mitchell addresses this once or twice as best as he can. Amberley supposedly has Inquisitor rivals / superiors (don't remember which) who would pull rank and requisition Jurgen from her if he were part of her retinue and was discovered how powerful he is. By leaving him with Cain, she knows he isn't in too much danger as an aide-de-camp to a cautious commissar, and she can fetch him whenever she needs a blank more than she needs the psyker/s in her retinue. Plus, it gives her a convenient excuse to visit her boyfriend more often (this wasn't in the text explanation, just my headcanon  )
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Mar 2, 2021 09:38
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NihilCredo posted:Mitchell addresses this once or twice as best as he can. Amberley supposedly has Inquisitor rivals / superiors (don't remember which) who would pull rank and requisition Jurgen from her if he were part of her retinue and was discovered how powerful he is. I actually forgot about that bit with the rivals. I've been re-reading Eisenhorn and Ravenor and got used to my Inquisitors being established, un-fuckwithable, autonomous entities
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Mar 2, 2021 10:39
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I finished Penitent and drat, this could change every era of the narrative. Some random thoughts, big spoilers for well, everything: Doesn't Valdor returning mean Russ will be back? I guess Valdor hasn't "returned" yet though. Valdor is physically incapable of being disloyal right? So he is actually doing what the Emperor would want, like a plan B? Is the City of Dust in the Imperial Webway? Has Valdor found another "shining path" for humanity? If the Valdor stuff doesn't get neatly tied up in the next book it must have huge implications for the 42nd millennium. But then what was Valdor doing between the time of Penitent, and Guilliman returning?
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Mar 2, 2021 12:06
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Dog_Meat posted:I actually forgot about that bit with the rivals. I've been re-reading Eisenhorn and Ravenor and got used to my Inquisitors being established, un-fuckwithable, autonomous entities Both Eisenhorn and Ravenor definitely got dicked around by their superiors in the Inquisition, though. While Inquisitors are pretty much an un-fuckwithable source of ultimate authority where most of the Imperium is concerned, they do seem to have this thing going where the most dangerous enemy an Inquisitor can have is a higher ranking Inquisitor. I also feel like you could make a legit argument that Cain has been ridiculously effective and capable in the service of the Emperor and breaking up the team so that she can keep a pocket blank around in case she needs one would be detrimental to the Imperium, especially because Cain wanted to avoid horrible meatgrinders and he had the seniority and influence that let him do it for the most part. Remember, when she meets him he's already a famous and beloved Hero of the Imperium. He's not just some random commissar, so keeping him intact and serving is a sensible priority. Khizan fucked around with this message at 12:24 on Mar 2, 2021 |
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Mar 2, 2021 12:21
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Khizan posted:Both Eisenhorn and Ravenor definitely got dicked around by their superiors in the Inquisition, though. While Inquisitors are pretty much an un-fuckwithable source of ultimate authority where most of the Imperium is concerned, they do seem to have this thing going where the most dangerous enemy an Inquisitor can have is a higher ranking Inquisitor. The theme being there that if you remain a field Inquisitor, on a long enough timescale everyone eventually crosses some kind of line, and everyone gets hosed over by their superiors. It's just which line you cross, and how badly you get hosed over.
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Mar 2, 2021 14:35
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Shockeh posted:The theme being there that if you remain a field Inquisitor, on a long enough timescale everyone eventually crosses some kind of line, and everyone gets hosed over by their superiors. It's just which line you cross, and how badly you get hosed over. They'll cross every line possible except the one that leads to management.
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Mar 2, 2021 14:56
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Z the IVth posted:They'll cross every line possible except the one that leads to management. When I change job this is gonna be my resume's tagline
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Mar 2, 2021 15:03
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Shockeh posted:The theme being there that if you remain a field Inquisitor, on a long enough timescale everyone eventually crosses some kind of line, and everyone gets hosed over by their superiors. It's just which line you cross, and how badly you get hosed over. You could condemn a hundred worlds to fiery penance in exterminatus, you could ally with daemons and xenos, you could even gently caress genestealers... but being in the path of another Inquisitor's ambition and/or ire gets no forgiveness. e; Now I want a story of an Inquisitor getting excommunicate and spends the entire book on the run, pulling all his favors and leverages just to see another hour pass and then find out an inquisitor lord is out for his rear end because they took the last groxciutto and asiagrox cheese wrap at a function he doesn't even remember. MariusLecter fucked around with this message at 15:38 on Mar 2, 2021 |
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Mar 2, 2021 15:31
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Just got my Penitent ship notification and I am going to speedread the poo poo out of it so I can finally engage with these spoilers 
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Mar 2, 2021 15:35
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Yeah I'm powering through Pariah as best I can, then I'll probably buy the eBook of Penitent for the same reason since I'm sure my preorder physical copy will take a long time. Pariah has a really weird feel, like... Victorian? Dickensian? It's a nice change of pace from Eisenhorn/Ravenor though.
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Mar 2, 2021 15:36
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NUMBER 1 FULCI FAN posted:Pariah has a really weird feel, like... Victorian? Dickensian? It's a nice change of pace from Eisenhorn/Ravenor though. It honestly reminds me of Fallen London/Sunless Sea
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Mar 2, 2021 16:17
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MariusLecter posted:You could condemn a hundred worlds to fiery penance in exterminatus, you could ally with daemons and xenos, you could even gently caress genestealers... but being in the path of another Inquisitor's ambition and/or ire gets no forgiveness. Inquisitor Lord Ross Geller.
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Mar 2, 2021 16:46
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NUMBER 1 FULCI FAN posted:Yeah I'm powering through Pariah as best I can, then I'll probably buy the eBook of Penitent for the same reason since I'm sure my preorder physical copy will take a long time. The Maze are incredibly flowery people, and Beta is a little autistic.
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Mar 2, 2021 17:01
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I think what threw me off when reading Pariah was that in the other books (Eisenhorn and Ravenor) their POVs were filled with authority and knowledge. Then you get to Pariah and no one knows WTF is going on, it's cool trying to figure out how things tie together based on learning with the protagonist. The reader has better context from the other books but you might miss a few things.
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Mar 2, 2021 18:27
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No joke, Pariah and Penitent are basically literary rewards for knowing enough about 40k. Abnett has never been better as a writer, and he's flexing hard with his skill. They are joyful, beautiful, must-owns for anyone deep in 40k.
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Mar 2, 2021 18:42
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abrosheen posted:It honestly reminds me of Fallen London/Sunless Sea That's it! I just started listening to Pariah and have been trying to figure out what it reminded me of.
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Mar 2, 2021 20:24
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New Krieg just dropped.
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Mar 2, 2021 21:56
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Brendan Rodgers posted:Inquisitor Lord Ross Geller. The Ross Geller field protects you...unless it’s on a break
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Mar 3, 2021 00:33
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Azubah posted:I think what threw me off when reading Pariah was that in the other books (Eisenhorn and Ravenor) their POVs were filled with authority and knowledge. Then you get to Pariah and no one knows WTF is going on, it's cool trying to figure out how things tie together based on learning with the protagonist. The reader has better context from the other books but you might miss a few things.
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Mar 3, 2021 01:46
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I was rereading the second Dark Angels heresy book, and I have to wonder if any BL author has ever gotten every detail of space marines right-in this one, the main character can’t overhear a conversation because of the engines of the ship they’re standing by, but Space Marines have an ear mod that specifically filters out background noise at will. Not blaming the author, that’s such a tiny detail that it’s easy to miss, but it must happen all the time.
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Mar 3, 2021 07:37
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Do not click this if you haven’t read Penitent. Thou hast been warned, you’ll be sorry, etc. On the one hand, ‘CV’ is too big a reveal to not use it. It’s practically indicating a whole new faction emergent into the 40k universe, and I’m down with it. However - there’s a very solid reason why it might be a setup. One of the key themes of the book and the whole Inquisition side of the Abnettverse (indeed, the book even explicitly says it a few times) is the name of a thing does not make it a thing. Beta is not Alizebeth. Radicals are only Radicals from their opposite PoV. Traitor is a subjective term. It’s entirely possible that CV will not be who he says he is, or might not be what he says he is. Again, I don’t think they’ll do that - It feels much more likely we’re going to see Imperium Tertius entering 40k, founded from Pandaemonium, but it’s an interesting side theory. Seriously, don’t do it. You’ll hate me for it. I even tried to spare someone who accidentally clicks it.
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Mar 3, 2021 11:21
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