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Johnny Joestar posted:i'm not surprised that they named their subreddit that but also at the same time do they never actually realize what kind of look it gives off when they name themselves after a faction where it literally takes the vast majority of the books before they reach a point where someone might even remotely be able to turn them around and make them not a bunch of highly, morally corrupt fascists? Thin red shepherd's crook.
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Oct 25, 2021 20:08
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Johnny Joestar posted:i'm not surprised that they named their subreddit that but also at the same time do they never actually realize what kind of look it gives off when they name themselves after a faction where it literally takes the vast majority of the books before they reach a point where someone might even remotely be able to turn them around and make them not a bunch of highly, morally corrupt fascists? One would think, but apparently actually no, there's never a "are we the baddies?" realization with these people. Maybe they realize it but they don't care?
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Oct 25, 2021 20:09
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Rarity posted:You'd need a reason for Perrin to gently caress off from Rand for the back half of the series Have him go help Elayne take back the throne, seems like an obvious way to tie together two bad plots.
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Oct 25, 2021 20:15
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Johnny Joestar posted:i'm not surprised that they named their subreddit that but also at the same time do they never actually realize what kind of look it gives off when they name themselves after a faction where it literally takes the vast majority of the books before they reach a point where someone might even remotely be able to turn them around and make them not a bunch of highly, morally corrupt fascists? That's a feature not a bug for them.
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Oct 25, 2021 20:16
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:One would think, but apparently actually no, there's never a "are we the baddies?" realization with these people. Maybe they realize it but they don't care? i mostly have to assume they don't care and view it as the point, but there's not even like a 'good' thing to gesture towards throughout the series when it comes to them. they're just a bunch of inept and dumb as poo poo people led by overtly corrupt leaders and it takes galad pretty much weeding the entire garden before there's even the basis of something that won't suck poo poo. it's baffling.
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Oct 25, 2021 20:18
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Jaxyon posted:I'm up to Trollocs attacking Emonds field and so far the only even vaguely racial description has been that Egwene had the same dark coloring as Nynaeve. The only consistent physical description of Two Rivers folk is dark hair and eyes. By implication, Tam's skintone must be something where he could plausibly be Rand's father, and Rand's skintone is ... not really explicitly stated, but he has dark red hair and blue-grey eyes, and his biological ancestors are people who get sunburned easily. But also, from context, the people of Andor are slightly darker in complexion than those of Cairhien, since I feel like "pale Cairhienin" is said almost as much as "copper-skinned Domani" (and our perspective characters are all from Andor or its backcountry). I always have a decently strong sense that, in terms of appearance, the peoples of Randland are (mostly) more racially homogeneous/delineated than makes sense given the backstory. And it's almost never relevant for the story.
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Oct 25, 2021 20:22
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Vavrek posted:And it's almost never relevant for the story. this is an essential point. It's mentioned here and there, people from here look like this, people from there look like that...and no one ever comments on it, and it doesn't matter to anyone aside from "well clearly that's an Aiel" or whatever.
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Oct 25, 2021 20:44
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Vavrek posted:The only consistent physical description of Two Rivers folk is dark hair and eyes. By implication, Tam's skintone must be something where he could plausibly be Rand's father, and Rand's skintone is ... not really explicitly stated, but he has dark red hair and blue-grey eyes, and his biological ancestors are people who get sunburned easily. But also, from context, the people of Andor are slightly darker in complexion than those of Cairhien, since I feel like "pale Cairhienin" is said almost as much as "copper-skinned Domani" (and our perspective characters are all from Andor or its backcountry). Eh, wasn't Kari Al'Thor a red haired Andoran girl? Even if Tam is of dark complexion, everyone could just be assuming Rand got his looks from his "mother". 
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Oct 25, 2021 21:02
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i think rand's looks were noted as being slightly outside of the norm for that area but not really notable enough on that front unless you were someone who had actual real contact with the aiel, in which case he was sort of a dead-ringer in a way where it stood out enough to be of note.
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Oct 25, 2021 21:05
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Johnny Joestar posted:i mostly have to assume they don't care and view it as the point, but there's not even like a 'good' thing to gesture towards throughout the series when it comes to them. they're just a bunch of inept and dumb as poo poo people led by overtly corrupt leaders and it takes galad pretty much weeding the entire garden before there's even the basis of something that won't suck poo poo. For some people, gently caress you I'm a moron deal with it seems to be the point, yeah.
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Oct 25, 2021 21:05
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jng2058 posted:Eh, wasn't Kari Al'Thor a red haired Andoran girl? Even if Tam is of dark complexion, everyone could just be assuming Rand got his looks from his "mother". Even parents where both have dark skin sometimes produce much lighter children, as anyone from a family with dark skin can tell you. Also it's entirely possible the town knew Rand was adopted and just politely didn't speak of it. But as previously was said, race is almost completely irrelevant in the series other than the author intentionally making it clear that it's not just or even mostly white people.
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Oct 25, 2021 21:07
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silvergoose posted:this is an essential point. It's mentioned here and there, people from here look like this, people from there look like that...and no one ever comments on it, and it doesn't matter to anyone aside from "well clearly that's an Aiel" or whatever. We do see a certain amount of in-universe racism. People have biases against the Tuathan'an or there's the stereotype of "Acting like a black-veiled Aiel" or whatever. Importantly these are always, without exception, shown to be inaccurate and unfair prejudices. For all the (often justified) criticism of these books, Jordan was at least trying to be progressive in his fiction, especially for the time.
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Oct 25, 2021 21:07
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:We do see a certain amount of in-universe racism. People have biases against the Tuathan'an or there's the stereotype of "Acting like a black-veiled Aiel" or whatever. The Aiel one is an interesting one. Particularly since the only contact most people would have had at all with them is when they boiled over the Dragonwall and made a mockery of every army thrown their way. I like that it's completely understandable in-universe, just as the reasons they did that are completely understandable in-universe. Really plays into the whole no communication thing Jordan did so well.
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Oct 25, 2021 21:11
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:We do see a certain amount of in-universe racism. People have biases against the Tuathan'an or there's the stereotype of "Acting like a black-veiled Aiel" or whatever. yeah there's plenty of prejudice directed at specific ethnic groups and nationalities, it just doesn't generally map on to skin color in any obvious way
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Oct 25, 2021 21:13
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Rereading New Spring, it makes sense why Moiraine and Siuan would look for normal Randland mothers and newborn babies. But once she got to Emond's Field, where three boys are the right age, and one of them inexplicitly looks like an Aiel, with Moiraine knowing that the Dragon was reborn during the very last battle of the Aiel War, she simply must have pegged Rand as the one she was searching for. By the way, did we every learn why Moiraine came to Emond's Field in the first place? Why she thought there were possible Dragon Reborn candidates there?
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Oct 25, 2021 21:16
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Torrannor posted:By the way, did we every learn why Moiraine came to Emond's Field in the first place? Why she thought there were possible Dragon Reborn candidates there? Explaining this was gonna be the third of RJ's planned prequels
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Oct 25, 2021 21:17
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In tgh when she gives the background of Tam, I assume it was recently discovered info, given what their plans were wrt tdr
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Oct 25, 2021 21:18
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silvergoose posted:this is an essential point. It's mentioned here and there, people from here look like this, people from there look like that...and no one ever comments on it, and it doesn't matter to anyone aside from "well clearly that's an Aiel" or whatever. jng2058 posted:Eh, wasn't Kari Al'Thor a red haired Andoran girl? Even if Tam is of dark complexion, everyone could just be assuming Rand got his looks from his "mother".
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Oct 25, 2021 21:24
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It's a little funky, because if Moiraine'd heard the name "Tam Al'Thor" there wouldn't be much question who she was looking for, and she'd know right away it was Rand, not Mat or Perrin. So she must have somehow heard about "There was this guy from the buttfuck nowhere part of Western Andor who went back there after the war with his wife and new baby," but without getting the guy's exact name. I'd have thought that a Blademaster wouldn't be too hard to identify among his old comrades, but who knows?
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Oct 25, 2021 21:27
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jng2058 posted:It's a little funky, because if Moiraine'd heard the name "Tam Al'Thor" there wouldn't be much question who she was looking for, and she'd know right away it was Rand, not Mat or Perrin. So she must have somehow heard about "There was this guy from the buttfuck nowhere part of Western Andor who went back there after the war with his wife and new baby," but without getting the guy's exact name. I'd have thought that a Blademaster wouldn't be too hard to identify among his old comrades, but who knows? yeah it's not like perrin and mat's dads were vets (or if they were i've totally forgotten). maybe she got the information through some prophecy/whatever and only knew the region edit: vvvv that's probably it, even if she knew rand was probably it, the shadow wants all three kids so you might as well make sure that doesn't happen eke out fucked around with this message at 21:42 on Oct 25, 2021 |
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Oct 25, 2021 21:33
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jng2058 posted:It's a little funky, because if Moiraine'd heard the name "Tam Al'Thor" there wouldn't be much question who she was looking for, and she'd know right away it was Rand, not Mat or Perrin. So she must have somehow heard about "There was this guy from the buttfuck nowhere part of Western Andor who went back there after the war with his wife and new baby," but without getting the guy's exact name. I'd have thought that a Blademaster wouldn't be too hard to identify among his old comrades, but who knows? Even if you knew the name of the vet, you show up in the village and there are three kids the right age, and the Dark One is targeting all three of their homes, you'd want to grab all three just to be on the safe side. Maybe there was a baby swap or something and you don't want to gently caress up and leave the wrong kid back in bumfuck.
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Oct 25, 2021 21:37
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I feel like Moiraine didn't know the name Tamlin al'Thor when heading to the Two Rivers, and did research once she had a moment to rest. "Okay, who in the light is Tam al'Thor?" [read read read] "He was the Second Captain of the Companions?!"
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Oct 25, 2021 21:44
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It seemed like the information she had was "dude came home from war with a baby that wasn't his, he fought at Tar Valon." She was able to pretty rapidly identify Perrin and Mat by age, but until she heard Tam had rolled into town she didn't actually seem to be aware of him. I'd guess that when she heard the cart arriving she stuck her head out to see who and what, leading to her meeting Rand. I'm a little hazy on how long she had been in the village before Tam and Rand arrived, but it didn't seem like long enough to have heard about them living out in the forest - that, or she'd also heard that they were due in before Winternight, so stayed put. As for how she knew - she was shown to be exceptional at ferreting out information (how DID she know it was Sammael in Illian?!)
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Oct 25, 2021 21:53
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Data Graham posted:This only showed up what, like twice? And there's all these other increasingly efficient methods of Fast Travel they keep discovering as time goes on. Everyone always says WoT is a shonen anime; eh, more like it's a JRPG Yeah it doesn't last for very long and I think it's most notable use is (I think) Asmodean and Rand battling to Rhuidean on plates? I brought it up as a way to travel faster, but still have time to communicate. Sit down for a spot of tea on your way instead of gateway straight there. Of course no one wants to talk to each other so there's that. Also yes WoT does seem built as a JRPG with scaling, stacking, and advancing techniques that change with growth in power and expertise.
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Oct 25, 2021 21:55
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Data Graham posted:This only showed up what, like twice? And there's all these other increasingly efficient methods of Fast Travel they keep discovering as time goes on. Everyone always says WoT is a shonen anime; eh, more like it's a JRPG The Notorious ZSB posted:Yeah it doesn't last for very long and I think it's most notable use is (I think) Asmodean and Rand battling to Rhuidean on plates? It was pretty loving awesome when the Skimming platform makes a return with Mat and the gholam though.
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Oct 25, 2021 22:16
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Vavrek posted:I feel like Moiraine didn't know the name Tamlin al'Thor when heading to the Two Rivers, and did research once she had a moment to rest. Even that, while him being in the Two Rivers is a bit odd, it wasn't like some huge post that absolutely everyone knows who he is nor is it a super famous post. He certainly would have been known in Illian's army and probably their nobility with having a heron mark blade, but it's not like he's one of the Great Captains. Comrade Blyatlov posted:It seemed like the information she had was "dude came home from war with a baby that wasn't his, he fought at Tar Valon." She was able to pretty rapidly identify Perrin and Mat by age, but until she heard Tam had rolled into town she didn't actually seem to be aware of him. I'd guess that when she heard the cart arriving she stuck her head out to see who and what, leading to her meeting Rand. Moiraine didn't know it wasn't Tam's baby, the only people who knew were the Wisdoms, him, and Kari. He and Kari said it was theirs and no one had any reason to question. She did know Rand was born outside the Two Rivers and was of the right age but beyond that she was as in the dark as Rand was initially. Definitely a reason to think it's probably him but she didn't know for sure.
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Oct 25, 2021 22:51
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I can think of three main themes of the series:
With that in mind, Fain should have served as a wild card in the last battle, throwing both armies into chaos and generally mucking things up, maybe threatening a return of Shadar Logoth or Mashadar um constrained and forcing them to deal with an unpredictable threat
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Oct 25, 2021 22:56
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Ehhhh.... I'm kind of working from the idea that Moiraine identified The Two Rivers as the place to look because of Tam's history. New Spring made clear the Tower was looking for babies of a certain age. I can't imagine Tam returning from Dragonmount with a baby was completely overlooked by everyone he fought with. Put it all together and I'd say Moiraine got wind of a soldier who returned to the Two Rivers from Illian with a baby after the battle at Tar Valon. Thats how it all hangs together in my mind, anyway. I can't really think how else she would have wound up there.
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Oct 25, 2021 22:58
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The wheel wheels
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Oct 25, 2021 23:03
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seaborgium posted:
It's not clear that she knew that when she showed up. She.might have only found out from nynaeve later.
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Oct 25, 2021 23:04
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ONE YEAR LATER posted:The wheel wheels It do be do be do be do
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Oct 25, 2021 23:10
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4. Everyone knows exactly what a given prophecy must mean and acts following that knowledge; they are, of course, wrong.
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Oct 25, 2021 23:31
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:Ehhhh.... I'm kind of working from the idea that Moiraine identified The Two Rivers as the place to look because of Tam's history. Mightn't it have been some "hey I think Manetheren used to be around here" kind of thing?
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Oct 25, 2021 23:41
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i think literally one of the reasons she goes to two rivers is because it's one of the very few places they have yet to check and basically no one from the white tower ever goes there in the first place. it's why they comment so much about finding so many potential channelers there later on in the series, it's a place they had written off for the most part and ignored.
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Oct 25, 2021 23:47
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Oct 25, 2021 23:47
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SerSpook posted:it should be fine, post away friend Spoilers for the extended trailers / episode 1. The first scene is an extended cut of what we've seen of Egwene getting dumped into a river. This is part of her induction into the women's circle by Nynaeve and is almost certainly a metaphor for Saidar as Egwene is told to let the river take her and she ends up safe as soon as she stops struggling against it. Notably she's getting her braid as she's inducted so presumably in this version every woman of age is in the circle? The second scene we see is what we've seen before, Moraine walks into the inn in Emond's field and everyone is surprised by her and they all recognise her as Aes Sedai. There's nothing hugely different from what you've observed in the trailers here. The third scene is an extended look at Winternight. The trollocs show up during the celebrations and murder the hell, we're talking spikes through heads, of some of the people there. There's a huge panic as Egwene and Nynaeve find shelter behind a cart and watch the carnage. Mat and Perrin get to safety, but Mat realises the girls aren't with them and goes back out into the town to find them. To me this is honestly a hugely important bit for Mat that does a wonder for his character immediately. We also cut to Rand and Tam fighting a trolloc invading their home. This time instead of running Rand fights a single Trolloc with Tam and they manage to beat it out with Tam taking his near fatal injury as a result. I don't think Narg is showing up. The last scene is probably the most important to me. Moraine explicitly tells Rand/Mat/Perrin/Egwene that one of them is the Dragon Reborn and she doesn't know which. Which is markedly different from how closely she plays it to her chest in the books. She tells them straight up that if they stay in Emond's Field the Dark one's armies, that they can see in the Mountains of Mist will come after them and kill everyone in the town. It ends with the paragraph and the beginning of Chapter 1 of the Eye of the World, with a wind rising in the Mountains of Mist. Overall I felt what changes there were didn't feel gratuitous and it looks great in motion. It feels a lot less subdued in tone than Game of Thrones did, specifically looking at the colour and dynamism of what you see on screen.
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Oct 26, 2021 00:14
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Quoting from the TV thread:Hieronymous Alloy posted:Amazon has a new interactive page up for the show. There's a map! Nothing particularly revolutionary for book readers, but neat nevertheless. Make sure you log in to Amazon Prime to get access to the cool stuff.
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Oct 26, 2021 00:20
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the pattern made her go there, rand started tugging at the world from breath 1 imagine you have the Talent to see ta'veren and you see this baby just GLOWIN
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Oct 26, 2021 00:21
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jng2058 posted:Quoting from the TV thread: Yay new maps  I think the places that get called out on this map are interesting. Notable missing from the expected book 1 script is Caemlyn (and Baerlon) and barely mentioned Breens Spring has a map marker The Glumslinger fucked around with this message at 01:33 on Oct 26, 2021 |
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Oct 26, 2021 01:29
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I can't even remember breens spring.
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Oct 26, 2021 01:39
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