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RC Cola posted:poo poo now I need to figure out what sub forum all of our main characters would hang out in Moiraine: TGO Lan: D&D Nynaeve: GWS Egwene: A/T Rand: HCH Mat: FYAD Perrin: E/N Loial: TBB Thom: NMD Siuan: PI
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Dec 17, 2021 18:00
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SerSpook posted:lol if they have perrinxegwene and just cut gawyn and faile entirely this could work Rarity posted:It's cool that Rand's gonna be exploring his sexuality at least lol this was my first thought
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Dec 17, 2021 18:04
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Rarity posted:Moiraine: TGO Nah, Lan would totally be Fight Island
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Dec 17, 2021 18:14
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Rarity posted:Softening up Lan's character seems like an intentional choice to modernise the story with an example of positivity masculinity and I'm completely here for it Rand learning toxic masculinity from Lan and then having to find a way out of it is, like, the crux of his entire arc. If that's not happening... what exactly is Rand's arc, now? Hell, what's Lan's arc? If this is where he starts, where has he got to go? RC Cola posted:The non book spoiler tv thread is arguing about how realistic Tigraine's fight scene was, and its really hard to not explain that literally that is what Aiel do. And she is like a little baby Aiel. A normal maiden would have killed all of those men with half the effort and twice the anime Yeah, uh. I need to preface this by say that I loved the blood snow, I was loving pumped for the whole scene, but uh. I did not, ever, at any point reading the books, imagine the Aiel were that good. Good, yes. Merk nine members of the most elite fighting company in the westlands outside of the warders while pregnant good? No, not remotely. That's not "good at fighting" or even "tv-good at fighting", that's straight up supernatural good.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:20
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Rarity posted:Moiraine: TGO Perrin should be PI. Lan should be LAN
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Dec 17, 2021 18:21
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Loving how committed Unos actor is. This guy is loving it.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:25
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buffalo all day posted:Loving how committed Unos actor is. This guy is loving it. I also love how loving tiny he is compared to everyone. Just a little ball of anger and swears.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:26
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TLM3101 posted:The Ways: Good. Very good. I like the aesthetic they came up with. Wish we could have seen more of the vastness of the place, but what we got was good. A little sad the demented rantings of Machin Shin wasn't included, but the route they did go worked well, and in some ways even better. That thing will find and use your fears and insecurities and shame against you. Also, Loial. Oh, Loial. And drat, Fain. Machin Shin: I don’t quite get this version. It’s cool with the whispering but is the expectation just that it makes you go mad? The books gave me the impression it would literally rip you apart going by the dead trollocs they found and whisper it’s delight in doing it. And the declaration by Rand being the DR with Callandor will still happen. Right now it’s “I’m the DR because Moiraine says so” but I imagine he’ll kind of fight that thinking he’s just another man that can channel because tEotW leads to nothing changing. Callandor is the proof of being the DR for himself and for everyone else.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:32
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:Rand learning toxic masculinity from Lan and then having to find a way out of it is, like, the crux of his entire arc. If that's not happening... what exactly is Rand's arc, now? They establish in book 3 that 2 Aiel take on 20 men when attacked from behind while surprised and still take out over half of them. Aka Gaul when he is captured and his friend dies. So uh. It makes sense. They also establish that something like 6 Maidens can take on 3 Fades shortly after. Or at least hold their own. They are established to be almost superhuman with their fighting style the entire series. I think its 1 Aiel is worth 10+ men.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:36
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:Rand learning toxic masculinity from Lan and then having to find a way out of it is, like, the crux of his entire arc. If that's not happening... what exactly is Rand's arc, now? They're definitely portrayed as absurdly good at fighting in the books. I think the show erred on the correct side of things.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:36
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latinotwink1997 posted:Machin Shin: I don’t quite get this version. It’s cool with the whispering but is the expectation just that it makes you go mad? The books gave me the impression it would literally rip you apart going by the dead trollocs they found and whisper it’s delight in doing it. Uh, in the books the Trollocs are stuck in melted stone. And it doesn't rip you apart. Loial says that anyone who comes out touched by Machine Shin is insane. Those who don't come out are presumed to have just died of being nuts or jumped off the side. Also I don't know if i'm just dumb or what but I only recently realized that the whole "Those who come between the dragon and the dark one will die" is already setting up Moridin.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:38
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They even establish that 1/3 of the Aiel come out of the wastes and slaughter the entirety of the combined forces of Randland without effort while looking for 1 dude to kill. Its heavily implied that they could have conquered it all if they wanted to.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:39
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RC Cola posted:They establish in book 3 that 2 Aiel take on 20 men when attacked from behind while surprised and still take out over half of them. Aka Gaul when he is captured and his friend dies. So uh. It makes sense. They also establish that something like 6 Maidens can take on 3 Fades shortly after. Or at least hold their own. They are established to be almost superhuman with their fighting style the entire series. I think its 1 Aiel is worth 10+ men. That's a pair of idiot nobles and their entourage IIRC, they hardly compare to the Companions. And I don't know if the Fade was portrayed as being this good at fighting in that scene. If Thom had been moving like this he'd have clowned on that thing. How are u posted:They're definitely portrayed as absurdly good at fighting in the books. I think the show erred on the correct side of things. Again, it's a fun scene and I liked it. But it's definitely pushed the ceiling on martial skill in this universe waaaaay further out than I thought it was going to be.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:41
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Also it was clear from everyone kneeing over in pain that it's not just "oh there's evil whispers in my head". Everyone was doubled over in pain and immobile before Nyneave got pissed enough to force them all away. I could literially believe their heads exploding, or them tearing themselves to pieces, if left there.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:42
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yeah tigraine soloing 5 dudes and only getting a mortal wound because she was literally in labor seems pretty book-accurate in terms of how dangerous an individual Aiel is. i wouldn't be surprised if the dudes chasing down a wounded solo aiel fleeing the battlefield are not necessarily the best fighters in Illian, either also we repeatedly see dumbass nobles horrifically underestimate them and people like Mat having to intervene to stop them from getting their troops murdered
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Dec 17, 2021 18:43
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:That's a pair of idiot nobles and their entourage IIRC, they hardly compare to the Companions. And I don't know if the Fade was portrayed as being this good at fighting in that scene. If Thom had been moving like this he'd have clowned on that thing. Afterwards Faile immediately explains that she knows those guys. The main boasting guy specifically previously had won a 1v4 fight vs 4 people who were combat experienced, and the fighting men with him fighting Gaul all knew what they were doing. I literally just read this scene yesterday so its pretty fresh. On your next re-read (if you do so) notice early on how often they talk about the skill of the Aiel. That's something I've been focusing on this re-read
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Dec 17, 2021 18:46
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:That's a pair of idiot nobles and their entourage IIRC, they hardly compare to the Companions. And I don't know if the Fade was portrayed as being this good at fighting in that scene. If Thom had been moving like this he'd have clowned on that thing. I feel like you're overstating the level of the Companions, they're never portrayed as an elite fighting force. They're certainly not at Warder level and I doubt they'd even match up with your average Borderlander
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Dec 17, 2021 18:46
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:That's a pair of idiot nobles and their entourage IIRC, they hardly compare to the Companions. What makes you think that a hugely prestigious and fancy organization like The Companions isn't full of idiot nobles who think they're way more competent than they actually are?
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Dec 17, 2021 18:46
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Reminder that Rand's dad rose to the top of the Companions as a random farmer from bumfuck nowhere
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Dec 17, 2021 18:47
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The southern nations are specifically portrayed as pompous idiots hooped up on their own farts who have no idea what real trouble is like
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Dec 17, 2021 18:49
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The Dragon Reborn, Chapter 34 is the fight, Chapter 35 is Faile elaborating to Perrin about how the men who attack Gaul were good at fighting.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:49
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How are u posted:What makes you think that a hugely prestigious and fancy organization like The Companions isn't full of idiot nobles who think they're way more competent than they actually are? i don't remember enough specifics in how the Aiel War was described throughout the books to say for sure, but i definitely got the impression Jordan was thinking of a WWI-esque deal where a bunch of the aristocracy made some incredibly stupid decisions because they failed to understand the kind of threat they were dealing with
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Dec 17, 2021 18:49
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:Rand learning toxic masculinity from Lan and then having to find a way out of it is, like, the crux of his entire arc. If that's not happening... what exactly is Rand's arc, now? Rand doesn't learn Toxic Masculinity from Lan, he learns Martyrdom from Lan. I can see the argument that maybe they went a little too far by having Lan say something like Moiraine doesn't own him to reassure Nynaeve about their connection, but even then he couches that in terms of duty by saying he's no different than this Wisdom who crossed the world to save her fellow villagers from the Aes Sedai and is forbidden to ever marry by her position. At the end of the day he may not be MARRIED TO DEATH at this point, but he's certainly still married to his duty. His arc will be overcoming that, and Rand arc will be overcoming that alongside his certainty that his duty is to die. "His blood on the rocks of Shayol Gul," and all that. RC Cola posted:Reminder that Rand's dad rose to the top of the Companions as a random farmer from bumfuck nowhere Tam is loving LEGIT though, even Lan says so. Then again, Lan admitted to having doubted him until he saw him fight, so clearly just being in the Companions wasn't enough to convince the Dai Shan.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:52
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RC Cola posted:Reminder that Rand's dad rose to the top of the Companions as a random farmer from bumfuck nowhere And Tigraine managed to become a Maiden despite going to the Aiel as an adult after living as Andoran nobility her whole life. I don't think the books are really putting a ton of stock into the idea the Aiel are genetically superior or anything, with specific training basically anyone can reach super-human combat levels. See also: Rand being able to go toe to toe with the Seanchan blademaster after getting a few months of study with Lan.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:52
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Zore posted:And Tigraine managed to become a Maiden despite going to the Aiel as an adult after living as Andoran nobility her whole life. I don't think the books are really putting a ton of stock into the idea the Aiel are genetically superior or anything, with specific training basically anyone can reach super-human combat levels. See also: Rand being able to go toe to toe with the Seanchan blademaster after getting a few months of study with Lan. Have you considered that Tigraine is loving badass, op?
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Dec 17, 2021 18:54
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Honestly the thing that I liked the least about the episode is that they gave Lan a 'family' of sorts. Lan-Nynaeve romance is a bit rushed but eh what ya gonna do, it's TV.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:54
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But more seriously Tigraine was able to become skillful enough to be a Maiden because the Pattern needed her to be so she could end up on Dragonmount to give birth to Rand. I imagine random women who aren't mum to the saviour of the world would be able to do it
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Dec 17, 2021 18:55
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Zore posted:
I always wondered if him winning that sword duel wasn't partly Lews Therin, as it later would be with various channeling weaves. Lews was one of the best in the world with swords.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:57
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How are u posted:Honestly the thing that I liked the least about the episode is that they gave Lan a 'family' of sorts. Lan-Nynaeve romance is a bit rushed but eh what ya gonna do, it's TV. It felt like very heavy handed family fun, but it gave us Lan's Batman Hello to invite Nynaeve in, so I'm satisfied.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:57
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Zore posted:And Tigraine managed to become a Maiden despite going to the Aiel as an adult after living as Andoran nobility her whole life. I don't think the books are really putting a ton of stock into the idea the Aiel are genetically superior or anything, with specific training basically anyone can reach super-human combat levels. See also: Rand being able to go toe to toe with the Seanchan blademaster after getting a few months of study with Lan. To be fair he has ta`veren energy going for him their and possible channelling - he's desperately losing against a foe who's not putting his full effort in for the first exchange then hits the Void and stomps on him.
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Dec 17, 2021 18:58
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Is the show just doing away with the significance of the heron-mark blade and blademasters? Rand just strolls around with it tucked in his belt and nobody ever comments on it, while the books have a ton of scenes early on where people freak out like he's a walking nuclear bomb when they spot it.
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Dec 17, 2021 19:00
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Sanguinia posted:I always wondered if him winning that sword duel wasn't partly Lews Therin, as it later would be with various channeling weaves. Lews was one of the best in the world with swords. This is always how I felt tbqh. Lews Therin has been bleeding in since book 1. Also fair. Tam is legit. I'm just saying that just because you get to wear plate mail doesn't make you competent. Lost of rich boys get to be knights by being rich.
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Dec 17, 2021 19:00
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God drat the machin Shin sequence was really poorly edited. Everyone getting little plot whispers in a row. show them running and then intersperse the wind howling. maybe instead of meeting a King in his Hall and spending all that time delivering speeches to one another agelmar could have been doing an inspection on the walls. or hell, skinning an elk. something give this show a little kinetic energy. the show has turned show don't tell into Show and Tell.
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Dec 17, 2021 19:01
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Dr. Clockwork posted:Is the show just doing away with the significance of the heron-mark blade and blademasters? Rand just strolls around with it tucked in his belt and nobody ever comments on it, while the books have a ton of scenes early on where people freak out like he's a walking nuclear bomb when they spot it. I think it's a time issue. Give it 2 more episodes in the season and they could have added a lot more in.
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Dec 17, 2021 19:01
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RC Cola posted:Afterwards Faile immediately explains that she knows those guys. The main boasting guy specifically previously had won a 1v4 fight vs 4 people who were combat experienced, and the fighting men with him fighting Gaul all knew what they were doing. I literally just read this scene yesterday so its pretty fresh. My memory of this exchange is that Faile says she knows of him as a great fighter by repute, but it's in the context of Faile being a dork who doesn't know as much as she thinks she does/is caught up in the romance of the Hunters narrative. I remember Lan being decidedly less impressed with them. My read was always that that guy's reputation was a lie. But, I have not read it as recently as you and so I will defer to your take for the moment.  RC Cola posted:Reminder that Rand's dad rose to the top of the Companions as a random farmer from bumfuck nowhere Ah, now. You can quibble about the notional eliteness of the Companions and the Hunters all you want, but blademasters are one thing that we know everyone takes deadly seriously, and Tam earnt that sword legit. eke out posted:i don't remember enough specifics in how the Aiel War was described throughout the books to say for sure, but i definitely got the impression Jordan was thinking of a WWI-esque deal where a bunch of the aristocracy made some incredibly stupid decisions because they failed to understand the kind of threat they were dealing with Yeah, same.
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Dec 17, 2021 19:02
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Dr. Clockwork posted:Is the show just doing away with the significance of the heron-mark blade and blademasters? Rand just strolls around with it tucked in his belt and nobody ever comments on it, while the books have a ton of scenes early on where people freak out like he's a walking nuclear bomb when they spot it. I'd assume they bring it in next season when Rand gets his sword lessons
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Dec 17, 2021 19:05
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:My memory of this exchange is that Faile says she knows of him as a great fighter by repute, but it's in the context of Faile being a dork who doesn't know as much as she thinks she does/is caught up in the romance of the Hunters narrative. I remember Lan being decidedly less impressed with them. My read was always that that guy's reputation was a lie. I walked back my Tam line if that wasn't clear. But it's more a "Tam was the best of them and wasn't fighting her, we don't know how skilled these random dudes are or if they got a fancy position because daddy is on the council of 9" On the hunters, they boasted and exaggerated, but there was still skill under the lies. Also Lan didn't comment either way. He just stood there stone faced. I'm really looking forward to this scene in the show tbqh. Y'all I love the show and also the books and also all of you. Any arguing I do is out of love of talking about this poo poo
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Dec 17, 2021 19:11
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Dr. Clockwork posted:Is the show just doing away with the significance of the heron-mark blade and blademasters? Rand just strolls around with it tucked in his belt and nobody ever comments on it, while the books have a ton of scenes early on where people freak out like he's a walking nuclear bomb when they spot it. To be fair, the main reason for that is so Rand will feel compelled to hide it in Camelyn, which in turn will make him coincidentally get into the Royal Family's good graces when he crashes their garden. No reason to put screen time on it in S1 if that scene gets cut. In S2 its a much more important plot point.
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Dec 17, 2021 19:11
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RC Cola posted:Y'all I love the show and also the books and also all of you. Any arguing I do is out of love of talking about this poo poo 
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Dec 17, 2021 19:16
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El Grillo posted:I wasn't clear as to why there was the whole melodramatic YOU'RE ALL GONNA DIE AT THE EYE YO thing Moiraine was saying. Was that some info she explicitly received from elsewhere? It was very weirdly put. Why on Quite literally just got to this part of Eye, and she does almost the exact same thing. Straight up tells them there's a very high chance they're going to die, but the fate of the world depends on them so they need to step the gently caress up. Like, a lot of the stuff you complain about is based on book behavior. It's like the guy complaining about all the "inaccuracies" in the Ways, when almost everything they described as being wrong actually happened. They had issues crossing bridges and had the backtrack. It took Loial longer than normal to find the correct path due to defacement a couple of times. The path to each gate is a bridge from a landing platform. Loial had issues finding the final path when Machin Shin was bearing down on them. They did have issues getting to the Fal Dara gate and opening it before Machin Shin arrived. There was even a "you shall not pass" moment, it was just Moirainne instead of Nynaeve. El Grillo posted:I swear to god I've seen a set design like the ways before, either in a game or some film or TV - a dark hexagonal stone floor pattern, with a load of almost crystalline-lookinb hexagonal columns coming up out of it at different heights. Am I going crazy or do any of you know what I'm talking about? Lol. As for this, it's the suicide mission from Mass Effect 2, right down to projecting a magic bubble to protect everyone from the evil bugs. Devorum fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Dec 17, 2021 |
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Dec 17, 2021 19:18
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